Who is LLATL best suited for?

[Marie131]

It seems people either love or hate LLATL. I like the looks of it but wonder how it would suit our family. What type of teacher and student is this curriculum best suited for?

[Lily_Grace]

IMO, for ones who want to skip book studies.

[LMD]

Which levels are you talking about OP? I've used & liked blue, red & yellow.I like it because it is gentle, easy to implement, covers a lot. For the most part, I really have loved the literature books. My kids enjoy it too, they have retained the information well, enjoyed the little activities.

If you want a fun, gentle, all in one (though I did supplement) open & go LA then it's worth a look imo.

 

[Elfknitter.#]

IMO, for ones who want to skip book studies.

 

That's a bit blanketed and general....

 

We're currently using LLATL Red for ds 1. He seems to respond best to short and quick kinds of lessons. I thought Primary Language Lessons would have been fine (and I did note progress) but he wasn't happy with it. I acquired CWP and LLATL. He seems to prefer LLATL, so in respone to his needs, that what we're going with. However, it doesn't prohibit us from a handwriting or spelling program. As we already have read alouds, I don't feel shorted a book study.

[Susie in MS]

For those who do not want extreme rigor of the typical grammar program, and see that most children can learn without having to label 30 sentences per day.

For those who like mini unit study type book studies.

For those who feel it is more important to cover patterns in words than to have 20-30 words per week on a spelling list.

For those who don't mind supplementing IF their child is behind in an area.

For highschool --for those who do not feel the need to have grammar every year and see writing and lit to be more important at this stage.

[elizabeth rose]

I love it. It works here because it includes so much in such a gentle way. My oldest is in orange and she is doing the book study for boxcar children right now. If that isn't a book study, I don't know what is. My younger is in red and we enjoy that also. I love lit here and that is why it appeals to me. With my teen who is now I high school, we always used rod and staff and that never included literature aside from some poetry. It was rigorous to the point of exhaustion. For my youngest I wanted something totally different.

[Marie131]

Which levels are you talking about OP? I've used & liked blue, red & yellow.I like it because it is gentle, easy to implement, covers a lot. For the most part, I really have loved the literature books. My kids enjoy it too, they have retained the information well, enjoyed the little activities.

If you want a fun, gentle, all in one (though I did supplement) open & go LA then it's worth a look imo.

 

I am thinking of yellow or orange for my oldest and maybe blue for my younger ds but I have a phonics program that is working so I migh carry on with that and start him in llatl later if I like it.

 

It sounds like LLATL might be well suited for us. My oldest ds is workbook phobic, I don't feel a lot of rigour is necessary in these early years, I love literature and want something that is all in one and isn't going to take up our whole day. Is LLATL teacher intensive?

[LMD]

Blue & red are teacher intensive, but the lessons are short. Almost anything at that age is though imo.

 

Yellow can be fairly independent, just discussion questions now & then. I believe that higher than yellow can be done almost independently, but I don't know that first hand.

[Susie in MS]

Is LLATL teacher intensive?

 

The blue and red levels are.

[Mrs. Lilac]

I've been looking at LLATL too- which parts of LA does it cover? Does it provide enough writing instruction?

[morningcoffee]

I am thinking of yellow or orange for my oldest and maybe blue for my younger ds but I have a phonics program that is working so I migh carry on with that and start him in llatl later if I like it.

 

It sounds like LLATL might be well suited for us. My oldest ds is workbook phobic, I don't feel a lot of rigour is necessary in these early years, I love literature and want something that is all in one and isn't going to take up our whole day. Is LLATL teacher intensive?

 

I found the blue's phonic program a little shallow so we continued our own simple phonics review alongside that year's LLATL and that worked well.

 

I've used blue, red, yellow, orange and part of purple. As you would expect for lower elementary, the blue and red levels are definitely teacher driven. From memory... although the middle elementary levels could have been more independent, some of the directions were still contained in the teacher's manual and it was not always predictable as to when you (the teacher) would be needed. With something like Rod and Staff, it was predictable. I knew I would teach the lesson from the TM and then set the independent work. LLATL is very different. Just mentioning because that might be an issue.

