Student or Parent doing the legwork for college?

[openmind421]

How is everyone else striking a balance here?  My GT son is a junior, scores well on standardized tests, takes comm. college courses, AP, and works in a lab at a Big Ten university nearby.  But when it comes to narrowing down colleges, looking for scholarships, etc., he's not very motivated.  He says he doesn't want to write a short essay for a scholarship opportunity ($500, $300, $250) because "it's not very much money".  This from a child who wants to attend engineering schools that are in the $50-60K range!  I've tried to explain that even small scholarships will add up, and we're finding that white males are the new most-discriminated "population", as so many scholarships make clear they're not for him.  I've tried to tell him the "big" scholarship may never materialize, but he seems content to wait for it.  *sigh*

 

How do you other parents encourage your teen to get involved in this process?  I feel it's becoming a part-time job, and he doesn't seem to feel the urgency at this point.

 

Thanks!

 

[Laura Corin]

I did some of the early work and then Calvin took over.  I asked C what his criteria were for colleges and then I came up with names (I know Britain much better than he does, so it was easier for me to narrow down to the kind of setup that he wanted).  I requested the prospectuses for the universities he was interested in, then left them lying around.  He would read them at breakfast.

 

I started talking about open days and one of his friends mentioned taking a trip to a big name university.  Three of them went together (I helped with the travel and hotel arrangements - I had to find a hotel that would take one 16 and two 15yos travelling together).  And Calvin fell in love with the idea of university.  He went on five more open days - mostly on his own, but sometimes with Husband or me.  He has written his UCAS (common application) essay and is working towards the exams he needs to take this year.  

 

Has your son visited a likely university/talked to students doing his subject?  Perhaps he needs something like that to get him excited.

 

L

[retiredHSmom]

I hate to say it but I agree with him.  $300 when you are talking $50,000 isn't much at all.  Consider that he spends several hours working on the essay.  $100 per hour sounds great, but not when you realize that you need 166 scholarships to pay tuition.  A junior taking community college classes, AP classes and working in a lab may not have many hours to spare and spending them writing an essay for a scholarship that you might not get may look pretty futile. Maybe look at ROTC.

[openmind421]

Thanks for your replies so far!   Yes, we did go down south in the spring to visit three different universities that offer the major he wants.  He's already eligible for one of the top scholarships at one of those universities, but it is still not even half of the total cost of tuition.  

 

Tania, I do see your point about the busy schedule.  However, a handful of $500.00 scholarships would at least pay for books!  I'm just starting to get a bit frantic here because I completed a sample FAFSA, and WHAT A JOKE!   We're not "eligible" for much aid, and we cannot go into debt for college.  I've also encouraged my son to try to avoid going into debt.

 

ROTC not an option....he actually wanted to attend the US Naval Academy, but given the current level of morale in the military and the current budget issues facing the military, the USNA is off the table.

 

*sigh*  I'm sure so many of you have already walked this road!

 

 

[Sunshine State Sue]

My sister and bil determined how much $$$$$ they were willing to spend on their dc's college education and communicate that clearly.  If the dc wanted to go somewhere where it was going to cost more than they were willing to pay, it was up to the dcto make up the difference.  I like the idea, but ds refuses to cooperate. 

 

I alternate between pushing and prodding ds and looking for less expensive alternatives.  Look for those schools where he is in the top 10% or 25% or whatever so that merit aid is more likely.  Have a financial backup. 

 

I have been trying to self-educate on the financial aid front.  It's not easy.  You are right.  I look at it as a temporary, part-time, unpaid job. 

[Ravin]

He's rejecting ROTC/USNA because of military budget cuts? Or you are? If he gets it, he gets it budget cuts notwithstanding. Not sure why it would be off the table. It's not likely cuts would affect training/scholarship/recruiting devices. 

[regentrude]

While I agree that the small scholarships may add up, you should also investigate how the colleges he is interested in deal with external scholarship money. Some schools DD has been looking at will simply reduce their aid if the student earned outside scholarships, so any savings would be the colleges', and the student would not see an extra penny. Which would not be a great motivation for the student.

[Pawz4me]

While I agree that the small scholarships may add up, you should also investigate how the colleges he is interested in deal with external scholarship money. Some schools DD has been looking at will simply reduce their aid if the student earned outside scholarships, so any savings would be the colleges', and the student would not see an extra penny. Which would not be a great motivation for the student.

 

^^This.^^

 

I think small scholarships are probably not worth the time and effort involved.  We're pretty much just hoping that DS will qualify for significant merit aid at the majority of the schools he applies to.

 

As far as narrowing down colleges, etc. -- We've left that totally up to DS.  Our thinking is that if a kid isn't mature/motivated enough to take the lead on that, he's probably not ready to be going off to a four-year school.  Now DS has firmly taken control of his college search (and now the application process), so I can't say for sure that we wouldn't have stepped in, but I don't think we would have. We've seen too many parents micromanage the process because the kid won't, only to have the kid back home in a month or two and the parents out of $$$. 

[creekland]

I completed a sample FAFSA, and WHAT A JOKE!   We're not "eligible" for much aid, and we cannot go into debt for college.  I've also encouraged my son to try to avoid going into debt.

 

Did you try the net price calculators at the colleges he is interested in?  They may be more accurate.

