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History Spine: Usborne or Kingfisher...and...


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I am looking at Amazon and my public library and there are a few versions of Kingfisher - which is the better one to use for a 5th grader studying the Ancients for the first time?

 

We will be using this as a spine and our History book from Seton will be the supplement. Shhh. We will like it better this way. :)

 

This one seems different than the rest of them. Is it for a younger age group?

 

51%2B81EgHtGL._SY300_.jpg

 

1999 Edition:

 

9780753451946_p0_v1_s260x420.jpg

 

 

 

2004:

9780753457849.jpg

 

This says 2010 and seems to be a different book, bot covering the same time:

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This one is the 2012 edition. I have this on hold for me at the library but I don't know what I'm looking at to see what's changed!

 

9780753468753.gif

 

+++++

 

Usborne in second post

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Usborne:

 

I don't even know where to begin!! There are so many World History books.

483864-M.jpgtwelve-thousand-years-world-history.jpg

 

 

These Three look really interesting as we will be focusing more on JUST the ancient and not getting into the Medieval times or later. Has anyone used them?

 

9780439221351.jpg1757735.jpgancient-world-new.jpg

 

If you have used both, which do you find more exciting? Which do you like better? Can you tell me why?

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I don't have any of those, but I did want to mention that I think the Usborne titles are both a part of the Usborne Encyclopedia of World History. http://www.amazon.com/Usborne-Encyclopedia-World-History-Internet/dp/0794526888/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1371207387&sr=8-1&keywords=Usborne+encyclopedia From what I understand that book has prehistoric, ancient, medieval & a last few years (or something like that) section. Usborne has a habit of including their small encyclopedias in combined volumes, and giving them a broader title, as well as selling them individually. I don't think it's a bad thing, but I really wish they'd make it more obvious in the item descriptions! I've ended up with the same exact pages in different Usborne books, so you might want to check out the previews of those to compare them and make sure you know exactly what you'd be getting.

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Have you used any other Usborne books? Some people really like them and some people don't. I use Usborne for my younger children (3rd grade and under) and Kingfisher for older (4th grade and up). I will second what was said above about the different smaller books being combined into one big book. So if you decide to use Usborne with Ancients, you can either get their main history encyclopedia OR the Ancient World book...not both. We have the white Kingfisher Illustrated History of the World and I really like it, but I have never seen the other Kingfisher editions so I don't know how to compare them for you. Hopefully someone else will chime in on the differences:)

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The white Kingfisher is the preferred Kingfisher.

 

We have the Internet linked Usborne, which the kids like, but honestly we do not consistently use it. I have found they vastly prefer pouring through a stack of children's nonfiction from our library in any given history topic than the Usborne. We use it, but not nearly as much as we use the Usborne science encyclopedia.

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I had to cut the first post short as my battery was MUCH lower than I thought.

 

A few years ago I looked at the newer Kingfisher encyclopedia before I bought the white edition. While they appeared to have very similar content, the older edition's layout seemed less jumbled, less visually distracting.

 

If I was only going to purchase one History encyclopedia I would purchase a Kingfisher.

 

If you want the older edition, and do not want to pay a bundle for it, watch Amazon. Whenever there is a Kingfisher thread here the price spikes on the white edition, but it will drop back down. I think I gave a little over $20 for it two years ago.

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We have the 3rd Kingfisher, and none of the Usborne ones listed.

 

Hmmm, I might be in Vegas this next month sometime - I should bring them and show you!!! :D

 

The Usborne ones drive me nuts trying to figure out which is what in each book. But they do mostly seem to have the bigger book broken down. We have 2 version of the Encyclopedia, then the Ancient and Medieval books.

 

My oldest was not into the Kingfisher, and my middle one isn't really ready for all the words on the page yet. I'm going to try it with her this summer though..... but darn it, now I want the white KF!!

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We have the white Kingfisher. It is better than the first red one (the only other edition I've seen) IMO, but I'll be surprised if you will *both* like it for your spine.

It is pretty dry.

 

I'm curious - is it used as a supplement with WTM? I don't have the book and I only read it once a few months ago. I just know these are recommended here to be part of the history.

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I own the white Kingfisher and the set of 4 Usborne books (prehistory, ancient, medieval, last 500 years). I have seen and evaluated the red Kingfisher and the internet-linked Usborne. I think the Usborne books are a draw; they contain the same material, just one large vs four smaller books. If the internet links are valuable to you, definitely get the larger volume. The white Kingfisher has more of a narrative voice and the red Kingfisher has more of a bulleted, DK/Usborne voice. Usborne has more/better pictures and a lower reading level. Kingfisher is lovely too, but with more white space and a higher reading level. Assuming your DD is grade level, I think Kingfisher is more appropriate.