 

Yellow would be one of my favorite levels and orange had some nice units in it, including a lovely one on poetry.

 

I think LLATL is best suited to families who are happy with a very gentle introduction to grammar and writing, who don't mind a few varied activities and who are willing to supplement as needed.

[morningcoffee]

I've been looking at LLATL too- which parts of LA does it cover? Does it provide enough writing instruction?

 

LLATL includes vocabulary, grammar, phonics, book studies, copywork/ dictation, writing activities and (some) spelling.

 

 

It is hard to answer the question of writing instruction. I think LLATL is consistent with Ruth Beechick's ideas so it's not going to contain the same explicit and logical writing instruction that is found in Rod and Staff or BJU.

 

You will need a writing curriculum to use alongside LLATL at some stage but it will vary between families as to when they feel this need. We definitely needed something by the orange or purple level. Hope this makes sense :)

 

We have only used up to purple so I can't comment on the higher levels.

[Marie131]

Thanks for all the feedback. LLATL is a curriculum that I want to try sometime or in our homeschool journey and from the sounds of things, yellow may be a good place to start.

[Kyr]

re the writing part, yeah, the philosophy seems to be that if you regularly expose children to examples of strong writing then they will naturally emulate that and need little formal writing instruction. I personally know a family that had that experience. Her children entered public school at the high school level with no writing instruction other than what is in LLATL and did amazingly well. Top of their classes.

 

My children are a few years younger and I inherited her books when she moved on. My experience is that my children need more direct writing instruction. Despite the copious amount of fine literature that have read or had read to them, left to their own devices they tend to emulate Captain Underpants. :glare:

 

That said I do still like the books. IME the more things something tried to do the less it does really well. As an overview, it works well. If you need more in depth work in a given area you will probably need to supplement.

[poiema]

Here are my thoughts on LLATL, for what they are worth. We have only used red and yellow.

 

In general, what I like about LLATL is that it covers everything. You can use it as a stand-alone if you want a gentle, incremental approach. And if you choose to supplement, the lessons are short enough that LA still will not take all day to complete.

 

One thing to consider though is that the books are known to be a little behind grade level, so make sure you look at the samples and Scope and Sequence when deciding. Yellow book, for example, is supposed to be 3rd grade, but I am using it with a 6.5yo working at 2nd grade level. I found this to be a common thing among reviews that I read online.

 

With that said, my son can do almost everything independently in the yellow book, but I like go through it with him as much as I can. His student activity book says "discussion with teacher" when I am supposed to be involved, so he lets me know that I'm supposed to "do something" if I am busy with his brother. There is writing instruction, but I can see why some might supplement with a more rigorous writing program.

 

The red book is much more teacher intensive and has a lot of cut-out activities to do. If a child is already reading well it is pretty much a waste of time IMO. We had to skip a large amount of the lessons and activities because they used readers that I didn't purchase because my ds was already a good reader. I won't be using the red book with my 2nd ds for that reason. But if your 5yo is an emergent reader, then the red book might be a good fit. The activities we did do were fun.

 

Last year I did supplement a lot, partly because we skipped so much and partly because I thought language arts had to be more intensive. We did FLL1 and half of FLL2, handwriting, spelling, journaling, as well as some extra grammar and reading comp workbooks. This year, the only extra LA ds does is a daily language practice journal (because I already had it and I hate to waste it), journaling, occasionally FLL2 (because we have it), and an occasional worksheet or Brain Pop Jr if I find something that looks worthwhile. And reading of course!

 

HTH

[fairy4tmama]

Ok this sounds like it might be just what I have been looking forbut I am wondering do I NEED the student books or would it be possible to use just the TM and have DC write in comp books? From the sample it looks like the student book is not needed... I am looking at the orange level or maybe yellow.

 

thanks

[poiema]

Ok this sounds like it might be just what I have been looking forbut I am wondering do I NEED the student books or would it be possible to use just the TM and have DC write in comp books? From the sample it looks like the student book is not needed... I am looking at the orange level or maybe yellow.

