What is the BEST Physical Science you did for Middler's?

[Murrayshire]

Okay so I'm trying to figure out what science to use for my dd in 8th......I'll give you the run down of what we have used, what we are using, and what we would like to use........

 

DD1 used Oak Meadow Life & Lyrical Life Science for 6th grade......this year she is using Elemental Science Logic Earth/Astronomy..... for 8th dd wants to dive into chemistry and physical science.

 

I've looked at Ellen McHenry and love the looks of The Elements (amongst everything else!)..........I wish Elemental Science had Physical but doesn't look promising for us(doesn't come out until 2014)...... I would just use that and Ellen McHenry. I did look at Ellen's physical science page but it didn't look like it would be a complete physical science curriculum.

 

I'm not against text books but I'm afraid we won't do the experiments b/c it may require a lot of prep and $ for supplies...Could use it has a spine and add videos, simple experiments, and lab notebook??

 

Year 1 of Rainbow is an option but I don't know if I could spend that much just on 1 year of science, though it could be passed down to my other dc.

 

I would like more of a laid out schedule for dd to follow......

I would very much like something that will prepare her for high school.......We thought we were going to put dd in our local ps but now we have decided to homeschool instead.

 

Can anyone care to ellaborate on what you've used for Physical Science whether it was a hodge podge of stuff or an all-in-one curriculum! I would prefer a secular one!

Thank you!

[Chrysalis Academy]

What about the middle Hakim Story of Science book (Newton at the Center) plus the Quest guide along with a kit, like the Thames & Kosmos Milestones of Science Kit? You could also pull in McHenry's Elements, there is a unit in that book mostly on chemistry.

[lisabees]

How about Hewitt's Conceptual Physical Science? Or Conceptual Physics. You can find cheaper, older editions. At the end of each chapter, there are great questions, activities and exercises. You pick and choose. Add lots of documentaries and a few fun books about chemistry, physics etc. and you're good to go. :)

[Sweet Home Alabama]

We've used Exploration Education for physical science. I would recommend the advanced version. My kids loved it. My oldest son was in 6th grade when he used it, but please don't think that its juvenile. They sell EE advanced for 7th-10th graders. I wanted him to have the chance to do the lab reports, and he wouldn't have been able to if we had gone with the standard version. The projects were great. I'm sure you could find more expensive labs... yet the ones in EE were fine.

 

http://www.explorationeducation.com/

 

 

As an 8th grader, ds may repeat physical science just because he wants to... If that happens, we're considering Derek Owens physical science. It is available for purchase which is what I would do:

http://www.derekowen...cal_science.php

 

 

 

 

Now, what I would not recommend..... CPO Foundations of Physical Science. I know CPO is so very popular on the board, and we wanted to love it. But as an 8th grader last year, my dd used this text (I had the teacher's manual,) and there were many errors in both the student and teacher books. The errors really frustrated dd. My dh- mechanical engineer- helped her understand the information and worked through the problems with her. There was no way he wanted to use that book with our other kids based on the trouble the two of them had with the CPO text.

[Murrayshire]

What about the middle Hakim Story of Science book (Newton at the Center) plus the Quest guide along with a kit, like the Thames & Kosmos Milestones of Science Kit? You could also pull in McHenry's Elements, there is a unit in that book mostly on chemistry.

 

Do you mind sending me a link for the books you suggested and for the kits?

Much appreciated!

[Murrayshire]

How about Hewitt's Conceptual Physical Science? Or Conceptual Physics. You can find cheaper, older editions. At the end of each chapter, there are great questions, activities and exercises. You pick and choose. Add lots of documentaries and a few fun books about chemistry, physics etc. and you're good to go. :)

 

I will check it out.......Thank you!

[Murrayshire]

We've used Exploration Education for physical science. I would recommend the advanced version. My kids loved it. My oldest son was in 6th grade when he used it, but please don't think that its juvenile. They sell EE advanced for 7th-10th graders. I wanted him to have the chance to do the lab reports, and he wouldn't have been able to if we had gone with the standard version. The projects were great. I'm sure you could find more expensive labs... yet the ones in EE were fine.

 

http://www.explorationeducation.com/

 

 

As an 8th grader, ds may repeat physical science just because he wants to... If that happens, we're considering Derek Owens physical science. It is available for purchase which is what I would do:

http://www.derekowen...cal_science.php

 

 

 

 

Now, what I would not recommend..... CPO Foundations of Physical Science. I know CPO is so very popular on the board, and we wanted to love it. But as an 8th grader last year, my dd used this text (I had the teacher's manual,) and there were many errors in both the student and teacher books. The errors really frustrated dd. My dh- mechanical engineer- helped her understand the information and worked through the problems with her. There was no way he wanted to use that book with our other kids based on the trouble the two of them had with the CPO text.

 

We tried CPO Earth Science at the beginning of 7th grade and dropped it for Elemental Science. It was too much and wasn't getting done....I was pleased with the content but overwhelmed with juggling different leveled sciences!