 

That said, these are all encyclopedias, so they provide a bare bones overview (much like a literal spine, LOL). If your Seton book has more details to flesh out the history, great. If not... What are your plans here? Will you follow the WTM method (read from encyclopedic spine, outline, research choice topics and read from supplemental sources, outline/summarize/notebook, correlate literature selections to history, etc.) or are you looking for these two books to serve as the lion's share of your history program? If the former, any of these would be good and sufficient (and, personally, I would go with either Kingfisher, picking which edition according to your own preference and with knowledge of what Seton will make up for). If the latter and you want more meat, maybe look at the K12 Human Odyssey, Oxford University Press, MoH, etc.

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Which Seton book? Why are you wanting to supplement? The answers to these may give us some idea of if one or another would be a better fit.

 

That said we will be using A Message of Ancient Days. It is the middle school textbook that Calvert uses for ancient history. I own the first red Kingfisher and the Usborne Internet Linked World History. The Usborne is the easier text. I do not plan to use either. I may use SOTW on audio, when we are out and about in the car, just because I also own it.

 

Mandy

 

 

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I'm curious - is it used as a supplement with WTM? I don't have the book and I only read it once a few months ago. I just know these are recommended here to be part of the history.

 

The White Kingfisher was the original WTM's spine-of-choice for logic-stage history. It went out of print & she's changed the rec (to the Red Kingfisher, for example) with different editions of WTM. Not every WTM rec is the best fit for our particular kids. :coolgleamA:

 

DD#1 used it as one of her spines this year as part of History Odyssey (Pandia Press - although they actually schedule the Red Kingfisher; I had to switch the page #s). If you ask her, she would have rather used SOTW1 as her spine. I seem to remember your daughter thought SOTW1 sounded very 'young' (geared toward little kids). I think my daughter liked that aspect (nostalgia for the 1st time she went through it, easier content).

 

It isn't necessarily very enjoyable, YKWIM? There are some other really good logic-stage narrative spines (Susan Strauss Art, Dorothy Mills, Human Odyssey, etc.) for Ancients.

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Which Seton book? Why are you wanting to supplement? The answers to these may give us some idea of if one or another would be a better fit.

 

That said we will be using A Message of Ancient Days. It is the middle school textbook that Calvert uses for ancient history. I own the first red Kingfisher and the Usborne Internet Linked World History. The Usborne is the easier text. I do not plan to use either. I may use SOTW on audio, when we are out and about in the car, just because I also own it.

 

Mandy

 

This is the Seton book we will be using. It's pretty general so I was hoping to fill in more details with books and a spine to give more of a time line. I like their history, but I feel it needs *more* if that makes sense.

 

https://www.setonhom...oView=P-HI06-17

 

Obviously it's Catholic through and through and Christian themes are through out the book. I want to add more "meat" to it.

 

I'm not hooked into Usborne or Kingfisher if there is something better out there that fits the bill for us! I'm going to check out your A Message of Ancient Days book.

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I don't have any of those, but I did want to mention that I think the Usborne titles are both a part of the Usborne Encyclopedia of World History. http://www.amazon.co...ne encyclopedia From what I understand that book has prehistoric, ancient, medieval & a last few years (or something like that) section. Usborne has a habit of including their small encyclopedias in combined volumes, and giving them a broader title, as well as selling them individually. I don't think it's a bad thing, but I really wish they'd make it more obvious in the item descriptions! I've ended up with the same exact pages in different Usborne books, so you might want to check out the previews of those to compare them and make sure you know exactly what you'd be getting.

 

I didn't know that about Usborne - that's good to know. SInce I am interested in the Prehistoric and the Ancient book, I'd do better to get the whole encyclopedia and only use the parts we want to use.

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Have you used any other Usborne books? Some people really like them and some people don't. I use Usborne for my younger children (3rd grade and under) and Kingfisher for older (4th grade and up). I will second what was said above about the different smaller books being combined into one big book. So if you decide to use Usborne with Ancients, you can either get their main history encyclopedia OR the Ancient World book...not both. We have the white Kingfisher Illustrated History of the World and I really like it, but I have never seen the other Kingfisher editions so I don't know how to compare them for you. Hopefully someone else will chime in on the differences:)

 

Truthfully? I have never even seen an Usborne book IRL yet. I just keep hearing about how good they are and that so many people recommend and use them.

 

It sounds like Kingfisher is more her age group though. She's a rising 5th grader.

