HSLDA or another legal source?

[Alison in KY]

I was just wondering if anyone had ever had a problem with their homeschooling rights and they used alternative aid other than HSLDA. I'm considering joining HSLDA this year, for the first time, but I still have a few issues with them. I wish they were strickly for homeschool rights, but it seems like they are involved in so much more that I just don't know about joining them.

 

Has anyone here ever directly been helped by HSLDA or another source??

[Murphy101]

bump - also interested

[k10coon]

I haven't joined this group yet, but was considering

 

http://www.nheld.com/

[melmac]

your concerns, I've been debating this same thing as there is a small group in our town trying to stir trouble for homeschoolers.

 

Thanks!

[Alison in KY]

Well, I don't want to start a fight, but my biggest concern with them is that they are involved in so much more than just the protection of homeschool rights. If you go to their website and look at the info. or questions about them, the leaders of HSLDA are involved with colleges, Gen Joshua, and other things I really can't specfically think of right now. But it was more about politics not necessarily related directly to homeschooling but also related to Christian lifestyles. I'm a Christian, however, some of their viewpoints may not be shared by all Christians. The leaders pick certain political candidates to endorse based on the leaders viewpoint...at least that's what I gathered from glancing at the website. Anyway, all of that makes me a bit uneasy and I doubt I'm making much sense considering how tired I am at the moment. It's hard to put into words how I feel...to bad I didn't have WWE when I was a kid :)

 

Alison

[Misty]

We have homeschooled for almost 7 years and we have never joined HSLDA. Most homeschoolers do not join... In fact only 10-15% of homeschoolers do join HSLDA. HSLDA does not usually get involved in DHS cases. They have the option of accepting or refusing all legal cases. I also think that HSLDA will represent non-members, so that's something to think about (or investigate further).

 

There are other legal groups around the country that serve homeschoolers. .

 

Association of Homeschool Attorneys

http://www.ahsa-usa.org/main.php

 

National Home Education Legal Defense

http://www.nheld.com/

 

And here's some consumer information on HSLDA

http://homeschooling.gomilpitas.com/articles/102299.htm

 

I am not for or against HSLDA... We just never bothered to join. I do not have an opinion about HSLDA. I'm just passing on info that I have accumulated over the years from an on-line friend (Valerie Moon, News and Commentary Director of Home Education Magazine, owner of http://www.militaryhomeschoolers.com ) .

[wide eyes & laughter]

HSLDA is powerful enough to meet our needs and its organization is growing in reach and scope. Therefore, it would appear there is no reason to consider another organization for us. Respectfully, none of these programs (Gen Joshua, etc) offend us - at least based on our current knowledge of them.

 

In fact, I deeply appreciate seeing a conservative organization advancing in a pro-active way as with the program Gen Joshua - and backed by some great leaders like Mike Farris and Chris Klicka. Influencing homeschooled interested youth to participate in the civic arena - and perhaps we will see some of them as statesmen instead of politicians. At least that would be my hope.

 

HSLDA has been helpful to us in a personal way. I have emailed them with a question and rec'd a timely response which was helpful to me. I haven't needed legal representation - yet. However, I feel watched over and alerted w/emails as to potential threats to my homeschooling freedoms in MN as well as threats to other states & countries.

 

I can't say enough good about HSLDA. And I just wanted to throw in my 2cents about it~

 

:)Cheryl

[Ellie]

Attorneys are "regular" people, too, so of course HSLDA's attorneys will be involved in a variety of issues, including things not strictly homeschooling.

 

No one has the experience the attorneys at HSLDA have when it comes to homeschooling issues. They've been defending hsers since 1982. IMHO, their experience is invaluable.

[Alison in KY]

just looking for any more comments

[Murphy101]

My biggest gripe is that they are more like a lobbiest organization, and they are far too willling to wheel and deal with homeschooling rights, imo.

[autumndivona]

I am very anti-HSDLA, mostly because of their politics. I also feel that sometimes they do homeschoolers a disservice, by taking an issue about one thing and somehow flipping it around to an issue of homeschooling rights. Also, I just can't agree with the positions for which they lobby, their anti-gay sentiment, etc.

 

However, if you are seeking someone to protect or assist you legally, many states do have homeschool groups - not just a co-op, but an actual group involved in government and legal issues. In "The Link" homeschooling newspaper, they have a state resource page in pretty much every issue. Looking at it, I found the following in Kentucky:

 

Christian Home Educators of Kentucky (CHEK) - www.chek.org

 

According to the listing they are involved in legislation, child protection rights, protection resources, and Constitutional Rights defense.

