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Claremont Consortium - College(s) visit report(s) - Harvey Mudd, Pomona, Claremont McKenna Colleges


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I decided to do this "report" as just one thread - hopefully it won't get too long to post.

 

We visited the Claremont Consortium February 13 - 15, 2013. The Claremont Consortium contains 5 undergraduate institutions and two graduate schools all of which are located within one square mile. They are located in Claremont, California, about 40 miles east of LA. The five undergraduate schools are (in order of founding) Pomona, Scripps (women's college), Claremont McKenna, Harvey Mudd, and Pitzer. Each school has its own campus, facilities, vibe, admissions process, etc. However, they also have shared resources (libraries, etc.) and allow for much cross-registration among the schools. Collectively, they field two sets of Division III athletic teams - Pomona/Pitzer are the Sagehens, and Mudd, Scripps, CMC are the Stags/Athenas. Adjacent to the campuses is the Claremont Village - a delightful area of cute shops and quaint restaurants. There is also one boutique hotel there, but it was booked when we visited as it was family weekend for all the schools. One could easily walk/bike from campus though parking is easy and free.

 

POMONA:

 

Pomona is the original school and is the most similar to a traditional LAC. We did the most at Pomona - info session, tour, attended a class, and ds had an interview as well as a trial piano lesson. The info session was good, though I found the presenter rather arrogant. There is no merit aid at Pomona, but they are need-blind in their admissions process. No AP credits are accepted. As is true with all the CCs (Claremont colleges) there is a significant core required. All majors require a senior thesis. Doing a double major is allowed but discouraged according to the admissions officer. Enrollment is approximately 1,600 students fairly even among men and women. Though, if you look at their common data set there are significantly more female applicants. The campus is absolutely gorgeous! The group was large, and I had a hard time hearing the tour guide, but I was lingering toward the back. The campus seemed quite large to me given the enrollment. The food in the cafeteria was good. Freshman are grouped into "sponsor groups" of 12 - 20 who are paired with two sophomores. We attended an IR class which was excellent - students were engaged in the discussion and the professor seemed to know all their names. I counted 27 in the class, but apparently some were out for Model UN. This was larger than I expected. One red flag to me on the tour was the guide's mentioning that it was sometimes difficult to get into some of the required classes and that overrides were often necessary. My son had an interview which was with a senior female student. Being the monosyllabic boy that he is, I was told it was, "Good." He said it was very relaxed in a getting to know you sort of way. Pomona was the only school we visited that would interview him this early in his junior year. He also had a thirty minute lesson with a music faculty member. She graciously provided this service gratis.

 

HARVEY MUDD:

 

This is a LAC for STEM-types. The campus is NOT pretty at all. Very brown buildings with not much character. They only offer nine majors all within math/science/CS/Engineering. Enrollment is 750. The info session was only 30 minutes, and it was actually shorter than that because the admissions person was late by about 15 minutes! My college roommate who lives in Southern California came to hang out with us, and she went back to the admissions office to see why no one was in the building where the info session was to occur. Notwithstanding the fact we had signed in at the admissions office (as I assume the other four families who were there did), there had been some communication lapse. Not a great first impression. However, he did an excellent job once he arrived. They know they are a niche market and don't try to be anything else. In addition to courses for one's major, there is a Mudd core (lots of math and science courses) as well as a humanities/social science core. Within the latter, six courses must be completed, and one must choose a depth of study within an area. I would think for an science/engineering type kid who had been a WTMinder, this would be very appealing. However, there is very little flexibility to take anything outside of their requirements - just not room in the schedule. Our tour was excellent. It was only us and one other family with two guides. These kids were delightful and engaging and clearly enthusiastic about what they did there. They showed us inside many of the buildings, and we saw several groups of kids working in labs. Their capstone experience can either take the form of a thesis/research or be done through something called "clinic." Thus, if research isn't one's thing, one need not do a thesis. This was the only school where we saw inside a dorm room. They were suite-style and pretty large. We saw our tour guide's room, and he and his roommates had crammed all beds and desks into one of the rooms and had a "hang-out" space in the other. We were not able to attend a class at Mudd. The kids are clearly smart and quirky. Many riding unicycles!