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The white Kingfisher is the preferred Kingfisher.

 

We have the Internet linked Usborne, which the kids like, but honestly we do not consistently use it. I have found they vastly prefer pouring through a stack of children's nonfiction from our library in any given history topic than the Usborne. We use it, but not nearly as much as we use the Usborne science encyclopedia.

 

That's a great point. I like getting little books to go along with what we're studying and I know she likes getting out of the book too.

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I had to cut the first post short as my battery was MUCH lower than I thought.

 

A few years ago I looked at the newer Kingfisher encyclopedia before I bought the white edition. While they appeared to have very similar content, the older edition's layout seemed less jumbled, less visually distracting.

 

If I was only going to purchase one History encyclopedia I would purchase a Kingfisher.

 

If you want the older edition, and do not want to pay a bundle for it, watch Amazon. Whenever there is a Kingfisher thread here the price spikes on the white edition, but it will drop back down. I think I gave a little over $20 for it two years ago.

 

I will keep that in mind. Our library is carrying the 2012 edition and I have it on request so I can at least look at that. If it's too visually distracting and jumbled, then I'll know the White Kingfisher would probably be better for us.

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We have the white Kingfisher. It is better than the first red one (the only other edition I've seen) IMO, but I'll be surprised if you will *both* like it for your spine.

It is pretty dry.

 

Can you tell me why it's better? If it's because of the narrative voice, I think I'm going to want to find the White one. The one thing she did like about SOTW was the narrative/story type voice.

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I have the red The Kingfisher History Encyclopedia 1999 edition. It is not really a narrative. As someone pointed out, it is a bit like the DK Eyewitness books in that it will have the main text and then pictures with text around them. The Usborne Internet Linked History is at a lower reading level and has almost the same set-up, but to me the Usborne text feels a little choppier than the Kingfisher text. Both of my copies contain an OE timeline.

HTH-

Mandy

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Wow, I think this is the textbook we used when I was in school. Hey, you can get it for $1.99, not bad! http://www.barnesand..._-2688924509946

I purchased a 2003 edition used in great condition (the spine isn't even broken in) and I don't think that I paid over $10. I purchased it because ds wanted to go a more textbook route next year. We seriously considered Calvert, but in the end I just paid a fraction of the cost and purchased the same or similar textbooks from amazon. This is the textbook packaged with their 6th grade ancient history study. :)

Mandy

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I have the red The Kingfisher History Encyclopedia 1999 edition. It is not really a narrative. As someone pointed out, it is a bit like the DK Eyewitness books in that it will have the main text and then pictures with text around them. The Usborne Internet Linked History is at a lower reading level and has almost the same set-up, but to me the Usborne text feels a little choppier than the Kingfisher text. Both of my copies contain an OE timeline.

HTH-

Mandy

 

Excuse my ignorance, but what is the OE timeline?

 

I think she will like the narrative better, so I'm going to actually try to comb the used book sites for the white Kingfisher - it sounds like it's going to be the best fit for us. Now to find it reasonable in price!!!!

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I think she will like the narrative better, so I'm going to actually try to comb the used book sites for the white Kingfisher - it sounds like it's going to be the best fit for us. Now to find it reasonable in price!!!!

 

Ugh. Now I am scared you will buy it and be disappointed. :lol: How to put this... I know I said it had "more of a narrative voice," but the book as a whole is not a running narrative. I was speaking more in comparison to the newer Kingfisher editions which went decidedly more DKish in the breaking up of text. As I said, just to be clear, what you get is still an encyclopedia. The sections are broken up, and the history is chronological but not at all in a story form like SOTW. It is just that the writing in each section is less fragmented than in the the red Kingfisher.

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Ugh. Now I am scared you will buy it and be disappointed. :lol: How to put this... I know I said it had "more of a narrative voice," but the book as a whole is not a running narrative. I was speaking more in comparison to the newer Kingfisher editions which went decidedly more DKish in the breaking up of text. As I said, just to be clear, what you get is still an encyclopedia. The sections are broken up, and the history is chronological but not at all in a story form like SOTW. It is just that the writing in each section is less fragmented than in the the red Kingfisher.

 

 

Ok Kristina, that makes sense. I get it now. It's not written in story form like SOTW, but it's not in sentence/thought fragments. It's written out as a regular book would be.

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Ok Kristina, that makes sense. I get it now. It's not written in story form like SOTW, but it's not in sentence/thought fragments. It's written out as a regular book would be.

