SO SO Modesty: TSA agent shames 15yo

[Hoot]

Very well said, Faith. I would venture though, that oftentimes when the initial exchange is in person, a lot more goes into the assumption of ones character than just how they are dressed. Yes, we are a very visual bunch and so physical appearance goes a long way to create a first impression, BUT, there are other subtle and not-so-subtle cues as well. There is the way you carry yourself, the way you speak, and gesticulate. The mini-skirt girl that my dad opted not to hire was dressed in an overtly sensual manner; however, there is a dress code that would make this sort of thing relatively unimportant had she been hired. It was her decidedly kitten-like demeanor that accompanied said outfit that made her a poor choice. The way she spoke and carried herself said that what was coming from her mouth matched what she was wearing on her body. Would she have still been judged for her outfit alone? Yes, I think so. Was she judged even more severely because her attitude appeared to match her dress? I don't really see how not to. We can't always take the time to get to personally know each and every person that comes into our path. Sometimes, a few minutes are all we have to make a decision. Sometimes it will be the right one, other times, not so much.The man up the street who looks haggard and just generally gives me the heebie-jeebies. Do I trust my child to play at the house with his grand-children or do I take the external cues that I get from him and form an opinion? Sometimes, that's just the way it is. I think this is why it is so important for children to understand social appropriateness in the way they carry themselves both internally and externally.

 

 

Tough question for certain and food for thought. I think the answer may come with the word "judge". To assume intent and moral character failings based solely alone on clothing choices is troubling. I've seen kids treated horribly for very superficial reasons such as this and it makes my heart bleed.

 

If we decide she's a trollop and a slut for wearing a camisole under an unbottoned up shirt, then isn't it also okay to think and God forbid SAY OUTLOUD "trash" when the little boy down the street whose parents can't afford nice clothing shows up to the school openhouse in a dirty shirt and worn out jeans. I had an elementary teacher in school who ass exactly like this. Your entire school year and the success thereof was predicated on what you wore the first day of school and how much your parents could afford. That's judgment too. Most people would be appalled, but the reality is she assumed he was of low character because of his clothing. That's exactly what people have done in this thread with the young lady in question.

 

The actual intentions of another person are pretty hard to exclusively tell based on clothes. Yep, I teach my kids that people do it anyway...it is the game we play...trying to make other people like us or not think ill of us in certain social situations based on what we wear. Look at the whole "what to wear to this wedding" thread. Dress codes at weddings, not attending if you can't afford the tux, what will people think if you wear khakis and a long sleeve button up to a beach wedding and then it turns out that all of the other guys have suits! It goes on and on. Our culture is very superficial and assumes its okay to ascribe any number of character flaws and intentions to all kinds of personal clothing and accessory choices. I'd like to see us grow up as a nation and try, especially when we aren't talking about needing a dress code for a business situation because we are trying to please everyone all the time, to think a little more deeply and not make judgments on what we see at first glance. The miniskirt gal might be the nicest, kindest, most compassionate, community service minded, volunteer the town has ever seen. Will the people who decide she's a whore because she's in a mini- skirt ever know that? If this thread is any indication, it's kind of doubtful. Everyone is assured that the clothing choice automatically dictates matters of the heart. To be honest, it's the "I'm better than them because I choose X" comparison and sad to say, self included at my low points in my life, we pretty much all probably do it at one time or another. Humans aren't actually all that kind to each other naturally. We have to work at it!

 

The boy with the baggy pants and the nasty t-shirt might also be the one that spends every Friday night at the soup kitchen ladling up broth and befriending homeless men. Will the people who decide he's a punk based on his clothing ever know that? Probably not. If we write people off so quickly, what are the chances we'll stop to get to know them?

 

Do I like it when dad has to make an employment decision based on appearance or reaction to a dress code? No, I hate it. On the other hand, he's trapped by the dictates and very probable narrow mindedness of the people he needs to write him checks for his services and products. He's hampered by the society he happened to be born into...we all are.

 

So, I have to teach my kids that there is a huge population of people out there that will judge them, and judge them severely, based on something like their choice of jeans. On the other hand, while I have to teach them that some of these people have to be sucked up to because you are between a rock and a hard spot if you don't - the dean, the grant committee you make your proposal to, your employer, etc. - I'd also like to think I teach them to be a lot kinder in their own minds and much more respectful of the other humans on planet earth.