 

CLAREMONT MCKENNA:

 

Another beautiful campus! Unbelievable spaces just for lounging about and studying. Several varieties of dorms and not all have air-conditioning. The information session was exceptionally good! Extremely well-presented and full of enthusiasm (the presenter was an alumni). Fairly thorough core at CMC as well, though here some AP courses are accepted. Touted that it was easy to double major and if doing so, only one thesis (instead of one for each major) is required. He also emphasized that CMC, though a LAC, focuses on pragmatism - what he called the "so what" factor - meaning what will you do with your education once it has been completed. CMC does have *some* merit-based scholarships. Enrollment is around 1250. Had lunch here as well - I thought the offerings were better here than at Pomona. A lovely facility called the Atheneum (sp?) houses a library where "tea" is served every afternoon - with rice crispy treats, chocolate-covered strawberries, and various other goodies. Additionally, there is a lovely banquet hall where distinguished speakers are brought in four nights per week. CMC students have priority for these over students at the other colleges. One must dress up to attend, but it just counts as regular meal. Emphasis at CMC is Econ, Government, and IR - though other majors are available including sciences, psychology, etc. and some foreign language. One third of the student body are involved in varsity athletics. We did attend an Economics course here. Only about 16 in the class. More lecture-oriented than the IR class at Pomona, but he was still clearly laying a foundation.

 

Hope this is helpful to someone. Please feel free to ask questions for things I did not cover.

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I forgot to mention that students can eat at any of the dining halls on any of the campuses. Additionally, CMC has maid service (!) every other week in its dorms.

 

These schools have a LOT of money to throw around. Many student activities are subsidized. At Pomona, If you find an unpaid internship they will pay you to do it - I believe up to $7,000??? Very large endowment at Pomona on a per capita basis.

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I forgot to mention that students can eat at any of the dining halls on any of the campuses. Additionally, CMC has maid service (!) every other week in its dorms.

 

 

 

When my daughter was considering applying, we told her that her work study would doubtless be to be maid to other students! It is a neat feature -- one that I can't imagine too many other colleges have.

 

Regards,

Kareni

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  • 1 month later...

I am a CMC graduate ('97) and am happy to speak with anyone about the school. I actually transferred to CMC from USC because of CMC's stellar reputation with law schools. About 25% of our grads go to law school (or did, before the recession). I graduated from Stanford Law School, and I know that CMC played a large role in my admission. I did double major in Russian, which was at Pomona, and am happy to answer questions about the different flavors between these two schools -- because they are *very* different.

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Thanks for this review! Harvey Mudd is on our radar for our STEM guy come application time. Did they address anything specifically for homeschool applicants? A couple of years ago, there were reports of a snobby attitude toward homeschoolers. I'm wondering if that's changed.

 

We have two family members who graduated from there--one from CMC, one from HM--but they were traditionally schooled. Both loved their experiences!

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Thanks for this review! Harvey Mudd is on our radar for our STEM guy come application time. Did they address anything specifically for homeschool applicants? A couple of years ago, there were reports of a snobby attitude toward homeschoolers. I'm wondering if that's changed.

 

We have two family members who graduated from there--one from CMC, one from HM--but they were traditionally schooled. Both loved their experiences!

 

 

I don't really know about their attitude toward homeschoolers. My ds enrolled in a charter school halfway through 9th grade, so that aspect is no longer applicable to us. I would imagine they would have something on their website that specifically addresses homeschool applicants, but that doesn't mean they don't have a bias against them unfortunately. I just don't know. Sorry.

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I don't remember where I saw this information, but I know that last year, Harvey Mudd's tiny freshman class of 175 students had 3 homechoolers in it.

 

We visited there when DS was a junior and loved it. In the end, he decided not to apply after he came home from his exchange year in Germany. It is across the USA for us and I think it seemed a bit too far from home for him. HM's graduates have a stellar reputation though. I've heard that from more than one quarter.

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  • 5 months later...

This is great information - thank you all for posting.  Does anyone know anything about Pitzer?  Daughter very interested in the LACs - Pomona seems dreamy, but extraordinarily difficult to get into, Claremont McKenna seems a bit too "business-like" for her, maybe?  Wondered about Pitzer?  She is thinking of majoring in biology - maybe neuroscience?  Maybe even education?  She is quite liberal and has a great sense of service/community involvement.  Wondering about the different "vibes" of all of the different colleges within the consortium.  Great concept though - and very appealing!  

 

Any info/insight much appreciated.

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  • 2 years later...

We just returned from a tour of Harvey Mudd, so I thought I would poke around the WTM archives and see what others had to say.  Found this thread and decided to post a 2016 update.    

 

Unfortunately we scheduled our visit after school was out, but before many students were returning for their summer research, so it wasn't ideal.  In fact, it turned out to be very problematic, as we had planned to each lunch on campus before the info session only to find there is only one cafeteria on campus and it was closed for the summer.  Whah?  So I asked about the other college campuses next door, and the folks in the office were completely unaware of eating options at the other campuses, so they sent us walking 3 blocks off campus to a grocery store, lol.  