 

If in need of merit aid, you really do need to look at schools where he will be in the top 10 - 20% of students, and then make sure those schools offer merit aid.  Look closely at their numbers from the common data set to see what the odds are.  Low odds can be worth applying to if his stats are worthy.  0% odds are not.  Avoiding debt is usually not possible for a really good degree.  The amount of debt that is worth investing into ones future varies.  For us, it's around 30K (totally, not annually).  That's about the price of a car... and should be easily paid off a few years after graduation.  The degree and opportunities it offers are with the student for a lifetime.  Hubby had some debt when he graduated (we also got married the year he graduated).  We lived frugally back when we had no kids and got the debt paid off.  We've reaped the benefits ever since.  Had he opted for no debt I'm not sure it ever would have happened - certainly not in the same time frame or from a college as respected in his field as his was.

 

While I agree that the small scholarships may add up, you should also investigate how the colleges he is interested in deal with external scholarship money. Some schools DD has been looking at will simply reduce their aid if the student earned outside scholarships, so any savings would be the colleges', and the student would not see an extra penny. Which would not be a great motivation for the student.

Do check this out before really pushing the smaller scholarships.  His time doing them could, indeed, be worthless if he gets any aid from the school.  If this is not the case, then by all means... start showing him the value of the $$.  ;)

 

Oh... and with regards to college apps, white males aren't actually the most discriminated group (last I checked).  Asian females, Asian males, and White females have it worse.  The males likely overtake the females when it comes to engineering though.  I seriously doubt White males overtake Asian males though.

 

To answer your original question... I did the bulk of the checking into schools as I had far more time for it.  I used data that they wanted fit-wise (major as well as type and locations, etc).   My boys looked carefully at any that passed what we needed financially.  They were also free to suggest any names they came up with from any lead.

 

So far, it's worked well.  We have one more to go this year.

[Penguin]

I have been through the process twice. Here is the most recent experience. 

 

Junior Year.  There were plenty of discussions and campus visits, but not really that many specific tasks for my student to do. He was rock solid on his major, so that helped.  I really tried to get him to narrow down what was important to him:  Small classes?  Urban environment?  Good weather?  You get the idea :)  I certainly helped him come up with schools that seemed like a good fit, but I did not mind.  I enjoyed the research.

 

Senior Year:   We set up a Sunday meeting time, and we met once per week to discuss deadlines and progress.  I tried very hard not to bring the topic up outside of the weekly meeting, but it would be disingenuous for me to claim that I never nagged :).

 

After those initial  visits/discussions, we took a project management approach and created tasks and deadlines.  We both had input at this point.  After that, he did all of the work.  I still have my notes, so I can share.

 

First task:

Make a preliminary list of schools.

Include reach, match and safety schools.  If you are not sure what this means, read this article.

Discuss your list with me.  You should be able to answer these questions:  Is this school a safety, a match or a reach?  Why is this school on your list?

 

Concrete tasks all along the way : 

Launch the Common App, make sure that your SAT scores have been sent, etc.

 

Finalizing the list of schools:

 

Finalize your list of schools.

Be able to answer these questions:  How much does it cost?  What scholarships, if any, would be possible? Why is this school on your list?  What is the IB credit policy ?  (He was an IB student. I did not want IB credits to drive his list, but I wanted him to make an informed choice.)

 

At the end of the meeting, we discussed what should be done by the next meeting.  Some weeks,  there was nothing in need of attention.  Those were two minute meetings.

 

 

 

I would like to add that I do not think that it is unusual for parents and high-school students to define "last-minute" differently:)

 

HTH.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[creekland]

 

I would like to add that I do not think that it is unusual for parents and high-school students to define "last-minute" differently:)

 

:lol:  Definitely true!

[Sunshine State Sue]

 Look closely at their numbers from the common data set to see what the odds are.  Low odds can be worth applying to if his stats are worthy.  0% odds are not.

Would you share where the common data set is and perhaps give an example from it?

[openmind421]

Wow!  Thanks so much for all the insight!  Penguin, I like the idea of the weekly meetings; I think that would help with goal-setting. 

 

He would have been a great fit for the USNA and was even accepted into their STEM summer program last year.  However, he was quite unsettled by the administration's handling of the Benghazi incident and began questioning if he really wanted to serve in the military.  

 

Regentrude, thanks for mentioning that some schools will reduce aid if you are awarded outside scholarships....I wasn't aware of that.  Kinda stinks, imo.

 

Thanks to all you homeschool-high school veterans!  Keep the ideas coming!  

 

[Penguin]

Would you share where the common data set is and perhaps give an example from it?

 

Sue, try putting Common Data Set along with the Institution Name in your search engine.  Alternatively, go to the college's web site and use their site map to see if you can find it.

 

To the best of my knowledge, there is no one-stop for the CDS and not all institutions publish their CDS.  Someone will surely chime in if I am wrong about that...

[Penguin]

At the end of the meeting, we discussed what should be done by the next meeting.  Some weeks,  there was nothing in need of attention.  Those were two minute meetings.

 

 

I should have emphasized this part.  By having a two-minute meeting instead of no meeting, the habit of a weekly meeting became automatic.

[creekland]

Would you share where the common data set is and perhaps give an example from it?

I agree with using google and/or the school's web site.  Most colleges have data they report - not all do.

 

For an example for my youngest, this year, I can google "Eckerd" and "Common Data Set" to get this webpage of data:

 

http://www.eckerd.edu/about/commondataset/

 

Then I scroll down to section H.

 

Line 3 shows me they give institutional need based and non-need based aid.  That keeps them on our list.  ;)

 

For need based aid, H2 sections d & h tell me that almost 20% of students determined to have need had their need fully met without PLUS, private, or unsubsidized loans (they could still have the basic subsidized loans, but that doesn't amount to much).

