Jump to content

Menu

Logic stage writing skills: How do I know how to progress with narrations?


Recommended Posts

Ds is starting 5th grade. He has progressed pretty well with composing narrations in 1st - 4th, and with dictation. He can "marry" narration and dictation together pretty well now, but we'll still work on building his ability to "hold words in his mind" while writing them down, via dictation. I've taken my direction for teaching these things from WTM and the Writing Without Fear CD.

 

We've begun one level outlining in history and science. That's going pretty well, so far. It takes some talking through to find the main idea of a paragraph, but he understands the general idea of finding it.

 

But I'm not sure where to go with narration in these years....someone told me the other day that narration can be dropped and rewriting from an outline can be started around grade 7 (I'm guessing this is so that the student has had a couple of years of experience in ordering ideas via outlining?). What should my goals be for grades 5 and 6 for narrations, then? Should I be transitioning him from writing two or three sentence narrations, to writing a half page? A couple of paragraphs? If so, how do I do this? Or do I just let him write write as much about the topic as he wishes, as long as it's about the main ideas in whatever passage he read? I don't imagine it would have to be more than a page, since on the writing CD, SWB mentions that towards the end of logic stage, it's useful to the student for the rewrites to be often, but short (a half to one page). But, I just am not sure what goals I'm supposed to be aiming for with narrations at this stage, so I can't figure out the steps to reach them.

 

Also, if I'm going by the WTM and writing CD suggestions, we'd be doing the following each week (I'm trying very hard to keep our week to 4 days): a history outline (one level, from 5 or 6 paragraphs), a science outline, a lit. narration (after discussion), two history narrations (two is suggested in WTM, but I'm not sure why two instead of one), and a science narration (again, as suggested in WTM - but called a report there). Plus writing up the science experiment. If we do all this, there will be more than one writing assignment on some days. Is this too much for this age, even if each narration is just a few sentences? Or do I pare down the amount of narrations per week and just make sure there are at least two outlines per week? Or do I still write some of his narrations for him as he composes? I'm trying to sift out what is truly important, and I don't know exactly what is! He's one of those boys who hates the physical act of writing (I'm thinking of teaching typing sometime in the next year or two, but am also unsure about the whole "handwriting vs. typing" and at what age to transition to typing). But he doesn't mind the thinking part that happens when I coach him through putting his thoughts into words with proper grammar and all that.

 

I'm just not sure about the progression in skills that is supposed to happen in the next few years. Any advice on anything I appear to be unsure of? Thank you! :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just one HUGE caveat that what I say is not "expert" advice, just how things are here. With 2 boys. ;)

 

My oldest son learned to type when he was 7, and he did all his narrations and now all his high school essays at the computer. With typing, for him, there is nothing to inhibit the flow of words. My 8th grade son works well either typing or writing long hand. I've had them continue with handwriting practice through the years -- dictations are great for that, workbooks too.

 

I personally never required more than one writing assignment per day, and honestly, when they were in 5th grade, I didn't require one daily. I also have had them edit their work, rewrite with corrections for spelling, grammar and punctuation, which eats into time (and inhibits the desire) for extra writing. We always discuss everything which gives me a handle on whether main points are being identified, and an idea of how they are formulating their opinions about a topic, and how strong or logical their arguments are.

 

Their written narrations became much longer through the middle school/logic stage and to me it makes sense to write a narration based on an outline -- a paragraph per main point. The narrations we did also became less like narrations and more like research topics -- read up on historical figure X or science topic Y and present your findings. Sometimes they'd be expected to do just short answers, other times larger research presentations. It all led naturally to essay writing.

 

So, to me, quality is more important than quantity in writing. If progress is being made then don't feel the need to require more simply because it is "logic stage". Typing is fine, handwriting helpful because standardized test essays are handwritten (as are many other things like employment applications).

