Should 6yo boy w June bday be in K or 1st? Does this plan sound ok?

[RosieCotton]

My 6 year old has his math facts down to 12, and we are working on to 20 now. He is in the blending stage of reading, and is doing well with all short vowels, double and triple consonant beginnings, and has started in on the more interesting sounds of ing, ang, ong, ew, oi.oy, ea, ai, etc.

 

I'm laughing at myself some, so please all join in, because he was learning at a slower place than his brother now in second grade. But was thinking not all kids learn the same or at the same rate so be patient.

Then it dawned on me he just turned 6 in June, he wouldn't be in first grade yet most likely anyway. !

 

I've read posts and blogs about placement, and many think it's more important to place for readiness rather than age. I'm happy where he is at and we are focusing this year on becoming an independent strong reader thru SSRW level 1 material and those readers along with more fun readers like Nora and AFables.

 

He loves the SOTW we do each day, and to draw and write to summarize what we've learned. We journal science and using living books and encyclos, and flip thru the Foresman boring school textbook  once in awhile also.

 

The only area I see him struggling in is his letter formations are not neat and I wonder about motor development issues. But he is still young so when do you start to consider that as in issue?

 

ISince he is doing well in the other areas I plan on keeping up with it so he can continue to advance. He has amazing memory skill and I'm astonished at what stories and facts he retains.

 

Should I pull back (don't want to) or keep going with what we are doing?

Suggestions on the motor issue other than patience, practise, and time?

 

 

 

 

 

[My3girls]

My dd7's birthday is in May so she started K at 5, 1st at 6, and 2nd at 7. It's on the younger side of the grade level but well within the birthday cutoff, a least here in GA. Here they have to be 5 by Sept. 30. Now, my nephew turned 5 in August, and his parents decided to wait a year so he turned 6 11 days after K started. He was he oldest in his class. All that to say, it's really up to you.

[kirstenhill]

I'm sure it varies, but most people i know locally who send their kids to public school only redshirt or "hold back" kids with August birthdays (cut off here is Sept 1st).   I think I know two families with kids who have earlier summer birthdays that were started a year late, and both kids were socially immature and the parents were worried about them in that regard (going into public school). 

 

The nice thing about homeschooling is unless your state paperwork requires you to declare a grade level, you really don't have to decide anything right now.  I would just focus on working with him where he is at in each subject.  My currently-six-year-old first grader (late March birthday) is nearly half way through a 2nd grade math book, but has atrocious handwriting (he doesn't see the "point" of neat handwriting, so it is hard to motivate him to even try very hard at it) and is solidly plugging away at easy readers -- he's comfortable reading something at about a 1.5 level, and can stretch above that just a bit.   It's nice to be able to challenge him in his best subject while letting him make progress in other areas at his own pace. 

 

[SKL]

I would have a child that age with those abilities in 1st grade.  As far as I know, every state (or nearly every one) has a cutoff later than June.  If he were not reading or understanding basic math concepts, then I would consider calling him a K student.

 

My daughter will be 7 in January and she's in 2nd grade.  Her handwriting is pretty bad for 2nd grade, but today was the first time any teacher complained about it (her Q1 report card recommends that she practice writing more).  I would not base a school placement decision on handwriting.  Kids will be typing their work soon enough.

[musicianmom]

Based on what you've described, I would say first grade is an appropriate placement, especially when homeschooling.

[boscopup]

I'd do 1st grade.

 

My middle son will be 7 in a couple days. He is about in the same spot in reading and handwriting as your son. He's in first grade. I am not holding him back any. He'll be fine in the long run. I just focus on reading and don't do stuff like grammar and a lot of copywork because he's not reading well yet. I've even dropped handwriting, and he just writes well during his phonics lesson (we're using R&S Reading and Phonics, and the Phonics portion has places to write the first 1 or 2 letters of a word based on how it sounds). Surprisingly, since I cut down his handwriting each day to just that miniscule amount in Phonics, his handwriting has improved! :D Less is more.

 

FWIW, my oldest wasn't great at letter formation in 1st grade either. Now in 4th grade, he's writing paragraphs in a sitting with no problem (ok, he has the occasional b/d mixup and some age appropriate spelling errors, but when he goes back over his work, he catches everything, including the spelling errors).

