Would you take this child for a reading evaluation?

[cjgrubbs]

7 year old, 2nd grade boy. He's bright - working through RightStart Level C math; can do double digit addition and subtraction in his head.  However, reading is so difficult.  We worked through IEW's PAL program, which I felt was excellent.  We worked on probably 100 sight words and all the phonics rules.  He has CVC words down fine, but the blends and applying all the rules to sounding out words just isn't happening for him. We work and work on it and he will have it down as long as we are drilling on that thing every day, but as we stop drilling he can no longer remember it...or maybe he just can't apply it to actual words. He wants desperately to read independently (like his brothers).  Short term goal is to be able to read Boxcar Children books but his long term goal is to read Narnia!

 

Currently we are using Spelling Workout A, Explode the Code (1st grade level) and he is still struggling so much.  We practice reading a guided phonics book or dr. suess or something around 1st grade level every day.  The only way he seems to learn his spelling words is by using Spelling City but really I don't think that is long time learning. 

 

I have contacted a local therapy place about a reading evaluation.  The place is highly recommended by our pediatrician.  However, the cost is $250 and it will take 2 sessions  to complete the evaluation.  I don't mind coming up with the money if he really needs this but I don't want it to be a waste of our time and resources if something else could serve us better. 

 

Any advice?  input?  help?

[Chris in VA]

Wellll...might be something, might not be.

 

I think I'd be tempted to just back off a bit, and just have him read CVC books without sight words, add in silent "e," then maybe add one or two blends a month for the rest of the year. You'd be surprised how many words that will unlock for him. I would actually ditch the rules for a while--I think rule-based phonics makes too many steps for the reading process to work fluidly. I know that is heresy to some. 

[alisoncooks]

I wish there was a tried & true "this is when to get an evaluation."

It would be so helpful for those of us who continue to plod on and struggle and wonder if we're doing the right thing...

 

For our family, I'm choosing to hold off for now.  At least I am seeing progress in oldest DD's reading, no matter how small & slow.  

[srs]

I got a vision eval for my DD first, which turned out to be her problem, when she couldn't make the jump from the individual words (like in Explode the Code) to sentences. I am glad that we didn't wait and wonder.

[jenbrdsly]

Yes, I would.  I'm speaking as a former K-3 teachers too.  By second grade, as bright as your son is (way to go on the RS level C!) blending should be coming a bit easier for him.  Some people will disagree with me and say hold off until third grade.  But the way I see it, what if there was a problem that got unaddressed for a whole year?

 

But, no way should you have to pay out of pocket!  You live in Alabama, right?  Your child has the right to a free and appropriate education, homeschooled or not.  So write a letter to your school district explaining your concerns, drop it off at the district office, have it time stamped in your presence, have them make a copy of that for your records, and then wait.  Testing for a potential learning disability should be free.  I have some more info on my blog in case that helps.

 

Good luck!

[herekittykitty]

I would go ahead and take him. You have nothing to lose by getting an evaluation. However if you wait, and there is something going on, you will regret it. I would encourage you to think carefully about where you take him. Places like Learning RX (a cognitive skills program) and other tutoring places aren't really qualified to diagnose dyslexia or other learning disabilities. For a complete evaluation you need to see a psychologist who provides testing for learning disabilities.

[Ellie]

7 year old, 2nd grade boy. He's bright - working through RightStart Level C math; can do double digit addition and subtraction in his head.  However, reading is so difficult.  We worked through IEW's PAL program, which I felt was excellent.  We worked on probably 100 sight words and all the phonics rules.  He has CVC words down fine, but the blends and applying all the rules to sounding out words just isn't happening for him. We work and work on it and he will have it down as long as we are drilling on that thing every day, but as we stop drilling he can no longer remember it...or maybe he just can't apply it to actual words. He wants desperately to read independently (like his brothers).  Short term goal is to be able to read Boxcar Children books but his long term goal is to read Narnia!

 

Currently we are using Spelling Workout A, Explode the Code (1st grade level) and he is still struggling so much.  We practice reading a guided phonics book or dr. suess or something around 1st grade level every day.  The only way he seems to learn his spelling words is by using Spelling City but really I don't think that is long time learning. 

 

I have contacted a local therapy place about a reading evaluation.  The place is highly recommended by our pediatrician.  However, the cost is $250 and it will take 2 sessions  to complete the evaluation.  I don't mind coming up with the money if he really needs this but I don't want it to be a waste of our time and resources if something else could serve us better. 

