I have an extremely premature question about honors/AP high school courses.

[Alte Veste Academy]

I see people discussing what they used that was "approved" for AP courses. I have even seen AP packages for sale on the classified boards. This is bumming me out, and I am trying to figure out if I am bummed over nothing or for good reason. It is very likely that we will homeschool through high school. An enormous part of the excitement for me was the idea that we could dig deep with truly extraordinary resources, weaving together custom coursework just as we always have, but at a higher level (definitely honors/AP level stuff). The dream does not include using the exact same textbook and materials as every other student across the country. The idea of creating my own curriculum from 1st through 8th only to be forced to get with the program for high school makes me want to have a temper tantrum. :tongue_smilie:

 

So, basically, what's the scoop? What are the rules and where can I find them? Can you only get AP credit if you use approved materials or does credit come from just passing the test, regardless of materials? Can any of you share how you handled honors/AP work while still exercising intellectual freedom? Also, most importantly, is there anything I should know about how to proceed in the middle grades for the greatest chance of success in high school?

[klmama]

As I understand it, an AP course has to have its syllabus approved by the College Board. You cannot call your class an AP class on the transcript unless your syllabus has been approved. However, your dc do not have to take an approved AP course to take the test. You can have your dc use whatever materials you see fit to prepare them for the test. Earning college credit for passing that particular test will be entirely up to the college. Some grant credit and others may not grant credit at all. Be sure to check out the College Board or the websites of colleges your dc are considering to find out what tests can earn credit at which colleges. That can change from year to year, so it is a good idea to check back.

[OSUBuckeye]

AP is a trademarked name, so schools and individuals can only list that they took an "AP .... course" if they get the approval of the syllabus. For a homeschool, what really matters is what your kid scored on an AP course. You could go through the whole CollegeBoard approval process, but if your child gets a 1 (out of 5), then it's not like they were successful. A child who doesn't take an official AP course yet earns a 5 still demonstrates that they have mastered the course content and are ready for college. [A 5 shows that they are a capable, advanced student, a 4 is admirable as well, and a 3 demonstrates to admissions staff that the student took challenging high school classes and did well, though they shouldn't necessarily receive college credit for their efforts.]

 

One thing to reflect on is that AP courses are great for teaching a high school student how to efficiently and effectively store large amounts of information, and how to put that information down in a way that's connected to many related pieces of information. It's not necessarily a class for long creative "bunny trails", or for deep pondering and reflections. But I think that the ability to process large quantities of information, make connections between events/concepts, and write coherently about them is nothing to sneeze at either. Kids in AP classes have a lot of reading assigned and they are forced to manage their time well. But again, the difficulty of an AP class is largely in the sheer quantity of material that will be tested on, not in the complexity of concepts within that material or the level of deep thinking they'll be required to do on the test. (Again, it's not a bad thing, nor is it the ideal way to learn, it just is what it is, and I really value those lessons/methods for that age group)

 

The good news is that you can get a book like "5 Steps to a 5" and spend a portion of your time learning/drilling AP-testable concepts, facts, and their applications, and if you make sure that this is one of your priorities (as opposed to willy-nilly teaching stuff), then you can free up time for the bunny trails and the deep thinking like you've said you enjoy. Find a efficient way to teach the "Must Know" facts so you can spend some time with the interesting "Want to Learn" explorations. If you happen to be thinking about US History, I've made some posts a while back that get into the nitty gritty of structuring a course.

[regentrude]

So, basically, what's the scoop? What are the rules and where can I find them? Can you only get AP credit if you use approved materials or does credit come from just passing the test, regardless of materials?

 

As others have already stated, the credit comes from passing the test with a high score, not from merely taking the course.

The student does not have to take a designated AP class to take the exam, but must prepare for precisely the content that is being tested.

You can obtain an AP label for your personal course if you submit your syllabus to the College Board for approval and need to do that if you want to call the course an AP course on the transcript. Some homeschoolers do so, others do not find it necessary and simply label their course xxx with AP exam.

One way to balance the more restricted AP class with more freedom is to choose carefully which subjects to do AP in and freestyle other subjects.