 

thanks

 

You probably could get away with just getting the TM, especially if you do most of the lesson orally, which we sometimes do anyway. You could even photocopy the handwriting pages and assessments from the TM. The only thing I can see that is really missing from the TM are the enrichment activities, and those are actually my ds's favorite part. In the yellow book, the enrichment activities are things like reading a pair of words and deciding how they are related, and spelling activities like scrambles and crossword puzzles. But I'm sure you could find a way to supplement. Obviously, it's easier to have the student book, especially if you want dc to work somewhat independently, but it's worth a shot to try out just the TM because you could always decide to get the student book later if you wanted.

 

ETA: I just remembered that the yellow book also has word cards in the back for just a few activities. I didn't even know this until yesterday when we used them for the first time. For yesterday's activity we used the word cards with nouns and adjectives and played a matching-type game. After that, the cards are not used again until week 26, 32, and 36 and they include more noun/adjective cards, antonyms, and verb tense. But the words are listed in the TM so you could just write them out.

[LMD]

I wouldn't skip the students manual myself, I used it more than the TM, even in yellow. I did supplement too, blue & ETC, red & WWE1, yellow & CW primers.

[fairy4tmama]

Thanks, Fireproof anb LMD, that makes sense. I scored a TM for 4 bucks (woohoo) and I from looking at the sample I couldn't tell if the student book had anything the TM did not. I am excited to give this curriculum a try!

[Susie in MS]

For Red and Blue you must have the student wkbk. You also need the readers. For the blue level there is also a student pack which has the paper dice, etc you will need. It can be bought separately at Rock Solid Inc.

 

Yellow on up are different. You can get away without the wkbk, but you will miss somethings.

 

Gold levels the TM and the SM are one in the same.

[Susie in MS]

 

 

One thing to consider though is that the books are known to be a little behind grade level, so make sure you look at the samples and Scope and Sequence when deciding. Yellow book, for example, is supposed to be 3rd grade, but I am using it with a 6.5yo working at 2nd grade level. I found this to be a common thing among reviews that I read online.

 

 

 

 

Woah! I am seriously trying to picture my 7.5 yo using the Yellow book at 6.5 and-- no way, no how! LOL She is in the Red book now, and I still scale down the writing part of it for her. The reading is easy, but we always are doing extra reading anyway. Though when you get up in the levels a bit, I do agree that some of it can be used a year ahead with no problems.

[jmccumbers]

As far as needing the teacher book vs. the student book, I have to say that I prefer the old spiral bound books that were around before the student books even came out. Granted, I've only used the Red book this way and looked through the Purple one, but they seem MUCH more Ruth Beechick-like than the newer editions. Plus, you can find them super cheap! My son would have hated all the cutting and pasting busy work in the newer edition of the red book, but the old one is just what I was looking for. We alternate the Red book with WWE level 2 each week. On our Red book week, we do 2 weeks of work in one, normally.

 

Just a completely different suggestion...

[elizabeth rose]

I agree, the levels are not belle grade level IMO. The actual books you read may be, but its what you do with the books that makes the program.

[Elfknitter.#]

Woah! I am seriously trying to picture my 7.5 yo using the Yellow book at 6.5 and-- no way, no how! LOL She is in the Red book now, and I still scale down the writing part of it for her. The reading is easy, but we always are doing extra reading anyway. Though when you get up in the levels a bit, I do agree that some of it can be used a year ahead with no problems.

I agree, the levels are not belle grade level IMO. The actual books you read may be, but its what you do with the books that makes the program.

 

:iagree So far, I'm finding the red book to be on grade level. I wonder if it is because the lessons aree so short and not constant drilling that gives the perception that they are lower than listed grade.

 

As far as needing the teacher book vs. the student book, I have to say that I prefer the old spiral bound books that were around before the student books even came out. Granted, I've only used the Red book this way and looked through the Purple one, but they seem MUCH more Ruth Beechick-like than the newer editions. Plus, you can find them super cheap! My son would have hated all the cutting and pasting busy work in the newer edition of the red book, but the old one is just what I was looking for. We alternate the Red book with WWE level 2 each week. On our Red book week, we do 2 weeks of work in one, normally.