 

Any advice?  input?  help?

 

Spalding. :-)

[cjgrubbs]

We do live in Alabama and we can get some services through our local school system like speech.  But for some things to get good service he would need to be enrolled.  I would need to check into this more.  I suspect the paperwork and "red tape" to make it happen might make me wish I'd pay the $250.

[cjgrubbs]

When I look at the Spalding website I'm overwhelmed and confused...plus I can't figure out how to look at samples. It looks complicated and I'm sure I will never be able to attend a 15 hour class on how to teach it.   Can I really figure it out and implement it without pulling out my hair?  I have 3 other kids at home so there is little free time and less quiet!

 

I own All About Spelling and used it with my middle son.  He was further along in his reading before he stalled but it did help him.  I wonder if I should try that since I have it.  I know they sell All About Reading now but I've never used it.  Are the 2 very different?

 

 

 

 

 

[ondreeuh]

We also used PAL. Did you finish the lessons and do all the games? Was he able to identify phonograms in the poetry and on the cards? What about the green discovery cards? Did he master the "magic e" game? My son flew through the program and the only part I kind of skimmed over was the phonetic farm. He didn't seem to absorb anything from reviewing that daily. The poetry and the daily word cards were the biggest help to him. I supplemented with Bob Books because my son was memorizing the words and needed to practice decoding.

 

I don't think PAL Is the program for every kid, but hopefully you were able to identify which skills held your son back. There are more systematic, incremental programs out there like All About Reading. Personally, I advise you to save your money. If you do the testing and they say he does have a reding LD, they are just going to recommend a program like Lindamood Bell or Orton-Gillingham. You can just get started on a good O-G program on your own. AAR is what I'd choose because it seems pretty universally well loved and user friendly.

[cjgrubbs]

We also used PAL. Did you finish the lessons and do all the games? Was he able to identify phonograms in the poetry and on the cards? What about the green discovery cards? Did he master the "magic e" game? My son flew through the program and the only part I kind of skimmed over was the phonetic farm. He didn't seem to absorb anything from reviewing that daily. The poetry and the daily word cards were the biggest help to him. I supplemented with Bob Books because my son was memorizing the words and needed to practice decoding.

 

I don't think PAL Is the program for every kid, but hopefully you were able to identify which skills held your son back. There are more systematic, incremental programs out there like All About Reading. Personally, I advise you to save your money. If you do the testing and they say he does have a reding LD, they are just going to recommend a program like Lindamood Bell or Orton-Gillingham. You can just get started on a good O-G program on your own. AAR is what I'd choose because it seems pretty universally well loved and user friendly.

He could identify them right after we studied them but then the next time I would have to point them out to him...maybe he wasn't just ready?  We played the games but he HATED them!  We finally had to stop at the Discovery stage bc he just can't do it!  The daily word cards (what I'm calling sight words) are the words he mainly knows and I'm assuming that is from memorizing them. 

 

They already mentioned O-G to me on the phone, so I'm assuming that is what they will use no matter what they find from the evaluation.  Then I will be paying a weekly fee for them to work through the program with him. 

 

I will look at AAR again.  Thank you!

[sbgrace]

 

I wouldn't do Spalding with him. I did teach my kids to read with phonograms. We used a spelling program based upon Spalding up until this summer. So I'm not saying that because I don't see Spalding as a good program. I just don't think it's the best program for kids struggling in these areas.

 

 

First, does he have signs of dyslexia? http://www.dys-add.com/dyslexia.html#anchorSymptoms

If you see symptoms, I would do a Barton student screening http://www.bartonreading.com/students_long.html#screen

 

If you think it's dyslexia, I'd take a dyslexia based approach with him. That could be Barton. That could be Recipe for Reading (cheaper by a lot). You would have other options, and people here could guide you in those options.

 

Take a look at symptoms of visual perception issues. http://www.covd.org/?page=Symptoms If you see some of those, click the locate a doctor section of the website and try to see a doctor on their list for an evaluation.

 

If none of that looks likely, I'd just change approaches. Considerations: Dancing Bears, I See Sam, Progressive Phonics, the Recipe for Reading techniques...you have lots of good options.

 

 

 

[Ellie]

When I look at the Spalding website I'm overwhelmed and confused...plus I can't figure out how to look at samples. It looks complicated and I'm sure I will never be able to attend a 15 hour class on how to teach it.   Can I really figure it out and implement it without pulling out my hair?  I have 3 other kids at home so there is little free time and less quiet!