 

Line i tells me that, on average, 86% of need is met.

 

For merit aid, lines n & o tell me how many were given merit scholarships and the average $$ amount.  Elsewhere on their website they say their highest merit award is 17K if memory serves me correctly.  If I wanted/needed my guy to get a full ride here based upon merit alone I'd need to do a little more searching to see if they have any offerings like that, but it's highly doubtful. 

 

If a student's EFC is affordable, Eckerd could be a decent school to consider.

[Luckymama]

If it wasn't for me doing the vast majority of the early leg work, my college kids would still be living in my house.

 

Ds was the worst. He had no idea what he wanted to major in, and he had no idea what schools might interest him. We spent a lot of time talking about he'd prefer----cold vs warm area, large vs small campus, hilly vs flat (he bikes so this actually was important), a walkable campus vs one that requires bus use, landscaping or the lack thereof (this was important--he needed a physically attractive campus), equalish M:F vs lopsided in either direction, distance from home/travel difficulties, etc.

 

I knew he would need merit aid to attend college, so I searched websites, Common Data Sets, and spent way too much time on College Confidential. I looked for schools where ds would be in the top 20% of the applicants based on test scores and GPA (ds attended a private high school), then I sorted those schools based on the qualities ds was looking for. Since he wasn't sure about a major, I focuses on schools which were strong overall and would accept most if not all of ds's AP scores for credit or placement. I knew that if/when he changed his major, those AP credits might make the difference in needing to take classes during the summer.

 

After I created The Big List of 25 possibilities, ds spent a good amount of time reading the schools' websites and the information mailed to him. He eliminated several. Dh took ds to visit some schools, and I took him to visit one. Two that were at the top of his list were eliminated after the visits. He applied to four schools, received four acceptances, and received the highest or next-to-highest merit awards at all the schools.

 

Ds skated quite close to application deadlines set by his high school. They wanted the boys to have certain steps done by certain days (all-boy school) so that the school would be able to get all their stuff done way before the actual deadlines.

 

Dd18 learned from watching her brother ;). She narrowed potential majors down to two by the end of junior year. We created a list of 20 schools together that summer (the way I had done for/with ds). We met with her college counselor at her private high school in July who added a few other schools to the list. And then we started to visit. One school was eliminated 15 minutes into the visit :lol:

 

She applied to seven schools. We were really uncertain how the merit aid would play out with some of the schools. She knew how much we would pay per year, and that she'd have to make up any difference in scholarships or loans. She didn't want any loans so we waited and waited for merit money. She did very, very well despite not having as high stats as her brother. One $52K school (!!) gave her so much money that it brought the cost down to the cost of our state flagship ($22K total COA). April was a very looooooooong month as she tried to make her final decision.

[Sunshine State Sue]

Thank you for the explanation, creekland.  Eckerd is one that ds has applied to.

If a student's EFC is affordable, Eckerd could be a decent school to consider.

It is my understanding that no student's EFC is affordable.  :crying: I know ours isn't.
 

[Susan in TN]

If it wasn't for me doing the vast majority of the early leg work, my college kids would still be living in my house.

 

Ds was the worst. He had no idea what he wanted to major in, and he had no idea what schools might interest him. We spent a lot of time talking about he'd prefer----cold vs warm area, large vs small campus, hilly vs flat (he bikes so this actually was important), a walkable campus vs one that requires bus use, landscaping or the lack thereof (this was important--he needed a physically attractive campus), equalish M:F vs lopsided in either direction, distance from home/travel difficulties, etc.

 

 

 

It is so good to hear that my ds is not the only one.  I think his issue (with this and most other things) is that he can't make a decision unless he thinks he has all the information and he can make a defining choice.  Unfortunately with college, he has no idea what he wants in a school.  We are visiting a handful of local colleges and universities to try to give him a ballpark understanding, but still he has no real "college experience" so he feels stuck.  Add to that his inability to choose an even general course of study, and you have mom making lists of prospective schools and saying - OK, dear, tonight we will apply to this or that state university or college. 

 

In the mean time, I am trying to encourage him that scholarship funding will help us make a decision and that even if he chooses one college/major and it's a disaster, he can always transfer and/or make changes. 

[creekland]

It is my understanding that no student's EFC is affordable.  :crying: I know ours isn't.

 

Some students have a very low EFC.  It's not uncommon at our school for some to have an EFC of 0 - many more have it at 5K or less.  The 0 should be affordable.  Whether or not the <5K is depends upon the situation just as it does for anyone.

 

We're visiting Eckerd on our upcoming FL trip so we'll know soon afterward if my guy wants to apply or not.  It is rather high on his list via info from mailings and their website.

[Kareni]

When my daughter expressed an interest in majoring in Latin/the Classics, I looked into what colleges had that major but also met full financial aid or were considered "Best Buy" colleges. I then narrowed down the list by eliminating those colleges which did not seem as though they would be a good fit for her (i.e., too big, too conservative, too cold!, etc.) That left about thirty colleges on the list. I then passed the list on to her, and she wrote to each department asking for information. (She wrote those letters as I recall early in her junior year.) The replies she received helped her narrow the field further. She ultimately applied to ten colleges and was accepted by eight.

 

She applied widely because we are fairly low income so financial aid offers would play a big role. Of the ten colleges she applied to, one was an Ivy League school. She was denied admission there; however, this school has a generous aid policy such that had she been accepted, it might well have offered the best aid. She applied to two highly selective liberal arts colleges (one offered admission, one put her on the wait list). Five other applications went to liberal arts colleges or small universities of varying selectivity. The final application went to our state university's honor college.

