AmandaVT Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 DS is working through MM 1 and it's pretty easy for him - he can do pretty much any addition/subtraction question in his head and a fair bit of multiplication as well. I didn't want to rush him as this is his first year so we're moving at a brisk pace through MM 1 and keeping it fun. Today we are working on the section "when can you subtract" and the premise is that not all subtraction problems are solveable. DS immediately announced that the book was incorrect and the answer would just be -3, -2, etc. I changed the instructions on one of the pages from "find the subtractions where you can't take away that many and cross them out" to "Find the subtractions that equal a negative number and cross them out". Is that how I should be handling this? He knows and "gets" negative numbers, I don't want to confuse him by telling him they don't exist. We are cruising through pretty quickly - maybe I should accelerate him more? We're doing all of the word problems, I'm double checking some of the other ones and having him do 1 per section to make sure he gets it and then I let him do anything that looks fun to him just because he likes math. Thanks for the help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaSprout Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 I've taught this twice. Once as you are- and the second time as "going in debt" ( which Maria says in the instructions somewhere ) for a kid who would no way get negative numbers. For the second, the abacus was handy. No problem to do what you are doing if kiddo gets it, and a number line is a fun add in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexi Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 I'm doing what you are. My dd gets negative numbers so I change the instructions or I simply have her solve them and write the negative number. We are in 2A now. If my child did not get it yet I would wait and teach as written. But if they get it I would modify the instructions to challenge them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boscopup Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 We actually skipped the subtraction chapter completely when my oldest went through MM1, but whenever there was a question of, "Can you subtract?", I would say, "Can you subtract... without going negative?" Problem solved. All my kids have understood negative numbers by 5 years old, so I've had to deal with that with each of them. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmandaVT Posted October 25, 2013 Author Share Posted October 25, 2013 Thank you! So I'm on the right track. I just flipped through the rest of the subtraction chapter and I'm thinking about skipping it and going to the place value stuff - that he doesn't know yet, and since he can subtract stuff like 65-18 in his head, I'm thinking I don't need to ask him to do pages of 6-4. He knows time and money really well too, but I think that chapter will be really fun for him, so I won't skip it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiana Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 Thank you! So I'm on the right track. I just flipped through the rest of the subtraction chapter and I'm thinking about skipping it and going to the place value stuff - that he doesn't know yet, and since he can subtract stuff like 65-18 in his head, I'm thinking I don't need to ask him to do pages of 6-4. He knows time and money really well too, but I think that chapter will be really fun for him, so I won't skip it. I would definitely skip doing pages of 6-4 if he can do stuff like 65-18. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagira Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 Whoa your kids understand negative numbers that easily? I remember being introduced in 5th or so with a witch and a cauldron. Ds10 is just now getting a grasp of this and dd6 has no clue. She is doing MM1A as well as Miquon Red with number rods. I'm just surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TracyP Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 Whoa your kids understand negative numbers that easily? I remember being introduced in 5th or so with a witch and a cauldron. Ds10 is just now getting a grasp of this and dd6 has no clue. She is doing MM1A as well as Miquon Red with number rods. I'm just surprised. My two oldest got negative numbers very easily. (It is too soon to tell with the youngers) I always give the credit to our MN winters. We get a lot of practice with negative numbers. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathmarm Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 ...Today we are working on the section "when can you subtract" and the premise is that not all subtraction problems are solveable. DS immediately announced that the book was incorrect and the answer would just be -3, -2, etc. I changed the instructions on one of the pages from "find the subtractions where you can't take away that many and cross them out" to "Find the subtractions that equal a negative number and cross them out". Is that how I should be handling this? Yes, sounds fine. He knows and "gets" negative numbers, I don't want to confuse him by telling him they don't exist. Definitely don't tell him that they don't exist...Asking him to ID when and where a negative number is the answer is perfectly fine. We are cruising through pretty quickly - maybe I should accelerate him more?...Possibly, Math Mammoth also sells topical workbooks. If you don't own them, it might be advisable to go through the Table of Contents (TOC) and decide which sections are most worth your time and