 

Yep, lot's of mixed messages, and I have absolutely no wisdom concerning how to get around some of it or change it or make the world a nicer place.

 

Faith

[LucyStoner]

I think all of my creep-o-meter buttons have been pressed on this thread, far more so that the original comment made by this TSA dude. Frankly the searching for other pictures of her in shorts, questioning her motives, imagining that we can see through opaque fabric, accusing her of lying or flirting etc is all stuff I find disgusting. IMO some folks are borrowing heavily from what I reckon would be the contents of a Sex Crime Defense Attorney Manual were such a book to be published.

 

Geez Louise. Excuse me while I go pull out my entire Gits collection and play it all, hoping against hope that should I ever blessed with a daughter I can protect her from this utter garbage. This is exactly why I care so much about this topic.

[albeto]

The idea that an older guy telling a 15yo she should be covering means he wants to rape her, or would approve of anyone else raping her, is beyond ridiculous. The fact that I think the girl's shirt was too revealing means I think rape is justifiable is extremely offensive.

 

Part of having a well-trained mind is reading and responding to the words actually written in a written discussion. No one has so much as implied this connection.

[Kathryn]

I think all of my creep-o-meter buttons have been pressed on this thread, far more so that the original comment made by this TSA dude. Frankly the searching for other pictures of her in shorts, questioning her motives, imagining that we can see through opaque fabric, accusing her of lying or flirting etc is all stuff I find disgusting. IMO some folks are borrowing heavily from what I reckon would be the contents of a Sex Crime Defense Attorney Manual were such a book to be published.

 

Geez Louise. Excuse me while I go pull out my entire Gits collection and play it all, hoping against hope that should I ever blessed with a daughter I can protect her from this utter garbage. This is exactly why I care so much about this topic.

 

Oh, for goodness' sake, I didn't go searching for pictures of her in shorts. I was looking for any more information on the story and when I googled her name, her Facebook page was the first thing that came up.

[unfrumpable.]

This is crazy talk. It is not misogyny to not want to see high school girls running around half naked in public places. And nobody here has come anywhere close to rape victim blaming.

 

Sure they have. Plenty of people have said that he was being "fatherly" and didn't want other creepos to be eying her. That he was trying to "protect" her from others. That comes pretty close to blaming the rape victim for her choice of clothing, IMO.

[albeto]

I'm shocked by the number of people in this thread who are making all kinds of assumptions about her intentions, her behavior, and her character based on nothing more than what she's wearing — which is a perfectly normal and appropriate outfit among American teens in 2013.

 

I suspect this is crux of the issue here. If the outfit is not understood to be normal and appropriate, then the TSA agent was acting virtuously, courageously saying what other good and decent folk think but are too shy to say out loud. This is why the most interesting part of this entire conversation for me has been the correlation between clothes (or lack thereof) and a bombardment of uninvited pornographic thoughts and images imposed on otherwise innocent bystanders.

[Kathryn]

 

 

Part of having a well-trained mind is reading and responding to the words actually written in a written discussion. No one has so much as implied this connection.

 

I've seen quite a few posters state or imply that anyone who thinks she (or anyone else at any time) may have been dressed inappropriately thinks that means she is just asking to be raped.

[albeto]

I've seen quite a few posters state or imply that anyone who thinks she (or anyone else at any time) may have been dressed inappropriately thinks that means she is just asking to be raped.

 

The comment was in reply to SKL's premise that the TSA agent telling a 15yo she should be covering means he wants to rape her, or would approve of anyone else raping her. Perhaps someone has made that argument and it has escaped my memory (not hard to do, believe me), but as far as I recall, nothing like that has actually been suggested.

[LucyStoner]

 

 

Oh, for goodness' sake, I didn't go searching for pictures of her in shorts. I was looking for any more information on the story and when I googled her name, her Facebook page was the first thing that came up.

 

Kathryn, I like you and read your posts with interest. Obviously we disagree on this topic and that is ok. But drawing conclusions about how she chooses to present herself by a summertime photo in shorts IS really creepy and inappropriate to me. You don't need to like my opinion or agree but that is just the way it is. If a 15 year old girl can't wear short shorts, who can? There is nothing wrong with that picture you posted except that it's being used to illustrate some point about the girl. Like it has ANY relevance whatsoever.

 

 

NOT on topic of the TSA guy, but about clothing choices, because the thread has a couple of different topics going and one of them is clothing choices: I just googled her name out of curiosity and this girl seems to me to have made a certain choice with her clothing in how she presents herself. (Link deleted)

 

What "certain choice" is she making? That she likes a nice photo of her and a friend on a summer day? That she has a butt? We all do, three feet below our noggins.