The financial aid offers of the eight accepting schools varied tremendously (up to about $14,000 dollars difference in the combination of out of pocket and loan payments for the academic year). Several of the private liberal arts colleges would have cost significantly less than our state university.

 

She happily attended one of those highly selective liberal arts colleges.  As Regentrude mentions above, do look into how colleges deal with outside scholarships and grants.  My daughter's college is one that subtracts most of those awards from grants that they give resulting in a near zero net change for the student.

 

Regards,

Kareni

 

 

[regentrude]

DD wants to major in physics with a possible double major in English and thus was not looking at a tech school, but at a school with a top physics program as well as strong humanities. DH helped DD make an initial list of colleges that have the best physics programs. DD researched the school's website and created a spreadsheet with lots of criteria. She narrowed down the list by eliminating schools that are too big for her liking or that are in locations she does not want. The remaining list has 14 or so schools.

She is in charge of the application process; I have done my part on the common app.

Some of the schools offer generous financial aid but are very competetive; we found that at this point, it makes not much sense to fine tune finances. We will wait for acceptances and revisit the financial issues when we know where she was admitted.

[creekland]

The financial aid offers of the eight accepting schools varied tremendously (up to about $14,000 dollars difference in the combination of out of pocket and loan payments for the academic year).

Both oldest and middle sons' accepting schools varied tremendously with costs left for us too.  I don't recall the exact amount of the difference for oldest, but I do recall one of middle son's schools wanting us to pay > $35,000.  We axed that one quickly.  Three of his choices were < 10K - far more affordable for us (and in line with our EFC).  He could also have chosen other schools where he could likely have gone for free or very close to it.  He opted not to even apply to those as they didn't have as much depth as he wanted - his stats would have put him at or near the top student there - with few, if any, peers.  We were 100% ok with that.  Some might prefer those options financially.  If so, look for schools that have full ride scholarships and your student is way over the top stats-wise.

[Crimson Wife]

He would have been a great fit for the USNA and was even accepted into their STEM summer program last year.  However, he was quite unsettled by the administration's handling of the Benghazi incident and began questioning if he really wanted to serve in the military.

By the time he is finished with college there will be a new administration. So I wouldn't let Obama stand in the way of pursuing an appointment to a service academy or a ROTC scholarship.

[Teachin'Mine]

I wonder what's cookin' as I can see someone stirring a pot ...

 

Openmind seems like a misnomer for a moniker.  JMO.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

By the time he is finished with college there will be a new administration. So I wouldn't let Obama stand in the way of pursuing an appointment to a service academy or a ROTC scholarship.

From induction to leaving the reserves, I served under Reagan, Bush, Clinton and G W Bush. The Cold War loomed large at the beginning, the Berlin Wall fell, the USSR collapsed, Haiti and Cuba sent thousands to sea in rafts, Yugoslavia devolved, there were numerous terror attacks including September 11th, a Global War on Terror, war in Afghanistan and Iraq.

There were rifs and boards where few were promoted and years when there were retention bonuses.

 

I would think that this cycle is pretty common for careers over the last century. I don't try to talk people into the military. There are plenty of good reasons for doing other things. But I think expecting to always agree with the administration and congress isn't realistic. My $0.02.

[swimmermom3]

I wonder what's cookin' as I can see someone stirring a pot ...

 

Openmind seems like a misnomer for a moniker.  JMO.

 

Thanks for saying it. My thoughts exactly.

 

[Lori D.]

If it wasn't for me doing the vast majority of the early leg work, my college kids would still be living in my house.

 

 

I was in the same boat with Lucky Mama -- 2 DSs with no idea of what they wanted to do, coupled with extreme introversion and dislike of having to get out there and find out about things they knew nothing about.

 

Since neither DS knew what he wanted to do, and we have extremely limited funds for college, and because we have a high quality community college (CC) with credits accepted to many schools... after discussing with DSs, they opted to head straight to the CC for Associate Degrees and transfer certificates. We did not search further.

 

I also spearheaded the scholarship search. A number of opportunities of smaller local awards passed by while they were in high school due to DSs' lack of interest or caring to put in the effort to seek out funds. :(

 

So, when older DS graduated, I decided to make our money go as far as possible by doing the legwork on the scholarship search for college. I found the info and then sat down WITH DSs to fill out the online application and essay question answers. Basically, they are doing it, but I am holding their hands to make sure it happens. It was well worth it, as older DS received an $800 award his first year (covered his books and a bus pass), and then last year AND this year each, received a $2500 award which *almost* covered all of the year's tuition at the CC. And younger DS received a $1500 award this year! All of which helps "protect" the small amount of funds we've been saving and adding to since they were born, to go towards the 4-year degree each will now need to go for.

 

Older DS will finish both his AAS in Digital Arts: Film & Video Production, and a transfer certificate at the end of this year. He just decided this fall to NOT use the transfer certificate at the local public university, but knows he wants to look for a small Christian liberal arts college that will transfer a lot of his credits, so he can finish a degree in 2 years, starting in Fall 2014. So, we are actually just now starting a college search for this DS who would be starting at a university/college 3 years after high school graduation. We'll be attending a Christian College Fair in Oct., and driving to visit a campus a few hours away this fall, so DS can start to figure out what he wants to do.