 

I own All About Spelling and used it with my middle son.  He was further along in his reading before he stalled but it did help him.  I wonder if I should try that since I have it.  I know they sell All About Reading now but I've never used it.  Are the 2 very different?

 

It isn't complicated at all. The 15-hour class is probably good, but most of us have learned to teach Spalding without it.

 

Here's what you do:

 

Teach the first 45 phonograms, first the letters that begin with circles, then the letters that begin with lines, then the multiple-letter phonograms. This is where the penmanship starts. :-) Script and sample dialogues included in the manual.

 

Begin teaching the words in the extended ayres list (script and sample dialogues in the manual), while reviewing previously learned phonograms and continuing to learn new ones.

 

Wash, rinse and repeat.

 

Easy peasy. Much more direct than all those games and stuff in PAL, seems to me.

[MerryAtHope]

I own All About Spelling and used it with my middle son.  He was further along in his reading before he stalled but it did help him.  I wonder if I should try that since I have it.  I know they sell All About Reading now but I've never used it.  Are the 2 very different?

 

There are quite a few differences. They both use a similar sequence and the same phonograms. Both are complete phonics programs, so they are interrelated in that way. All About Reading includes research-based instruction in decoding skills, fluency, automaticity, comprehension, vocabulary and lots and lots of reading practice.  AAS focuses instead on encoding skills, spelling rules and other strategies that help children become good spellers. Both are open and go. You may want to look through the sample TM's and Student Activity books.

 

Blends are difficult for a lot of kids. And, beginning blends are harder than ending blends. You might focus on ending blends first, and then when those are getting easier for him, work on beginning ones.  While you're deciding what to do with testing or curriculum, you might teach him the Blending Procedure from AAR--you can see it in this post on breaking the word-guessing habit. That will really help with reading words with blends too.

 

HTH some, Merry :-)

[Ellie]

I wouldn't do Spalding with him. I did teach my kids to read with phonograms. We used a spelling program based upon Spalding up until this summer. So I'm not saying that because I don't see Spalding as a good program. I just don't think it's the best program for kids struggling in these areas.

 

Using another method "based on Spalding" doesn't provide any indication as to how good Spalding is.

 

And I have seen Spalding used with many children who are struggling in these areas and the resultant dramatic improvements. :-)

[sbgrace]

Using another method "based on Spalding" doesn't provide any indication as to how good Spalding is.

 

And I have seen Spalding used with many children who are struggling in these areas and the resultant dramatic improvements. :-)

 

True of course. All kids are different. We used Phonics Road for spelling (we were reading prior to beginning, having used other  techniques). It's a good program. So is Spalding of course. But the pacing of Spalding itself, in my opinion, wouldn't be the best choice for a child with issues like dyslexia. The OP's child may not fall into that severe of a category. But, in my experience, the same issues can apply to those kids with more mundane reading or spelling struggles.

 

OP, here is a good thread on the subject. http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/116897-dyslexia-and-spalding/ Clearly, though, people's experiences will differ.

 

I can give you some free for printing links of things I used, to see if something feels like it might be a good fit. I did the first two sets of I See Sam first (free ones to print/use). We used the cursor card (just a business sized card with a little notch cut out to uncover one sound at a time, ala http://www.3rsplus.com/documents/Getting_Started_With_READ_BRI1_001.pdf and it really helped my son get past the blending issues. It wasn't fast at first, but it was entirely enjoyable and he was successful. I'll also link one of many threads here about I See Sam. http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/180570-question-about-i-see-sam-books/ The point isn't the links in that thread and many are likely "dead", but that it really is a full teach to read program that can be used for both typical learners and those with really severe issues. You get experienced users as you look downward in the thread (the first part is just questions about printing and etc.) I used I See Sam with a struggling reader and a typical learner. Both loved it.

 

Then I used a multi-sensory O/G based approach using  this free program to do it well--it includes K-2nd reading and spelling. It would give you an idea of the Recipe for Reading techniques and the pacing used in O/G programs as well. I used it to teach the phonograms up front though, concentrating on reading alone. We were reading well before we picked up spelling.

 

Along with the phonogram introduction using the multi-sensory techniques, we used Progressive Phonics (free too) so that we could actually read using the phonogram we were learning. I had to switch the order of presentation of the phonograms a little to make it fit Progressive Phonics order.