 

As far as grade placement goes... Most states have a cutoff of Sept. 1, and some might have a little earlier or later cutoff, but I can't think of a state where a June birthday would be after the cutoff. So I think in every state, your son would likely be placed in first grade by a public school. Some 6 year olds are in K only because their parents redshirted them. My oldest has a June birthday, and while he wasn't ready to write in K/1st like most of the other kids were, his hand caught up later. His academic abilities have been very different from my current 1st grader's, but I place in grades by age, not ability. They work at their ability level in my homeschool. My 4th grader has different subjects at different levels, ranging from 3rd to 7th. My 1st grader's few subjects are 1st-2nd (he's ahead in math). My 4 year old, who isn't officially doing school but likes to do stuff independently, is doing stuff in the K-1st range (he reads as well as the 1st grader... possibly a bit better). All kids are different, and I don't bump my 1st grader down because his older brother was reading Charlotte's Web in 1st grade. My 1st grader is reading at a 1st grade level. So while he's taking the long, slow route to reading, he's technically at grade level in that subject. By time he gets to high school, I am sure you won't be able to tell that he wasn't reading independently until age 7 or later.

[Kathryn]

By age, he'd be in first in every state I know of. By ability, he sounds fine for first as well.

[Carrie12345]

He'd be a 1st grader by age in most schools. My 6yos b-day is 5/1. He's very slightly "behind" some 1st grade standards, but child development is still so varied at this age, I'm not interested in setting him up for extra years of school just because of that.

[alisoncooks]

Both of mine are June birthdays.  My 5 yr old is K'er, my 7 yr old is 2nd grade.

I think, ability-wise, he'd be fine for first.

 

Or -- what I'd do:  call him "First" (b/c that's where his aged-peers will be placed) and still teach him at his level, even if it's Kinder work for a while.

[mytwomonkeys]

Here, the cut-off is September 1st, so a six year old with a June birthday would be a young first grader here.

 

My daughter has an early Fall birthday, so she fell on the other end of the spectrum & was turning 6 at the beginning of kindergarten. Honestly, I'd say do whatever you want though. It would be appropriate here at his age to be in grade K or 1st. Since you are homeschooling, you don't even need to decide yet.

[mom2bee]

He would be 1st by age, his abilities aren't that bad for a first semester, first grade child. He'll continue to improve.

 

For motor development--archery and sewing...

[Ellie]

First grade. Absolutely. It has nothing to do with his academic ability or his maturity or anything else.  A child who is 6yo by the cut-off in the state where he lives would be in first grade in the fall. That's all the "grade level" means.

[Mandylubug]

Most say go by states cut off only because it truly doesn't matter since you homeschool. However, that isn't the case with our family since we attend a co-op and there is NO way that my girls will be ready for the 4th and 5th grade group next year nor are they even remotely ready to do standardized testing this year as a 3rd grader. So, we are calling them 2nd grade. Maturity wise that is where they are even though their bday was July. If they were in PS, I would have advocated for them to be held back in K. All of my kids are immature for their age and they are "behind" in all subjects.

[swellmomma]

He would be 1st grade.  dd6 is 1st grade and her birthday is sept 19th.  If she went to ps she would only be in K due to cut offs but she is doing fine in first at home.  Had her birthday been in june she would have been in 1st in ps as well.

[IceFairy]

My DS turned 6 in July and is doing 1st grade work....as he would be in 1st grade here in PS. The cut-off is September 1st.

[Walking-Iris]

Both my younger children have July birthdays. My 6 year old is considered 1st. 

 

I just declare them whatever grade they need to be based on age. That makes it easier to talk to the stranger who wants to always ask what grade they are. But really "grade level" varies depending on what subject or even sub-topic within a subject we are studying. My kids are always ahead in some areas, behind in others, and average in some others. 

 

I think in this case I would just declare grade by age and then to just continue working on skills at his ability level. 

[kbutton]

My May birthday son started brick and mortar school at five (he's home for the 2nd year this year). He did fine. My December birthday son will be six soon, and he's doing a mix of K and 1st grade work, depending on whose standards he follows. He started school mid-year last year. We call him Kindergarten for age-based activities.

 

Writing--my older son has dysgraphia. Nearly everyone in hubby's family struggles with handwriting automaticity. I take writing slowly with my 6 y.o. to be sure he'll remember. He picked up printing (Italic) pretty fast because he was motivated to learn cursive, and he does like to write. He's not that neat. He made some of his letters wrong, so I now sit with him to be sure he's making the motions correctly. He now corrects himself with letters he already knows, and the neatness is starting to come along. We are taking cursive much more slowly (New American Cursive style). I make my own worksheets for him so that we can spend more time on each letter. I teach them in order of letters that have similar formations rather than the order in the book. Also, the book has too small of a font. As we focus on correct formation, automaticity is slowly following. Once things are more automatic, they've been getting neater. I would definitely be sure he's doing things right vs. neat, and then go from there.

[Julie Smith]

Here (Eastern Canada) the cut off is Dec. 31st. So he would be an older grade 1 student. 