 

We will definitely be striving for scholarships and work study, as room and board will bump 2 years at a school away from home to at least $25,000/year, which is way more than what we have been able to save, in spite of frugal living all along, and being debt-free except for a moderate mortgage. I cannot express how frustrating it was to watch college costs double in those years our DSs were in high school -- and to see the amount we were able to save for each drop from being able to cover SIX semesters for each, to just THREE semesters. :(

 

Younger DS has also discovered he needs a Bachelor's in order to take the Nat'l Certification test for Interpreting for the Deaf (which is the 3-year AAS he is working on currently). Fortunately, we just learned that one of our state's public universities will take all of the credits from that program, and he would only need to do 30 credits at the university (all online! YEA -- no room & board on top of tuition!) in order to earn a Bachelor's. Due to mild LDs, he will likely need 3 semesters to do those credits, so we will still be looking for scholarships for next year (his last at the CC), and for when he transfers to the university. He is working hard, but he may not be able to keep a GPA up high enough for scholarships.

 

In both cases, I also highly encouraged them to fill out the application and pay the one-time/lifetime fee of $80 when they were invited to join Phi Theta Kappa, in order to help access possible transfer from CC-to-university scholarship dollars awarded by Phi Theta Kappa.

 

Also, in each year, I have taken a step back, and placed more of the burden on them.

 

 

I suppose I am being a "helicopter mom", and taking on too much of what DSs should be initiating... But, they are NOT initiators by nature, times have changed dramatically from when I went to college, and the economy has so reduced the value of what we were able to save for DSs, that I felt that if by putting in a few hours at something I'm good at -- online research -- I could make the hoop-jumping happen and help DSs earn some much-needed scholarships to help stretch our education $$ ... well, then I guess I can live with the stigma of helicoptering... ;)

 

Just wanted to share our path, which is different from many on this board who go straight from high school graduation to high quality colleges with scholarships. It's been a very good route for us financially, but it has also been an excellent route for DSs for giving them time to mature, to begin to figure out what they want to do with their lives, and to do their "late blooming" in their unique timetable. :)

 

BEST of luck to all, whatever your post-high school path looks like, and however much of the research/prep is done solo by student / together / or mostly by parent. Warmest regards, Lori D.

[Lori D.]

...He says he doesn't want to write a short essay for a scholarship opportunity ($500, $300, $250) because "it's not very much money".  This from a child who wants to attend engineering schools that are in the $50-60K range!  I've tried to explain that even small scholarships will add up, and we're finding that white males are the new most-discriminated "population", as so many scholarships make clear they're not for him...

 

Same here. I just went ahead, did the legwork, and came in and said, "Okay, now it's time for you to do an essay for the scholarship application". I counted it as the writing for that day/week. :)

 

And it really depends on your situation whether it's worth it to go for for $250 with an essay. If your student can knock it out in 2 hours, IMO yes it is worth it -- so many small scholarships actually go UNawarded because no one was willing to do the 2 hours of work to apply and write the essay. What job pays a high school student $100/hour??! Only if I really KNEW my child would be losing out on a big scholarship because the college reduced its award due to outside monies would it not be valuable to go for the "petty cash". And neither of my DSs is that type of student to be guaranteed of getting big scholarship $$...

 

Also worth it to us even if all DSs is "book money" amounts. It will be less debt for their future, as DSs know we only have limited funds for their college expenses. The Dave Ramsey Foundations in Personal Finance DVDs really made an impact on them on how debt drastically reduces your options, and how being able to invest even just $2000/year in la ong-term investment for a few years as early in your working career as possible will reap much greater benefits due to compound interest... They are both very interested in investing, rather than having to spend their earnings on tuition and books, so that has been a helpful motivator as I walk alongside them in this process...

[xixstar]

Thanks for posting this, we need to set this up. Lets just ignore that were into the senior year and nothing at all is done yet except 1 attempt at the SAT that won't turn heads and now wondering about signing up for ACT or the November SAT... We need to set a time and stick to it to meet each week especially because seems like everyone else is already way far ahead on this.

 

 

 

I have been through the process twice. Here is the most recent experience. 

 

Junior Year.  There were plenty of discussions and campus visits, but not really that many specific tasks for my student to do. He was rock solid on his major, so that helped.  I really tried to get him to narrow down what was important to him:  Small classes?  Urban environment?  Good weather?  You get the idea :)  I certainly helped him come up with schools that seemed like a good fit, but I did not mind.  I enjoyed the research.

 

Senior Year:   We set up a Sunday meeting time, and we met once per week to discuss deadlines and progress.  I tried very hard not to bring the topic up outside of the weekly meeting, but it would be disingenuous for me to claim that I never nagged :).

 

After those initial  visits/discussions, we took a project management approach and created tasks and deadlines.  We both had input at this point.  After that, he did all of the work.  I still have my notes, so I can share.

 

First task:

Make a preliminary list of schools.

Include reach, match and safety schools.  If you are not sure what this means, read this article.

Discuss your list with me.  You should be able to answer these questions:  Is this school a safety, a match or a reach?  Why is this school on your list?

 

Concrete tasks all along the way : 

Launch the Common App, make sure that your SAT scores have been sent, etc.

 

Finalizing the list of schools:

 

Finalize your list of schools.

Be able to answer these questions:  How much does it cost?  What scholarships, if any, would be possible? Why is this school on your list?  What is the IB credit policy ?  (He was an IB student. I did not want IB credits to drive his list, but I wanted him to make an informed choice.)

 

At the end of the meeting, we discussed what should be done by the next meeting.  Some weeks,  there was nothing in need of attention.  Those were two minute meetings.