[Firefly]

Exactly what "message" was this girl sending with her outfit?

[Mrs Mungo]

Exactly what "message" was this girl sending with her outfit?

 

To me it says: I like to be comfortable when I fly.

[Kathryn]

 

 

Kathryn, I like you and read your posts with interest. Obviously we disagree on this topic and that is ok. But drawing conclusions about how she chooses to present herself by a summertime photo in shorts IS really creepy and inappropriate to me. You don't need to like my opinion or agree but that is just the way it is. If a 15 year old girl can't wear short shorts, who can? There is nothing wrong with that picture you posted except that it's being used to illustrate some point about the girl. Like it has ANY relevance whatsoever.

 

Hmm, I wasn't so much thinking about the shorts there as the short white lace shirt with dark bra. I specifically said it had no relevance to the TSA guy's right to comment on her clothes. There is an alternate talk about appropriate clothing and what clothes say about a person going on though. And, since the thread started by talking about this girl, and I had just run across that picture, it reminded me of it. I'm sorry if you find that creepy and inappropriate.

[unfrumpable.]

I saw nobody commenting on this girl's character. What we are commenting on is that clothes make statements, intended or otherwise. My first comment was to "want to give the girl the benefit of the doubt" that she did not intend anything, maybe she didn't realize her boobs were showing. It happens. She's young. Most people would not say anything to let her know, and she didn't have her parents there to advise her. I don't think she meant to draw attention to herself. Though it is always a possibility. The above quote goes way overboard in assigning beliefs and intentions to people who are only talking about the clothes and perhaps saying "maybe" about a couple of things that are in fact quite common among girls that age. Some of the words quoted above were not in reference to this girl at all, but to the belief that parents need to teach girls about what clothes can communicate. This was in response to the journalist who stated that when we tell our girls to "cover up," that equals all kinds of horrible misogynistic things.

 

Her boobs are. not. showing! They're not! They are covered. You either have x-ray vision OR your imagination takes over with very little provocation. There is no other choice here since you are so insistent that her boobs are showing.

[FaithManor]

Hmm, I wasn't so much thinking about the shorts there as the short white lace shirt with dark bra. I specifically said it had no relevance to the TSA guy's right to comment on her clothes. There is an alternate talk about appropriate clothing and what clothes say about a person going on though. And, since the thread started by talking about this girl, and I had just run across that picture, it reminded me of it. I'm sorry if you find that creepy and inappropriate.

 

Well, I think because I kind of interjected an off topic, but related topic discussion a page or two ago, now we've got two things going at once and so it's getting confusing about who is responding to whom and what it's referring to so that adds to some of the wondering.

 

Sorry everyone. My apologies!

 

Faith

[unfrumpable.]

Hmm, I wasn't so much thinking about the shorts there as the short white lace shirt with dark bra. I specifically said it had no relevance to the TSA guy's right to comment on her clothes. There is an alternate talk about appropriate clothing and what clothes say about a person going on though. And, since the thread started by talking about this girl, and I had just run across that picture, it reminded me of it. I'm sorry if you find that creepy and inappropriate.

 

 

That is kind of creepy that you went out of your way to post a link to her FB page. We all put stuff on FB knowing that once on the internet, others may view it, but come on. She is 15 years old, she doesn't need to be having her FB page linked here.

[LucyStoner]

Hmm, I wasn't so much thinking about the shorts there as the short white lace shirt with dark bra.

 

Either way, could you please tell me what "choice" she is making? I fail to see why it matters or what it supposedly says about her that she apparently liked a nice picture of herself and a friend decked out for summer (I assume at a concert or fair or something based on the structure they are walking towards) enough to post it to her Facebook.

[fairfarmhand]

So darn true. In 2000 I threw my brother an 18th birthday party. Someone gave him a gift that when he opened it exploded purple glitter everywhere. I swept the floor. I vacuumed the rug. I took up the rug and beat it outside. I swear that bits of that glitter subsequently followed us on at least 3 moves over 6 years. I never saw that girl who gave him the gift again without thinking in my head "you're that glitter b!tch." (In silent jest)

 

Isn't it nice to have that little speck of glitter stuck on somebody's face? :)

 

However, not removing it, if it was baggy, would have been a very strong potential of pat down. Baggy clothing is a real red flag. That's why the travel agencies warn people to wear form fitting clothing of light weight material and no bras with metal clasps which means cami/shelf bras, bikini tops, or sports bras. To have a good chance of avoiding the pat down, this kind of clothing IS the norm now.