 

My Youngest turns 8 next month and is in grade 3.

[FairProspects]

It depends on the practices in your area. He would easily make the cutoff here (Sept. 1), but if you live in an area with 30%+ of parents red-shirting back to January birthdays, he might struggle in outside activities against much older kids. Whether or not that could be an issue depends on your region and family. Do you have any PS teacher friends you could ask? My friends were honest with me that a summer birthday boy put in at grade level would likely be a struggle for many years to come in our area. We might have made a different decision in a different part of the country, but I think this one has to be decided on a case by case basis.

[Crimson Wife]

I personally think it's ludicrous to "redshirt" normally developing kids with a late spring or very early summer birthday. If the kid is 5 on the 1st day of kindergarten and doesn't have any developmental or suspected LD issues, then he/she should go. The "redshirting" trend is getting out of control and I suspect that the only way to stop all the "gaming" of the system will be via changes to the compulsory education laws.

 

ETA: This is talking about kids who will be attending a brick & mortar kindergarten. Homeschoolers I'm fine with a delayed academics approach.

[HS Mom in NC]

Why do you need to know what "grade" he's in if you homeschool? If you're trying to place him in a church or extra curricular class just go with whatever age they do unless his academic abilities would make him bored with his age mates. Grade levels usually hold back bight students because of the compulsion most people have to do everything in the specified grade level even if the child is perfectly capable of moving on.

 

When people ask my homeschooling kid what grade she's in I have her say 3rd because that's her age, but to be honest, I cringe to think that most of them assume she's doing what a typical ps student in our crappy local ps 3rd grade classroom is doing. There is no grade level for Latin and Greek Roots, the grades on the formal logic cover early elementary school, SOTW is World History and that's not covered at all in ps, and narrations cover a wide range of things.  Her Math is from Singapore and it's not based on grade/age levels because they don't bump kids up to the next level until the kid masters the one they're in.  Grade levels are meaningless gobbledeegook.  They should just ask how old the kid is and be done with it.

 

But since they didn't ask about what she's doing in school, I do the grade level based on age thing because that's the cultural norm. Those that do ask what's she doing are usually embarrassed to follow up with what their kids in the same "grade" are doing.   When my older two (17 and 15) are asked what grade they're in people don't know how to respond to them when they say, "I'm in college."   It's harder to avoid pointing out the low standards of the typical grade level content in that situation.

 

Grade levels in public schools are just about age.  If you've ever compared or than 3 or 4 different types of curriculum (homeschool or otherwise) you know that grade levels are arbitrarily assigned and have no consistency when it comes to content. So, there's no need to pin it down as a homeschooler unless you're surrounded by homeschoolers whose kids used to be in ps or private schools.  Many of them simply cannot let it go when you say, "Grade levels just don't really apply homeschooling." They insist on it being a big deal, so it's best to play along to keep them calm. I've run into it so many times in my 13 years of homeschooling.  It's shocking how much emotion this topic sparks in them. You can take them out of the system, but that's part of the system you can't take out of them.

 

I have a homeschooling friend whose kids asked, "What grade am I in, mom?" She responded with, "What grade to do you want to be in?" They told her and she said very dramatically something like, "I hear by pronounce you to be in grade (whatever the kids said.)" Then she  made a dramatic wave of the hands.  They got her point.

 

[T'smom]

I have a boy who turned 6 in September in 1st grade. I decided to go with the state cutoff even though I hate it. Michigan is in the process of pushing back the cutoff date but when we were starting K the cutoff date was to be 5 by Dec. (I don't remember if it was the 1st or 15th) But if something were to happen and he would need to go to public school, I would want him with his age group. I firmly believe that half of a K class should not be 4 years old.

[bluemongoose]

My boy is a Jan birthday and is 6yo and in 1st grade. The cut off here is Sep 1st. All my kids have winter birthdays, so if they are ready for school just before they turn 5, I start them in K anyway (my first and third child are this way), but if they are not, they start the year they would be in K based on the cut off. I do not imagine that I would redshirt unless there were obvious delay reasons that made in necessary.

[kbutton]

I personally think it's ludicrous to "redshirt" normally developing kids with a late spring or very early summer birthday. If the kid is 5 on the 1st day of kindergarten and doesn't have any developmental or suspected LD issues, then he/she should go. The "redshirting" trend is getting out of control and I suspect that the only way to stop all the "gaming" of the system will be via changes to the compulsory education laws.

 

ETA: This is talking about kids who will be attending a brick & mortar kindergarten. Homeschoolers I'm fine with a delayed academics approach.

