3rd grade chemistry: anybody else planning this?

[serendipitous journey]

Is anybody else planning their 3rd grade chemistry?

 

So far I'm enchanted by

Ellen McHenry's Elements (12 weeks, 8yo and up) perhaps to follow with her

Brain (9 weeks, 8yo and up) and, if Button is up to it,

Carbon Chemistry (no time listed, for 9yo and up).

I figure that be a year's worth of work.

 

I'm tempted to use

REAL Science Chemistry as a spine, but perhaps that would be a pointless addition.

 

I thought I'd supplement with

Basher's Periodic Table and

Basher's Chemistry

Cartoon Guide to Chemistry (for older children -- will have to see how this goes)

 

Maybe biographies for

Marie Curie

George Washington Carver

Antoni Van Leeuwenhoek

Louis Pasteur

Lord Kelvin (? -- the distinction btw. physics and chemists blurs/doesn't apply this early, not sure when we'll do Kelvin)

Antoine Lavoisier

Josiah Wedgwood -- not an academic chemist, but functionally a master materials scientist; would love to find a good bio for him

 

Montessori-style cards were made by this blogger (links to her instructions) using this

Elements site -- basic subatomic structure of each element. I haven't figured out whether or not I want to to this myself.

 

we ourselves don't work very well from DK-style books, so none are listed ... but what are y'all doing? or, if you've come through Grammar chemistry already, what have you liked?

 

ETA resources suggested by others, down-thread:

Elemental Science curriculum

GEMS Chemical Reactions unit

Mr. Q's Chemistry

Noeo Chemistry II

Royal Fireworks' Press Dr. Dave's Teaching Manuals: Chemistry (text + CD with visuals; you can download a sample)

Guest Hollow's chemistry (this is a free scheduling of resources for a year of chemistry: do visit for the resource list at least, incl. DVDs)

Homeschool Share's free chemistry unit (lapbooking/notebooking)

ACS middle school chemistry-- this is free, but FWIW boardies much prefer McHenry's Elements. It is suggested to try ACS, then Elements since ACS is simpler; the ACS includes videos of dramatic demonstrations you prob. won't be doing at home :)

ACS's Wonderscience activity book (on Amazon, used, much more cheaply) -- boardies love this resource.

"Chemically Active: Experiments You Can Do At Home" book by Cobb

"Exploring the World of Chemistry: From Ancient Metals to High-Speed Supercomputers" by Tiner

Memoria Press' guide to the Tiner book above (they sell the text, too) -- scroll down a bit.

"The Disappearing Spoon": this is not a book written for children; good resource for the parent or for a child old enough to enjoy. A living book.

Theodore Gray's "The Elements"

" "Elements Vault": Treasures of the Periodic Table w/ Removable Documents and Real Element Samples Incl. Gold

" Photographic Card Deck of the Elements

" The Elements Puzzle (1000 pieces)

periodictable.com (from Gray & co, just like the Elements book but with other stuff too)

periodicvideos.com from the University of Nottingham: videos for all elements, links to the authors' writing in the peer-reviewed journals Science and Nature Chemistry, &c.

 

[elizabeth rose]

sounds great! I'm thinking of doing chem next year with a 5th and 3rd grader. I would probably use elemental science.

[Melissa B]

I'm planning to do chemistry next year with a 4th and 2nd grader. Right now the plan is to use Elemental Science Chemistry with McHenry's Elements and Carbon Chemistry as supplements.

[boscopup]

Have you looked at Guest Hollow's chemistry?

 

http://www.guesthollow.com/homeschool/science/otters_chemistry/chemistrybooks.html

 

She used the RSFK and McHenry stuff, plus other books (not encyclopedias).

[FairProspects]

Me. I'm using Guest Hollow's Schedule and we'll probably take another 3 month break in the middle to do the Science and Engineering Fair since that is going so well this year.

 

I'd like to add in the GEMS Chemical Reaction unit, and I have another Vicki Cobb book, Chemically Active, that I may synthesize in as well. I'm also going to make sure my boys complete the chemistry badge on DIY.

[Crimson Wife]

My oldest did Ellen McHenry's Elements and Carbon Chemistry plus Tiner's Exploring the World of Chemistry the first time through the cycle.