 

Even our church, on the youth mission trip to Costa Rica last year, advised shorts that weren't baggy or very long...definitely not grazing the knee and preferably not longer than mid-thigh, t-shirts that fit quite tight - even for the boys, sports bras for the girls, slip on shoes with just footies, and no extra layers of any kind in the hopes of getting the bulk of the group through the line smoothly with the least number of pat downs possible. Jackets, shirts, or sweaters over the arm so they would be placed on the conveyor and NOT have to be removed. How many churches do you know that would recommend tight t-shirts and sports bras for the women???? The youth group leader's wife even suggested that though she didn't appreciate having to advise it, a dark sports bra under a white t-shirt a size too small, might help a girl avoid getting the hand between and under the breasts part of the pat down since well, if the bra is dark and the shirt is light and VERY form fitting, then there is less left to the imagination of the agent. That's how bad the TSA is at Detroit International Airport. Their reputation really, truly stinks.

 

Apart from passengers clearly going directly from their flight to a meeting, I rarely see anyone in professional clothes at the airport except those that are employed at the airport. Casual and form fitting is the usual. I'm at the airport A LOT so I am getting the impression that this is the regular and usual choice and I blame it on security protocols.

 

Faith

 

weird. I just flew out of Nashville and Denver. Got patted both times. The x ray machine bleeped highlighting my hips, so an old Grandma lady came and patted my hips to make sure that SOMETHING wasn't there. (nothing but flab) In Denver, it bleeped on my chest where my necklace was resting so a lady pattted around my upper chest and clavicle area.

 

I wore jeans both times and underwire bras, and nothing showed up at all in the bosom area.

 

The patdowns that I experienced and saw took less than 30 seconds and were not invasive at all.

[Kathryn]

She is 15 years old, she doesn't need to be having her FB page linked here.

 

That occurred to me for a minute. Then I decided that the fact that her dad is the one that put this out all over the media and when I searched her name, she is pretty out there made her sufficiently in the public for me to not worry about it.

[albeto]

weird. I just flew out of Nashville and Denver. Got patted both times. The x ray machine bleeped highlighting my hips, so an old Grandma lady came and patted my hips to make sure that SOMETHING wasn't there. (nothing but flab) In Denver, it bleeped on my chest where my necklace was resting so a lady pattted around my upper chest and clavicle area.

 

I wore jeans both times and underwire bras, and nothing showed up at all in the bosom area.

 

The patdowns that I experienced and saw took less than 30 seconds and were not invasive at all.

 

If I ever require a pat-down, I'm going to take my mother in law's lead. Last time she visited us she was about 79 years old, traveling by herself for the first time. They brought her over to a spot where there were a few TSA agents, and explained to her very politely what would happen, what the pat down would be like (back of the hand, over the clothes, etc). Without skipping a beat, she pointed to the youngest, shyest man and said, "Well, then, I want him to do me."

 

She told me she wasn't so lucky, the woman patted her down, but it was worth a try.

[nmoira]

That occurred to me for a minute. Then I decided that the fact that her dad is the one that put this out all over the media and when I searched her name, she is pretty out there made her sufficiently in the public for me to not worry about it.

 

 

But why? If you were trying to illustrate a point that had nothing directly to do with the TSA incident, why her? How is the picture of *her* relevant? FWIW I don't recall her father using her name in the single blog post he made on the subject.

[unfrumpable.]

That occurred to me for a minute. Then I decided that the fact that her dad is the one that put this out all over the media and when I searched her name, she is pretty out there made her sufficiently in the public for me to not worry about it.

 

 

That occurred to me as well, but in reality, she is not a celebrity. Her dad did choose to post one pic of his daughter and expose the TSA agent. That is not putting her whole life in the public eye. I find linking to her FB page even more disturbing, as she is a minor.

[Slartibartfast]

Ya know, regardless of one's outfit and whether or not you find it appropriate it is RUDE to admonish someone about their outfit while you are at work. What he did was unprofessional and rude. Even if you would never allow your children to wear such a thing I would suggest one NOT chastise random strangers about what they are wearing. It is not his job to police the dress code of the universe. He needs to shut his trap.