 

There are lots of really fantastic programs, too, if spending isn't an issue. Once you have a since of the underlying issues, if any, I'm sure lots of people will have ideas. You can post on the Learning Challenges board. It may be that your son just isn't yet clicking with it all, of course. But I think proactive is better than wait and see--particularly given that proactive can be enjoyable and inexpensive.

[Tidbits of Learning]

I would wait.  My ds10 took forever to graduate from cvc to blend words and reading, but when he did...it was all at once.  I think Boxcar Children is a good goal but we read it in 4th grade with 2 different curricula not as 7 yr old 2nd graders.  My son is now 5th grade and Narnia was the first book he read this year.  We tried every phonics program in the book and I will recommend The Reading Lesson b/c it isn't drill and kill.  It isn't a ton of charts.  You are reading words and sentences the 1st day.  I would try it before I would pay for therapy.  I would say give the gift of time and get him away from comparing himself to older siblings.  Also, pick up books in his reading skill level now for him to read as well as use the other books as read alouds to him.  I personally love the emerging readers set that HOD uses in Beyond.  The only downside is they don't sell the emerging readers list and questions by themselves.  You can get their catalog and go in order though.  We skip the Beginner's Bible and just start with the readers.  

The Reading lesson is excellent if you suspect dyslexia as well.  It has a small circle in certain letters to distinguish between b and d or p and q and underlines for u and n and the like.  

[Heathermomster]

I live in Huntsville. My DS was evaluated by the local Scottish Rite Learning Center for free. Not all centers provide free testing. Maybe google Scottish Rite Learning Centers in your area, call them, and discover whether they test and for how much.

 

ETA. Maybe read Overcoming Dyslexia by Shaywitz and the Dyslexic Advantage by the Eides. Many moms use Barton for reading remediation and there is an online test on the Barton website that your DS can take. Whatever you do, lay off the sight words. 98% of the DOLCH words can be read using phonics rules, plus straight up sight word memorization can be harmful for dyslexics.

 

My DS learned to read with the assistance of a Wilson tutor while my 5 year yo blends easily. I would definitely pursue testing as it sounds like your DS may be 2e.

[beishan]

Sounds like my second grader in reading. He knows the rules but not apply it without reminder. We have a tutor using OG coming in once a week. She said the same thing and she is not sure why he is not applying. She said he plays phonics game very well and even reads word list well by using new rule they learn. It just not transfers to his reading. However, after several tutoring sessions (almost 2 months), finally she can see him starting to sound out by using the new skills they learnt so that we guess he needs a lot of repetition in order to reflect the skills automatically. We will have to keep plugging.

We used AAR2 earlier this year but not help him too much as he knews those rules already. Now we are in the middle of dancing bears fast track and pair with I SEE SAM set 4. They seems working well with him.

[cjgrubbs]

I wouldn't do Spalding with him. I did teach my kids to read with phonograms. We used a spelling program based upon Spalding up until this summer. So I'm not saying that because I don't see Spalding as a good program. I just don't think it's the best program for kids struggling in these areas.

 

 

First, does he have signs of dyslexia? http://www.dys-add.com/dyslexia.html#anchorSymptoms

If you see symptoms, I would do a Barton student screening http://www.bartonreading.com/students_long.html#screen

 

If you think it's dyslexia, I'd take a dyslexia based approach with him. That could be Barton. That could be Recipe for Reading (cheaper by a lot). You would have other options, and people here could guide you in those options.

 

Take a look at symptoms of visual perception issues. http://www.covd.org/?page=Symptoms If you see some of those, click the locate a doctor section of the website and try to see a doctor on their list for an evaluation.

 

If none of that looks likely, I'd just change approaches. Considerations: Dancing Bears, I See Sam, Progressive Phonics, the Recipe for Reading techniques...you have lots of good options.

First, when I look at this list he DOES have some signs of dyslexia, which include these: can't master tying shoes (though honestly I haven't worked on it much), slow to choose right or left handedness, difficulty with rhyming, difficulty remembering some of the letters (u, v, w primarily), can read a word on one page, but won't recognize it on the next page, omits and adds small function words - though this is not too often but often enough I've noticed it, spelling worse than reading, unusual pencil grip, fatigue with writing. 

 

So I gave him the Barton test.  I watched the tutor video last night and gave him the test today.  He passed A and C, but missed 3 on B so that was considered a fail for that section.   Would you think this means dyslexia?  I'm not really ready to give him that label yet....