 

 

 

I would like to add that I do not think that it is unusual for parents and high-school students to define "last-minute" differently:)

 

HTH.

 

[MicheleinMN]

While I agree that the small scholarships may add up, you should also investigate how the colleges he is interested in deal with external scholarship money. Some schools DD has been looking at will simply reduce their aid if the student earned outside scholarships, so any savings would be the colleges', and the student would not see an extra penny. Which would not be a great motivation for the student.

 

This is what my dd and I found when she was working on applications, so we agreed it was more important for her to find a school who covers 100% of Cost of Attendance (not just tuition) rather than work on a ton of small scholarships.  Even with a school that works to cover 100% CoA, my dd was still expected to take out the maximum in govt. loans each year.

 

And dd and I both worked hard to find the right schools for her, and while she is a VERY motivated student, she still needed a tremendous amount of hand-holding through the entire process.

 

HTH

[AnitaMcC]

How is everyone else striking a balance here?  My GT son is a junior, scores well on standardized tests, takes comm. college courses, AP, and works in a lab at a Big Ten university nearby.  But when it comes to narrowing down colleges, looking for scholarships, etc., he's not very motivated.  He says he doesn't want to write a short essay for a scholarship opportunity ($500, $300, $250) because "it's not very much money".  This from a child who wants to attend engineering schools that are in the $50-60K range!  I've tried to explain that even small scholarships will add up, and we're finding that white males are the new most-discriminated "population", as so many scholarships make clear they're not for him.  I've tried to tell him the "big" scholarship may never materialize, but he seems content to wait for it.  *sigh*

 

How do you other parents encourage your teen to get involved in this process?  I feel it's becoming a part-time job, and he doesn't seem to feel the urgency at this point.

 

Thanks!

 

For my Dd, I had to do very little.  She was very motivated and independent.  I only helped when she asked for it.  She did the applications, scheduled interviews and physical, request the Presidential nomination/Senator nominations for the Naval Academy.  She handled it all.

 

For my Ds1, I had to basically do all of it.  He just couldn't handle it.  It was too overwhelming to him.  Some of the time I had to fill out the forms, etc while he sat with me.  Some of the time I was able to have him fill out the forms with me supervising/guiding.  I went with him to registration and made sure what needed to get done got done.  We went together to his guidance counselor to deal with his ADA accommodations.  Usually all I had to do was tell him what needed to be done/what to ask about, and then have him follow through with me nearby in case he got confused or forgot to do/ask something.  No way could he have done it on his own.  But through out it all, he was right there with me.

[regentrude]

For my Ds1, I had to basically do all of it.  He just couldn't handle it.  It was too overwhelming to him.  Some of the time I had to fill out the forms, etc while he sat with me.  Some of the time I was able to have him fill out the forms with me supervising/guiding.  I went with him to registration and made sure what needed to get done got done.  We went together to his guidance counselor to deal with his ADA accommodations.  Usually all I had to do was tell him what needed to be done/what to ask about, and then have him follow through with me nearby in case he got confused or forgot to do/ask something.  No way could he have done it on his own. 

 

So how is he handling things now in college? Juggling his schedule, work load, deadlines, electronic assignment systems, etc?

The applications are certainly a pain in the neck, but not more complex than actually being a college student.

I am not being snarky, just curious.

[memphispeg]

We got all the guides in the summer betw. sophomore and Jr. years and independently looked at schools.  We all made lists in the back of the places we thought were "cool".  We visited some of the cool places that were on our way to somewhere else.  In Jr. year, the dds started narrowing their choices and we visited what ever ones we could.  In the summer between jr. and sr. year, the dds and I made up a binder with a section for each school, with tasks to be done for each application.  We had a weekly meeting, and looked at the calendar and decided what each of us should be doing next.  This made it less stressful for all of us as we all knew what we should be doing.  

Oddly enough, the binders are something that both dds will not let me throw away ever!!!!?????

 

We received a variety of financial aid offers for both dds.  The best came for my eldest from a slac, we paid very little for her education as a result.  

[AnitaMcC]

So how is he handling things now in college? Juggling his schedule, work load, deadlines, electronic assignment systems, etc?

The applications are certainly a pain in the neck, but not more complex than actually being a college student.

I am not being snarky, just curious.

 

He's handling it well.  His professors and the student services is helping.  He just needs to be told or shown what and how to do things and then he is fine.  With the applications, registering for classes, seeing the campus for the first time, etc.,  it was all new and he needed to be shown once and then he is good to go.  After he is shown, then he has a sort of template to follow.  Makes sense?   It is mainly to do with his autism.  But now he is already an old pro at college-LOL.

[kiana]

Anita I am glad to hear your kids are doing well, I wondered how it was going.

[J-rap]

My kids all varied with this (ambition to apply to colleges independently, etc.). A couple who were very ambitious did everything completely on their own. A couple others dragged their feet quite a bit and I was much more involved. (But once they were in, they picked up the ball and did great.)

 

My youngest is now going to a non-traditional college for a year abroad, and I really wanted her to apply to some 4-year U.S. colleges for the fall of 2014 before leaving the country. I think it was quite overwhelming for her. I pretty much had to sit her down, pull up the applications online while sitting next to her, and walk her through the questions. Then, she'd work on the essays on her own over the next few weeks. I helped her make lists of everything she needed to do, such as contacting people for reference letters, etc.