 

I'm not sure how conservative or open they are, but there's one to check out. Also:

 

Central Kentucky Homeschool Association - www.geocities.com/ckchsa

 

They help homeschoolers with state law information and pass on legislative news.

 

I have checked both links to ensure that they are current. I hope one of these groups will be useful to you for anything you might need.

[Alison in KY]

Yeah, I guess a few of the problems I have with HSLDA is that their directors seem to do so much more...like have their hands in so many different pots, some of which I don't know that I would totally endorse. And when you start endorsing political candidates, well that's just so personal an issue. I know most of the people I homeschool with do join, and they are totally into the other issues, but I guess it just makes me uneasy. Some would probably be angry at me for even questioning HSLDA or Gen J or anything else they are involved in.

 

Do you feel it's taking a risk or okay in modern times to not join a legal group and to just follow the rules as you know it? My husband doesn't want to join HSLDA, he would rather just keep going like we are going and handle any issues as they arrive (basically banking on never having any issues).

 

Overall do you think in this day and age that problems with homeschoolers is less common, and that if you are doing things legally, as far as you know it then you'll be okay?

 

I guess I am assuming that common sense will prevail if we ever have an issue, however, if anyone has ever experienced any problems with homeschooling rights I would love to hear about it. Am I being too naive? Some homeschoolers around here seem to actually get angry with the government, DPP's, etc, but I'm not really like that. I dont' want to pick any fights and I sometimes worry that the more aggressive families who don't go along with the local authorities might make it worse on everyone else. I do not want to argue with anyone, but if there are some real, none heresay, negative stories that actually have happened recently then I'd love to know. Should I worry about being checked out by local DPP's or anyone else?

 

Wow, the scope of this has just changed. I hope to have some wonderful replies with no arguments

 

Thanks,

Alison in KY

[Alison in KY]

bump

[carolinagirl710]

They've been a great help to many in PA and to our family specifically. I'm sure it wouldn't suit everyone but we are thankful for them.

 

Elaine in PA

[autumndivona]

I think HSDLA is fine for some folks. But it is good that there are other

groups out there!

 

With regard to joining a legal group, someone with more experience can hopefully weigh in on that one. Personally, I don't feel the need to join such a group, but I do like to be aware of the local groups and make at least a few contacts within them.

 

It seems that most everything that comes up as a legal issue with homeschooling, tends to FIRST be attached to another issue entirely, such as child abuse. Hence, when homeschooling is dragged into the matter, it is really not at the heart of the matter - this is one of the things I feel HSDLA does, as with a recent case.

 

If you are aware of your state's laws and the local groups, you're probably in better shape than many people out there. I'm not sure about your state. Here in Delaware, the law is very simple and straightforward. No one from the government has ever bothered anyone I know here. Once a year, the local homeschooling legal association visits the legislative offices to deliver cookies and stickers to their senators and reps. Other than that, all is well and quiet on the homeschooling front.

[jentwo]

Alison,

Are you inquiring because of the current problems with the DPP in the Paducah area? I think several HSLDA members have contacted them now to voice concerns over the DPP trying to require more information than they are within legal limits to ask for.

 

I am in Illinois but I know there has been a lot of talk about the issues KY DPP is stirring up this year.

 

FWIW I am not an HSLDA member but have considered it for various reasons. At this time I feel confident enough in my own legal knowledge to defend myself if need be.

[Amy in NY]

... and they are far too willing to wheel and deal with homeschooling rights, imo.

 

I've had to use them and, from my experience, I agree with the above statement.

 

However, given the cost of an attorney, there is no alternative for our family. After what we went through, which was really minor in the grand scheme of things, I wouldn't homeschool without them in NY.

[Alison in KY]

Yes, the Paducah City DPP asking for more than required is what started my post, however, I've always been curious. Alot of homeschoolers in the area use and endorse HSLDA, but not all of us of course. I'm in the county by the way, so I haven't heard of anything different going on here. Are you close Jen?

 

Amy? Sorry, how quickly I forget names. Would you mind sharing your problem and how HSLDA helped you.

 

And FWIW, I've never heard of anyone having a problem in our area either. I have heard of local cases, like we are experiencing now, however none of that has turned into an actual investigation of anyone that I know of, or at least I haven't heard of an investigation in the past 4 years since I've been homeschooling.

[Murphy101]

Alot of homeschoolers in the area use and endorse HSLDA, but not all of us of course.

 

Amy? Sorry, how quickly I forget names. Would you mind sharing your problem and how HSLDA helped you.

 

 

I don't think most people can truely endorse HSLDA unless they've actually benefitted from using their services? I think they simply endorse it because A. it's the most common and B. the most widely advertised and C. they simply repeat what they've been told/read.