 

Does that help?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Colleen, this is just my sense and how I'm piecing things together, so you can take it with a grain of salt, but I think that you're missing that the goal of going into the logic stage is to transition from a simple narration (rather disorganized, basically only chronological) retelling into something with more structure or logic. You also want to start to see some more sophistication in their style, for instance combining sentences to refine their product. So when you do the 5th grade sentence outlining of the history, as per wtm, the goal is to get them to where they eventually are writing summaries, as in properly structured paragraphs, from that. You'll notice that concurrent WTM (ok, I only have the old edition) suggests WS levels that are covering paragraphing. So you're learning how to do more structured writing in your "writing" class time and you're working slowly toward that in your content writing. Make sense? When I asked JW about it at the Cincy convention, she specifically made the comment that SWB suggests we have our students able to write a "paragraph" by the end of 4th. When I say paragraph, and when they say paragraph, I think they mean something with a bit more intentional structure than a narration. Sorry, maybe that seems like splitting hairs, but hopefully that's more clear.

 

As far as the notebooking and write-ups for the history and science, I would suggest that you again try to move from a basic narration slowly into something with a bit more intentional structure. For instance, with my dd for this coming year, I'm setting up a formatting sheet for her notebooking, requiring 2 pages per week to be notebooked on any topic from her history reading, and requiring 5 points be in the writing. Initially, I don't care if those 5 points turn into a beautiful paragraph or not, but that is my goal for what I'd like to have happen by the end of the year.

 

BTW, I had wanted her to outline her history text, but when I switched my plans on texts, I went to something not as conducive to that, grrr... If I had stuck with the Eggleston and had her outline like I had planned, I was going to have her only outline for the start of the year and work toward summaries from those outlines 2nd semester. I think when SWB talks about short compositions, that is what she is referring to, these 1 paragraph summaries. But I think, and this is just my take reading through WTM and sorting through it myself, that the intention is that they transition from being a narration to more of an intentionally structured paragraph. That's my take. When I think of paragraphs, I think of topic and closing sentences, but also the choice to exclude or delete certain extraneous points. So you're just easing them into this process. I'm still retaining the sentence outlining in our year, but it's coming in through formal writing assignments (IEW-style, where we'll outline a model or source, write a summary from the outline, edit, and hope to come out with a decent paragraph or set of paragraphs). So we're still going to do it, just in our formal writing time, rather than the history. In the history would have been awesome, just didn't work out, sniff...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What I have done:

 

Ds12, a reluctant writer, learned to type around age 10 and types his longer assignments. He has continued handwriting dictations, some copywork, outlining, and occasionally a freewrite or shorter writing assignment. So the handwriting has continued but in order to get his best quality of writing for reports and narrations, he types.

 

Outlining- once a week- either science or history. Usually I pick something that is fairly easy to outline (i.e. not the KHE).

 

Narrations- I vary these rather than just have him do the same thing each week. Last term, he rewrote a Greek Myth in his own words each week, as he worked his way through Hawthorne's Greek Myths. He does one writing assignment a day, 4 days a week (not counting dictations or copywork which he continues to do). So, he does 3 "narrations" a week, but sometimes it's a report (I call it that but it usually involves extra research), sometimes a creative assignment, sometimes a book report, sometimes just a rewriting of something in his own words, sometimes a writing assignment from a writing curriculum. Sometimes he works on a writing assignment all week, or over 2 weeks, and polishes it.(because he types, it is easy to edit his assignments and he we usually edit the same day he writes). Once he did a research report that took several weeks.

 

I just try and keep my kids moving forward, expose them to different forms of writing, I gather ideas from all different places, and I try and design assignments that will be interesting to the kids. Having them writing every day is just a structure we have used for years, but they don't have time to do more than one writing assignment a day so I have them write across the curriculum.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, to me, quality is more important than quantity in writing. If progress is being made then don't feel the need to require more simply because it is "logic stage". Typing is fine, handwriting helpful because standardized test essays are handwritten (as are many other things like employment applications).

 

Does that help?