 

Can any of you share how you handled honors/AP work while still exercising intellectual freedom?

We have chosen not to do AP at all and go for dual enrollment at the university instead. We use dual enrollment for selected subjects and do others at home with an eclectic mix of materials.

 

There is a long sticky thread on top of this board.

Also, most importantly, is there anything I should know about how to proceed in the middle grades for the greatest chance of success in high school?

 

 

Be aware that your child's level of math will determine which science sequence is possible in high school.

Physics and chemistry require algebra. If the student has not had algebra before 9th grade, his only option is biology in 9th, or the less rigorous conceptual physics/conceptual chemistry.

Reading and writing ability are more important than having covered specific content in the content subjects. We focus on things like the ability to work with a text, take notes from reading, write coherently, know how to research information while aiming for exposure and broad background knowledge in history/science without attempting to be comprehensive.

[Lori D.]

Well, my understanding is that if you are doing AP, top tier/selective schools would like to see 3-5 AP tests, all with high scores (a 5 preferably, but a 4 is acceptable in there). So you could decide to delegate classes you don't care about creating for yourself to become the AP classes -- perhaps: one math; one science; a foreign language; and government. That leaves you free to create the remaining 20+ classes of high school yourself, and certainly the English/Lit., History/Humanities, Art/Music, and Electives, which are most frequently the courses homeschoolers like to design for themselves. :)

 

One thing to keep in mind: there is the beginning of a bit of backlash *against* AP starting now, due to some high schools saying they are offering AP, but their courses are not really of AP level. Also, some colleges do not necessarily grant credit for AP tests, although the AP tests may be a factor that helps toward admissions to some selective universities. You may want to look at the possibility of taking some SAT II (also called SAT Subject Tests), or take Dual Credit courses instead of AP, or even do some CLEP tests for college credit, depending on where your student plans to go to university and what your options are locally. Check out the threads linked in that stickied thread Regentrude referred to (post #2 has most of the threads on AP, CLEP, Dual Credit, etc.).

 

At this point, I'm not sure I'd get worked up about AP, as you really won't be at the decision-making process for that for a few more years. Your student may not even end up heading toward a post-high school option that will need any APs. Or, things may continue to change, with AP tests perhaps peaking and descending in popularity/desireablility. Also, who knows how Common Core may (or may not) change the SAT Reasoning test? At the moment, the SAT or ACT, and possibly some SAT Subject Tests seem to be the most frequently desired/required tests that colleges want to see from students...

 

So, do some reading, keep your options open, and maybe wait on AP until 11th and 12th grades to see if they are still even in vogue at that time. You never know! ;)

 

BEST of luck in your research and planning! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[MorningGlory]

The idea of creating my own curriculum from 1st through 8th only to be forced to get with the program for high school makes me want to have a temper tantrum.

 

 

I had a similar temper tantrum last year before my son started 9th grade. My fit wasn't brought on by the nature of AP classes or the like but by the extremely limiting graduation requirements dictated by my state in combination with my cover school (which you pretty much have to use in the state of TN). When I started sketching out my son's 4 year plan, I realized that there was very little room for deviation from "standard". I was furious...and still am to an extent; this is not what my homeschooling dream was like. My cover school requires 23 specific credits PLUS 4 Bible credits. As you can see, that doesn't give much room for an interesting, exciting, *unusual* high school plan.

 

Well, I've tweaked it as much as I can to provide my son an education that fits him. As just one example, he is required by our cover school to have a year of either World History (yes, in one year) or World Geography. I am presently designing a course that I am going to call "World Culture, Religion, and Geography". It should fit the requirement, but it will allow my son to study some things beyond pure geography. I plan to do the something similar with the required Wellness course; I would like for him to read about the "big food" industry and local farming and westernized diets, etc. So I plan to make that requirement fit our particular goals. I am also adding in a semester here and a semester there of courses that might give him glimpses of "different things". He is doing two AoPS courses (C&P and Number Theory). He is going to take a semester each of astronomy and meteorology...plus all the usual required sciences (including AP courses). I am really stretching his Bible credits to include worldview issues and Christian literature. And I'm throwing a sabermetrics course (baseball statistics) into the mix, too. These are just some examples of ideas that I have had to make his high school experience interesting and a little bit different. If you are creative, you can certainly find a way to make the requirements fit your homeschool...instead of the other way around. :)