 

Our info session included one other student from New Jersey, and it was informative.  I got this sense that there is quite a bit of Mudd pride and involvement by alumni.  My dd and I were the only ones on our tour.  Many of the labs seem to be underground, and a little old looking, but wow, the faculty are so nice and accessible, not intimidating at all.  Eager to stop and chat and answer questions.  This is why one attends a smaller school.  Such a contrast to our subsequent trip to UCLA.  

 

My big negative was the fact that there is a single engineering major at Mudd:  Engineering.  I think electrical and mechanical are highly different courses of study, and I don't think they work well combined in this age.  But if any readers disagree, I'm happy to hear your thoughts.  

 

I like the idea of visit reports!  We should resurrect this idea on this board!  

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I couldn't tell from their websites whether or not they have varsity sports.  It looked like they just had intramural sports, but there was mention about there being a fun, competitive, inter-dorm league at Mudd.  Does anyone know?

 

What do you all think about the generalist engineering degree vs going to a school where you pick a subspecialty and become a certain type of engineer, i.e. chemical engineer, mechanical engineer, etc.?  What is the difference in jobs after graduation?  It seems to me that with a generalist degree, you would be more in need of going to graduate school to then become a certain type of engineer.  Would this generalist engineering degree limit you or actually open more doors for you?  I don't know, just thinking out loud and wondering if others know more than I do about this.

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I couldn't tell from their websites whether or not they have varsity sports.  It looked like they just had intramural sports, but there was mention about there being a fun, competitive, inter-dorm league at Mudd.  Does anyone know?

 

 

They are NCAA div3 through a combined Claremont Mudd Scripps athletic department. A friend of ours played varsity water polo there.

 

https://www.hmc.edu/student-life/student-activities/athletics/

http://www.cmsathletics.org/prospective_athletes/index

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What do you all think about the generalist engineering degree vs going to a school where you pick a subspecialty and become a certain type of engineer, i.e. chemical engineer, mechanical engineer, etc.?  What is the difference in jobs after graduation?  It seems to me that with a generalist degree, you would be more in need of going to graduate school to then become a certain type of engineer.  Would this generalist engineering degree limit you or actually open more doors for you?  I don't know, just thinking out loud and wondering if others know more than I do about this.

 

This is a very good question.  In my mind, an electrical engineer and a mechanical engineer have very little overlap after freshman physics classes, and both have a pretty full 4 years of classes and projects in their major.  But I do have an open mind, and I'd like to hear what others say as well.  

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I will preface this by saying that I am not an engineer, so I really have no idea what I'm talking about.  But I know I've read here on the forum that it's important to go to an engineering program that is certified for the particular subspecialty in which you want to work, because you can't get a job as an aeronautical engineer if you have a chemical engineering degree.  (I am sure there are exceptions to that, just stating what I remember reading here.)  So, it seems like the generalist degree would be good in that it leaves doors open for you to explore different avenues, but then ultimately if you decide you want to work as an XYZ engineer, then you will have to go on to grad school for that specific degree, i.e. chemical, mechanical, aeronautical, etc.  So, does that just mean more time and money to get the same job?  I don't know.

 

ETA: I am sure there are pluses to both options, I just don't know what they specifically are.  

Edited by Grantmom
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Harvey Mudd does offer merit scholarships. Their most prestigious scholarship is full tuition. They choose a certain number to interview for it, and only 8 are chosen for it in the end. My daughter was offered a Harvey Mudd Merit Scholarship for $10,000/yr or $40,000 total, along with some need based aid. Their room/board costs were probably the most expensive of any of the colleges to which my daughter was accepted. The costs for room/board alone was about $16,000/yr, apart from tuition.

 

My daughter really loved Harvey Mudd, but in the end the additional cost involved with that choice did not make sense for us.

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Harvey Mudd does offer merit scholarships. Their most prestigious scholarship is full tuition. They choose a certain number to interview for it, and only 8 are chosen for it in the end. My daughter was offered a Harvey Mudd Merit Scholarship for $10,000/yr or $40,000 total, along with some need based aid. Their room/board costs were probably the most expensive of any of the colleges to which my daughter was accepted. The costs for room/board alone was about $16,000/yr, apart from tuition.

 

My daughter really loved Harvey Mudd, but in the end the additional cost involved with that choice did not make sense for us.

We may be crossing this one off our list but I will let DS decide. That seems high for room & board.