 

For my 2nd, I'm planning Ellen McHenry's The Elements, the Tiner book with the new MP study guide, Royal Fireworks Dr. Dave's Teaching Manuals for chemistry & phases of matter, and possibly he might do some of Carbon Chemistry towards the end of the year (I don't think he'll be ready for everything in that program but we'll just have to see). He will also tag-along with the labs in his big sister's Mr. Q Advanced Chemistry.

[bethben]

Anybody thinking about this:

http://www.inquiryinaction.org/classroomactivities/ ?

 

Or Real Science Odyssey Chemistry?

 

Beth

[Greenmama2]

We are a little way into McHenry's Elements and loving it. The Bedside Book of Chemistry has also been a fun addition (lots of biographies etc).

[serendipitous journey]

sounds great! I'm thinking of doing chem next year with a 5th and 3rd grader. I would probably use elemental science.

I'm planning to do chemistry next year with a 4th and 2nd grader. Right now the plan is to use Elemental Science Chemistry with McHenry's Elements and Carbon Chemistry as supplements.

 

Hmmm... have you been using Elemental this year, and like it? or is there another reason you're planning on using it for Chemistry?

 

Have you looked at Guest Hollow's chemistry?

 

http://www.guestholl...istrybooks.html

 

She used the RSFK and McHenry stuff, plus other books (not encyclopedias).

 

No, I hadn't looked at Guest Hollow: will do!

[serendipitous journey]

Me. I'm using Guest Hollow's Schedule and we'll probably take another 3 month break in the middle to do the Science and Engineering Fair since that is going so well this year.

 

I'd like to add in the GEMS Chemical Reaction unit, and I have another Vicki Cobb book, Chemically Active, that I may synthesize in as well. I'm also going to make sure my boys complete the chemistry badge on DIY.

 

 

I like GEMS but have not been using it this year: thanks for the pointer to their chemistry unit, and to the Cobb book which I'd not heard of.

 

My oldest did Ellen McHenry's Elements and Carbon Chemistry plus Tiner's Exploring the World of Chemistry the first time through the cycle.

 

For my 2nd, I'm planning Ellen McHenry's The Elements, the Tiner book with the new MP study guide, Royal Fireworks Dr. Dave's Teaching Manuals for chemistry & phases of matter, and possibly he might do some of Carbon Chemistry towards the end of the year (I don't think he'll be ready for everything in that program but we'll just have to see). He will also tag-along with the labs in his big sister's Mr. Q Advanced Chemistry.

 

 

oh, these resources look lovely. I didn't know MP had a chemistry study guide, and had completely forgotten about the Dr. Dave manuals. Have you used and liked these before? thanks so much!

[FairProspects]

I think you are going to love the Guest Hollow guide, it pretty much schedules in everything you already want to do, looking at your list. :)

[serendipitous journey]

Anybody thinking about this:

http://www.inquiryin...roomactivities/ ?

 

Or Real Science Odyssey Chemistry?

 

Beth

 

 

I'm thinking about RSO Chemistry myself, but don't love their Earth Science -- the beginning weather projects were buggy (ie didn't work well) and that irritated me. But I like the format, and the research write-up experience ... maybe I should download a sample and testdrive it :) ...

[serendipitous journey]

We are a little way into McHenry's Elements and loving it. The Bedside Book of Chemistry has also been a fun addition (lots of biographies etc).

 

 

Greenmama, can you link this? Is it the Levy or the Bradley?

[Crimson Wife]

I had completely forgotten about the Dr. Dave manuals. Have you used and liked these before? thanks so much!

 

These will be the first Dr. Dave manuals we've tried. They've gotten good reviews on this forum including from MariannNOVA.

[Greenmama2]

 

 

Greenmama, can you link this? Is it the Levy or the Bradley?

Levy.http://www.booktopia.com.au/the-bedside-book-of-chemistry-joel-levy/prod9781742660356.html

Off to look at the other one now :)

[Mélie]

My tentative plan for next year (2nd grade) is to use Mr. Q Chemistry and Ellen McHenry Elements, along with lots of books and following his interests when possible.