 

I think it is VERY important to note that paying for HSLDA memebership does NOT in any way shape or form guarantee you an attorney. They are very selective about what cases they will take, under what circumstances they will fight them, and who they will fight for. And if they take your case, your view of what rights they should fight for and not be willing to budge on will come second to their goal in taking the case. So you might win, but loose some ground for yourself and others.

 

I've never used HSLDA, but this is the take I have after years of reading their own advertisements and e-lerts on cases they've handled.

 

Oh and I doubt Amy can comment on specifics? If she can, that'd be great, but it's a pretty standard legal clause contract that clients can't complain in any manner that might be conscrued as slanderous. I do NOT know if HSLDA requires such a clause, just saying my dh has to get a LOT of legal clearance in his line of work (he's NOT an attorney) and that's always part of the package.

[Murphy101]

Might I recommend that if one wants genuine legal insurance, that is what they buy? such as Hyatt Legal maybe?

[Gretchen in NJ]

I joined HSLDA on the advice of my local homeschool group. It was great that we did. I have a neighbor who called CPS the very 1st year we homeschooled to report that our children were not in school. They call on us every September.

 

Well, last year for the 1st time CPS came a knocking on my front door. It was the scariest momment in my life. My first phone call was to HSLDA. I had a lawyer on the phone in 15 minutes. They helped protect our 4th Amendment rights.

 

CPS sent nasty evil anti-homeschooling neighbor a letter saying that we were all fine here.

 

As a side note (HSLDA had nothing to do with the following):

A few months later, nasty evil anti-homeschooling neighbor put their house on the market. They just moved out last month! Yea!

[Murphy101]

I joined HSLDA on the advice of my local homeschool group. It was great that we did. I have a neighbor who called CPS the very 1st year we homeschooled to report that our children were not in school. They call on us every September.

 

Well, last year for the 1st time CPS came a knocking on my front door. It was the scariest momment in my life. My first phone call was to HSLDA. I had a lawyer on the phone in 15 minutes. They helped protect our 4th Amendment rights.

 

CPS sent nasty evil anti-homeschooling neighbor a letter saying that we were all fine here.

 

As a side note (HSLDA had nothing to do with the following):

A few months later, nasty evil anti-homeschooling neighbor put their house on the market. They just moved out last month! Yea!

 

Awesome! I don't want to discount that these things most certainly do happen and one is mighty glad ot have a heavy hand backing them up when it does.:D

 

My only effort here is to hope that people understand what they are getting with HSLDA. For some reason, everyone seems to think they are getting some kind of guaranteed attorney service and that is NOT what HSLDA is, kwim? That's why I say they are a lobbiest organization FIRST.

[Gretchen in NJ]

Awesome! I don't want to discount that these things most certainly do happen and one is mighty glad ot have a heavy hand backing them up when it does.:D

 

My only effort here is to hope that people understand what they are getting with HSLDA. For some reason, everyone seems to think they are getting some kind of guaranteed attorney service and that is NOT what HSLDA is, kwim? That's why I say they are a lobbiest organization FIRST.

 

From what I understand, they do not take cases involving divorces and child abuse. I believe if it involves a homeschooling issue or a 4th amendment issue they will give you attorney services.

[phathui5]

Even as a conservative Christian, I would not be comfortable supporting HSLDA financially. There's too much mixing of causes going on. For example, I would be fine with leaders of HSLDA being involved in other organizations, but I am not happy when I get emails directly from HSLDA about us needing to defend "parents rights" in regard to hitting children or "save marriage" by stopping gays from marrying. Those things are unrelated to homeschooling.

[Parrothead]

We are members. I've had to ask a few questions via email and have always gotten a prompt response.

 

While I don't agree with all their politics, I agree with most. I can over look the things I don't agree with because I like using the form at the beginning of the years that has Home School Legal Defense on it.

 

HSLDA is one of the few name brands I pay for.

[Ellie]

Awesome! I don't want to discount that these things most certainly do happen and one is mighty glad ot have a heavy hand backing them up when it does.:D

 

My only effort here is to hope that people understand what they are getting with HSLDA. For some reason, everyone seems to think they are getting some kind of guaranteed attorney service and that is NOT what HSLDA is, kwim? That's why I say they are a lobbiest organization FIRST.

 

I would have to disagree about HSLDA's being a lobbiest organization first. The attorneys of HSLDA are not lobbiests by any stretch of the imagination. They are defenders of homeschoolers, first and foremost. They stay up on legislation, and will contact legislators on issues which affect homeschooling (or parenting, which also affects homeschooling, yes?), but they do not *lobby.*

 

HSLDA members will get legal advice and representation on *homeschooling* issues. That some people think they should also get legal advice and representation on things such as divorce/child custody is not HSLDA's fault.