 

Jenn,

 

Thanks for mentioning quality over quantity. I just had no idea what I was to be expecting in narrations now! I think (after reading these responses and looking over my writing CD notes and the WWE writing overview sample chapter) that I'm going to stick with dictation (gradually lengthening them and helping ds to hold words in his head) a couple of times a week and narrations in content areas (of just two or three sentences, but steering him towards using diagraming to "fix" his sentences, since I have been modeling how to narrate for three years). I think I'm seeing from everyone's responses that the narrations don't necessarily have to become longer, but since he is comfortable with putting his thoughts into words now, I can work with him more on the quality of ONE paragraph. Phew! I just could NOT see that until last night.

 

Also, I will continue the one level outlining. I *think* that for this year, I'll consider that to be introductory to what's coming in another couple of years (deeper outlining, then rewriting from that), and it will be alongside our regular dictation/narration routine.

 

I like SWB's description (I've read it before, but it's now starting to "click" with me) of sentence level ordering (using diagraming) and paragraph level ordering (using outlining). I guess these are the quality things to be working on over the next four years, and they can be practiced on small quantities. Right??

 

And I think I need to just chart out a weekly writing schedule of the various skills, and not worry about trying to do two history narrations a week - an outline and a narration is enough, as long as it's being done consistently. I have followed the suggestions in WTM so closely over the years, because without it I would not have known how to teach my kids these various skills. But I am starting to see why SWB has said she put the schedules in there at the publisher's insistence, and so I'm timidly going to try out my own schedule, as long as I am confident I know how to teach the *skills* that SWB and JW were trying to put across in the book and their various articles.

 

I think I'm going to need to print out my own post so I won't forget what to do and why. :lol:

 

EDIT: oh, there were a couple of other things you said that were helpful: about reasons for keeping up with handwriting (I'd never have thought of test essays and such), and about the time you took to help your kids think through their logic while writing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that you're missing that the goal of going into the logic stage is to transition from a simple narration (rather disorganized, basically only chronological) retelling into something with more structure or logic.

 

So you're learning how to do more structured writing in your "writing" class time and you're working slowly toward that in your content writing. Make sense?

 

I think when SWB talks about short compositions, that is what she is referring to, these 1 paragraph summaries. But I think, and this is just my take reading through WTM and sorting through it myself, that the intention is that they transition from being a narration to more of an intentionally structured paragraph. That's my take. When I think of paragraphs, I think of topic and closing sentences, but also the choice to exclude or delete certain extraneous points. So you're just easing them into this process.

 

About your first paragraph, I think you're right!! Thanks for pointing that out to me! That's what I was hoping, that someone would point out what I couldn't see.

 

And the other parts of your post that I quoted above were very helpful, too, as I went through all my notes last night (see my reply to JennW). I think I have a better picture now of what I'm supposed to be doing over the next few years. What a relief to find at this new stage for me that teaching writing skills CAN be done systematically, in a way that makes sense, and very deliberately building on bits and pieces.

 

I think now that I'm supposed to be helping him work on one paragraph at time, consistently. Not expecting tons of paragraphs but not knowing what to do with all those paragraphs!

 

Slowly but surely, more lights are coming on in my brain.:lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What I have done:

 

Ds12, a reluctant writer, learned to type around age 10 and types his longer assignments. He has continued handwriting dictations, some copywork, outlining, and occasionally a freewrite or shorter writing assignment. So the handwriting has continued but in order to get his best quality of writing for reports and narrations, he types.

 

Outlining- once a week- either science or history. Usually I pick something that is fairly easy to outline (i.e. not the KHE).

 

Narrations- I vary these rather than just have him do the same thing each week. Last term, he rewrote a Greek Myth in his own words each week, as he worked his way through Hawthorne's Greek Myths. He does one writing assignment a day, 4 days a week (not counting dictations or copywork which he continues to do). So, he does 3 "narrations" a week, but sometimes it's a report (I call it that but it usually involves extra research), sometimes a creative assignment, sometimes a book report, sometimes just a rewriting of something in his own words, sometimes a writing assignment from a writing curriculum. Sometimes he works on a writing assignment all week, or over 2 weeks, and polishes it.(because he types, it is easy to edit his assignments and he we usually edit the same day he writes). Once he did a research report that took several weeks.