 

So don't be bummed. My son's 9th grade year has been wonderful. If you look at my siggy, you will see a list of very traditional-looking courses. But beneath that exterior list, there has still been lots of "rabbit trails" and delightful excursions. Even in Abeka biology. :)

Jetta

 

P.S. Start *selectively* reading this high school board. There are quite a few ladies on here that design the most fascinating courses. I LOVE reading about the unusual things that they do...it gives me encouragement to be creative myself. Do a search for "outside the box" courses on this forum...there was a thread a while back that gave me lots and lots of ideas. The problem is fitting them all in!

[Jane in NC]

You have received some good input already, but I will toss out one other tidbit. Try to be aware of which way the wind is blowing! This is true of AP and college application requirements in general.

 

Let me give you an off topic example: when my son was on the verge of high school, NC changed its requirements for applicants to the UNC system. Instead of three years of math, students need four. This caught some homeschoolers unaware. Their older kids had entered the UNC system with a certain group of classes, but their younger siblings could not do the same.

 

Credit acceptance from dual enrollment, AP and CLEP are among the things that are bound to change. Some schools that once gave credit for a 3 on the AP exam, now only give credit for a 5. The exams themselves are changing. AP Bio formerly required a ton of memorization. Supposedly that is not the case with the new test.

 

Which all leads to Aunt Jane's moral of the story: Do what is best for your kids and your family. There have been some great discussions on breadth vs. depth (Swimmermom3 started a lengthy thread). Some parents feel that AP offers the sort of challenge their students enjoy. Others feel that AP is too constrictive. Our students need to demonstrate on their college apps that they are capable of college work--there are lots of ways of doing this.

 

Frankly I think that the beauty of homeschooling is allowing our kids to follow their passions. I know homeschooled students who have done all sorts of interesting and distinguishing things: sail boat construction, peacewalking, national sewing competitions. My guy was able to spend several weeks volunteering with a college archaeological field school during a time when brick and mortar students were in the classroom taking their end of grade exams. This single experience led to tons of advice, his college application essay, a great letter of recommendation and the kindling of a fire that lit up his eyes whenever the topic of archaeology came up.

[PeterPan]

MorningGlory, it seems like you're doing on the front end what I figured I would do on the hind end (looking at the things we did/wanted to do and putting them into categories, determining time spent or material covered, and assigning units/credits). So in that sense, even though your cover school seems annoying, it's probably saving you hassle in the long run. Now I'm thinking I need to get *my* butt in gear and think through this better. :)

[Alte Veste Academy]

As I understand it, an AP course has to have its syllabus approved by the College Board. You cannot call your class an AP class on the transcript unless your syllabus has been approved. However, your dc do not have to take an approved AP course to take the test. You can have your dc use whatever materials you see fit to prepare them for the test. Earning college credit for passing that particular test will be entirely up to the college. Some grant credit and others may not grant credit at all. Be sure to check out the College Board or the websites of colleges your dc are considering to find out what tests can earn credit at which colleges. That can change from year to year, so it is a good idea to check back.

 

Thanks. It makes sense to start by looking at specific college requirements. As we get closer and the kids start to think about where they would like to go, I'm sure it will get easier. Right now I have this overwhelming feeling of needing to prepare them for any college, whatever they might choose. I didn't know where I wanted to go until my junior year, at which point 3/4 of my high school coursework had already been determined. Of course, that is not my focus right now, just little worries that creep up on me at night. :tongue_smilie:

[Alte Veste Academy]

AP is a trademarked name, so schools and individuals can only list that they took an "AP .... course" if they get the approval of the syllabus. For a homeschool, what really matters is what your kid scored on an AP course. You could go through the whole CollegeBoard approval process, but if your child gets a 1 (out of 5), then it's not like they were successful. A child who doesn't take an official AP course yet earns a 5 still demonstrates that they have mastered the course content and are ready for college. [A 5 shows that they are a capable, advanced student, a 4 is admirable as well, and a 3 demonstrates to admissions staff that the student took challenging high school classes and did well, though they shouldn't necessarily receive college credit for their efforts.]