I will check out your link.....I've briefly looked at Exploration Edu. and I heard about Derek Owens through math but didn't know he offered science, too. Off to check these out and I'll get back to you if I have any questions!

Thank you!

[Murrayshire]

I'm wondering if this is going to be too much? http://www.lucideducation.com/?p=PhysicalScienceBuy.php

Who has used this with success or no success?

[Murrayshire]

Sweet Home Alabama (and whomever else would like to buzz in)-- With EE, could the advanced version (7th-10th) easily be used for 3 days instead of 5 days a week? Or, just stretch the 5 days into 2 weeks? We school year round so I'm not in a hurry to get it done in 36 weeks.

Though I know you haven't used Derek Owens yet, but how would you compare it to EE? I think my dd would be happier with the experiments in EE b/c she is so hands on. Is EE something she could possibly use independently with me overlooking and adding to discussion?

 

If I go with EE, would I be crazy to get two levels (for my 5th grader as well) or is it pretty simple to add in a 2nd and 5th grader each at their own levels so everyone is on the same topic. Though I could just use my Evan Moor Teacher File Box subscription for younger two, add books, Ellen McHenry, science videos and call it a year!! Whew!

Wish it was that easy for dd#1.....8th grade needs more structure and more deeper thinking to prepare her for high school science.....Do you think EE would do this better than Derek Owens or Conceptual Physical Science?

Thank you so much for helping!

Please excuse any typing errors....I've been up since 4am and need another cup of coffee.

[lisabees]

I'm wondering if this is going to be too much? http://www.lucideduc...lScienceBuy.php

Who has used this with success or no success?

 

I've heard good things about the class. Search the board for specifics. Ds used Derek Owens for Algebra (online class) and enjoyed it. :)

 

Best of luck deciding.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

Sweet Home Alabama (and whomever else would like to buzz in)-- With EE, could the advanced version (7th-10th) easily be used for 3 days instead of 5 days a week? Or, just stretch the 5 days into 2 weeks? We school year round so I'm not in a hurry to get it done in 36 weeks.

Though I know you haven't used Derek Owens yet, but how would you compare it to EE? I think my dd would be happier with the experiments in EE b/c she is so hands on. Is EE something she could possibly use independently with me overlooking and adding to discussion?

 

If I go with EE, would I be crazy to get two levels (for my 5th grader as well) or is it pretty simple to add in a 2nd and 5th grader each at their own levels so everyone is on the same topic. Though I could just use my Evan Moor Teacher File Box subscription for younger two, add books, Ellen McHenry, science videos and call it a year!! Whew!

Wish it was that easy for dd#1.....8th grade needs more structure and more deeper thinking to prepare her for high school science.....Do you think EE would do this better than Derek Owens or Conceptual Physical Science?

Thank you so much for helping!

Please excuse any typing errors....I've been up since 4am and need another cup of coffee.

 

 

Just want you to know that I've seen this and will respond. We've gotten a late start, so it will probably be around lunch when I'll get back to the board. :001_smile:

[Chrysalis Academy]

here you go:

 

http://www.amazon.com/The-Story-Science-Newton-Center/dp/1588341615/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1363183698&sr=8-1&keywords=story+of+science%3A+newton

 

http://www.amazon.com/Students-Quest-Guide-Newton-Science/dp/1588342557/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1363183725&sr=1-1&keywords=story+of+science%3A+newton+quest+guide

 

http://www.amazon.com/Teachers-Quest-Guide-Newton-Science/dp/1588342522/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1363183749&sr=1-2&keywords=story+of+science%3A+newton+quest+guide

 

http://www.amazon.com/Thames-Kosmos-Classic-Science-Milestones/dp/B000VLQ2V4

 

http://store.ellenjmchenry.com/?product_cat=elements

[redsquirrel]

It is hard to know, because different people have different ideas of what "best" means. Do you mean most rigorous? Do you mean easy to use? There are a lot of things covered by 'best'

 

We will be doing physical science next year and I am going to be using the Prentice Hall Physical Science: Concepts in Action text. I will be using the lesson plans/schedule by Kolbe Academy, but using more hands on labs. I have used Kolbe before and I know their science is secular with a religious part that can be added on. I don't use the religious part.

 

http://www.kolbe.org/Eighth-Grade-Curriculum/

[TheApprentice]

My older son has used Derek Owens for Alg. 1, Physical Science and Physics. He not only was successful in them, but he enjoyed them as well. My ds going into 8th grade in the fall will also use Derek Owens Physical Science, which is one you can actually purchase.

[Murrayshire]

here you go:

 

http://www.amazon.co...science: newton

 

http://www.amazon.co...ton quest guide

 

http://www.amazon.co...ton quest guide

 

http://www.amazon.co...s/dp/B000VLQ2V4

 

http://store.ellenjm...ct_cat=elements

 

 

SWEET! Thank you!