 

I just try and keep my kids moving forward, expose them to different forms of writing, I gather ideas from all different places, and I try and design assignments that will be interesting to the kids. Having them writing every day is just a structure we have used for years, but they don't have time to do more than one writing assignment a day so I have them write across the curriculum.

 

Thank you Peela for responding to my desperate cries for understanding this stuff again!

 

One thing I did is put KHE as a secondary source, and am using SOTW for outlining history now. We're using KHE to get dates for the timeline, compare maps, and pick topics for further study. It's working out great.

 

After reading all these responses and reviewing my various writing notes here, I think I have a little more understanding of what to do. It's that not knowing what to do and how to proceed that throws me for a loop. It helps to read how other people conduct things.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Colleen, just as a question, have you considered using a writing program like IEW? Even WTM says to use a writing program. It just seems like you're trying to figure out things that a good writing program would make more explicit. Of course WTM, at least in the old edition I have, recommends WS, and for the life of me I still don't get why. WS is just so ugghy compared to all the newer stuff out there (IEW, WT, etc.). You were asking if you should be doing anything further for "quality" in your ds's writings. I like everything you're thinking, and to that I would just add some work on improving sentence structure, eliminating redundancy, etc. This might not be the year for that, but it's a skill coming up and something to consider. WT2 and IEW both do a really good job of helping you tackle those things.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Colleen, just as a question, have you considered using a writing program like IEW? Even WTM says to use a writing program. It just seems like you're trying to figure out things that a good writing program would make more explicit. Of course WTM, at least in the old edition I have, recommends WS, and for the life of me I still don't get why. WS is just so ugghy compared to all the newer stuff out there (IEW, WT, etc.). You were asking if you should be doing anything further for "quality" in your ds's writings. I like everything you're thinking, and to that I would just add some work on improving sentence structure, eliminating redundancy, etc. This might not be the year for that, but it's a skill coming up and something to consider. WT2 and IEW both do a really good job of helping you tackle those things.

 

Yes, we've been using R&S for writing exercises (as well as grammar) since grade 3 (I use this because it was rec'd in WTM, and I liked the reasons for the rec). So, I've used it alongside the grammar stage writing techniques rec'd in WTM (copywork/dictation and narration).

 

I'm mostly just trying to sort out how to implement the logic stage writing techniques (outlining/continued narration/rewriting from outline) from WTM/writing CD/WWE overview. Within that is narration, and I just didn't know how I was to be conducting 5th and 6th grade narration and why. I imagine they all fit together somehow, I just haven't completely sorted out that puzzle. But I think I'm a little clearer tonight than I was last night! If I can come up with a plan of what to do each week in which grades, how, when, and why, I might post it and ask if I'm thinking in the right direction.

 

I'm also guessing that the "writing program" (like R&S in my case) is the thing that helps polish up the writings that come from using the WTM/writing CD/WWE techniques. I'd never have understood that if it hadn't been for those WTM resources - I'd have just moved through the R&S writing lessons and not known how to use what was learned. I *think* the WTM techniques are the thing on which the writing program lessons are practiced. But I needed an understanding of the underlying reasons *why* we use the WTM techniques first.