 

What do you think?  I can't seem to find anything about reading when I search Dancing Bears - can someone post a link?  I'm familiar with AAS so I could probably pick up and teach AAR without a struggle but this boy is easily distracted by all the manipulatives....I had to let him play with the tiles before I started the Barton test :)  I also took a look at The Reading Lesson which was suggested by another poster...wonder if that could be as helpful with all the pieces and parts?  I looked at samples on Timberdoodle and I know the first 2 lessons he could do easily...I'm assuming they get harder by the end.  If I went this route would you combine some readers with it?

[beishan]

dancing bears is from UK

http://www.soundfoundationsbooks.co.uk/

 

You can preview the whole book online to see if it is a good fit for your son.

[sbgrace]

Well, you have struggles that seem out of synch with his other academic skills, some significant dyslexia red flags, and a fail on a portion of the Barton screening. I had a very similar situation with my son. Like you, I wasn't sure. I did talk to Ms. Barton briefly on the phone. She was very helpful and felt my son was dyslexic. I still don't know, and we really couldn't put the money into Barton, tutoring, or formal evaluations at the time. I still don't know about my son, but I suspect he has learning issues that mirror some dyslexia challenges but aren't exactly that.

 

At any rate, I was in a very similar situation and I just decided to (inexpensively) act as if. In other words, I picked materials that work with dyslexic kids yet didn't cost anything much. I was doing something proactive in case it was dyslexia, and if it wasn't it could only help the reading situation anyway. I landed on the materials I linked above. But, again, there are other options and every child is different. In your case, I think I would sort of act "as if" in terms of selecting materials. It can't hurt anything. We ended up with the Sound Foundations Apples and Pears with spelling after we were reading well. I've heard good things, but never actually seen Dancing Bears. I will say that viewing Apples and Pears online left me scratching my head. But in practice it's been absolutely fantastic here. I wish I had used it for spelling originally. I really felt good about our reading approach, too, and it was free for printing. I did eventually buy the I See Sam printed books though.

 

[Heathermomster]

Maybe look at LOE Essentials...

[cjgrubbs]

sbgrace - thank you!  I really like the lessons from Rochester that seemed to be based on Recipe for Reading.  Is the book basically the same as the lessons on this site?  I prefer a printed out book - I just work better from it, but I could print out the lesson plans on the Rochester site if I need to.  I looked at the Kinder lessons and he knows the 9 letters covered...should I just start at 1st grade?  He knows most of the letters and some of the digraphs but I'm not opposed to review.

 

Also, how did you coordinate the Progressive Phonics readers with the Rochester lessons?  or the I See Sam readers?  Maybe this would be more obvious to me as we start working through the lessons?

 

ETA:  After looking through the Rochester Lessons more - I realize they are pulling lessons from 3 different books.  I think I would need all of those to complete the lessons as written.  I'm thinking I'm back to considering AAR or Reading Recipe.....

[Ellie]

But the pacing of Spalding itself, in my opinion, wouldn't be the best choice for a child with issues like dyslexia.

 

Not sure what you mean by the "pacing of Spalding itself," since it is infinitely flexible and has a proven track record of success when used with children who are dyslexic. :confused1:

[pollo_la]

7 years old and reading CVC words is really not bad at all. All kids do catch on at different rates and have different learning styles. Honestly, based on everything you have said, I think he's fine. My first dd was fast to learn reading, and so was my 3rd. My second dd has been very different. I see so many differences in how she learns and processes information. Reading has come much more slowly to her, but she is progressing. I think it's the progress that you have to look for. Does he read better now then he did 6 months ago? Does he read better now then he did a year ago? Progress for my second dd has been SLOW, but fairly steady. She started blending her first words (CVC) when she was 4. At 5 she was still only blending CVC words, but a little bit faster and more efficiently. She also learned a few basic sight words. Now at 6 (nearing 7) she can read CVC words well, knows quite a few basic sight words, and can sound out a few harder words as well - words like ship, chop, them, etc. She can read books like Ten Apples Up On Top. It's still a bit of a challenge for her, but she can do it. So, there is progress... slower then I expected, but progress none the less.

 

Personally, the thing that has really helped my dd lately has been Dancing Bears!! I'm sure there are other programs that could have worked as well, but Dancing Bears is so easy to use, and inexpensive too! :-)

 

ETA: Oh, and I have never used anything rule based to teach reading. I just introduce new "sounds" and we practice reading words with those sounds. Rules don't make sense to me. I can't think about a rule and try to sound out a word at the same time! Patterns and letter combinations make more sense. I can sound those out. So - introduce "ar" as the sound "ar" (as in car) and then practice reading words with that sound. Then practice reading a few sentences that have some words with the "ar" sound in it. So, car, shark (assuming they have learned "sh"), bark, bar, barn, far, etc. A sample sentence might be. Can the car start on the hill?