 

One thing to reflect on is that AP courses are great for teaching a high school student how to efficiently and effectively store large amounts of information, and how to put that information down in a way that's connected to many related pieces of information. It's not necessarily a class for long creative "bunny trails", or for deep pondering and reflections. But I think that the ability to process large quantities of information, make connections between events/concepts, and write coherently about them is nothing to sneeze at either. Kids in AP classes have a lot of reading assigned and they are forced to manage their time well. But again, the difficulty of an AP class is largely in the sheer quantity of material that will be tested on, not in the complexity of concepts within that material or the level of deep thinking they'll be required to do on the test. (Again, it's not a bad thing, nor is it the ideal way to learn, it just is what it is, and I really value those lessons/methods for that age group)

 

The good news is that you can get a book like "5 Steps to a 5" and spend a portion of your time learning/drilling AP-testable concepts, facts, and their applications, and if you make sure that this is one of your priorities (as opposed to willy-nilly teaching stuff), then you can free up time for the bunny trails and the deep thinking like you've said you enjoy. Find a efficient way to teach the "Must Know" facts so you can spend some time with the interesting "Want to Learn" explorations. If you happen to be thinking about US History, I've made some posts a while back that get into the nitty gritty of structuring a course.

 

Very helpful. Thanks! I think part of my problem/bias is that I took every AP and honors course my high school offered and, while I felt the materials and instruction were superior, we never did seem to have any time for meaning or enjoyment of the material. The pace was as you describe and we were just supposed to feel proud for high grades. I was the classic "test and forget" student.

 

I spent some time last night after I posted reading about the changes coming to the AP program. It makes me happy to think of what might be by the time my kids get there.

[Alte Veste Academy]

As others have already stated, the credit comes from passing the test with a high score, not from merely taking the course.

The student does not have to take a designated AP class to take the exam, but must prepare for precisely the content that is being tested.

You can obtain an AP label for your personal course if you submit your syllabus to the College Board for approval and need to do that if you want to call the course an AP course on the transcript. Some homeschoolers do so, others do not find it necessary and simply label their course xxx with AP exam.

One way to balance the more restricted AP class with more freedom is to choose carefully which subjects to do AP in and freestyle other subjects.

 

We have chosen not to do AP at all and go for dual enrollment at the university instead. We use dual enrollment for selected subjects and do others at home with an eclectic mix of materials.

 

There is a long sticky thread on top of this board.

 

Be aware that your child's level of math will determine which science sequence is possible in high school.

Physics and chemistry require algebra. If the student has not had algebra before 9th grade, his only option is biology in 9th, or the less rigorous conceptual physics/conceptual chemistry.

Reading and writing ability are more important than having covered specific content in the content subjects. We focus on things like the ability to work with a text, take notes from reading, write coherently, know how to research information while aiming for exposure and broad background knowledge in history/science without attempting to be comprehensive.

 

Oh, thank you for the reminder about dual enrollment. That would be a huge help! Good info about the importance of the math sequence too. Thanks!

[Alte Veste Academy]

Well, my understanding is that if you are doing AP, top tier/selective schools would like to see 3-5 AP tests, all with high scores (a 5 preferably, but a 4 is acceptable in there). So you could decide to delegate classes you don't care about creating for yourself to become the AP classes -- perhaps: one math; one science; a foreign language; and government. That leaves you free to create the remaining 20+ classes of high school yourself, and certainly the English/Lit., History/Humanities, Art/Music, and Electives, which are most frequently the courses homeschoolers like to design for themselves. :)

 

One thing to keep in mind: there is the beginning of a bit of backlash *against* AP starting now, due to some high schools saying they are offering AP, but their courses are not really of AP level. Also, some colleges do not necessarily grant credit for AP tests, although the AP tests may be a factor that helps toward admissions to some selective universities. You may want to look at the possibility of taking some SAT II (also called SAT Subject Tests), or take Dual Credit courses instead of AP, or even do some CLEP tests for college credit, depending on where your student plans to go to university and what your options are locally. Check out the threads linked in that stickied thread Regentrude referred to (post #2 has most of the threads on AP, CLEP, Dual Credit, etc.).