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Harvey Mudd does offer merit scholarships. Their most prestigious scholarship is full tuition. They choose a certain number to interview for it, and only 8 are chosen for it in the end. My daughter was offered a Harvey Mudd Merit Scholarship for $10,000/yr or $40,000 total, along with some need based aid. Their room/board costs were probably the most expensive of any of the colleges to which my daughter was accepted. The costs for room/board alone was about $16,000/yr, apart from tuition.

 

My daughter really loved Harvey Mudd, but in the end the additional cost involved with that choice did not make sense for us.

Wowza! Got curious and looked this up. Room and board for next year is > $17,000!

 

https://www.hmc.edu/admission/afford/cost-of-attendance/

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Does Harvey Mudd offer merit scholarships? Do the campuses border each other?

 

I believe that the varsity sports teams are for the combined colleges (not very important to us).

The campuses do border each other, and are easy walking distance. CMC-Mudd-Scripps are one sports team and Pomona-Pitzer are another team. As was mentioned, they are D3. My apartment on campus at CMC was very nice, but nothing extravagant; I imagine the cost of living in Southern California is reflected in the room and board.

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We just returned from a tour of Harvey Mudd, so I thought I would poke around the WTM archives and see what others had to say.  Found this thread and decided to post a 2016 update.    

 

Unfortunately we scheduled our visit after school was out, but before many students were returning for their summer research, so it wasn't ideal.  In fact, it turned out to be very problematic, as we had planned to each lunch on campus before the info session only to find there is only one cafeteria on campus and it was closed for the summer.  Whah?  So I asked about the other college campuses next door, and the folks in the office were completely unaware of eating options at the other campuses, so they sent us walking 3 blocks off campus to a grocery store, lol.  

 

Our info session included one other student from New Jersey, and it was informative.  I got this sense that there is quite a bit of Mudd pride and involvement by alumni.  My dd and I were the only ones on our tour.  Many of the labs seem to be underground, and a little old looking, but wow, the faculty are so nice and accessible, not intimidating at all.  Eager to stop and chat and answer questions.  This is why one attends a smaller school.  Such a contrast to our subsequent trip to UCLA.  

 

My big negative was the fact that there is a single engineering major at Mudd:  Engineering.  I think electrical and mechanical are highly different courses of study, and I don't think they work well combined in this age.  But if any readers disagree, I'm happy to hear your thoughts.  

 

I like the idea of visit reports!  We should resurrect this idea on this board!  

 

I wanted to answer this last night, but was on my phone. A couple of things...

 

Big school v. small school -- having come from USC to CMC, I can tell you that the best thing about the Claremont Colleges is the small school environment. I never had more than 25 people in a class, and most of my courses had less than 10. You really get to know your professors and fellow classmates, there are no grad student TAs, and the vast resources available are dedicated to just a few students -- all of which are ugrads. I will strongly encourage my children to attend a small school, if given the opportunity.

 

Mudd, generally -- I got to know Mudd students primarily from my experience in Army ROTC with them. There wasn't a single one that I didn't enjoy knowing. They were highly intelligent people, creative problem solvers, and all had that fabulous blend of geek + wicked sense of humor. Among the 5 colleges, Mudd was also known for throwing the best parties. Just an interesting work hard/play hard kind of place.

 

Generalist v. specialist -- I don't have an engineering background, but I do have experience competing for prestigious fellowships, grad school admissions, and job offers. Here again, I found the small school environment, and liberal arts background, to be a huge advantage. All grad schools, employers, and fellowships are looking to add more diversity in their selection process, and some of that diversity is reflected in hiring from a wide variety of schools. When you are in a large school, students are often pre-screened by these very specific majors. For example, when I interviewed with investment banks, out of ugrad, these interviews were open to all majors at CMC. In contrast, many banks limited their interviewing to only certain majors at larger schools. It actually made it much easier to stand out in the selection process, as we were not all so cookie cutter. I would imagine that engineering firms and jobs would be similar -- interviewing from any major at Mudd vs. only specific majors at large schools. Also, when applying to grad schools and for post-grad scholarships, I found it to be a major advantage to be competing with a small handful of students at CMC vs. the vast legions of people you'd be competing against at a larger school. Yes, there were more Harvard ugrads at Stanford Law than CMC ugrads, but on a per capita basis, our numbers were solid -- my CMC class had only 170ish students, and I know that at least 3 of us were admitted to Stanford Law. Those numbers looked similar for Rhodes Scholarships, etc. -- just a plethora of opportunities for an extremely small number of students.

 

   

  

 

 

 

Edited by SeaConquest
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