[Murrayshire]

I've heard good things about the class. Search the board for specifics. Ds used Derek Owens for Algebra (online class) and enjoyed it. :)

 

Best of luck deciding.

 

My older son has used Derek Owens for Alg. 1, Physical Science and Physics. He not only was successful in them, but he enjoyed them as well. My ds going into 8th grade in the fall will also use Derek Owens Physical Science, which is one you can actually purchase.

 

We've used Exploration Education for physical science. I would recommend the advanced version. My kids loved it. My oldest son was in 6th grade when he used it, but please don't think that its juvenile. They sell EE advanced for 7th-10th graders. I wanted him to have the chance to do the lab reports, and he wouldn't have been able to if we had gone with the standard version. The projects were great. I'm sure you could find more expensive labs... yet the ones in EE were fine.

 

http://www.explorationeducation.com/

 

 

As an 8th grader, ds may repeat physical science just because he wants to... If that happens, we're considering Derek Owens physical science. It is available for purchase which is what I would do:

http://www.derekowen...cal_science.php

 

Now, what I would not recommend..... CPO Foundations of Physical Science. I know CPO is so very popular on the board, and we wanted to love it. But as an 8th grader last year, my dd used this text (I had the teacher's manual,) and there were many errors in both the student and teacher books. The errors really frustrated dd. My dh- mechanical engineer- helped her understand the information and worked through the problems with her. There was no way he wanted to use that book with our other kids based on the trouble the two of them had with the CPO text.

 

 

I found these videos for physical science with Derek Owens....are these ALL of the course lectures (free) for the class? http://www.lucideducation.com/?p=VideoIndex.php&course=PS If buying the complete course ($172), does this include anything for labs? Am I going to be purchasing a bunch of lab equipment for this....?

[Murrayshire]

It is hard to know, because different people have different ideas of what "best" means. Do you mean most rigorous? Do you mean easy to use? There are a lot of things covered by 'best'

 

We will be doing physical science next year and I am going to be using the Prentice Hall Physical Science: Concepts in Action text. I will be using the lesson plans/schedule by Kolbe Academy, but using more hands on labs. I have used Kolbe before and I know their science is secular with a religious part that can be added on. I don't use the religious part.

 

http://www.kolbe.org...ade-Curriculum/

 

Okay..."best" for me would be easy to navigate, clear instructions for the student, easy for a non-sciency mom to grade, rigorous--challenging but not so to overwhelm since this is a beginner in physical science, a motivating science that will keep my dd on the edge of her seat and not bored to death, and one that will make her love science even more. I am not looking for a honors physical science course. This is just for an average kid learning to love science.....does this make a lick of sense?

Thank you for your help! I looked at Kolbe and still trying to compare others and decide......What do you plan to purchase of it? The whole shabang, bits and pieces, or do you purchase just the plans/schedules and find the books elsewhere?

[Sweet Home Alabama]

Sweet Home Alabama (and whomever else would like to buzz in)-- With EE, could the advanced version (7th-10th) easily be used for 3 days instead of 5 days a week? Or, just stretch the 5 days into 2 weeks? We school year round so I'm not in a hurry to get it done in 36 weeks.

Though I know you haven't used Derek Owens yet, but how would you compare it to EE? I think my dd would be happier with the experiments in EE b/c she is so hands on. Is EE something she could possibly use independently with me overlooking and adding to discussion?

 

If I go with EE, would I be crazy to get two levels (for my 5th grader as well) or is it pretty simple to add in a 2nd and 5th grader each at their own levels so everyone is on the same topic. Though I could just use my Evan Moor Teacher File Box subscription for younger two, add books, Ellen McHenry, science videos and call it a year!! Whew!

Wish it was that easy for dd#1.....8th grade needs more structure and more deeper thinking to prepare her for high school science.....Do you think EE would do this better than Derek Owens or Conceptual Physical Science?

Thank you so much for helping!

Please excuse any typing errors....I've been up since 4am and need another cup of coffee.

 

 

Ok... I'll try to answer your questions now.

 

If you'll look on this page, you'll see they explain that the first three (out of five) lessons in each chapter build a foundation for the physical science concept. The last two days are for the lab and lab write-up.: http://www.explorati...anced/demo.html

 

The standard and the advanced versions are IDENTICAL... The standard version is repeated in the advanced version but the advanced includes (adds in) two additional days: lab and lab write-up.

 

As far as using EE for 3 days instead of 5, it just depends on what you want to accomplish. The first three days will give your student the foundation lessons for the chapter topic. This is "enough" for grades 4-6 according to their description. If you intend to make this more upper middle school/high school level, you would want to include days 4 and 5. To get it all accomplished in three days would require combining more than one lesson per day- doable, but you'd have to see if your schedule allows for the time it would take to do this.

 

As for stretching the 5 days into 2 weeks, you would not be able to finish the entire book at that pace.... then again, you school year-round. It could work. EE is very well organized. If you'll carefully read the info on their web site and look at the samples, I think you'll get a pretty good idea how it works. If there are questions, the author is very good about answering any you may have.