Have you looked at Guest Hollow's chemistry?

 

http://www.guestholl...istrybooks.html

 

She used the RSFK and McHenry stuff, plus other books (not encyclopedias).

Thanks for posting this! I hadn't seen a lot of those books!

[Spetzi]

Don't forget periodictable.com (just like Elements book, but other photos as well) and periodicvideos.com (videos of chemists experimenting with nearly every element). My kids love both sites...and so do I!

[crazyforlatin]

We are also listening to The Disappearing Spoon, although I'm not sure if it's appropriate for a second grader/third grader. Along with Elements and Tiner's Chemistry, I've also added in Noeo's Level 2 for more depth. Gray's Elements Vault has been a fun addition, especially his second book.

[Sleep-Deprived]

I'm doing 3rd grade chemistry for the second time using Mr. Q's Classic Science Curriculum http://www.eequalsmc...meschoolers.htm

The first time was a couple years ago when my oldest son was in 3rd grade. This year I am working through it with a 3rd and 2nd grader. The first time around my oldest did the reading on his own, and did the labs with me. This time I am reading aloud with them and we do labs together. I had my oldest do the worksheets, but he was more mature and self-directed than my current two. We are talking through the answers for the worksheets but we don't actually fill them in.

[Staceyshoe]

We *love* Ellen McHenry's science programs! HS Share has a free chemistry unit study available. We chose bits and pieces of it, doing the lapbook elements that complemented The Elements, and we read a couple of chemist biographies and did notebooking pages on them. ACS Middle School Chemistry is very doable for elementary. (I found it to be more basic in the scientific concepts covered than The Elements or Carbon Chemistry.) It also includes some video clips of science experiments that you wouldn't want to be do at home but are quite dramatic. The multi-media aspect is very appealing for younger children. I recommend using ACS chemistry first if you want to use it and Ellen McHenry's because the ACS program is a basic introduction to chemistry while McHenry's programs are more indepth.

[Thia]

My kids will be 9,7,5,3 and we're going to use Mr. Q and RSO. Of course, I won't be doing every little thing from each program, but picking and choosing. I like the more textbook style of Mr. Q and the worksheets, but RSO has some great information and the kids related well to their Earth Science program.

[serendipitous journey]

We are also listening to The Disappearing Spoon, although I'm not sure if it's appropriate for a second grader/third grader. Along with Elements and Tiner's Chemistry, I've also added in Noeo's Level 2 for more depth. Gray's Elements Vault has been a fun addition, especially his second book.

 

 

-- thanks for those ideas. How old is your child?

[serendipitous journey]

We *love* Ellen McHenry's science programs! HS Share has a free chemistry unit study available. We chose bits and pieces of it, doing the lapbook elements that complemented The Elements, and we read a couple of chemist biographies and did notebooking pages on them. ACS Middle School Chemistry is very doable for elementary. (I found it to be more basic in the scientific concepts covered than The Elements or Carbon Chemistry.) It also includes some video clips of science experiments that you wouldn't want to be do at home but are quite dramatic. The multi-media aspect is very appealing for younger children. I recommend using ACS chemistry first if you want to use it and Ellen McHenry's because the ACS program is a basic introduction to chemistry while McHenry's programs are more indepth.

 

The ACS chemistry often seems to leave folks unimpressed -- but it's good to know about the dramatic demonstrations!

A general science thread recently brought up WonderScience from the ACS folks, which people seem to be really liking. It's cheaper (used) at Amazon, and the link incl. sample sections.

[Classically Minded]

We are doing Chemistry this year for dd9 in 3rd grade. Although we took 3 months off for our new baby, we are starting back up this coming week. I've been following the WTM rec's for Chemistry using the Usborne science encyclopedias to look up definitions and doing experiments from the "Adventures With Atoms and Molecules" books, but dd seems to want more. I bought 2 kits for fun - "My First Chemistry Kit" and "Fizzy Foamy Science". I also purchased "Lapbooking Through the Periodic Table" by Elemental Science and it looks awesome! We got the book from the library that goes along with it - "Fizz, Bubble & Flash".

