What to use after First Language Lessons Level 3? Do I really want FLL 4?

[matrips]

I am planning out our third grade year and we will be finishing up FLL3 sometime in the fal (we started it last year).  I'd like to know what to use after that.  The kids are having a pretty easy time with all the FLL levels so far, and learning fine.  Do I want FLL 4?  Is it a big step up or include that much more than FLL 3?  Is any of it independent?   If I did get it, can they just breeze through a bunch of it to get to any new stuff?  Looking at the index, I just didn't see huge differences from what they've learned already.  I don't mind review for them if it can be independent.  I just don't want to spend a lot of teacher time doing what amounts to review.

 

What are some of my other options to use and how do they compare/what are they like.  My kids are pretty decent at grammar, punctuation, spelling etc.  No real troubles.  Of course, I'd like to keep it that way though, so I'm assuming they will need something.

 

IEW and WWE3 will be our writing programs if that matters.

 

Thanks!

 

 

[matrips]

Bump. Still hoping to hear some feedback. Grammar is something I've never looked through at a homeschool convention because I was so set for so long. Thanks.

[SilverMoon]

A kid who has completed FLL 3 is well equipped for FLL 4, no matter their age.

 

Nothing in FLL 4 is independent. It's totally teacher led just like 3.

 

There aren't chapter tests or anything like that to jump through sections, but you can simply skip the lesson or parts of it you know they can do it blindfolded with one arm behind their back.

 

Some other options are Rod and Staff English, Junior Analytical Grammar, Hake, and Growing with Grammar. The first one is unabashedly Christian, the other three are secular. We're long term, happy Rod and Staff English users.

[matrips]

What is rod and staff like? Can you compare/ contrast to FLL so I can see what it would be like? Is it independent? Diagramming? Circle up an answer? ... Thanks again.

 

A kid who has completed FLL 3 is well equipped for FLL 4, no matter their age.

 

Nothing in FLL 4 is independent. It's totally teacher led just like 3.

 

There aren't chapter tests or anything like that to jump through sections, but you can simply skip the lesson or parts of it you know they can do it blindfolded with one arm behind their back.

 

Some other options are Rod and Staff English, Junior Analytical Grammar, Hake, and Growing with Grammar. The first one is unabashedly Christian, the other three are secular. We're long term, happy Rod and Staff English users.

[Stellalarella]

I was happy to continue from FLL 1,2 and 3 into FLL 4 because I appreciate the consistency of definitions.  FLL4 gives a step up on diagramming.  I also appreciated FLL4 for the poem memorization.  Of course, anyone can insert poem memorization into her curriculum, I just found it very useful to have FLL4 remind me to do it.  :)  I'm homeschooling a big bunch of kids,  so that's why it helps me.  

 

I have used Rod and Staff for older kids.  It also has sentence diagramming.  You will need to purchase TM, SB.  You may want to purchase the worksheets which do make it easier on the kids rather than having to write out things from the book.  

 

The reason why I find FLL 3 and 4  "easy" for the kids and me is that it is scripted, the definitions are frequently verbally repeated, and the workbook pages are laid out in an easy to follow way.  They learn grammar because FLL uses effective tools to teach it.  FLL sets me up to be a good teacher.  

 

If a person is just wanting more challenge, I would direct her to KISS Grammar.  Free, all grade levels, and guaranteed challenging enough to put hair on the chest.  Finish one of those upper level pages and you'll be swinging through the trees yodeling like Tarzan.  You also get a merit badge for learning to successfully navigate the KISS website.   Here is a thread on how to do that

 

But really, I did learn some serious grammar from KISS.  :)    

[SilverMoon]

R&S is a nice blend of teacher instruction and independent work. It could be done all independently if needed, but I find that little bit of teacher interaction with the new concept makes a huge difference in how deeply mine understand the grammar. Diagramming is taught thoroughly.

 

The student textbook has a teaching section to read, an oral exercise section and a written exercise section that work with the new concept, and a small review section that covers old concepts. There's a meaty review lesson at the end of each chapter. The written section often just has them writing individual words; it's not overwhelming.

 

The teacher manual has an oral quiz covering old concepts, a scripted plan to teach the new lesson, reduced images of the student pages, and a full answer key. There also a test booklet and optional worksheets you can purchase. The worksheet book is extra review should you need it, and only has a sheet for 1/3-1/2 of the lessons.

 

R&S doesn't expect you to do ALL of that review unless you really need it. They expect you to pick the medium that is best for you. In my homeschool the student reads the lesson in his book, and tells me when he's ready for the oral work. After going over that section with him I'll have a really good idea of how much more review he'll need. He'll do the written work I assigned on the fly, and all of the review section. We do use the chapter reviews and tests, but rarely ever use a worksheet. Diagramming goes on a whiteboard.

 

You can see samples at www.milestonebooks.com

[SFM]

We moved from FLL3 to R&S and have been very pleased.

[Guest bluewarbler]

We went from FLL 3 onto FLL 4.  From there it was a smooth transition to R&S 5.  Having done FLL with the dialogue I knew how to interact with my son on R&S, treating it much the same way -- we took turns reading the discussions and had fun with the examples before moving on to the oral exercises.  (With my first daughter I tried to have her work on R&S independently, and it fizzled out quickly for both of us.)  I prefer FLL, as it involves less drill (but is still sufficient) and has more variety.  With R&S we skipped most of the written exercises, unless I felt it was in an area where my son's skills were particularly weak.  As a grammar book R&S is more than adequate, but FLL was better for us.

 

I also felt that the R&S writing examples were less than stellar.  Virtually every essay or paragraph ends with a Bible verse or a sentence proclaiming the wonder of God's works, often in an abrupt change of tone from an otherwise very objective piece of writing (after paragraphs on the nesting habits of alligators, an assertion that God made them perfect fails as a direct conclusion).  While I appreciate the sentiment, this is impractical for everyday analysis or technical writing and left us having to scrounge for more appropriate approaches to concluding sentences.

 

-Emily