 

We see it a lot here, but we also have many people planning babies to be born just past the fall cutoff date for school to give them an advantage. We know families who've spoken openly about doing this. They aren't technically red-shirting, but they may as well be. When my son was in school, it seemed like 80% of the kids have a birthday between September and Christmas.

[The Way of My People]

LOL! I've actually heard September - December called "Birthday Party Season" by parents of PS students! :)

[HS Mom in NC]

I personally think it's ludicrous to "redshirt" normally developing kids with a late spring or very early summer birthday. If the kid is 5 on the 1st day of kindergarten and doesn't have any developmental or suspected LD issues, then he/she should go. The "redshirting" trend is getting out of control and I suspect that the only way to stop all the "gaming" of the system will be via changes to the compulsory education laws.

 

ETA: This is talking about kids who will be attending a brick & mortar kindergarten. Homeschoolers I'm fine with a delayed academics approach.

 

 

We see it a lot here, but we also have many people planning babies to be born just past the fall cutoff date for school to give them an advantage. We know families who've spoken openly about doing this. They aren't technically red-shirting, but they may as well be. When my son was in school, it seemed like 80% of the kids have a birthday between September and Christmas.

 

 

What a bizarre reaction.   I've heard several preschool, kindergarten, first and second public school teachers and administrators advise every single parent they meet to delay all boys by at least a year because developmentally, boys are better off in this situation.That's not taking advantage of anything other than waiting until a child is ready and that's not "taking advantage" in a bad way.

 

How is it any different than homeschoolers delaying academics? If it's OK in one environment, how is it some sort of scam or con in the other? It's just good, common sense that seems to line up with child development if you ask me.  Heaven forbid people not blindly go along with the system just because the system gods have decreed it for all the masses.

 

The last thing ps teachers need is kids who aren't developmentally ready to be there and most boys aren't.  Parents have that responsibility and those making sensible, realistic choices when it comes to their individual children are helping all the kids in the classroom, the teachers and the taxpayers.  They don't your criticism, they need your gratitude.

[Roadrunner]

1st. My younger is a fall baby (just turned 7) and he is in second grade (he went to PS last year as a first grader).

 

Redshirting really hurt us. Last year my already young ( but legally 1st grader), ended up being in the classroom with kids 1.5 years older than him. He didn't fit in socially even though academically he was ahead of his classmates. Taking him out of school this year was partly due to this as well.

[...................]

 Age-wise, you can place him in K and therefore take the pressure off of both of you.  There's no problem AT ALL with doing that.  Don't look at now. Look at 4 years from now.

 

I think it could come back to get you in a few years if you push him ahead.  So really, I kind of think if I were you I would call this K and just explain if anyone asks that you are not into pushing early academics, and that it'll help him a lot down the road.  When 5th and 6th grade roll around, you will see what a huge amount of writing needs to be done, and how one year can make all the difference in the world.  I've seen people push the kids ahead one year and it's OK in first or second grade.  But when you get to fifth grade, their bodies just can't stay still as long and they are less mature.  It makes a difference more down the road.

[...................]

I personally think it's ludicrous to "redshirt" normally developing kids with a late spring or very early summer birthday. If the kid is 5 on the 1st day of kindergarten and doesn't have any developmental or suspected LD issues, then he/she should go. The "redshirting" trend is getting out of control and I suspect that the only way to stop all the "gaming" of the system will be via changes to the compulsory education laws.

 

ETA: This is talking about kids who will be attending a brick & mortar kindergarten. Homeschoolers I'm fine with a delayed academics approach.

 

I disagree.  The choice is between having a child that is painfully young, or a child that is a little older than most of his peers. If you were the actual parent of that particular individual child, would you really not want what is better for him or her?

 

I think any child all the way up to the end of October should be allowed to wait another year.  It makes such a huge difference....

[Farrar]

What a bizarre reaction.   I've heard several preschool, kindergarten, first and second public school teachers and administrators advise every single parent they meet to delay all boys by at least a year because developmentally, boys are better off in this situation.That's not taking advantage of anything other than waiting until a child is ready and that's not "taking advantage" in a bad way.

 

How is it any different than homeschoolers delaying academics? If it's OK in one environment, how is it some sort of scam or con in the other? It's just good, common sense that seems to line up with child development if you ask me.  Heaven forbid people not blindly go along with the system just because the system gods have decreed it for all the masses.

 

The last thing ps teachers need is kids who aren't developmentally ready to be there and most boys aren't.  Parents have that responsibility and those making sensible, realistic choices when it comes to their individual children are helping all the kids in the classroom, the teachers and the taxpayers.  They don't your criticism, they need your gratitude.

 

I agree with you completely from the perspective of thinking about individual kids.