 

I'm still considering getting Elemental Science's Chemistry (which utilizes the books we already have but gives me a schedule and worksheets!) OR Ellen McHenry's Elements & Carbon Chemistry OR just stick with what I have - but have yet to make up mind! :blink:

 

Here are some of my bookmarks for free things for Chemistry:

Chemistry Lapbook

Chemistry Unit free printables

Elements freebies

Periodic Table of Videos

Virtual Periodic Table

[elizabeth rose]

Hmmm... have you been using Elemental this year, and like it? or is there another reason you're planning on using it for Chemistry?

 

Yes, I am using the earth and space one. I like it. It is laid out for me day by day with reading assignment, a short narration and once a week an experiment. there is also weekly vocabulary. The internet links add some interest to the program. I'm using it with my 4th and 2nd grader. It's easy, probably too easy esp for my 9 year old. However, that's what they love about it. At this age I just want to expose them to the material. We add in brainpop videos on each topic if they are available, and I've checked out some Bill Nye science videos on a couple of the topics.

 

[PachiSusan]

I'm really out of it, I guess. Chemistry in 3rd grade? Am I thinking too much? All our science has been a little bit of this and a little bit of that.

[Crimson Wife]

If you follow TWTM 4 year science cycle, then chemistry will be in 3rd (or 2nd if you start the cycle in K).

[PachiSusan]

If you follow TWTM 4 year science cycle, then chemistry will be in 3rd (or 2nd if you start the cycle in K).

 

Ahhh. okay. I have not read WTM or follow it, so it seemed like a much later concept to teach for me.

[Alte Veste Academy]

Ahhh. okay. I have not read WTM or follow it, so it seemed like a much later concept to teach for me.

 

I don't follow WTM (or anything else, for that matter :tongue_smilie) for science and I absolutely believe chemistry should be introduced to young children. I personally think that the periodic table should be up next to the alphabet and number charts on the walls of early elementary classrooms. Everything in the world is made of those elements. It is elementary! How hard is it to explain to kids that water is H2O and point to the chart? But no one does that. They introduce the chart late, making it scary and intimidating. What a loss...

[PachiSusan]

I don't follow WTM (or anything else, for that matter :tongue_smilie) for science and I absolutely believe chemistry should be introduced to young children. I personally think that the periodic table should be up next to the alphabet and number charts on the walls of early elementary classrooms. Everything in the world is made of those elements. It is elementary! How hard is it to explain to kids that water is H2O and point to the chart? But no one does that. They introduce the chart late, making it scary and intimidating. What a loss...

 

I have introduced the concepts to my daughter, I just have never heard, until being on this forum of people, doing full courses of ONLY Chemistry this young. There are absolutely benefits - it's jut not something my brain has had to wrap around. LOL

[boscopup]

I have introduced the concepts to my daughter, I just have never heard, until being on this forum of people, doing full courses of ONLY Chemistry this young. There are absolutely benefits - it's jut not something my brain has had to wrap around. LOL

 

 

They're talking about elementary level chemistry, not high school chemistry. ;)

[PachiSusan]

They're talking about elementary level chemistry, not high school chemistry. ;)

 

 

Yes, I know. LOL I'm just saying that I never saw a full year of JUST Chemistry at this age. I thought it was an acoutrement.

[serendipitous journey]

Yes, I know. LOL I'm just saying that I never saw a full year of JUST Chemistry at this age. I thought it was an acoutrement.

 

 

Yes, I can totally see this! and many of the hardest-core science educators on the board don't do a full year of anything during elementary -- they do interest-led science, or many topics each year, or do the Apologia Exploring Creation series.

 

I myself really don't identify with the details of how the Well Trained Mind suggests teaching elementary science -- we don't get much retention from encyclopedias here (but great retention from DVDs, which WTM pooh-poohs), and trying the WTM method of reading the encyclopedia "spines" was killing Button's love of science -- but I kind of like the year of Chemistry, given the resources available & Button's interest in science.

[PachiSusan]

 

Yes, I can totally see this! and many of the hardest-core science educators on the board don't do a full year of anything during elementary -- they do interest-led science, or many topics each year, or do the Apologia Exploring Creation series.