 

Long answer to your simple question, I know. I've got a long way to go with my own writing skills and clarity of thinking! :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You know, I've read about people discussing whether the writing instruction in R&S was "enough" or not, but as that wasn't my approach I didn't really engage my mind in the threads. My older edition WTM recommends also using a writing program, but I have no clue what the new edition recommends. And with the newest edition to come out one day, who knows what will be recommended then, hehe! My only observation was that a good writing program might make some of this easier for you. A lot of people who like WRTR/SWR end up also liking IEW, so I thought it was a reasonable thing to suggest. What it would do for you is plan out the writing projects, instruction in structure, and discussion of style, making it a bit easier for you. But it absolutely can be done the way you're saying, just plowing through, pulling it altogether yourself. You just lose some hair and have the rest turn grey in the process. I got some more grey this summer, so maybe that was it, too much writing planning, hehe... :)

 

The other thing I'll observe, and I want to tread lightly here, is that it can be a misthought to say quality over quantity. Many children need a reasonable amount of quantity to become proficient in skills. I'm not saying to go for so much quantity that everything turns to junk, never gets edited, etc., but I wouldn't underestimate the value of quantity. I would shoot for the quantities and totals suggested in WTM, me personally. You know your dc and whether he has any pencil issues and can write more, needs to write less, etc. He is going up a grade, and you EXPECT there to be a writing increase with that grade level increase. I wouldn't be bashful about increasing the number of writing projects till he's pretty much at his comfort/groan level. And when you do that, you only EDIT and work fully through the process with one writing project a week. All the rest you just get done and move on. So if my dd writes a paragraph in science, we discuss briefly and move on. The only time I go through all the steps of thorough editing is with the single weekly project for her formal writing assignment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Elizabeth,

 

I really appreciate your hangin' in there with me on this thread! :)

 

I have the 2004 WTM and one of its top recs is R&S.

 

I'm not trying to come up with a whole new writing program on my own, I'm just trying to sort out how to implement the WTM techniques in the content areas, along with the program I already have. Make sense? (although I appreciate the IEW suggestion, based on your knowing I use WRTR! :)) And since you've been through the learning process of how to teach SWR, maybe this will make sense to you: Once I figure out how the WTM techniques all work together, how they are laid out, and why, and when, and the nitty gritty details of them, then I will know what I'm doing and can use them to actually *teach basic writing/thinking skills* along with R&S exercises.

 

When I was learning to teach WRTR, it was a tough process for me, yet I *knew* somehow that there was a bigger picture - I knew once I learned it, I'd be able to teach how to read and spell with no problem, and efficiently. I see the same thing now with the WTM/writing CD/WWE overview techniques - I *know* SWB is onto something, her explanations make sense to me, I can see that her goal is to show us the whole picture yet lay out the basic steps, and I can tell that she sees the beginning and end of the process. It's like she has put a puzzle together for us, but I can only see some of the pieces so far. But, I did it with WRTR and now can analyze other words not on the WRTR list, and now I'm trying to do it with SWB's methods, so I can use R&S with these methods and study content areas with these methods. I don't know how else to explain it but to say that she just makes sense of the progression of a thinking process via particular writing skills to me, and I just need to nail down the last nitty gritty stuff in my mind.

 

Hmm...your thoughts about quantity vs. quality made me think. I think quantity in dictation can increase some this year, but that's because I know why I'm doing it and how I'm to do it. Increasing quantity in outlining is easy, because you are doing the same thing over and over - finding the main point and writing it down. It's a concrete assignment. Increasing quantity in narration, I'm not so sure of. That's why I originally posted. To me, to say to a 10yo "write a page on Cheops" is too abstract for now. About the totals in WTM...I was getting caught up in those until I listened to the writing CD, where she said that if, by the end of 4th grade, your boy can write two sentences in a row without complaining about his hand, then this is good. So, then I didn't take those totals so seriously, because they were much more than two sentences.