 

From the perspective of how redshirting is effecting the schools and their expectations of what a kindergartener (and then first, second, etc. grader) should be able to do when they have a room full of kids who are six months older than the cut off, I have a huge problem with it.  It means a kid who is on a normal development path is now too young.  I think it's skewing things in many districts.  Of course, it's only in a system where there's so much rigidity and where kindergarteners are expected to be doing test prep where you get such problems and where people feel pressure to redshirt otherwise normally developing kids.  So it's not a problem in a vacuum.  Still, I see why many people really dislike redshirting.

[...................]

1st. My younger is a fall baby (just turned 7) and he is in second grade (he went to PS last year as a first grader).

 

Redshirting really hurt us. Last year my already young ( but legally 1st grader), ended up being in the classroom with kids 1.5 years older than him. He didn't fit in socially even though academically he was ahead of his classmates. Taking him out of school this year was partly due to this as well.

IMO, That was partly your fault for putting a 4 year old in Kindergarten.  .  

 

Not the parents who had the sense to fix the system for their boys. IOW I wouldn't say "red shirting hurt my son."  I would think you would say, "My son was very bright at four and parents on both ends of the continuum were being hurt by the one size fits all system."

 

And partly, which is not your fault, is that you obviously had a very bright child on your hands with a good pre-school upbringing, and that's why you are now homeschooling, which is better and why the system doesn't work for every kid....

[...................]

I would have a child that age with those abilities in 1st grade.  As far as I know, every state (or nearly every one) has a cutoff later than June.  If he were not reading or understanding basic math concepts, then I would consider calling him a K student.

 

My daughter will be 7 in January and she's in 2nd grade.  Her handwriting is pretty bad for 2nd grade, but today was the first time any teacher complained about it (her Q1 report card recommends that she practice writing more).  I would not base a school placement decision on handwriting.  Kids will be typing their work soon enough.

But many on this thread are talking about first grade and kindergarten.  You have too look 4 or 5 years down the road.  

 

It really, really, really behooves the kids, (especially boys) to have that extra maturity year.  NO ONE is saying to hold back a smart kid, but to hold back on the amount of expectations, even in clubs and social groups, Sunday School- it makes a difference everywhere they go.

[Ellie]

I personally think it's ludicrous to "redshirt" normally developing kids with a late spring or very early summer birthday. If the kid is 5 on the 1st day of kindergarten and doesn't have any developmental or suspected LD issues, then he/she should go. The "redshirting" trend is getting out of control and I suspect that the only way to stop all the "gaming" of the system will be via changes to the compulsory education laws.

 

ETA: This is talking about kids who will be attending a brick & mortar kindergarten. Homeschoolers I'm fine with a delayed academics approach.

 

There's a difference between delaying formal academics and deciding what grade level a child is "in."

 

Homeschooled children are not "in" "grades." They are 7yo, or 6yo, or 12yo. They can (and should) learn as much as they are capable of doing, regardless of what time of year it is or how old they are or when their birthdays are.

 

Establishing a grade level has only to do with which group of children hsed children would be with in any given situation, whether it's social (as in Sunday school classes, or scouting organizations, or any other group activity which sorts children according to grade level), or for the sake of standardized testing (because IMHO, children should be tested with other children who are the same approximate age, which translates into grade level). Otherwise, there is no real value in saying that one's homeschooled child is "in" any grade at all, which is to say that there's no good reason *not* to do that according to the child's birthday and the cut-off in the state where he lives.

[kbutton]

What a bizarre reaction.   I've heard several preschool, kindergarten, first and second public school teachers and administrators advise every single parent they meet to delay all boys by at least a year because developmentally, boys are better off in this situation.That's not taking advantage of anything other than waiting until a child is ready and that's not "taking advantage" in a bad way.

 

How is it any different than homeschoolers delaying academics? If it's OK in one environment, how is it some sort of scam or con in the other? It's just good, common sense that seems to line up with child development if you ask me.  Heaven forbid people not blindly go along with the system just because the system gods have decreed it for all the masses.

 

The last thing ps teachers need is kids who aren't developmentally ready to be there and most boys aren't.  Parents have that responsibility and those making sensible, realistic choices when it comes to their individual children are helping all the kids in the classroom, the teachers and the taxpayers.  They don't your criticism, they need your gratitude.

 

Since you are pointing out that boys are considered by many to be universally unready for school at age five, here is another scenario. Purposefully having a child (that you don't even yet know the sex of) in the fall to be ahead of their peers is not the same as evaluating an individual child near school age to see if they are developmentally ready. What if the child is an early maturing girl both physically and mentally who is stuck in a mature body by fourth grade by virtue of missing the Kindergarten cut off? Those girls face a lot of persecution and immature attention from peers. As puberty in girls gets earlier and earlier, it seems that parents who purposefully try to make fall babies are really playing with fire.