 

I myself really don't identify with the details of how the Well Trained Mind suggests teaching elementary science -- we don't get much retention from encyclopedias here (but great retention from DVDs, which WTM pooh-poohs), and trying the WTM method of reading was killing Button's love of science -- but I kind of like the year of Chemistry, given the resources available & Button's interest in science.

 

Thank you for letting me see that I'm not a total freak here! LOL I do interest led science as a supplement.

[Alte Veste Academy]

Yes, I know. LOL I'm just saying that I never saw a full year of JUST Chemistry at this age. I thought it was an acoutrement.

 

Well, I agree with you there. We weave through all scientific disciplines year after year. All are related, after all. At the elementary level in particular, I find them inseparable, they flow so smoothly. I find the false stops of sticking to one branch unnecessarily disjointed.

[Crimson Wife]

I find the false stops of sticking to one branch unnecessarily disjointed.

 

And I find the random mish-mosh of topics approach to be ADDish. One of the things that appealed to me about WTM when I first read it back when my oldest was 4 & I was figuring out which HS philosophy to follow was that the 4 year cycle seemed so much more logical. I studied science in college, and while I did enroll concurrently in courses from different disciplines, I never took a class that was a just random assortment of topics from different disciplines.

[serendipitous journey]

WTM science cycle

 

I thought I'd toss the WTM cycle out onto the thread. It is designed to nominally reflect the history cycles, so we have

 

Biology (same years as Ancients, nominally 1st, 5th, and 9th)

Earth & Space (Middle Ages, 2nd, 6th, and 10th)

Chemistry (early modern, 3rd, 7th, and 11th)

Physics (modern, 4th, 8th, and 12th)

 

Now, this mapping of science onto history is arbitrary in the extreme. The ancients had, in many ways, a better grasp of astronomy than biology -- with thousands of years recording the positions of heavenly bodies & making predictions, astronomy was the most scientific field and had a strong element of mathematical rigor. And so on.

 

But there are more substantive critiques of this cycle:

1. A la Alte Veste above, many prefer to teach integrated science each year.

2. Esp. in middle and high school, it makes sense to teach Earth Science and Astronomy early in the cycle -- they are not terribly complex -- and to teach chemistry BEFORE biology, since much of modern biology relies on an understanding of chemical interactions. Physics could come before chemistry or after it, depending on what the demands of the program & the skills of the student are (how computational is the program? is algebra and/or calculus desired?)

 

The Well Trained Mind places history before science in importance in the elementary years, and both as secondary to developing strong reading, writing, and computational skills.

 

The main method is similar to that for history -- read a bit from a spine, narrate, do experiments from a separate experiment book, write the experiment up (for third-ish grade level at least) and maybe read topical books on the subject as you go. For chemistry, the recommended spines are Usborne's Internet-Linked First Encyclopedia of Science and also the Usborne Internet-Linked Science Encyclopedia, with Adventures with Atoms & Molecules Books 1 & 2 for experiments. Science is scheduled twice a week, 60-90 minutes each (remember to take this schedule with several grains of salt).

[crazyforlatin]

 

 

-- thanks for those ideas. How old is your child?

 

Second grader, but I already have RSO Level 1, so another elementary level would have been redundant. She's fascinated with the elements and does better with more in-depth study of certain subjects. For the first year, we did do an assortment, but between physics and chemistry for second grade, it seemed that the latter made more sense as a launching point.

 

[crazyforlatin]

I also have Basher's Periodic Table as an audiobook. It's a short listen, just over an hour, for those days when DD just wants to listen about the elements again.

[Alte Veste Academy]

And I find the random mish-mosh of topics approach to be ADDish. One of the things that appealed to me about WTM when I first read it back when my oldest was 4 & I was figuring out which HS philosophy to follow was that the 4 year cycle seemed so much more logical. I studied science in college, and while I did enroll concurrently in courses from different disciplines, I never took a class that was a just random assortment of topics from different disciplines.

 

But it is not the least bit random. There are connections at every turn. Integrating all the disciplines does not have to be a mish-mosh (although I will certainly grant you that it is presented randomly in most schools). A study of animals leads to adaptations leads to habitats leads to climate leads to weather leads to states of matter...or erosion... Not random at all! Maybe "stream of consciousness" would be an accurate way of describing it. There is no chemistry without earth science, no earth science without physics, no life science without earth science or chemistry...