 

And VERY important. Do not move onto another sound until your child has mastered the previous sounds!!!

[alisoncooks]

7 years old and reading CVC words is really not bad at all. All kids do catch on at different rates and have different learning styles. Honestly, based on everything you have said, I think he's fine. My first dd was fast to learn reading, and so was my 3rd. My second dd has been very different. I see so many differences in how she learns and processes information. Reading has come much more slowly to her, but she is progressing. I think it's the progress that you have to look for. Does he read better now then he did 6 months ago? Does he read better now then he did a year ago? Progress for my second dd has been SLOW, but fairly steady. She started blending her first words (CVC) when she was 4. At 5 she was still only blending CVC words, but a little bit faster and more efficiently. She also learned a few basic sight words. Now at 6 (nearing 7) she can read CVC words well, knows quite a few basic sight words, and can sound out a few harder words as well - words like ship, chop, them, etc. She can read books like Ten Apples Up On Top. It's still a bit of a challenge for her, but she can do it. So, there is progress... slower then I expected, but progress none the less.

 

Personally, the thing that has really helped my dd lately has been Dancing Bears!! I'm sure there are other programs that could have worked as well, but Dancing Bears is so easy to use, and inexpensive too! :-)

 

I could've written all of this!  (Except it'd be my oldest daughter I'm talking about.)

Same progression, same current ability... and same success with Dancing Bears.  Totally painless -- even more so than the popular, "fun" programs we tried.

 

We're starting to add in "I See Sam" as a 2nd, separate reading time during the day (just b/c I wanted to put some books in her hand that she can practice reading).

[Tidbits of Learning]

First, when I look at this list he DOES have some signs of dyslexia, which include these: can't master tying shoes (though honestly I haven't worked on it much), slow to choose right or left handedness, difficulty with rhyming, difficulty remembering some of the letters (u, v, w primarily), can read a word on one page, but won't recognize it on the next page, omits and adds small function words - though this is not too often but often enough I've noticed it, spelling worse than reading, unusual pencil grip, fatigue with writing. 

 

So I gave him the Barton test.  I watched the tutor video last night and gave him the test today.  He passed A and C, but missed 3 on B so that was considered a fail for that section.   Would you think this means dyslexia?  I'm not really ready to give him that label yet....

 

What do you think?  I can't seem to find anything about reading when I search Dancing Bears - can someone post a link?  I'm familiar with AAS so I could probably pick up and teach AAR without a struggle but this boy is easily distracted by all the manipulatives....I had to let him play with the tiles before I started the Barton test :)  I also took a look at The Reading Lesson which was suggested by another poster...wonder if that could be as helpful with all the pieces and parts?  I looked at samples on Timberdoodle and I know the first 2 lessons he could do easily...I'm assuming they get harder by the end.  If I went this route would you combine some readers with it?

 

Yes, the Reading Lesson starts off easy and progresses.  For his age level (which was the age my ds started the Reading Lesson after a dozen failed phonics programs), you would do 3 pages a day and there are 20 lessons with about 20 pages per lesson and the writing gets smaller as you go and the visual cues disappear as well the further you go.  Yes, about 10 lessons into the Reading Lesson we picked up readers and I let my son pick whatever interested him.  It turned out to be Star Wars leveled readers and then Goosebumps.  By the time we finished the Reading Lesson, my ds was reading the Goosebumps chapter novels easily.

I did want to let you know that my ds is a diagnosed dyslexic and he reads excellent and above his grade level now.

[pollo_la]

Here is a link for Dancing Bears... http://www.soundfoundationsbooks.co.uk/

[sbgrace]

sbgrace - thank you!  I really like the lessons from Rochester that seemed to be based on Recipe for Reading.  Is the book basically the same as the lessons on this site?  I prefer a printed out book - I just work better from it, but I could print out the lesson plans on the Rochester site if I need to.  I looked at the Kinder lessons and he knows the 9 letters covered...should I just start at 1st grade?  He knows most of the letters and some of the digraphs but I'm not opposed to review.

 

Also, how did you coordinate the Progressive Phonics readers with the Rochester lessons?  or the I See Sam readers?  Maybe this would be more obvious to me as we start working through the lessons?