[Gretchen in NJ]

I would have to disagree about HSLDA's being a lobbiest organization first. The attorneys of HSLDA are not lobbiests by any stretch of the imagination. They are defenders of homeschoolers, first and foremost. They stay up on legislation, and will contact legislators on issues which affect homeschooling (or parenting, which also affects homeschooling, yes?), but they do not *lobby.*

 

HSLDA members will get legal advice and representation on *homeschooling* issues. That some people think they should also get legal advice and representation on things such as divorce/child custody is not HSLDA's fault.

 

:iagree: with Ellie. I am so very glad to have them on my side. The Rights of the Parent have a direct effect on homeschooling. Just look at what is happenning in Germany. Most all of the court cases state that the child has a right to a public education or the right of the State to educate the child and the parents have no rights in this regard.

 

This is why HSLDA has takin on this issue: not to promote spanking the child.

[jentwo]

Yes, the Paducah City DPP asking for more than required is what started my post, however, I've always been curious. Alot of homeschoolers in the area use and endorse HSLDA, but not all of us of course. I'm in the county by the way, so I haven't heard of anything different going on here. Are you close Jen?

 

 

Yes, I am north of you in Illinois. I am on the 3Rivers yahoo list and there's been a lot of talk about the DPP letters and I know that there are at least three HSLDA members that have contacted them for legal assistance for your county.

 

A similar thing happened last year in Williamson Co, IL (next to me). The truancy officers were showing up at the homes demanding to see all of the same things that your DPP is asking for this year.

[Gretchen in NJ]

Here is an example of a Parent Rights issue:

Australian Parents Furious at Mandatory-Food Policy

 

Australian parents are wondering “what’s next?†after the government implemented a new childcare center policy that restricts the types of food they can put in their children’s lunchboxes.

The program, called Good for Kids, Good for Life, was recently implemented at more than 300 preschools and day-care centers in the Hunter New England area of Australia to combat childhood obesity. Not only have foods high in fat, salt, and sugar been banned from meals and snacks, but even fruit has been limited: sultanas raisins to one, three-quarter-tablespoon portion, and apples to a half-sized serving.

The government initiative also requires childcare staff to conduct lunchbox audits to ensure that parents comply with strict food policies.

That leaves parents, like mother of three Tania Puxty, in a quandary.

She says she doesn’t have a problem with recommendations for healthy food options, but “lunchbox Nazis†limiting her child’s food intake is going too far. Her three-year-old son, Mason, will not eat his food unless he has a whole piece of fruit or a sandwich containing fillings that he likes. “It’s basically a diet they’re putting them on, and I don’t want my three-year-old children on a diet.â€

When she voiced her concerns, Puxty says she was told that the day care center could lose its license if it did not enforce the new policy. She has also been told by a program representative that if she continued to pack unauthorized food, they would need to sit down one-on-one with her to fix her kids’ eating problems.

 

[asta]

I would have to disagree about HSLDA's being a lobbiest organization first. The attorneys of HSLDA are not lobbiests by any stretch of the imagination. They are defenders of homeschoolers, first and foremost. They stay up on legislation, and will contact legislators on issues which affect homeschooling (or parenting, which also affects homeschooling, yes?), but they do not *lobby.*

 

HSLDA members will get legal advice and representation on *homeschooling* issues. That some people think they should also get legal advice and representation on things such as divorce/child custody is not HSLDA's fault.

 

I was just looking on their site, and I'm sorry to tell you, but they have their own PAC (Political Action Committee). That is lobbying.

 

HSLDA advocates on Capitol Hill by tracking federal legislation that affects homeschooling and parental rights. HSLDA works to defeat or amend harmful bills, but also works proactively, introducing legislation to protect and preserve family freedoms.

 

HSLDA advocates in state legislatures, at the invitation of state homeschool organizations, by assisting individual states in drafting language to improve their homeschool legal environment and to fight harmful legislation.

 

and under another section:

 

All candidate campaign activity is funded by HSLDA-PAC, an affiliated federal political action committee created by HSLDA in accordance with federal law. Under federal law, HSLDA may endorse federal candidates in communications to our members and we may solicit our members for contributions to HSLDA-PAC. These PAC contributions will be used to place Generation Joshua teens on selected federal campaigns under the direction and guidance of Generation Joshua staff.

 

 

a

 

(p.s. Georgia has their own group called HEIR)

[Alison in KY]

Wow, one of my threads was re-vived :001_smile:.