 

This is why I like SWB's methods so much - the instructions and reasons behind them are concrete. I have a feeling that she will even make her high school methods concrete (I read her articles on doing a research paper, and was amazed at how doable she made it sound!) when she finishes her writers series. Also, it seems to me that the methods are laying a proper foundation - one that wlll not require so much frustrating editing - I can't see the point in writing several paragraphs, only to edit one or two things in it and leave the rest. To me, that would leave the child wondering if he "got it" or not. That's too simplistic, I know, but I'm trying to communicate why I'm desperately trying to nail down the nitty gritty of the methods - because I know they will give a foundation from which to work. And I'm so frustrated that *my* lack of writing skill prevents me from communicating concisely here! :)

 

Thanks Elizabeth!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Colleen,

 

I think you are on the right path. What I've tried to do is re-use the R&S exercises as often as possible in our history and science writing. We usually discuss what the topic sentence is going to be, and should it be developed in order of time, or the order of importance. These are all lessons from R&S-4 that we'll be carrying over to 5th grade.

 

Then, as we learn more, we'll apply what we've learned. So, yesterday's lesson 4 of R&S-5 was about asking questions to help spur your thoughts about details. So, the next time we have a topic in history or science that will be either a narrative or a description, I'll prime his thinking-pump by helping him brainstorm some questions as part of the pre-writing process. And, hopefully, we'll continue doing this each time until it just becomes a natural part of the process.

 

And, the next lesson I see is Lesson 9 on "Exact Words". I know this is something that we'll be working on for years, as his vocabulary develops. But, after studying this lesson, I'll keep it bookmarked. Then, after each narration, it will be one of those things I'll ask, "Hmm...let's look and see if there are any words that could be more exact or more expressive." And, we'll read his narration once or twice looking for just that. And, we'll repeat that with *every* narration, until the process of intentionally thinking about "use exact words" becomes a habit - and, eventually he will start thinking about it during his draft. (BTW, there will probably be times when we *don't* find a word we want to change - and that's ok, too.)

 

Last year, I went through the trouble to make a "list of things to do" for my then-7th grader, where I wrote down all these type of steps. But, we never actually *used* it. It was too cumbersome. So, trust yourself. You *will* remember these lessons, and months from now you'll find yourself saying, "Remember how we learned to avoid words like "good" when a juicier word will be more accurate? Can you think of a better word to describe this?" And, it will just naturally come to you.

 

Hope that helps a bit!

Rhonda

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ooo, Rhonda's ideas sound great! (Not that I'm doing it, but it sounds like a sensible way of getting lots of bang out of the writing instruction in R&S.) On the WWF cd comments, I think you want to find some balance there. I loaned mine out and haven't gotten it back yet (oops, one more thing to do!), but it strikes me that sometimes SWB makes comments that are giving parents permission to use their own heads, not so much statements about what the average or above average student might be capable of. And yes, I definitely agree that just handing them a blank piece of paper and saying to write a page on Cheops might go over like a lead balloon. With my dd this year, I'm trying to give her very specific, concrete expectations. Just in case you're curious, we're doing a mesh of the 4th and 5th gr skills, but keeping to the 4th grade quantities, which seems to me the best way to keep her moving forward but keep the workload reasonable for the age. That's why I've been thinking about all this stuff. I think your overall thesis on WTM is exactly right, that you can piece this together and understand how to teach writing. It's curious to me that she recommends R&S for the writing, so we'll see what is recommended in the newest edition. It almost seems like she's not strongly tied to ANY single program, as she's recommended and discussed so many things in the past as acceptable options (IEW, WS, Wordsmith, now WWE). I think the WTM suggestions give you ways to carry the writing across the curriculum, but the writing program itself gives you a format for discussing structure and improvements to the writing. In that sense, I don't think it's SO much that one writing curriculum is superior to another as that one makes SENSE to you as the teacher more than another. So if you read Rhonda's ideas and go, "Yeah, but what do I do?" then I'd look for another curriculum that helps you get there. I don't know that WTM intends to contain enough writing guidance, sans a curriculum, to get you through. The new WWE levels are trying to apparently, but they're not going to be ready soon enough for us.