 

Those of us whose kids are intellectually ready but average or slightly late to mature in other areas get flack from teachers and other parents about developmentally appropriate behavior. The late birthday kids are often perceived as immature or childish even if they are developmentally right on track for their age. If we go to bat for said children, we get criticized even more for being helicopter parents or wanting special treatment. Our kids are being compared to kids who are sometimes on an entirely different developmental level as far as attention, stamina, self-control, motor control for handwriting, etc. go (I'm not talking about kids who are drastically immature or badly behaved for their age). Yet, they are right on track from a traditional point of view. If we hold these kids back, we risk disinterest in school because it's not challenging. If we supplement at home, then they are even more bored when they are allowed to go. It would be different if there were a variety of maturity levels in the classroom, which is what traditionally happened, but it's more like one huge group in the fall, and then a straggler or two all the way at the end of the year. Having a crop of kids who are older than the traditional norm sets up expectations that then become a new norm.

 

I think it's demeaning, in general, to label all five y.o. boys as developmentally unready at age five. Wow. I realize it's not you may not be saying that as forcefully as most teachers, but teachers want kids who are easy to handle, and at least some of the teachers saying this are hiding behind their "kind" words to excuse the fact that they don't want to deal with typically developing boys. It would be much more honest to say that many five year old girls like school-ish tasks better than boys the same age or that boys needs a different approach in the early years (and so do some girls, frankly).

 

I personally know boys who were held back because of such advice from teachers, and they later lost their love of learning because they were not challenged. They became behavior problems or poor students later in grade school, but by then, the teachers could blame it on tween weirdness instead of immaturity.

[katilac]

It depends on the practices in your area. He would easily make the cutoff here (Sept. 1), but if you live in an area with 30%+ of parents red-shirting back to January birthdays, he might struggle in outside activities against much older kids. <snip>

If you're not in school, I don't think there are many activities that are going to make you struggle. Playground sports go by age, not grade, and non-sports activities tend to have lots of wiggle room for 'playing down.' He's not *young* for 1st grade, so I don't see him as being in with 'much older' kids even in a big red-shirting area.

 

 

I disagree.  The choice is between having a child that is painfully young, or a child that is a little older than most of his peers. If you were the actual parent of that particular individual child, would you really not want what is better for him or her?

 

I think any child all the way up to the end of October should be allowed to wait another year.  It makes such a huge difference....

Parents pretty much do have the choice of waiting, even for birthdays beyond October. Generally speaking, the law only requires that kids be in school or 'an equivalent educational setting.' So, even if the compulsory age is 5, that does not mean they have to be in kinder. They can be in pre-school, they can be home schooled, they can be in an 'educational' day care setting. That's one of the reasons almost every day care uses words like learning, educational, or even school in their name. Even if you don't wish to do any of those things, for idealistic reasons or such, they generally aren't gunning for 5-yr-olds (if you don't enroll them in school to begin with, they won't even know they exist).

 

I agree that parents should feel free to make the best decision for their particular child. This would be easier to do if they looked at ways of building more flexibility into the system.

[boscopup]

1st. My younger is a fall baby (just turned 7) and he is in second grade (he went to PS last year as a first grader).

 

Redshirting really hurt us. Last year my already young ( but legally 1st grader), ended up being in the classroom with kids 1.5 years older than him. He didn't fit in socially even though academically he was ahead of his classmates. Taking him out of school this year was partly due to this as well.

We had the same experience. My 5 year old had students over a year older than him in his class, and it brought the social maturity level up. My son was a normal 5 year old, maturity wise. He was absolutely ready for school. He was academically ahead, and he was developmentally ready to sit in school for K. It was the other kids being older that caused social problems. And this was a June birthday kid, not a 4 year old.

 

It is a vicious cycle... people redshirt boys because the academic requirements for K have been raised above what boys are often developmentally ready for. Then the schools see that most of their K'ers are 6, so they increase the academic expectations. Now in many schools, they expect K students to be working at what used to be called 1st grade level, so more parents redshirt so the kids will be doing 1st grade level at age 6 (now called K).

 

It does irritate me that the problem exists. I don't blame parents for waiting until 6 to send their kids to school in that situation. My current first grader couldn't have handled first grade expectations at age 5. I'm really glad he was born in November, so after the cutoff date here (we didn't plan that - we have only planned a baby around hockey season :D ).

[katilac]

I totally forgot to address the original post: sounds like first grade, by age and ability.

[Farrar]

IMO, That was partly your fault for putting a 4 year old in Kindergarten.  .  