 

If someone said such a thing to my dd I would have a rude response.

 

I don't go around telling guys to pull up their pants because that would be rude. At least I cannot see her underwear like all those guys that run around with their pants on the ground.

[unfrumpable.]

Ya know, regardless of one's outfit and whether or not you find it appropriate it is RUDE to admonish someone about their outfit while you are at work. What he did was unprofessional and rude. Even if you would never allow your children to wear such a thing I would suggest one NOT chastise random strangers about what they are wearing. It is not his job to police the dress code of the universe. He needs to shut his trap.

 

If someone said such a thing to my dd I would have a rude response.

 

 

I agree! I worked for years in retail and waiting tables. I've dealt with plenty of people who made me want to stab myself in my eyeballs, but how they dressed never played into it. How they interacted with and treated me were what I was mostly concerned about. Working extensively with the general public helps to shut down a lot of stereotypes.

[Mrs Mungo]

 

 

 

I agree! I worked for years in retail and waiting tables. I've dealt with plenty of people who made me want to stab myself in my eyeballs, but how they dressed never played into it. How they interacted with and treated me were what I was mostly concerned about. Working extensively with the general public helps to shut down a lot of stereotypes.

 

Amen.

[Slartibartfast]

 

 

I agree! I worked for years in retail and waiting tables. I've dealt with plenty of people who made me want to stab myself in my eyeballs, but how they dressed never played into it. How they interacted with and treated me were what I was mostly concerned about. Working extensively with the general public helps to shut down a lot of stereotypes.

 

I have also worked in retail and waited tables, you may be right. I worked in a comic book store and there were some real characters that came in that would probably give many here the vapors but I guess it made me more tolerant in general.

[Slartibartfast]

And some of y'all must seriously be seeing something I am not because that girl's boobs are NOT showing. I have a big huge monitor and I don't see her boobs.

[Caroline]

I have also worked in retail and waited tables, you may be right. I worked in a comic book store and there were some real characters that came in that would probably give many here the vapors but I guess it made me more tolerant in general.

 

You had characters come into the comic book store. :lol: :lol:

[Slartibartfast]

You had characters come into the comic book store. :lol: :lol:

 

Yes. :lol:

 

I don't ever again want to have a sixty year old woman ask me why someone is wearing a tail and puppy dog feet.

[unfrumpable.]

I have also worked in retail and waited tables, you may be right. I worked in a comic book store and there were some real characters that came in that would probably give many here the vapors but I guess it made me more tolerant in general.

 

lol My brother worked in a comic book store for a while. I love comic book stores, though I am not overly into comics. We went to a local CBS on free comic day and there was someone dressed up as Ms Frizzle. It was awesome! The look on my son's face was priceless.

[Slartibartfast]

lol My brother worked in a comic book store for a while. I love comic book stores, though I am not overly into comics. We went to a local CBS on free comic day and there was someone dressed up as Ms Frizzle. It was awesome! The look on my son's face was priceless.

 

 

:lol: HIlarious!

 

 

 

 

Mrs Mungo just told me on the phone that she is wearing a tank top and yoga pants so I called her Whore of Babylon.

[Caroline]

 

 

:lol: HIlarious!

 

 

 

 

Mrs Mungo just told me on the phone that she is wearing a tank top and yoga pants so I called her Whore of Babylon.

 

I don't think that is the first time she has been called that by a forum member.

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

Honestly, I find many of the comments in this thread even MORE disturbing than what the TSA agent said. He was just commenting on her clothing. I'm shocked by the number of people in this thread who are making all kinds of assumptions about her intentions, her behavior, and her character based on nothing more than what she's wearing — which is a perfectly normal and appropriate outfit among American teens in 2013.

 

Describing her as "parading around," "half naked," "showing her private parts," "busting out of a sheer top," "advertising her stuff," "showing off her boobs," wearing the kind of clothes that "say I'm hot to trot, come and get me," wishing to "be viewed as a sexual object," "intentionally trying to attract men's attention and arouse their interest."

 

Characterizing a 15 yo girl, who asks for clarification from the man who is mumbling and glaring at her while inspecting her documents, as "confrontational" and "demanding."

 

Speculating that she was "flirting," or "leaning over with an eyeful of boob in his face," or "making it all up for 15 minutes of fame."

 

:cursing:

 

Jackie

 

Oh, thank you. I've been out all day but just popped back in to catch up, and I was working up to this very post, quotes and all. You've saved me the time. I am literally sickened by what I'm reading here.