 

ETA:  After looking through the Rochester Lessons more - I realize they are pulling lessons from 3 different books.  I think I would need all of those to complete the lessons as written.  I'm thinking I'm back to considering AAR or Reading Recipe.....

 

I used the multi-sensory methods included in those Rochester plans to introduce each phonogram. I did not do spelling with the phonograms. I didn't do any sight words/word walls. I was actually fighting a bent in that direction with my son. I printed out the multi-sensory hints/tips and set a up procedure that we used for all the phonograms. The multi-sensory (say/feel and do/see) was really key here.

 

I introduced the phonograms, one at a time, in the same order as the phonograms are presented and used in the Progressive Phonics books. So after we had learned a new phonogram, we could read with that Phonogram using Progressive Phonics books. When we mastered one, we went to the next. It was easy and it was enjoyable. I reviewed the learned ones regularly with flash cards, though the Progressive Phonics weaves that in naturally, given you're reading with learned phonograms.

 

We had already completed at least 2, and I think actually nearly 3 levels of I See Sam before starting the phonograms. So we had a good basis.

 

I wish I could help with your questions about the actual purchased Recipe for Reading program. We just didn't end up needing it. It was highly recommended to me at the time, but I don't see it mentioned much here. I don't think it's well known compared to Barton, Wilson, etc.

[Black-eyed Suzan]

A previous poster already mentioned this, but I would suggest getting his vision tested (and specifically mentioning that he has problems reading).  My otherwise-bright child showed some signs of dyslexia, but it ended up being a vision problem - convergence insufficiency - that explains his symptoms much better. He had had a regular eye exam that did not catch it.  If you have a COVD optometrist in your area, they will definitely test for convergence.

Also, the learning challenges board has lots of great discussions about when to get evaluations.  You may want to search over there. :)

[JudoMom]

Phonics Pathways, along with Reading Pathways. I'd give him a bit more time before I spent $250.

[cjgrubbs]

Phonics Pathways, along with Reading Pathways. I'd give him a bit more time before I spent $250.

Is Phonics Pathways an OG approach?  I know that seems to be what everyone recommends.  Do you do the Phonics book first and then the Reading Pathways book or do you do them together?

[Ellie]

Is Phonics Pathways an OG approach?  I know that seems to be what everyone recommends.

 

Not really, although the author told me that PP is "just like Spalding only better." :-)

[ElizabethB]

Here is how and why not to do sight words, you may need to do a bit of nonsense words to undo some of the sight word teaching.  My concentration game is a fun, free way to practice nonsense words.

 

My struggling remedial students do well with PP, I See Sam, Webster's Speller, Blend Phonics, working with a white board and spelling and games.  

 

I also like these charts:

 

https://www.phonovisual.com/products.php?c=1

 

The vowel charts are helpful for my struggling students, it is easier to point at the chart than repeat 100 times "aw and au say ah."  (I like to teach them in pairs, and also use these charts I made, I start with the colored version then wean down to black and white.)

 

The book that explains the method is online for free:

 

http://archive.org/stream/phonovisualmetho00scho#page/n0/mode/2up

 

 

[Pen]

I waited till 3rd grade to do testing and wish I'd done it sooner, so, IMPO, if you can do it, via Scottish Rite or, however, I would.   However, there are many things that can be tested and it can be hard to know where to start.  Your Barton screen does make it sound like that would be a start.   And don't fear the label--it tends to help figure out what to do for a child instead of being lost.   My ds who barely read after trying two different b&M schools and their methods, and various things in 2nd grade with me homeschooling is now, at this very minute, reading an adult level of reading difficulty book at age 11.5

 

Depending on your child what may help may be this or that, and what helped my child or someone else's may or may not be what works for him.

 

For my son the main thing was http://www.highnoonbooks.com Reading Intervention and Sound Out Chapter Books.   Some other programs (Barton, Spalding) which required memorizing phonograms and nonsense word reading did not seem right for him--but they may be a better fit for your child.   One cannot know long distance, and I think even with a child right there with us, sometimes we do not know till we actually try something.   High  Noon instead or nonsense words, and phonogramsm stressed reading phonics via, as soon as possible, stories with context, and that worked for him.   He then went on to Magic Tree House (his initial goal like Box Car for yours) and then soon after that to Percy Jackson, Harry Potter, etc. type books.

[Pen]

PS I am no in Alabama, so take this for what it is worth: We used the local public school for what testing they could do.   They could not officially give the word "dyslexia," but could do enough to be useful. At one point my son dual enrolled  to get services--for us it was not that big of a deal in terms of the red tape.  Though actually getting the services--going in daily-- was a big time commitment.