 

But presumably she lives somewhere with a cut off that is Sept. 30 or Oct. 1st or even Dec. 1st.  Why should she be blamed for following the law for a child who is developmentally normal?

 

This is one of my problems with massive redshirting.  It's forcing parents to have to figure this stuff out when a generation ago, they just had to follow the law of when the state said the child should start school.  A good friend of mine has a dd with a late summer birthday who is well within the Sept. 30th cut off here.  Without realizing, she sent her to kindy...  and found that she was a good year and a half younger than many of the other kids.  She's a perfectly smart, if a little shy kid, who has gotten shuffled behind because she's so much younger.  It's so sad.  If the rest of the kids were her age, like they are "supposed" to be, then she would have been fine.  Instead, she's not just on the "young end" she's an outlier.  And her mom got surprised by that. :(

[kbutton]

Another example of why redshirting is harmful with two PS families that will not likely ever consider homeschooling. One boy is being held back for being persistently, painfully shy. Another year (given his history) is unlikely to change anything. He is academically more than ready.

 

Example two...another boy ready academically. He probably has exceptionalities--at the least sensory and speech issues, maybe on the spectrum. His parents don't seem to be aware; they have no resources even if they are except for what school would provide. They think he is immature. He is missing a year of early intervention, best case scenario. He's not far enough off-track to raise big enough flags unless the teacher or parents are astute (the parents would probably not be open to feedback except from a professional with great tact), so the school will likely take a wait-and-see approach. Meanwhile, the poor kid is (and has been) in limbo of poorly fitting everything for a long time. He is at risk of being totally mislabeled because he's smart enough to blend in to a point but not really coping extremely well in overly stimulating environments (very happy at home but quirky). Child number two is one I've known personally since birth. I've also babysat him, I have an Aspie myself, and he's been in non-school activities with one of my kids. I really worry about him.

[FairProspects]

If you're not in school, I don't think there are many activities that are going to make you struggle. Playground sports go by age, not grade, and non-sports activities tend to have lots of wiggle room for 'playing down.' He's not *young* for 1st grade, so I don't see him as being in with 'much older' kids even in a big red-shirting area.

 

 

Everything other than Little League and competitive U teams goes by grades here. All the YMCA sports, Parks & Rec, AWANA, Lego classes - it is all grade based. There is a big difference in gross and fine motor skills between kids up to a year and half apart in age, so yes, I actually do see how it can be a problem here. It is also an attention span issue at various activities.

[RootAnn]

I'm going to address the OP first:

 

1) What you do with him doesn't change no matter what grade you call him. You keep working to his abilities & interests. Don't pull back. Help him enjoy his work & keep going with what you are doing.

 

2) Will he color for you? If so, work on purposeful coloring using small strokes in small areas to work on that motor control. If not, keep working on drawing. Slow & steady on the practice. Don't make it a marathon - make the letters he makes for you count - tell him to make each one the best he can but don't make him do a large amount of them. Four or five that are really good are much better than 15 sloppy ones. Ten minutes of handwriting at a sitting is more than enough.

 

.... And, to address the K/1st discussion - I think each kid should be taken on their own merits. My ds#1 is roughly the same age as OP's and he's definitely a K'er this year and NOT a 1st grader. To each his/her own.

[Roadrunner]

I don't understand. If he's still ahead of kids that are older than he is, your son is just really, really advanced, right? If he was with younger kids who know even LESS, how would that help?

 

{I really don't understand, and I'm not trying to question your experience or conclusions whatsoever, promise!}

He wouldn't have been bullied hopefully and called a baby, I guess. It was a huge issue. He would have fit in socially with others and made some friends.

We thought about keeping him back, but he wouldn't have been served well academically if we had done that. Yes, we knew some kids would have been redshirted because they weren't ready, but more than half of his class? We didn't expect that.

 

Our deadline was December 2nd. It's changing now, but at the time, we followed the law.

[SKL]

30 years ago, boys with September birthdays were often redshirted to make up for the fact that they are not as mature as girls their age.

 

Every year there are more and more people who don't want their kids to be among the youngest in the class.  Pretty soon August was the youngest in some areas/schools.  Then it was July.  Then June.

 

In my kids' school, their youngest classmate has a May birthday (the cutoff when they went to KG was September 30).

 

So now it's a given that all kids born after May are redshirted (in that community at least), so that means that kids with May birthdays are going to be the youngest.  Oh no!  Pretty soon all the May kids will be redshirted and we'll be pushing the effective cuttoff back to April, March, February etc.

 

And the obvious reaction of the school system is to push these kids harder, because they are older and more capable.  It now becomes practically child abuse to put a typical kid in school if his/her birthday is around the legal cutoff date.