 

Alison

[asta]

Wow, one of my threads was re-vived :001_smile:.

 

Alison

 

Heh - that's what you get when people use the search engine.

 

 

a

[Elaine]

I would have to disagree about HSLDA's being a lobbiest organization first. The attorneys of HSLDA are not lobbiests by any stretch of the imagination. They are defenders of homeschoolers, first and foremost. They stay up on legislation, and will contact legislators on issues which affect homeschooling (or parenting, which also affects homeschooling, yes?), but they do not *lobby.*

 

HSLDA members will get legal advice and representation on *homeschooling* issues. That some people think they should also get legal advice and representation on things such as divorce/child custody is not HSLDA's fault.

 

:iagree: Joining HSLDA is a very inexpensive way of buying peace of mind. I don't have a spare 10K sitting around to defend myself should I need an attorney.

 

When we first began homeschooling, I had a truant officer knock on my door. He wanted to come into my house and I told him that he wasn't allowed to. He told me he was and I told him I was going to call my attorney. I called HSLDA and they asked to speak with the man.

 

After a few minutes, he said, "OK." Hung up the phone, apologized for bothering me and I never heard from him again. I am glad that HSLDA was there.

[Impish]

I have a membership. And I've been extremely disappointed. I was promised by the head of the Canadian HSLDA that I would be getting assistance, and then after I sent in my $, haven't even had the courtesy of a returned phone call, and the information he had given me prior to my sending in funds was suddenly all false. Extremely disappointed.

 

My situation had to do with if WCB could force me into attendance to a daytime program for their convenience, since my work hours were always 3-11 pm specifically to accommodate homeschooling. HSLDA lawyer was in a frenzy, telling me oh no, they couldn't, etc, that he would be able to do something about that, that my province had hsing as a protected right...Uh huh. Come to discover that its NOT a protected right at all in my province. Found that out on my own, after I didn't even get a call back from the attorney. I offered to lodge a Human Rights case, etc, allow my situation to be used...nada.

 

Just very disappointed. Will I renew? Why? Maybe if I were to move to a less hsing friendly province, but not staying here in AB.

[Pamela H in Texas]

(haven't read through posts yet)

 

Is there a particular reason that you are wanting to join HSLDA or something like it? Have you fully evaluated your reason?

 

These are more rhetorical.

 

ETA: Nevermind. I see this is very old. Generally, I simply advise people to not give into fear and to do their research. Obviously I don't support them. This is one of the few things I'm in the majority on :)

Edited May 31, 2009 by 2J5M9K

[Murphy101]

thanks asta!:iagree:

[gardening momma]

I have a membership. And I've been extremely disappointed. I was promised by the head of the Canadian HSLDA that I would be getting assistance, and then after I sent in my $, haven't even had the courtesy of a returned phone call, and the information he had given me prior to my sending in funds was suddenly all false. Extremely disappointed.

 

My situation had to do with if WCB could force me into attendance to a daytime program for their convenience, since my work hours were always 3-11 pm specifically to accommodate homeschooling. HSLDA lawyer was in a frenzy, telling me oh no, they couldn't, etc, that he would be able to do something about that, that my province had hsing as a protected right...Uh huh. Come to discover that its NOT a protected right at all in my province. Found that out on my own, after I didn't even get a call back from the attorney. I offered to lodge a Human Rights case, etc, allow my situation to be used...nada.

I didn't think they took cases that occur prior to becoming a member--not sure how it works, but I thought you had to be a member first? Not have an active case or problem, then join and get representation?

[eaglei]

We have been members of HSLDA since the year before we actually began homeschooling, so for quite awhile. I agree with the poster who said it is well worth the peace of mind. Also, the first few years we homeschooled the school board contacted us not-so-nicely and we were very relieved to have HSLDA speak for us. The board left us alone for a few years then contacted us again two years in a row with false information and with faulty *knowledge* of the state homeschooling law. Again, we contacted HSLDA and the school board has not bothered us since. We have been very pleased with HSLDA's services.

[Impish]

I called first to see if it was something that they would be able to represent, since being on a tight budget, a membership wasn't something I could justify without being sure. I spoke with the lawyer, and he assured me that indeed, yes, he could and would ABSOLUTELY be able to take it on and would absolutely be able to do something about it for me. Once membership fees were processed, I couldn't even get a call back...even the secretary was shocked when I told her he hadn't returned my calls. I called BEFORE it was going to be a problem, it was something coming up on the horizon, I hadn't been actually forced into a day program yet...the attorney assured me that HSLDA would be able to prevent my being forced into a day program and putting my dd's hsing at risk. Turned out, they didn't even return a call, let alone do work on our behalf.