 

Of course you have to separate disciplines in upper levels. There is so very much detailed information to teach/learn that it would be virtually impossible to teach them the way I am describing. And, naturally, people specialize. We need physicists, chemists, geologists, geneticists, etc.

 

ETA: In fairness, I probably did/do have ADD. :D I was the one in the single discipline science classes who would have loved to have the interrelationships pointed out. It would have made everything so much more interesting to me. But I am a big picture person. :)

[PachiSusan]

Thank you for this very detailed and informative post! I do understand the cycle better now.

 

I do agree with you that Chemistry is best done before Biology, but rarely done that way.

 

WTM science cycle

 

I thought I'd toss the WTM cycle out onto the thread. It is designed to nominally reflect the history cycles, so we have

 

Biology (same years as Ancients, nominally 1st, 5th, and 9th)

Earth & Space (Middle Ages, 2nd, 6th, and 10th)

Chemistry (early modern, 3rd, 7th, and 11th)

Physics (modern, 4th, 8th, and 12th)

 

Now, this mapping of science onto history is arbitrary in the extreme. The ancients had, in many ways, a better grasp of astronomy than biology -- with thousands of years recording the positions of heavenly bodies & making predictions, astronomy was the most scientific field and had a strong element of mathematical rigor. And so on.

 

But there are more substantive critiques of this cycle:

1. A la Alte Veste above, many prefer to teach integrated science each year.

2. Esp. in middle and high school, it makes sense to teach Earth Science and Astronomy early in the cycle -- they are not terribly complex -- and to teach chemistry BEFORE biology, since much of modern biology relies on an understanding of chemical interactions. Physics could come before chemistry or after it, depending on what the demands of the program & the skills of the student are (how computational is the program? is algebra and/or calculus desired?)

 

The Well Trained Mind places history before science in importance in the elementary years, and both as secondary to developing strong reading, writing, and computational skills.

 

The main method is similar to that for history -- read a bit from a spine, narrate, do experiments from a separate experiment book, write the experiment up (for third-ish grade level at least) and maybe read topical books on the subject as you go. For chemistry, the recommended spines are Usborne's Internet-Linked First Encyclopedia of Science and also the Usborne Internet-Linked Science Encyclopedia, with Adventures with Atoms & Molecules Books 1 & 2 for experiments. Science is scheduled twice a week, 60-90 minutes each (remember to take this schedule with several grains of salt).

[PachiSusan]

There are connections at every turn. Integrating all the disciplines does not have to be a mish-mosh (although I will certainly grant you that it is presented randomly in most schools). A study of animals leads to adaptations leads to habitats leads to climate leads to weather leads to states of matter...or erosion... Not random at all! Maybe "stream of consciousness" would be an accurate way of describing it. There is no chemistry without earth science, no earth science without physics, no life science without earth science or chemistry...

 

 

Yes!! I think that's what was bouncing around in my head - that science has so many disciplines and they all intertwine.

[Crimson Wife]

A study of animals leads to adaptations leads to habitats leads to climate leads to weather leads to states of matter...or erosion... Not random at all! Maybe "stream of consciousness" would be an accurate way of describing it. There is no chemistry without earth science, no earth science without physics, no life science without earth science or chemistry...

 

I was the one in the single discipline science classes who would have loved to have the interrelationships pointed out. It would have made everything so much more interesting to me. But I am a big picture person. :)

 

You would probably like Singapore My Pals Are Here! because it organizes its books into "themes". So the Systems book has the student learning about the plant transport system, human/plant/animal respiratory systems, the human circulatory system, cells, and then electrical circuits. Personally, I did not care for the way MPH is organized and so when I used it, I just did the chapters pertaining to life science one year and physics another.

[Thia]

I think one reason biology comes before chem in the higher levels is because of the needed math skills. Doing it that way allowed extra time to learn the math instead of the chem teacher teaching the science concept and the math skills to understand it.

[MissKNG]

Thank you for your list! My big girl is BEGGING for another Chemistry curriculum (we worked through NOEO Chemistry 1 last year). I am going to try and put something together and your list is great!!