effort. Thanks for the help! You said that he can do double digit subtraction, I wouldn't invest much time with the single digit subtraction if that were the case. Unless there was some benefit to the exercises, such as automating his math facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 We actually skipped the subtraction chapter completely when my oldest went through MM1, but whenever there was a question of, "Can you subtract?", I would say, "Can you subtract... without going negative?" Problem solved. All my kids have understood negative numbers by 5 years old, so I've had to deal with that with each of them. :) I did the same, and would always say "...without going into negative numbers." Like your child and the OPs, my son understood negative numbers early and easily. To the OP you may want to look at the Edward Zaccaro book Primary Grade Challence Math as a fun suppliment that covers a number of topics (like negative numbers) that are considered "advanced" in a humane and joyful way. It would not replace MM, but could be a nice diversion. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagira Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 My two oldest got negative numbers very easily. (It is too soon to tell with the youngers) I always give the credit to our MN winters. We get a lot of practice with negative numbers. ;) That explains it, we live in S. Florida where we have no true winters and no snow :) My kids are like, "How can you have something less than nothing?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmandaVT Posted October 26, 2013 Author Share Posted October 26, 2013 Thank you everyone! TracyP - we're in north central VT and I believe the outside thermometer in winter was DS's first experience with negative numbers as well. And we see them quite regularly from the end of Dec-Feb! Mathmarm - I wasn't sure if there if he would lose out on anything by skipping ahead. I really like the puzzle corners and word problems. And DS loves those as well, so I think I'll have him do those solely until we come to something he hasn't seen yet. Spycar - thanks for the book recommendation. I just put it into the amazon cart to add to my next order. I think that's something he'll enjoy. He's s number loving kid and I want to encourage that without being overly pushy. I realized this week, while we were playing Yahtzee, that he can add up the sum of all five dice as quickly as I can (and I'm pretty quick). He can figure out change in his head when we're out grocery shopping - which I think is due to the love of his play cash register, loves the cuisinaire rods, all things mathy. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathmarm Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 Thank you everyone! ... Mathmarm - I wasn't sure if there if he would lose out on anything by skipping ahead. I really like the puzzle corners and word problems. And DS loves those as well, so I think I'll have him do those solely until we come to something he hasn't seen yet. If you cover only the exercises that serve some direct purpose because he knows the material/skill then there isn't anything for him to lose out on. However, you might want to do the single digit problems orally if he needs more practice with math facts, or even do a few of them just for handwriting practice. If the exercises serve a purpose, then do them. If he is enjoying them and benefiting from them in anyway, then do (at least some of) them, by all means. The purpose they serve may not be directly math related or they may be secondary, but excelling at something that is easy but serves a purpose can be: confidence-building, refining his handwriting, speeding up math-fact recall, laying mental math ground work, building his visualization skills......He's s number loving kid and I want to encourage that without being overly pushy. This can be a tricky edge to walk and what overly-pushy looks like, can vary greatly from parent-child dynamic to parent-child dynamic, so I can't give any direct advice here. I realized this week, while we were playing Yahtzee, that he can add up the sum of all five dice as quickly as I can (and I'm pretty quick). I would look into getting him more interesting math-facts practice then, perhaps sitting down and making him some 5 single digit math fact drills and putting them in a binder for easy access? Instead of answering 6 - 4, perhaps he could answer the problem 6 - 4 + 2 + 8 - 5 instead? He can figure out change in his head when we're out grocery shopping - which I think is due to the love of his play cash register, loves the cuisinaire rods, all things mathy. :-) I think you have a bright little kid on your head. If he is excelling at the mechanical, maybe you should look more into books problem solving for future resources. I think that letting kids excel at the mechanical/algorithmic is fine, even if that opinion isn't the most popular for the elementary crowd. Critical thinking is important but so are precision and skill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 Spycar - thanks for the book recommendation. I just put it into the amazon cart to add to my next order. I think that's something he'll enjoy. PGCM has questions of ascending levels of difficulty in each topic (Level 1, 2, 3, and Einstein levels). The hardests question may (or may not) be to do independently at this age, but it should last you for an extended period. We jumped around in the topics, rather than going in a linear progression, letting the child pick what he wanted to learn. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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