 

I have a friend who works at a university who told me lack of writing skills is the number one problem they see in incoming homeschooled freshman. It's sort of become my bugaboo, the thing I figure we better work, work, work on and make a priority.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ooo, Rhonda's ideas sound great! (Not that I'm doing it, but it sounds like a sensible way of getting lots of bang out of the writing instruction in R&S.) On the WWF cd comments, I think you want to find some balance there. I loaned mine out and haven't gotten it back yet (oops, one more thing to do!), but it strikes me that sometimes SWB makes comments that are giving parents permission to use their own heads, not so much statements about what the average or above average student might be capable of. And yes, I definitely agree that just handing them a blank piece of paper and saying to write a page on Cheops might go over like a lead balloon. With my dd this year, I'm trying to give her very specific, concrete expectations. Just in case you're curious, we're doing a mesh of the 4th and 5th gr skills, but keeping to the 4th grade quantities, which seems to me the best way to keep her moving forward but keep the workload reasonable for the age. That's why I've been thinking about all this stuff. I think your overall thesis on WTM is exactly right, that you can piece this together and understand how to teach writing. It's curious to me that she recommends R&S for the writing, so we'll see what is recommended in the newest edition. It almost seems like she's not strongly tied to ANY single program, as she's recommended and discussed so many things in the past as acceptable options (IEW, WS, Wordsmith, now WWE). I think the WTM suggestions give you ways to carry the writing across the curriculum, but the writing program itself gives you a format for discussing structure and improvements to the writing. In that sense, I don't think it's SO much that one writing curriculum is superior to another as that one makes SENSE to you as the teacher more than another. So if you read Rhonda's ideas and go, "Yeah, but what do I do?" then I'd look for another curriculum that helps you get there. I don't know that WTM intends to contain enough writing guidance, sans a curriculum, to get you through. The new WWE levels are trying to apparently, but they're not going to be ready soon enough for us.

 

I have a friend who works at a university who told me lack of writing skills is the number one problem they see in incoming homeschooled freshman. It's sort of become my bugaboo, the thing I figure we better work, work, work on and make a priority.

 

I agree with everything you said here.

 

There, that was easy, now I don't have to think hard in my reply this time! Thinking about teaching writing has made my brain tired this past week. :lol:

 

Now I need to go reply to Rhonda, because her ideas *do* make sense to me. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What I've tried to do is re-use the R&S exercises as often as possible in our history and science writing.

 

And, hopefully, we'll continue doing this each time until it just becomes a natural part of the process.

 

Last year, I went through the trouble to make a "list of things to do" for my then-7th grader, where I wrote down all these type of steps. But, we never actually *used* it. It was too cumbersome. So, trust yourself. You *will* remember these lessons.

 

Rhonda, I think you've mentioned this to me before, and it's sinking in a little further this time! Thank you for the reminder.

 

I thought of making a list, too. But R&S reviews writing lesson material in the oral reviews, so I guess I just have to remember to look for those points in ds' writing. He always remembers the writing lesson material when I ask him the oral review questions.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's curious to me that she recommends R&S for the writing, so we'll see what is recommended in the newest edition. It almost seems like she's not strongly tied to ANY single program, as she's recommended and discussed so many things in the past as acceptable options (IEW, WS, Wordsmith, now WWE).

 

I think the WTM suggestions give you ways to carry the writing across the curriculum, but the writing program itself gives you a format for discussing structure and improvements to the writing. In that sense, I don't think it's SO much that one writing curriculum is superior to another as that one makes SENSE to you as the teacher more than another. .

 

Actually, if I didn't have R&S here, and *if* Abeka just had review questions in it's grammar book, I would be very tempted to do Abeka with the Wordsmith series. It covers the same material as R&S, but in a more modern-kid friendly way (esp. for boys). But, even if I did that, I would *still* be sure that those lessons were being constantly reinforced in the content subjects.

 

(Although one thing I *do* really like about R&S is that, just as it reviews the grammar year after year, it reviews the writing principles every year as well. Not sure how you would get that repeat-coverage with Wordsmith. Sigh - unfortunately, we tend to need a LOT of review!)

 

:001_smile:

Rhonda

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...