[Gentlemommy]

I got a vision eval for my DD first, which turned out to be her problem, when she couldn't make the jump from the individual words (like in Explode the Code) to sentences. I am glad that we didn't wait and wonder.

This was our experience too. She desperately WANTED to read, but just couldn't make it through even a Bob book. Halfway through our 6 months of VT, she picked up at MTH book and read it. It was a convergence and tracking issue. When I was able to see how often she was skipping letters/lines/jumping back and forth, up and down, I was so sad that I didn't get her evaluated earlier. She was 7 when I took her, she did sixth months of VT and is reading all the time now. I'd say go get an evaluation. Even if it's nothing, it will be better if you and him know for sure, kwim?

[Gentlemommy]

Oh, and we did do Spalding. It didn't help until her vision issues were corrected. If there is a true vision issue, no curriculum will really 'fix' it. In fact, I was instructed to stop all reading instruction during VT and only do the exercises.

[Ellie]

Some other programs (Barton, Spalding) which required memorizing phonograms and nonsense word reading did not seem right for him--but they may be a better fit for your child. 

 

Spalding doesn't do nonsense words.   :-)

[herekittykitty]

I just wanted to chime in again...IMO the curriculum mentioned here are great for the right kids, however if you don't know what you are dealing with, it's really just throwing darts and hoping you hit something.  It is hard to take your child for an evaluation.  But IMO you should do it because it will guide you on what to do next.  it will give you so much information!  We can all say what has helped our kids, but unless you know what is going on with your child, it is again just a guess.  A good neuropsych eval is seriously invaluable.  I was very afraid to do it, because the idea of something being "wrong" is hard to confront.  But all of the results just made total sense and helped me really understand my child's strengths and weaknesses.  If you suspect visual processing issues, an eval by a COVD is also helpful.  I would do both of those things before you purchase or try any other reading programs.  Good luck.

[cjgrubbs]

I will be calling a local COVD eye doctor tomorrow to discuss setting an appointment for my son.  I was so excited to find a doctor that offers Vision Therapy only a few miles from my home.  I also found that a library in my county has Phonics Pathways so I've requested that to look over, as well. 

 

Thanks everyone, I will keep you updated with what happens!

[cjgrubbs]

Called the Dr. this morning and they just happened to have an opening!  1:45 appointment and Dr. said that he has Accommodative Insufficiency.   Convergence was fine, vision was fine.  He said this is harder to correct but it could explain his difficulty in focusing and reading.  We will start VT on Thursday and they will do some tracking exercises along with whatever else he needs.  I'm excited to feel like we might be making some progress.  I'm also going to try Phonics Pathways with him when the books comes in at the library.

[JudoMom]

Called the Dr. this morning and they just happened to have an opening!  1:45 appointment and Dr. said that he has Accommodative Insufficiency.   Convergence was fine, vision was fine.  He said this is harder to correct but it could explain his difficulty in focusing and reading.  We will start VT on Thursday and they will do some tracking exercises along with whatever else he needs.  I'm excited to feel like we might be making some progress.  I'm also going to try Phonics Pathways with him when the books comes in at the library.

 

I never answered you up above (every time I saw this post I was on my Kindle Fire and I hate typing on it, which was why my post was so short above).  PP is not a OG program, but it is a great program for teaching reading.  It used to be what was recommended in WTM, until OPGTR was written.  I recommended it because it really helps with fluency--especially the reading pyramids (I've used the older edition of Reading Pathways, called Pyramids, slightly behind where the student is in PP).  I'm glad you're getting to check it out from the library and that it works for you & your son.  It's not fancy, has no bells and whistles, but it's a great program that I think often gets overlooked these days.

 

 

 

 

[Pen]

Spalding doesn't do nonsense words.   :-)

 

 

To clarify my jumbled writing--from what I researched at the choosing stage, Barton does nonsense words, Spalding does phonogram memorization...though maybe by some other term.  Neither would have worked well for my particular child--which is not to say that these are not fantastic programs for many children.   Both of those, as well as High Noon, and a number of others too, have excellent track records.

 

You and I, like many others here, jump in with what has worked for us/our own children -- but I was trying to make the point that what will work well for OP's own child might not be what worked best for mine, or yours, or some other child.

[Mrszjk]

I have to second Logic of English Essentials. We have been working through it with my son and have really been seeing progress.