[Mrs Mungo]

 

 

I don't think that is the first time she has been called that by a forum member.

 

Ha!!!!!!

[unsinkable]

 

 

 

:lol: HIlarious!

 

 

 

 

Mrs Mungo just told me on the phone that she is wearing a tank top and yoga pants so I called her Whore of Babylon.

 

Ho of Hawaii sounds poetic.

[Mrs Mungo]

 

 

 

:lol: HIlarious!

 

 

 

 

Mrs Mungo just told me on the phone that she is wearing a tank top and yoga pants so I called her Whore of Babylon.

 

I haven't left my house yet today. But, the government employee who dropped off the package containing my new 2 piece swimsuit managed to not say anything to me about it. He didn't even look surprised or enticed. He must have iron control over his emotions.

[nmoira]

 

 

Ho of Hawaii sounds poetic.

 

 

Hawaii Five Ho... with friends.

[Caroline]

I haven't left my house yet today. But, the government employee who dropped off the package containing my new 2 piece swimsuit managed to not say anything to me about it. He didn't even look surprised or enticed. He must have iron control over his emotions.

 

 

I am sitting here in my two piece bathing suit because I am waiting for my turn in the shower. I did throw my coverup on to go get the mail, though.

[unsinkable]

 

 

Hawaii Five Ho... with friends.

 

 

:lol:

 

 

[Mrs Mungo]

Speaking of what I am wearing today-I have to attend a function this afternoon. The dress code is: Aloha Business Casual. Ideas?

[Slartibartfast]

Speaking of what I am wearing today-I have to attend a function this afternoon. The dress code is: Aloha Business Casual. Ideas?

 

 

A sundress and "nice" flip flops? I think anything with the word "aloha" means I get to wear flip flops.

[Mrs Mungo]

For dudes it apparently means: khakis or similar, collared shirt, closed toe shoes.

 

So, I think sundress (at least the type of sundresses I own) are a little too casual. Hmm...it might require shopping, oh darn. Give me some ideas?

[Slartibartfast]

For dudes it apparently means: khakis or similar, collared shirt, closed toe shoes.

 

So, I think sundress (at least the type of sundresses I own) are a little too casual. Hmm...it might require shopping, oh darn. Give me some ideas?

 

 

 

I think something like http://www.target.com/p/merona-petites-short-sleeve-v-neck-ruffled-dress-assorted-colors/-/A-14283255#?lnk=sc_qi_detaillink

 

or

 

http://www.target.com/p/merona-women-s-v-neck-sleeveless-wrap-dress-assorted-colors/-/A-14295728#prodSlot=large_3_3

 

Might work

[Caroline]

 

 

I think something like http://www.target.co...c_qi_detaillink

 

or

 

http://www.target.co...dSlot=large_3_3

 

Might work

 

 

Those are both cute. I like the second one better.

[elegantlion]

Exactly what "message" was this girl sending with her outfit?

 

 

I think her message was "I know of gravity only in theory and I have not given birth." Alas, *sigh*

[Guest submarines]

Oh, for goodness' sake, I didn't go searching for pictures of her in shorts. I was looking for any more information on the story and when I googled her name, her Facebook page was the first thing that came up.

 

 

Which of the articles mentions her full name?

[Mrs Mungo]

I found a Boden crinkle dress in my closet. It has short sleeves, v-neck, it is mid-calf in length (on me, pretty sure it hit the catalog model at the knee, lol), it has lots of flowers. I think it will work with some green espadrilles.

 

This dress:

http://item.mobileweb.ebay.co.uk/viewitem?itemId=111054353829

[unfrumpable.]

Pretty!

[Corraleno]

I think her message was "I know of gravity only in theory and I have not given birth." Alas, *sigh*

 

:smilielol5: :smilielol5: :smilielol5:

 

Jackie

[LucyStoner]

I found a Boden crinkle dress in my closet. It has short sleeves, v-neck, it is mid-calf in length (on me, pretty sure it hit the catalog model at the knee, lol), it has lots of flowers. I think it will work with some green espadrilles.

 

This dress:

http://item.mobilewe...Id=111054353829

 

Very pretty, I just dunno if it lives up to your title as the Whore of Babylon. You might need to shorten it.

[Mrs Mungo]

 

 

Very pretty, I just dunno if it lives up to your title as the Whore of Babylon. You might need to shorten it.

 

You just haven't seen my boobs in it.