My boys used EE mostly independently last year (6th and 3rd grades)...The 3rd grader tagged along- observed and "helped". The 6th grader handled most experiments alone, but my dh helped him on some of the projects. An older middle school student should be fine working independently, I would think.

 

My boys in 3rd and 6th grades used one kit. The 6th grader took charge of the text book. The 3rd grader followed along in discussions and experiments. 2nd grade might be a little young for EE advanced. Please know this... EE's elementary level is nothing like the other levels. I don't think they would correspond at all. The elementary version is very much for young kids.... take a look at it for your 2nd grader or you might just use what you have for your youngest.

 

 

Comparing EE with DO: Right... we haven't used it yet. I think DO is going to kick EE up another notch... Ds will use the physical science notebook that comes with DO's curriculum. He'll watch the lectures and take notes.... great practice for high school. And, science would be done mostly independently. There are some experiments.... I think these are somewhat light and few. That is fine with me because he'll have a somewhat heavy load alongside science (Alg. I, Composition I- outsourced, and American history).

 

Again, I've only used EE- not DO or Conceptual Physical Science...

If I had it to do over again, I would use DO for 8th grade physical science. (We used CPO when my dd was in 8th grade.....same year my boys in 6th and 3rd used EE.) I think DO is just structured better for 8th grade with the right level of independence and skills. I also think, however, that depending on a child's learning style, he/she may prefer one of the other books.... it just depends on the student.

 

I'll have kids in 10th, 8th, and 5th grades next year. I WANT my 8th grader to work as independently as he can so that I can help everyone as they need me.

 

If you have any other questions, don't hesitate to ask!

[redsquirrel]

Okay..."best" for me would be easy to navigate, clear instructions for the student, easy for a non-sciency mom to grade, rigorous--challenging but not so to overwhelm since this is a beginner in physical science, a motivating science that will keep my dd on the edge of her seat and not bored to death, and one that will make her love science even more. I am not looking for a honors physical science course. This is just for an average kid learning to love science.....does this make a lick of sense?

Thank you for your help! I looked at Kolbe and still trying to compare others and decide......What do you plan to purchase of it? The whole shabang, bits and pieces, or do you purchase just the plans/schedules and find the books elsewhere?

 

 

You can buy the text and everything from Kolbe. I already own the book, I got it for very little off of Amazon. I also got a teacher's edition and a workbook for not very much. I believe Kolbe doesn't require you to own the TE, just a key that is part of their bundle.

 

Because I will own the text already, I will just buy the lesson plan from Kolbe for 45$.

 

You can call Kolbe and they will answer your questions. I need to contact them myself because I don't know how they handle lab and lab supplies.

[Murrayshire]

 

You can buy the text and everything from Kolbe. I already own the book, I got it for very little off of Amazon. I also got a teacher's edition and a workbook for not very much. I believe Kolbe doesn't require you to own the TE, just a key that is part of their bundle.

 

Because I will own the text already, I will just buy the lesson plan from Kolbe for 45$.

 

You can call Kolbe and they will answer your questions. I need to contact them myself because I don't know how they handle lab and lab supplies.

 

 

Roger that, redsquirrel.....thank you again!

[Murrayshire]

Ok... I'll try to answer your questions now.

 

If you'll look on this page, you'll see they explain that the first three (out of five) lessons in each chapter build a foundation for the physical science concept. The last two days are for the lab and lab write-up.: http://www.explorati...anced/demo.html

 

The standard and the advanced versions are IDENTICAL... The standard version is repeated in the advanced version but the advanced includes (adds in) two additional days: lab and lab write-up.

 

As far as using EE for 3 days instead of 5, it just depends on what you want to accomplish. The first three days will give your student the foundation lessons for the chapter topic. This is "enough" for grades 4-6 according to their description. If you intend to make this more upper middle school/high school level, you would want to include days 4 and 5. To get it all accomplished in three days would require combining more than one lesson per day- doable, but you'd have to see if your schedule allows for the time it would take to do this.

 

As for stretching the 5 days into 2 weeks, you would not be able to finish the entire book at that pace.... then again, you school year-round. It could work. EE is very well organized. If you'll carefully read the info on their web site and look at the samples, I think you'll get a pretty good idea how it works. If there are questions, the author is very good about answering any you may have.

My boys used EE mostly independently last year (6th and 3rd grades)...The 3rd grader tagged along- observed and "helped". The 6th grader handled most experiments alone, but my dh helped him on some of the projects. An older middle school student should be fine working independently, I would think.

 

My boys in 3rd and 6th grades used one kit. The 6th grader took charge of the text book. The 3rd grader followed along in discussions and experiments. 2nd grade might be a little young for EE advanced. Please know this... EE's elementary level is nothing like the other levels. I don't think they would correspond at all. The elementary version is very much for young kids.... take a look at it for your 2nd grader or you might just use what you have for your youngest.