 

So what that means is that half of the kids who would have gotten a year of education beginning around age 5 are now going to be denied that.  (Unless they go to preschools which are actually kindergartens!  For those kids, the "academic pushing" just has a different name and costs the parents more.)

 

I put my kids in school early.  I think the schools should be required to accommodate all children who fall within the age range that is legally permitted to be in a given grade.  It should be illegal to deny a child an appropriate education just because other parents manipulate the playing field.  I think parents in my kids' school should thank me for making things a little easier for their kids.

[HS Mom in NC]

So that's a problem with the system ignoring child development.  Maybe if enough parents insist on NOT going along with it, eventually those involved with designing the system will get a clue. I hope they do, but wishing on rainbows hasn't paid off yet, and if I were stuck being a ps mom and had sons, they'd be held back a year unless they were truly ready for early academics.  I would owe it to them. Their future teachers would thank me for not making their already challenging jobs harder for no good reason.

 

Ultimately, every parent is responsible for their own individual children and it's individual children that suffer when parents blindly go along with the system, so parents really have no choice but to make the decision based on their own kids.  Many teachers, as I've pointed out, know very well it's the best route and haven't been able to change the system.  The chances are slim to none there's anything parents can do to change it for everyone else.  They can't go around wishing on rainbows at the expense of their own sons.

 

Just another reason to avoid the conveyor belt entirely if it's at all possible. Maybe this will wake a few parents up to show them that one size does not fit all.  Sure, everybody dislikes red shirting by others when it puts their own child at a disadvantage while others red shirt their kids so their kids will not be disadvantaged. I can't believe how many precious resources (children and treasure)  we're sinking into such a fundamentally flawed system.  This debate isn't selling the ps schools (or increasing taxes for ps) to anyone on the fence.

 

As to the social aspect of there being (GASP!) 12-18 months difference in kids in a room, so what? My older two were 22 months apart and we managed like most homeschoolers do.  I also know a couple of people who taught in multi-aged classrooms for private schooled kids in the early elementary years that were a range of 3 years apart.  Those kids were all doing well.  Then there were people like my dad and one of his girlfriends who went to one room school houses (in two different states in the 40s-60s) with a couple dozen kids aged 6-17.  They did just fine.

[SKL]

In my experience, there is no problem having kids socially mingling with a broad age range.  The problem comes when the teacher pressures, criticizes, punishes the younger kids for not being as advanced (outside of academics) as the older kids.  And punishes the parents for not red-shirting (every problem is allegedly because "s/he is young," though in reality these issues happen to kids of all ages).

 

My daughter has had some problems in school, but social fit is not one of them.  She is very popular and loves the social environment of school.  This has more to do with personality than age IMO.

[wapiti]

. 

 

Edited January 12, 2016 by wapiti

[Crimson Wife]

We see it a lot here, but we also have many people planning babies to be born just past the fall cutoff date for school to give them an advantage. We know families who've spoken openly about doing this. They aren't technically red-shirting, but they may as well be. When my son was in school, it seemed like 80% of the kids have a birthday between September and Christmas.

As mom to 2 fall babies, I suspect it has more to do with couples snuggling up on cold winter nights than anything else. If you conceive in January or February, your baby will be born in October or November.

[SKL]

It's funny, I always thought it would be a bummer for a capable child to be the oldest in his class.  I was the youngest in my class, and it still was not challenging enough.  Can't really see the point of school without challenge.  And 13 years is so long to just be complacent.

[Tanikit]

I was one of the youngest in my class at school and my sister was accelerated and was more than a year younger than most of her class. My DD has a September 14th birthday and by many state standards would only be starting kindergarten now though she is working at a second grade level in everything (except writing) and reading at a 4th grade level. Our schools here start in January and by their standards she should be starting 1st grade this January. I just teach her where she is at and let her join her age appropriate sports and Sunday school classes.

[alisoncooks]

As mom to 2 fall babies, I suspect it has more to do with couples snuggling up on cold winter nights than anything else. If you conceive in January or February, your baby will be born in October or November.

 

This is why there were lots of Fall babies in the rural farming community I grew up in --- harvest was over, less working time in the winter.  My brother and I were October and September kiddos. :p

 

I didn't realize this issues with redshirting.  I had no issues with it as a PS teacher.  

I was in kindergarten for a month before turning 5 (birthday just before the cut-off).  My brother (October bday) was one of the oldest in his class (we're 2 yrs difference but 3 grades).   And our experiences were largely based on personality/ability, not age.  I always excelled academically, was a leader, played sports competitively -- despite being the youngest in my class.