 

At this point, I'm not sure I'd get worked up about AP, as you really won't be at the decision-making process for that for a few more years. Your student may not even end up heading toward a post-high school option that will need any APs. Or, things may continue to change, with AP tests perhaps peaking and descending in popularity/desireablility. Also, who knows how Common Core may (or may not) change the SAT Reasoning test? At the moment, the SAT or ACT, and possibly some SAT Subject Tests seem to be the most frequently desired/required tests that colleges want to see from students...

 

So, do some reading, keep your options open, and maybe wait on AP until 11th and 12th grades to see if they are still even in vogue at that time. You never know! ;)

 

BEST of luck in your research and planning! Warmest regards, Lori D.

 

Thanks Lori! You did a great job of helping me see perspective here. Last night I did some reading about the changes coming to AP tests and was very happy about what I read. You're right too about me still having plenty of coursework left to play with.

[Alte Veste Academy]

I had a similar temper tantrum last year before my son started 9th grade. My fit wasn't brought on by the nature of AP classes or the like but by the extremely limiting graduation requirements dictated by my state in combination with my cover school (which you pretty much have to use in the state of TN). When I started sketching out my son's 4 year plan, I realized that there was very little room for deviation from "standard". I was furious...and still am to an extent; this is not what my homeschooling dream was like. My cover school requires 23 specific credits PLUS 4 Bible credits. As you can see, that doesn't give much room for an interesting, exciting, *unusual* high school plan.

 

Well, I've tweaked it as much as I can to provide my son an education that fits him. As just one example, he is required by our cover school to have a year of either World History (yes, in one year) or World Geography. I am presently designing a course that I am going to call "World Culture, Religion, and Geography". It should fit the requirement, but it will allow my son to study some things beyond pure geography. I plan to do the something similar with the required Wellness course; I would like for him to read about the "big food" industry and local farming and westernized diets, etc. So I plan to make that requirement fit our particular goals. I am also adding in a semester here and a semester there of courses that might give him glimpses of "different things". He is doing two AoPS courses (C&P and Number Theory). He is going to take a semester each of astronomy and meteorology...plus all the usual required sciences (including AP courses). I am really stretching his Bible credits to include worldview issues and Christian literature. And I'm throwing a sabermetrics course (baseball statistics) into the mix, too. These are just some examples of ideas that I have had to make his high school experience interesting and a little bit different. If you are creative, you can certainly find a way to make the requirements fit your homeschool...instead of the other way around. :)

 

So don't be bummed. My son's 9th grade year has been wonderful. If you look at my siggy, you will see a list of very traditional-looking courses. But beneath that exterior list, there has still been lots of "rabbit trails" and delightful excursions. Even in Abeka biology. :)

Jetta

 

P.S. Start *selectively* reading this high school board. There are quite a few ladies on here that design the most fascinating courses. I LOVE reading about the unusual things that they do...it gives me encouragement to be creative myself. Do a search for "outside the box" courses on this forum...there was a thread a while back that gave me lots and lots of ideas. The problem is fitting them all in!

 

Thanks for this! I will seek out the innovation here. :D I love what you are doing! My DS10 has expressed interest in being a sports statistician, so I will keep that in mind! I mostly stay on K-8 but I've been wandering onto the logic board a bit. Reading more on the high school board is probably a good idea. I can let the info seep into my brain slowly. I do love the out of the box threads. There are a few posters who really make my ears perk up when I see that they have posted.

 

My kids will most likely do high school either in TX (home) or WA (if we decide to stay when DH retires). Texas requirements do have a very strong pull!

[Alte Veste Academy]

You have received some good input already, but I will toss out one other tidbit. Try to be aware of which way the wind is blowing! This is true of AP and college application requirements in general.

 

Let me give you an off topic example: when my son was on the verge of high school, NC changed its requirements for applicants to the UNC system. Instead of three years of math, students need four. This caught some homeschoolers unaware. Their older kids had entered the UNC system with a certain group of classes, but their younger siblings could not do the same.