 

 

Comparing EE with DO: Right... we haven't used it yet. I think DO is going to kick EE up another notch... Ds will use the physical science notebook that comes with DO's curriculum. He'll watch the lectures and take notes.... great practice for high school. And, science would be done mostly independently. There are some experiments.... I think these are somewhat light and few. That is fine with me because he'll have a somewhat heavy load alongside science (Alg. I, Composition I- outsourced, and American history).

 

Again, I've only used EE- not DO or Conceptual Physical Science...

If I had it to do over again, I would use DO for 8th grade physical science. (We used CPO when my dd was in 8th grade.....same year my boys in 6th and 3rd used EE.) I think DO is just structured better for 8th grade with the right level of independence and skills. I also think, however, that depending on a child's learning style, he/she may prefer one of the other books.... it just depends on the student.

 

I'll have kids in 10th, 8th, and 5th grades next year. I WANT my 8th grader to work as independently as he can so that I can help everyone as they need me.

 

If you have any other questions, don't hesitate to ask!

 

Thanks a bunch!.....I'll stay in touch if I need anymore help! :grouphug:

I need a bit to process everything I've read today!

[bcnlvr]

How about Hewitt's Conceptual Physical Science? Or Conceptual Physics. You can find cheaper, older editions. At the end of each chapter, there are great questions, activities and exercises. You pick and choose. Add lots of documentaries and a few fun books about chemistry, physics etc. and you're good to go. :)

 

+1 for this. We are using the former in the 1999/2e. I found the tm and the practice book for next to nothing. We are also going to throw in multimedia.

 

Ds and I chose this after ds explored many ideas (Hewitt, Plato, self-guided, and Rainbow were his top choices).

[PeterPan]

Haven't read the whole thread, sorry, but I was chuckling at your comment about being afraid the textbook would keep you from doing the experiments. I sort of turned that on its head this year and decided we'd use JUST the labs from a couple curricula and totally skip the texts! :D

 

We're using the BJU and PH CIA labs, and they're both good. I spent time over the summer and compiled them into 36 weeks in a notebook. So each week when we're ready to do labs, I just open and go. Oh, I did go through and buy all the supplies ahead, like EVERYTHING. Cost me out the wazoo, but it's all there. If out the wazoo isn't your pricepoint, then start with a more affordable lab list (say apologia's) or get a kit that has all the lab supplies and instructions together for one concrete price.

 

I'm trying to think for a minute if I could have saved money. I mean I literally just went through and bought everything. If you have stuff on-hand, that will help. Some places you could use other things. I was intentionally wanting to up the ante and use regular lab equipment, and I viewed it as an investment toward high school sciences. So there you go. There have been threads on the high school board about getting costs down. For me, and this is just me, having the supplies is what makes it happen. We can do 3-5 hours of labs each week, because I know the supplies are right there, ready to go. Makes it work for us.

[thowell]

Haven't read the whole thread, sorry, but I was chuckling at your comment about being afraid the textbook would keep you from doing the experiments. I sort of turned that on its head this year and decided we'd use JUST the labs from a couple curricula and totally skip the texts! :D

 

We're using the BJU and PH CIA labs, and they're both good. I spent time over the summer and compiled them into 36 weeks in a notebook. So each week when we're ready to do labs, I just open and go. Oh, I did go through and buy all the supplies ahead, like EVERYTHING. Cost me out the wazoo, but it's all there. If out the wazoo isn't your pricepoint, then start with a more affordable lab list (say apologia's) or get a kit that has all the lab supplies and instructions together for one concrete price.

 

I'm trying to think for a minute if I could have saved money. I mean I literally just went through and bought everything. If you have stuff on-hand, that will help. Some places you could use other things. I was intentionally wanting to up the ante and use regular lab equipment, and I viewed it as an investment toward high school sciences. So there you go. There have been threads on the high school board about getting costs down. For me, and this is just me, having the supplies is what makes it happen. We can do 3-5 hours of labs each week, because I know the supplies are right there, ready to go. Makes it work for us.

 

 

Ok Elizabeth, you know you have to explain!! How are you going to explain concepts. What is your set up? Sounds like what I would love to do but not quite sure how, can I please hear your plan.....

[PeterPan]

Ok Elizabeth, you know you have to explain!! How are you going to explain concepts. What is your set up? Sounds like what I would love to do but not quite sure how, can I please hear your plan.....

 

Sigh, you're not gonna like the answer... Labs come with little intro paragraphs on the topics. I read them. I did some science in college, so I just plow forward recklessly and fearlessly. I try to make sure *I* understand the concepts, and I lead *her* into discovering them (and the terms for them) as she works. I'm much more concerned that she understand the *concepts* than I am about term retention. Someone else may disagree, but that's the choice I made for this particular dc for this go-round. It's physical science, not full physics or chemistry. I might get more picky next time around.