 

Sort of, but there are still interesting tidbits in sidebars and it is kind of "just the facts, ma'am" in the text. Also, there is a running timeline, lots of labeled illustrations and, later, pictures. It is still visually pretty busy.

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If she would like more of a narrative voice, see if your library has Human Odyssey Vol 1. (Used prices vary considerably. They can be lower than $15 for a good one to $35 or more depending on the time of year.) IMO, it could be referred to as an 'older version of SOTW.'

 

The point of the Kingfisher in WTM-like history is to be able to outline from the text. It almost seems like someone took a text and outlined it & that's what's in the Red Kingfisher. So, it isn't ideal for what our purposes are. The White one seems less choppy.

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Susan,

This is completely off topic of the thread, and I know it was mentioned before a while ago, but I just want to say...

I miss the beautiful pictures of your daughter you used to put in your siggy! They always made me smile.

 

 

Thank you. I might put it back one day. I was told it apparently bothered some people because it slowed down threads I posted a lot in, so I removed it. I was very used to Mommy boards where everyone had pictures of their kids in their siggies, so I put one here too. It's not really the norm here though, I guess.

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If she would like more of a narrative voice, see if your library has Human Odyssey Vol 1. (Used prices vary considerably. They can be lower than $15 for a good one to $35 or more depending on the time of year.) IMO, it could be referred to as an 'older version of SOTW.'

 

The point of the Kingfisher in WTM-like history is to be able to outline from the text. It almost seems like someone took a text and outlined it & that's what's in the Red Kingfisher. So, it isn't ideal for what our purposes are. The White one seems less choppy.

 

They don't have Human Odyssey, so I can't check it out.

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I found the white Kingfisher for around $20 on ebay and Human Odyssey vol 1 for $10 on amazon after obsessively checking daily on both sites for them. I'm not sure which my rising 5th will prefer, maybe we'll even use both at different times? This is my first year as a curriculum junkie, so I'm sure I will soon learn about others I will need.

 

FWIW, I really like the layout of the white Kingfisher. It seems very age appropriate without being overwhelming or flashy. We've used it once or twice just to look up answers to random questions, and it was easy to navigate. But I haven't seen the later versions, so I can't compare. I did do a lot of searches on the forums to figure out which version to buy, and the white one seemed to be the golden standard.

 

And I miss your daughter's pics, too - and your message about homeschooling since K and so grateful for the opportunity. It always made me smile.

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Thanks to Alte Veste for providing the link to Christianbook. Check out the samples to see what HO looks like. (Note in my first post, I mentioned the used volume price. I have a friend who got one used in awesome condition for less than $15. Camelcamelcamel can be a great tool for 'watching' for just the right price. Click on the link to Camel^3 above & make sure "3rd party used" is "on" - then put in your value for 3rd party used tracking & have them send you an email when your value is met.)

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Thanks to Alte Veste for providing the link to Christianbook. Check out the samples to see what HO looks like. (Note in my first post, I mentioned the used volume price. I have a friend who got one used in awesome condition for less than $15. Camelcamelcamel can be a great tool for 'watching' for just the right price. Click on the link to Camel^3 above & make sure "3rd party used" is "on" - then put in your value for 3rd party used tracking & have them send you an email when your value is met.)

 

 

I'll have to check that out! Thank you !

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I found this other book that I liked very much as well. It's very similar to Usborne:

 

DK Web-linked Prehistory

 

It has a website to go to and look up keywords:

http://www.prehistory.dkonline.com

 

51g90HVgroL.jpg

 

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/prehistory-peter-chrisp/1008579529?ean=9780756634612

 

I am more confused than EVER about what we're going to use now. I like both the presentation and the content of both the Usborne and the Kingfisher books.

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I am having so much fun with this!!! I have found two history series that I am looking to find at the local libraries:

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The "You Wouldn't Want to be a..." series

 

http://www.salariya.com/wouldnt/pages/wouldnt.html

 

61G220JNHPL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg

 

DK's Early Humans Eyewitness book is also very good for the ancients!!

 

51YzpMgKDsL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg

 

I'm looking for this one to audit as well:

http://www.amazon.com/Best-Book-Early-People-Books/dp/0753455773/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_y

 

51zoF4TjFkL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg

 

Children are very curious about who their prehistoric ancestors were, how they lived, and what they may have looked like, and this new Best Book is just the source to satisfy emerging anthropologists.

Children will learn how early families survived, hunted, gathered into primitive settlements, began to use tools, and invented farming techniques. Step-by-step illustrations and captions explore ancient villages and the work of the scientists who find and catalog their discoveries.

 

It's age level is a little lower than Mel, but I'm okay with that if the information is sound.

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