 

Our lives are kind of complicated right now, and so I told her that if I was going to be walking her through the college application process (which I was happy to do), it would be for colleges/universities in our state close to relatives, so that she will have the help and support she needs over the years, and to help simplify our lives. I did encourage her to apply at others too, if she was interested, but explained that I needed her to take more initiative on those because I only have so much time and energy right now. :)

 

In the end, she applied at five colleges all within about ten miles from each other in our home state. On her last weekend home, we spent about 3 hours touring all five colleges. Those were our college trips! She has been accepted at 3/5 so far.

[Katy]

Slightly off topic, but if you won't do the military, you won't do debt, and you don't have $50K to pay for school, and you make too much money for much aid, I highly suggest you look into honors programs at good state universities.  He'd have to work very hard to get very good standardized test scores, but many programs will give full ride scholarships to even out of state students with near-perfect scores.  Plus, the honors programs would surround him with academically inclined students with good study habits, give him access to mentors and advisers who could perhaps get him involved in research (a huge plus if he decided to apply to graduate school), and generally there are more part-time job opportunities in areas with larger universities.

 

A comparison, from my experience:

 

I fell for the marketing and went to a ridiculously expensive private tech school.  I went a year early to one of those programs designed for gifted students.

 

A friend of mine opted to go to a state university honors program instead. She didn't apply for more than 5 extra scholarships, but I think she got 4 of them. She stayed in high school for senior year but took tons of AP and CLEP exams and got two years ahead for college.  She got a president's scholarship for full tuition and books in a state university.  She got a part time job to cover room and board and expenses freshman year, the following year worked as an RA for free room & board, and also worked assisting in medical research.  She took only 12 credit hours at a time, but harder courses and worked hard at the research job.   She got a minor in Spanish and spent a term abroad getting fluent in Spanish.  When she graduated she got offers to Johns Hopkins and Mayo medical schools.  Mayo offered her a scholarship with a stipend because of her amazing recommendations, research experience, and being fluent in Spanish.   Her parents took the money they'd saved towards her college expenses (but not spent), made a down payment towards a condo near her school, and she got roommates. The roommates covered the mortgage payments, her stipend covered the rest of the expenses, and she graduated from a great medical school with no debt.  She even made money when she sold the condo.

 

After all of that, if I had it to do over again I would have gone to a state university. We are guiding our DC heavily towards test prep and state university honors programs too.  You don't have to go in state to get into those programs, but you do have to have near-perfect grades and test scores.

 

Of course, if DC insist on applying to a dream school we encourage them to do so, some of them do have pretty great aid packages.  But when you compare NO debt to lots of debt?  It's not a difficult decision.

[Storm Bay]

I think this varies a great deal depending on the family. Had I left this to my dd she'd probably be living at home & in CC due to procrastination issues. As it is, she's living on campus at a state college on a very large scholarship (I should add that she didn't do all of her high school at home) that includes nearly everything because I helped. She wrote the essays, of course, did any interviews, etc, but I did the grunt work on the Common App etc.

 

However, there are some teens who are very motivated to do it themselves and/or who learn a lot doing it for themselves. My dd's scholarship was application based, first come first serve, so once I saw that she met the criteria I felt it not worthwhile to wait & see if she got the Common App done in time. I should add that her moving out has been the best thing for her as well as for the rest of us (she's not that far away, so I've seen her a few times, but she hasn't come home yet.)

 

I also made sure she did college visits, both to ones she wanted to see that she learned about at a college fair and to state schools I knew had good scholarships, etc. I also dragged my younger dd along to save gas later, and it's paying off now because she's working harder to get into good schools and/or get scholarships than she would have otherwise. I'm not sure how we'll divvy up the legwork when it's her turn.

 

Dds scholarship covers tuition, fees, room & board & in one area of math is fifth in the nation. By doing the requirements to stay in the honours college she'll also get $300 per semester credit at the campus bookstore for textbooks.

[Hunter's Moon]

I just wanted to comment that you are all wonderful, caring mothers who have very lucky children!

 

 

[Penguin]

I just wanted to comment that you are all wonderful, caring mothers who have very lucky children!

 

Thank you for that comment :)

[*LC]

My college freshman did apply for a number of scholarships, including some that were small amounts. A lot of them where ones, I had found and said apply for this. However, once she had done a few applications, she realized she could reuse all or part of her essays for future scholarship essays. So, the later applications didn't take as long as the early ones.

 

The hardest part for her was going back to folks for more letters of recommendations, because they had to be uploaded by the reference into the scholarship's website.

 

Her school, a state university, did not reduce her merit aid by the outside scholarships. In fact, I had already paid her whole bill by CC when she received a $1,000 scholarship check for the university. So, the university credited that amount back to me. She will receive another $1,000 from this company for next semester, so I will know not to pay that amount.

 

However, this summer she went to a conference with a student, who had a full ride scholarship to Amherst. Amherst was going to reduce his scholarship by the $8,000 he received from an outside scholarship. So, he used that money to buy an extremely nice computer/equipment for school.

 

There were some scholarships that we skipped, because the timing didn't work with her senior year schedule, which including pubic school classes, dual-enrollment classes, two sports, and two or three jobs. We went in with the attitude that every little bit helps as long as it didn't hurt her current classes.

[Kareni]

Her school, a state university, did not reduce her merit aid by the outside scholarships. In fact, I had already paid her whole bill by CC when she received a $1,000 scholarship check for the university. So, the university credited that amount back to me. She will receive another $1,000 from this company for next semester, so I will know not to pay that amount.

 

That's great news!  Congratulations to her.

 

However, this summer she went to a conference with a student, who had a full ride scholarship to Amherst. Amherst was going to reduce his scholarship by the $8,000 he received from an outside scholarship. So, he used that money to buy an extremely nice computer/equipment for school.