 

She's a humanities person in general, but she can really connect with science and ask good questions and engage when it's in front of her, something real and connected, something she can ponder or interact with. So when you start rolling things down ramps, she's all the way there, asking questions. She naturally walks right into the concepts I need her to cover. I'm not necessarily hitting everything that was in the book when I do that. That was a choice I made. Someone else may chose differently.

 

Sometimes we look things up on youtube or find videos from the library on the concepts. There are tons of great science videos online. Just google the term in the labs, and boom you'll find stuff. There are also the Disney Imagineering videos from the library, etc.

 

Btw, I'm planning to continue this approach with biology. We'll do labs and add in other kinds of reading. I have some spine texts lying around, but I'm not sure how much I plan to use them. Probably just selectively. Most of my reading is biographies or essays or topical books. I count the number of hours, and that's what we work. I make sure she hits traditional textbook skills in other subjects and other ways. There are definitely issues like that and consequences to consider.

[thowell]

I actually really like that approach. i just think I am too chicken to do it. I am also not sure I have the basics myself to do it.

[Murrayshire]

Haven't read the whole thread, sorry, but I was chuckling at your comment about being afraid the textbook would keep you from doing the experiments. I sort of turned that on its head this year and decided we'd use JUST the labs from a couple curricula and totally skip the texts! :D

 

We're using the BJU and PH CIA labs, and they're both good. I spent time over the summer and compiled them into 36 weeks in a notebook. So each week when we're ready to do labs, I just open and go. Oh, I did go through and buy all the supplies ahead, like EVERYTHING. Cost me out the wazoo, but it's all there. If out the wazoo isn't your pricepoint, then start with a more affordable lab list (say apologia's) or get a kit that has all the lab supplies and instructions together for one concrete price.

 

I'm trying to think for a minute if I could have saved money. I mean I literally just went through and bought everything. If you have stuff on-hand, that will help. Some places you could use other things. I was intentionally wanting to up the ante and use regular lab equipment, and I viewed it as an investment toward high school sciences. So there you go. There have been threads on the high school board about getting costs down. For me, and this is just me, having the supplies is what makes it happen. We can do 3-5 hours of labs each week, because I know the supplies are right there, ready to go. Makes it work for us.

Sigh, you're not gonna like the answer... Labs come with little intro paragraphs on the topics. I read them. I did some science in college, so I just plow forward recklessly and fearlessly. I try to make sure *I* understand the concepts, and I lead *her* into discovering them (and the terms for them) as she works. I'm much more concerned that she understand the *concepts* than I am about term retention. Someone else may disagree, but that's the choice I made for this particular dc for this go-round. It's physical science, not full physics or chemistry. I might get more picky next time around.

 

She's a humanities person in general, but she can really connect with science and ask good questions and engage when it's in front of her, something real and connected, something she can ponder or interact with. So when you start rolling things down ramps, she's all the way there, asking questions. She naturally walks right into the concepts I need her to cover. I'm not necessarily hitting everything that was in the book when I do that. That was a choice I made. Someone else may chose differently.

 

Sometimes we look things up on youtube or find videos from the library on the concepts. There are tons of great science videos online. Just google the term in the labs, and boom you'll find stuff. There are also the Disney Imagineering videos from the library, etc.

 

Btw, I'm planning to continue this approach with biology. We'll do labs and add in other kinds of reading. I have some spine texts lying around, but I'm not sure how much I plan to use them. Probably just selectively. Most of my reading is biographies or essays or topical books. I count the number of hours, and that's what we work. I make sure she hits traditional textbook skills in other subjects and other ways. There are definitely issues like that and consequences to consider.

 

Thank you for chiming in Elizabeth....I feel like a new student after reading your post! I wish I had the knowledge and skill to do what you do! I'm soaking it in like a sponge....keep talking!

[PeterPan]

I actually really like that approach. i just think I am too chicken to do it. I am also not sure I have the basics myself to do it.

 

Hmm. Well maybe pick a set of labs you CAN accomplish? Maybe don't do so many labs and use a spine a bit more... If your dc has no issues with the length of the lessons, the BJU dvd/online of the physical science class is exceptionally good. It's just the lessons are 45 min. So I felt like by the time we did that, we'd basically never do the labs. But you *can* use the lessons selectively. That's what I'm doing now. On Sunday I'll just tell her to go watch 2 or 3 lessons from the chapter that corresponds to what we're doing in our labs. Helps her transition into Monday and gives her a bit of experience watching a zany guy talk physics and chem. So if the overall time required doesn't bug you, that would be a way to go.

[PeterPan]

Thank you for chiming in Elizabeth....I feel like a new student after reading your post! I wish I had the knowledge and skill to do what you do! I'm soaking it in like a sponge....keep talking!

 

No knowledge and skill, hahaha, just willingness to spend the time. It's not hard to buy the two lab books. They have perforated pages. You rip the lab books up and go NOW WHAT?!?! LOL Then you start connecting them, seeing where they overlap. You decide what you want to do first and next. Then you realize without 36 sticky notes and a big binder you're only going to have a BIG MESS.