 

Credit acceptance from dual enrollment, AP and CLEP are among the things that are bound to change. Some schools that once gave credit for a 3 on the AP exam, now only give credit for a 5. The exams themselves are changing. AP Bio formerly required a ton of memorization. Supposedly that is not the case with the new test.

 

Which all leads to Aunt Jane's moral of the story: Do what is best for your kids and your family. There have been some great discussions on breadth vs. depth (Swimmermom3 started a lengthy thread). Some parents feel that AP offers the sort of challenge their students enjoy. Others feel that AP is too constrictive. Our students need to demonstrate on their college apps that they are capable of college work--there are lots of ways of doing this.

 

Frankly I think that the beauty of homeschooling is allowing our kids to follow their passions. I know homeschooled students who have done all sorts of interesting and distinguishing things: sail boat construction, peacewalking, national sewing competitions. My guy was able to spend several weeks volunteering with a college archaeological field school during a time when brick and mortar students were in the classroom taking their end of grade exams. This single experience led to tons of advice, his college application essay, a great letter of recommendation and the kindling of a fire that lit up his eyes whenever the topic of archaeology came up.

 

I share your view about the ability to follow passions. I don't know why I envisioned everything changing for us in high school. I guess there is room for a mix if experiences. I read a nice article about the changes to AP courses last night (2 years old now, but it specifically addressed biology). It is nice to know that change is coming! Thanks for the advice. I will put up a mental wind sock. :D

 

For anyone else interested: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/education/edlife/09ap-t.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

[Alte Veste Academy]

MorningGlory, it seems like you're doing on the front end what I figured I would do on the hind end (looking at the things we did/wanted to do and putting them into categories, determining time spent or material covered, and assigning units/credits). So in that sense, even though your cover school seems annoying, it's probably saving you hassle in the long run. Now I'm thinking I need to get *my* butt in gear and think through this better. :)

 

Well now, this is an interesting warning of sorts for me. I can see myself having to categorize after the fact if we do end up homeschooling high school in Texas. I mean, starting out with no real requirements with kids who won't necessarily know where they want to attend college in four years... I can imagine myself planning some amazing classes for us and then running around like a crazy lady to try and make what we did fit requirements as I become aware of them. Hmmm. So, I need to keep my eye on the specific colleges that interest my kids, but is there a (mostly) universal guideline for high school requirements for college bound kids? I didn't end up studying math or science in college but I know my collegebound plan had me taking it every year.

[Luckymama]

 

 

Well now, this is an interesting warning of sorts for me. I can see myself having to categorize after the fact if we do end up homeschooling high school in Texas. I mean, starting out with no real requirements with kids who won't necessarily know where they want to attend college in four years... I can imagine myself planning some amazing classes for us and then running around like a crazy lady to try and make what we did fit requirements as I become aware of them. Hmmm. So, I need to keep my eye on the specific colleges that interest my kids, but is there a (mostly) universal guideline for high school requirements for college bound kids? I didn't end up studying math or science in college but I know my collegebound plan had me taking it every year.

 

If you follow 4 x 4 (4 years of English, social studies (history, psychology, govt, economics), math, science) plus 3 years of foreign language, you'd be set for pretty much any college or university :). Just add in electives of choice!

 

Dd will most likely be home during high school (her older siblings attend/ed private schools). We will be doing a combination of honors-level and AP classes. As we live in an area with highly-regarded private and charter schools, dd will be compared to a specific cohort of students who will be taking very competitive coursework during high school. I will go through the AP audit process for some courses so that dd will be able to use the AP designation on her transcript for homegrown courses. I feel this is important because then I will have access to teacher-specific materials through the College Board-----which may be doubly important during transition years for certain subjects!

 

Our community college system is not a good fit for dd. It is mainly for students who didn't make the academic cut for the state flagship university, not for advanced high school students who need additional challenge. Dd might be take a class or two at the state flagship should she outgrow the Art of Problem Solving math classes or my ability to provide higher level science classes.

[PeterPan]

ATV, I think the thing that becomes more challenging is when you're doing a bunch of things that are sort of disparate (not really organized into a course, a book on this, a pursuit of that) and need to think retrospectively on how that tallies up into something others can recognize.