 

My daughter's college required that all outside scholarships be divulged to them.  I would be pleasantly surprised to find out that Amherst does not have the same requirement.

 

Regards,

Kareni

 

[Julie in MN]

Do check this out before really pushing the smaller scholarships.  His time doing them could, indeed, be worthless if he gets any aid from the school.

This was true for us, as well.  Oldest's scholarships just meant "aid" was taken away.  In fact, somehow we ended up paying even *more* because of that.  It bumped him into a different category or something. 

 

Julie

[MysteryJen]

My son just came back from a road trip to visit a couple of schools.  I am amazed by the difference a weekend made!  Today, he (without the usual prompting-my word, he has another) wrote thank you notes, worked on an application, two scholarship essays, and did all his work.  :svengo: He can see his future more easily now.

 

But he never would have gotten there without my, ahem, prompting. :laugh:

[openmind421]

Okay, wow, just now getting back to this...

 

A HUGE thank you to all you veterans out there who are willing to take the time to pass along your experiences.  I am so grateful!

 

I guess I should expound on my son's decision about USNA since it appears to have gotten a few off track from my original question.  He heard on the news that some top-level officials were removed from duty for their role in trying to help the victims in Benghazi.  They were violating orders, so they were removed (at least from what he heard).  He asked me, "What would I do if I was an officer in a situation like that where I would have to decide between my moral values and the orders of my superiors?  I would lose my job.  How would I take care of my family?"

 

I thought that was a mature line of thinking for a then 15 yo.  However, I explained to him that any of us can have a moral dilemma in ANY line of work.  One could lose a job in the private or public sector.  This has nothing to do with political parties or who's in the white house.  *sigh*

 

To Teachin'mine....not sure what you mean by "stirring the pot"...unless you are assuming his rationale about USNA is some kind of political statement, which would be an unfortunate misunderstanding.    I posted originally because I really need insight from other parents who have already walked this road.  I'm a newbie at this college application/scholarship search process; and I'm not sure how much to expect from our students when they have heavy academic loads while trying to do the college thing, too.

 

Again, a big thanks to all of you who have posted information.  It is helpful to those of us who are just beginning this leg of the journey!

 

 

 

[openmind421]

I think this varies a great deal depending on the family. Had I left this to my dd she'd probably be living at home & in CC due to procrastination issues. As it is, she's living on campus at a state college on a very large scholarship (I should add that she didn't do all of her high school at home) that includes nearly everything because I helped. She wrote the essays, of course, did any interviews, etc, but I did the grunt work on the Common App etc.

 

However, there are some teens who are very motivated to do it themselves and/or who learn a lot doing it for themselves. My dd's scholarship was application based, first come first serve, so once I saw that she met the criteria I felt it not worthwhile to wait & see if she got the Common App done in time. I should add that her moving out has been the best thing for her as well as for the rest of us (she's not that far away, so I've seen her a few times, but she hasn't come home yet.)

 

I also made sure she did college visits, both to ones she wanted to see that she learned about at a college fair and to state schools I knew had good scholarships, etc. I also dragged my younger dd along to save gas later, and it's paying off now because she's working harder to get into good schools and/or get scholarships than she would have otherwise. I'm not sure how we'll divvy up the legwork when it's her turn.

 

Dds scholarship covers tuition, fees, room & board & in one area of math is fifth in the nation. By doing the requirements to stay in the honours college she'll also get $300 per semester credit at the campus bookstore for textbooks.

 

Wow....that great news about her scholarship!  Way to go!  My son is also motivated about the "idea" of the college search (in my initial search, I wrote he wasn't motivated - he knows it has to be done), but very busy with APs, dual enrollment, robotics, etc., that he literally doesn't have very much time.  

 

I'm finding it difficult to strike a balance between jumping through all the hoops while making sure he doesn't burn out before he's 20!  

[openmind421]

This was true for us, as well.  Oldest's scholarships just meant "aid" was taken away.  In fact, somehow we ended up paying even *more* because of that.  It bumped him into a different category or something. 

 

Julie

 

I am glad you all have posted this information.  Do the outside scholarships reduce the federal aid or does the college reduce the entire aid package (merit and need-based)?

[openmind421]

We got all the guides in the summer betw. sophomore and Jr. years and independently looked at schools.  We all made lists in the back of the places we thought were "cool".  We visited some of the cool places that were on our way to somewhere else.  In Jr. year, the dds started narrowing their choices and we visited what ever ones we could.  In the summer between jr. and sr. year, the dds and I made up a binder with a section for each school, with tasks to be done for each application.  We had a weekly meeting, and looked at the calendar and decided what each of us should be doing next.  This made it less stressful for all of us as we all knew what we should be doing.  

Oddly enough, the binders are something that both dds will not let me throw away ever!!!!?????

 

We received a variety of financial aid offers for both dds.  The best came for my eldest from a slac, we paid very little for her education as a result.  

 

What does "slac" mean?  sorry, i'm a newbie...

[openmind421]

By the time he is finished with college there will be a new administration. So I wouldn't let Obama stand in the way of pursuing an appointment to a service academy or a ROTC scholarship.

 

I clarified earlier, but just to note my son's decision has nothing to do with who occupies the white house.   This isn't about politics.  He was ruminating about how he would support a family if he was ever in a position where he would be relieved of duty for violating the orders of a superior officer.  

 

I admire him for thinking critically about the situation, and I  explained to him that one can lose a job in any public or private sector.