 

You know Lori D did something similar only using TOPs labs. The TOPs projects are all card-driven and affordable and easy to implement. I've known people who used them QUITE successfully. They don't get talked about much here, but when you combine them with a text, they could be a fabulous, practical option. You'd get independence, lots of labs, affordable pricepoint, and then you could just correlate *select* readings from a textbook or videos.

[bethben]

We're using Dive physical science with the older BJU text ($4 ppd on Amazon). I liked the idea of the bju teacher DVDs, but the cost of renting them was unreasonable to me. Also, 45 minute lectures almost every day would lead to a small rebellion. I am going to purchase the Dive lab equipment which is the biggest cost. This way, I get labs, a teacher, and independence for my ds.

 

Beth

[TheApprentice]

With Derek Owens, the videos on the site are examples, you would have to purchase the entire course for $172. The labs are very "household friendly". It really is a nice solid course. I felt I got my money's worth because after my middle son uses it, my younger son will also use it. So for $172, all three of my boys will have used the same curriculum. Not bad.

[Murrayshire]

With Derek Owens, the videos on the site are examples, you would have to purchase the entire course for $172. The labs are very "household friendly". It really is a nice solid course. I felt I got my money's worth because after my middle son uses it, my younger son will also use it. So for $172, all three of my boys will have used the same curriculum. Not bad.

 

Thanks for clarifying that.....I just realized that it was only a couple of chapters there! DUH!

 

I'm torn b/w Derek Owens & Conceptual Phys. Science.....I like how Conceptual Phys. grades the work too!

Can anyone help with decision making b/w the two programs?

 

My husband really likes Conceptual Physical Science and I like both! I will have to let my dd look over both to see which one she prefers!

[lisabees]

Well, ds used DO for Algebra. He liked it - it was very organized and he had high scores. But - it didn't inspire him or help him think creatively. He is now doing AoPS for that.

 

I looked at the DO's Physical Science youtube videos. Honestly, they would put me to sleep and not inspire me. You said your dd would like to "dive in" to Chemistry and Physics. Does that mean she is excited about them? I feel that Conceptual Physical Science encourages one to think beyond the standard definitions and formulas. It seems to me that your time could be very flexible, the course could be more interactive and your dd could make the program more personalized to her interests, if using Hewitt.

 

Of course, I could be wrong in my initial reaction. Your dd may have the opposite reaction!

[Murrayshire]

So I'm still juggling with which physical science to use for my 8th grader.....We do like Conceptual Physical Science and the whole computer set up it uses....videos, labs, and the whole interactiveness about it! But, (there's always a but....it seems) towards the last half of the program it studies Earth/Space which is what we are doing this year..... So I've been looking at other options that just have physical/chemistry topics in it. Has anyone used Pearson Interactive Books for Middle school? Are they Similar to Science Fusion?

[mothergooseof4]

Ok... I'll try to answer your questions now.

 

If you'll look on this page, you'll see they explain that the first three (out of five) lessons in each chapter build a foundation for the physical science concept. The last two days are for the lab and lab write-up.: http://www.explorati...anced/demo.html

 

The standard and the advanced versions are IDENTICAL... The standard version is repeated in the advanced version but the advanced includes (adds in) two additional days: lab and lab write-up.

 

As far as using EE for 3 days instead of 5, it just depends on what you want to accomplish. The first three days will give your student the foundation lessons for the chapter topic. This is "enough" for grades 4-6 according to their description. If you intend to make this more upper middle school/high school level, you would want to include days 4 and 5. To get it all accomplished in three days would require combining more than one lesson per day- doable, but you'd have to see if your schedule allows for the time it would take to do this.

 

As for stretching the 5 days into 2 weeks, you would not be able to finish the entire book at that pace.... then again, you school year-round. It could work. EE is very well organized. If you'll carefully read the info on their web site and look at the samples, I think you'll get a pretty good idea how it works. If there are questions, the author is very good about answering any you may have.

My boys used EE mostly independently last year (6th and 3rd grades)...The 3rd grader tagged along- observed and "helped". The 6th grader handled most experiments alone, but my dh helped him on some of the projects. An older middle school student should be fine working independently, I would think.

 

My boys in 3rd and 6th grades used one kit. The 6th grader took charge of the text book. The 3rd grader followed along in discussions and experiments. 2nd grade might be a little young for EE advanced. Please know this... EE's elementary level is nothing like the other levels. I don't think they would correspond at all. The elementary version is very much for young kids.... take a look at it for your 2nd grader or you might just use what you have for your youngest.

 

 

Comparing EE with DO: Right... we haven't used it yet. I think DO is going to kick EE up another notch... Ds will use the physical science notebook that comes with DO's curriculum. He'll watch the lectures and take notes.... great practice for high school. And, science would be done mostly independently. There are some experiments.... I think these are somewhat light and few. That is fine with me because he'll have a somewhat heavy load alongside science (Alg. I, Composition I- outsourced, and American history).