[8filltheheart]

Simply b/c you go the AP route for some courses does not mean you have to relinquish your "follow your own drummer" path for other courses. Call it a happy medium. ;)

 

For the subjects that the kids are passionate about and are flying beyond me and my ability to teach, AP courses or dual enrollment are a good way for them to have exposure to an educational approach which is polar opposite of their homeschool experience.

 

For other subjects, we continue to do it our own way. For example, math, science, English comp, econ, art history are the main subjects that my kids have taken AP or dual enrolled. At home, they have continued to study things like a literature study based on the movie Inception, another centered around C.S. Lewis/Milton/Dante, a philosophy of science and religion, etc. What they study in our "home-designed" classes are often far more challenging than anything we could find elsewhere! We love them and wouldn't/won't give them up.

 

Anyway, for us it hasn't been all or nothing. (BTW, I don't label any course honors on their transcripts. Their transcripts and course descriptions speak for themselves about the depth/quality of their work. For non-approved AP courses, I have labeled "xyz with AP exam."

 

HTH

[Alte Veste Academy]

If you follow 4 x 4 (4 years of English, social studies (history, psychology, govt, economics), math, science) plus 3 years of foreign language, you'd be set for pretty much any college or university :). Just add in electives of choice!

 

Dd will most likely be home during high school (her older siblings attend/ed private schools). We will be doing a combination of honors-level and AP classes. As we live in an area with highly-regarded private and charter schools, dd will be compared to a specific cohort of students who will be taking very competitive coursework during high school. I will go through the AP audit process for some courses so that dd will be able to use the AP designation on her transcript for homegrown courses. I feel this is important because then I will have access to teacher-specific materials through the College Board-----which may be doubly important during transition years for certain subjects!

 

Our community college system is not a good fit for dd. It is mainly for students who didn't make the academic cut for the state flagship university, not for advanced high school students who need additional challenge. Dd might be take a class or two at the state flagship should she outgrow the Art of Problem Solving math classes or my ability to provide higher level science classes.

 

Thanks. That is interesting, the idea of access to AP teacher materials! I guess I will have to just wait and see where we end up, using the basic 4x4 guide (thanks for that!). Until we settle, I won't know what good dual enrollment opportunities will be available.

[Alte Veste Academy]

Simply b/c you go the AP route for some courses does not mean you have to relinquish your "follow your own drummer" path for other courses. Call it a happy medium. ;)

 

For the subjects that the kids are passionate about and are flying beyond me and my ability to teach, AP courses or dual enrollment are a good way for them to have exposure to an educational approach which is polar opposite of their homeschool experience.

 

For other subjects, we continue to do it our own way. For example, math, science, English comp, econ, art history are the main subjects that my kids have taken AP or dual enrolled. At home, they have continued to study things like a literature study based on the movie Inception, another centered around C.S. Lewis/Milton/Dante, a philosophy of science and religion, etc. What they study in our "home-designed" classes are often far more challenging than anything we could find elsewhere! We love them and wouldn't/won't give them up.

 

Anyway, for us it hasn't been all or nothing. (BTW, I don't label any course honors on their transcripts. Their transcripts and course descriptions speak for themselves about the depth/quality of their work. For non-approved AP courses, I have labeled "xyz with AP exam."

 

HTH

 

A happy medium is a good way to look at it. I already know I will be way out of my league for some subjects. Those will be the first to be farmed out. I love how you put it, as exposure to another approach. I can see great benefit to experiencing different types of teachers and classes. It is interesting though, because the kids already seem to have such different strengths and interests that I can see AP and/or dual enrollment for different subjects for different kids. We will see what happens as they get older. I am already getting a whiff of future challenges with math and science and my oldest.

[MorningGlory]

MorningGlory, it seems like you're doing on the front end what I figured I would do on the hind end (looking at the things we did/wanted to do and putting them into categories, determining time spent or material covered, and assigning units/credits). So in that sense, even though your cover school seems annoying, it's probably saving you hassle in the long run. Now I'm thinking I need to get *my* butt in gear and think through this better. :)

 

 

You are completely right, Elizabeth. Using this cover school has many, many benefits which far outweigh the irritation of umpteen required credits. I *should* be very thankful for them.