 

Again, I've only used EE- not DO or Conceptual Physical Science...

If I had it to do over again, I would use DO for 8th grade physical science. (We used CPO when my dd was in 8th grade.....same year my boys in 6th and 3rd used EE.) I think DO is just structured better for 8th grade with the right level of independence and skills. I also think, however, that depending on a child's learning style, he/she may prefer one of the other books.... it just depends on the student.

 

I'll have kids in 10th, 8th, and 5th grades next year. I WANT my 8th grader to work as independently as he can so that I can help everyone as they need me.

 

If you have any other questions, don't hesitate to ask!

 

Thanks for this explanation. My typically "hands-off" ds chose EE Advanced at the convention the other day for his 8th grade year. He is not a science kid. We have covered science with random books until 7th when he chose Apologia General over other choices, but he has just been reading the labs instead of doing them. At the convention, we looked at many curricula for physical science, some that were simply overviews to call the subject "done." I thought he would pick one of the thin books that I showed him which included little hands-on application, but he would still choose Apologia. Then he was wandering around and saw all of the gadgets set up at the EE booth. I saw him standing there and walked up to ask what he was doing. He said that all of this stuff looked really cool, and he stood there tinkering with it all. I said, "You realize this is a curriculum that uses all of these gadgets for science? Would you want to use this or Apologia?" His face lit up, and he just pointed. We walked around the rest of the day, and when he still wanted it we ordered just as they were ushering us out the doors.

 

So, is it really going to hold his attention? Is it as fun as it looks? How much time per day does it require? Is it truly independent?

[Sweet Home Alabama]

 

Thanks for this explanation. My typically "hands-off" ds chose EE Advanced at the convention the other day for his 8th grade year. He is not a science kid. We have covered science with random books until 7th when he chose Apologia General over other choices, but he has just been reading the labs instead of doing them. At the convention, we looked at many curricula for physical science, some that were simply overviews to call the subject "done." I thought he would pick one of the thin books that I showed him which included little hands-on application, but he would still choose Apologia. Then he was wandering around and saw all of the gadgets set up at the EE booth. I saw him standing there and walked up to ask what he was doing. He said that all of this stuff looked really cool, and he stood there tinkering with it all. I said, "You realize this is a curriculum that uses all of these gadgets for science? Would you want to use this or Apologia?" His face lit up, and he just pointed. We walked around the rest of the day, and when he still wanted it we ordered just as they were ushering us out the doors.

 

So, is it really going to hold his attention? Is it as fun as it looks? How much time per day does it require? Is it truly independent?

 

 

I just asked my boys these questions.... Their reply? "Yes! Yes! 30-60 minutes, and Yes!"

 

For a little more explanation...EE held my boys' attention- they really enjoyed all of the equipments in the box. I think EE was kind of like a treasure box because with each new chapter, they had to go find new "stuff" to build with. So, it was fun. Depending on the daily plan, the time per day could run from 30-60 minutes.

 

I absolutely LOVED that mostly everything they needed for EE was in the box!!! We did have to buy a low-melt glue gun and glue, but that was minor. I did little to no planning or tweaking. EE was very,very open and go. The boys followed the lesson plan, worked the assignments, and completed the labs. I went over answers with them and tested my older son. Truly, the younger son just listened and participated when he knew the answers; I didn't test him.

 

As far as its independence... my boys were in 6th and 3rd grades when they used EE. EE was geared more to my 6th grader who was somewhat in charge, yet my 3rd grader really got into the experiments. On some projects, my dh was involved- the glider for one. Sometimes precision was important, and he oversaw that aspect. I would think an 8th grader could work mostly alone.... maybe he would need a hand here and there to hold projects steady.

 

I've read many more positive reviews than negative ones for EE on this board. No curriculum is perfect, but EE held the interest of my boys, was fairly easy to carry out independently, and it shined far and above any other science we've done. My youngest keeps asking for more science like EE.

 

We're doing earth/space science next year.... thinking of using Mr. Q, but am open to anyone's suggestion for an EE-type e/s science.

[walkermamaof4]

Sweet Home Alabama - how old/what math level would a child need to be to do EE advanced? Thanks!

[Sweet Home Alabama]

Sweet Home Alabama - how old/what math level would a child need to be to do EE advanced? Thanks!

 

 

According to their website, the advanced version is for 7th-10th graders....see here:

http://www.explorationeducation.com/CourseDescription/index.html#Advanced

 

As a 6th grader, my ds worked through most of the experiments. He probably wrote a lab report or two. (Really, it's been too long to remember details...) I didn't make him write lab reports for all of the experiments.

 

To use EE advanced to the fullest, I would agree with 7th-10th grades. On the younger end, the parent might need to be more involved. On the older end, the parent would need to be less involved.

 

I would also encourage anyone interested in EE to contact the author. He was always very nice about answering any question I had. I just love it when a company's customer service is kind. That goes a long way with positive recommendations!