 

Sometimes it hits me that one of the reasons, albeit minor, that I homeschool is that I don't like to be told what to do. Does anyone else ever feel this way? It isn't an honorable or redeeming character trait, that is for sure. So when my son hit high school and was given a list of required credits that he must fulfill to graduate, my rebellion sirens started going off. Just shameful... :(!

[Luckymama]

 

 

You are completely right, Elizabeth. Using this cover school has many, many benefits which far outweigh the irritation of umpteen required credits. I *should* be very thankful for them.

 

Sometimes it hits me that one of the reasons, albeit minor, that I homeschool is that I don't like to be told what to do. Does anyone else ever feel this way? It isn't an honorable or redeeming character trait, that is for sure. So when my son hit high school and was given a list of required credits that he must fulfill to graduate, my rebellion sirens started going off. Just shameful... :(!

 

I think required credits are fine-------we can choose whatever maths/sciences/other that would work best for dd. Required courses would make me absolutely batty. If I had to follow the guidelines of the umbrella schools in this area, I might as well just send her to private school :rolleyes:

 

We live in a very low reporting state---just the number of students and the number of school days.

[Storm Bay]

Yes, you can study history any way you like, which is one of the beauties of homeschooling and take any AP class you believe your teens are qualified to take. It's been successfully done before :). In our case, though,once my kids are teens, they didn't want to study history the lovely way I'd envisioned now preferred to do a textbook or book as a spine route. I did plan things so that they could have a lot of room to explore. However, my eldest moved to public school partway through her sophomore year (it can be done here without going back to freshman year) and works much better in school than at home (does most of her homework in class, etc) even now that she's a senior. I'm homeschooling my youngest year round & my middle one just in the summer now, which was NOT what I dreamed of.

[regentrude]

Sometimes it hits me that one of the reasons, albeit minor, that I homeschool is that I don't like to be told what to do. Does anyone else ever feel this way? It isn't an honorable or redeeming character trait, that is for sure. So when my son hit high school and was given a list of required credits that he must fulfill to graduate, my rebellion sirens started going off. Just shameful... :(!

 

 

You can still choose how to fulfill the credits. I find it very reasonable to say that, for a well rounded high school education, a student should have studied math, English, science, history for four years. (Coming from Europe, I also consider four years of foreign language essential, even if many Americans do not find studying a foreign language to fluency necessary - in many states there is no foreign language requirement)

 

That still leaves you a) to decide which courses to use to fulfill these requirements, and b.) what electives to add according to your student's interest, gifts, your philosophy. But I would argue the requirement for the core subjects constitutes the minimal framework for an educated adult.

[Jane in NC]

You can still choose how to fulfill the credits. I find it very reasonable to say that, for a well rounded high school education, a student should have studied math, English, science, history for four years. (Coming from Europe, I also consider four years of foreign language essential, even if many Americans do not find studying a foreign language to fluency necessary - in many states there is no foreign language requirement)

 

That still leaves you a) to decide which courses to use to fulfill these requirements, and b.) what electives to add according to your student's interest, gifts, your philosophy. But I would argue the requirement for the core subjects constitutes the minimal framework for an educated adult.

 

Your post ties in with something I mentioned upthread: Keep an idea on which way the wind is blowing, i.e. current trends.

 

While many colleges require three years of high school science for applicants, competitive colleges will see the majority of applicants have four, sometimes more for STEM students.

 

When I was wearing my college counselor hat, I saw most colleges requiring applicants to have a minimum of two years in a foreign language. But I also saw it noted on admissions blogs that schools requiring students to have two years of college level foreign language preferred applicants with four years of high school of Spanish, French, Latin, etc. These students can sometimes place out of the college foreign language requirement if their high school coursework was strong. This does not mean that they would not accept students with less than four years of a language but this is one of those things that can tip the balance.

 

Colleges want their students to be citizens of the world. Anything that broadens a student's outlook and exposure will look attractive on an application. Again, this is where I think homeschooled students can have obvious advantages.