Just a completely different suggestion...

 

Interesting. I have wondered about the spiral bound copies. FWIW, instead of all the cutting and pasting, we simple use a whiteboard or do the activity orally.

[fairy4tmama]

So the old spiral version of reb and blue do not have a student book associated with them hmmm...to be honest I really like our current set up of using comp books and while I can see transistioning my 4th grader to a wb I am not keen to do so with my now 2nd grader.

[LindaOz]

I agree, the levels are not belle grade level IMO. The actual books you read may be, but its what you do with the books that makes the program.

 

 

Agreed! There is so much more to it than just the books that are read.

[LindaOz]

So the old spiral version of reb and blue do not have a student book associated with them hmmm...to be honest I really like our current set up of using comp books and while I can see transistioning my 4th grader to a wb I am not keen to do so with my now 2nd grader.

 

 

Even the higher books had old spiral versions at one stage. You might be able to find old editions on ebay.

 

ETA: Actually, there is one here... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Learning-Language-Arts-through-Literature-1990-Paperback-/150979551046?pt=US_Texbook_Education&hash=item2327151f46

 

and another here...

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/LEARNING-LANGUAGE-ARTS-THROUGH-LITERATURE-2ND-GRADE-3-BOOKS-/261143360434?pt=US_Texbook_Education&hash=item3ccd5b73b2

[mom@shiloh]

I've used the older editions and the newer ones and hands-down I like the old ones better. The new ones are very workbooky. In the old ones, we'd begin the week with copywork, then do a different activity or discussion every day surrounding that copywork and finish up the week using that copywork for dictation (3rd grade and up). Using the old editions, I would probably add a grammar program in 5th grade and then do a grammar review in 7th or 8th, and maybe again in high school, depending on how well I thought my child knew it. Then, I might also add something else for writing at the jr. high or high school level.

 

I've found the old versions at paperbackswap.

[Donna A.]

I've used the older editions and the newer ones and hands-down I like the old ones better. The new ones are very workbooky. In the old ones, we'd begin the week with copywork, then do a different activity or discussion every day surrounding that copywork and finish up the week using that copywork for dictation (3rd grade and up). Using the old editions, I would probably add a grammar program in 5th grade and then do a grammar review in 7th or 8th, and maybe again in high school, depending on how well I thought my child knew it. Then, I might also add something else for writing at the jr. high or high school level.

 

I've found the old versions at paperbackswap.

 

That's interesting. I haven't ever seen the old versions, but what you described is *exactly* how My Father's World schedules language arts all the way through their curriculum. They use PLL and ILL from 2nd-6th grades, adding a "formal" grammar (learning the names of the parts of speech) workbook in 6th or 7th, and using a very gentle writing program from about 4th grade on. But in addition to that, you've got the copywork, dictation, memory work, etc. scheduled on the weekly grid each year (which are based on the Bible and history lessons). High school includes "light" grammar review, with a LOT of writing.

[poiema]

I agree, the levels are not belle grade level IMO. The actual books you read may be, but its what you do with the books that makes the program.

 

Agreed! There is so much more to it than just the books that are read.

 

:confused1:

I'm not talking about the reading level of the books used in the book studies, I'm talking about the actual LLATL lessons and daily activities. If there is something "more" that we are suppose to be doing in addition to reading the books, having discussions, and doing the workbook then, yeah, I guess I am missing something. When I was deciding whether to use LLATL, I read several reviews warning people that it is below grade level. And after using red and yellow, and perusing through purple, I completely agree. I am not trying to model our homeschool after public school, but comparing LLATL with what kids are doing in PS, and even comparing it to other homeschooling curricula I have seen, I am seriously confused at how this is even debatable. If this works for you at grade level, that's great. I just suggested that people look at samples and S&S, and decide for themselves. I am really glad I read reviews and looked at samples before ordering because I would have been really disappointed if I had ordered at grade level. I really like LLATL, but I always assumed that this was the reason it has a bad reputation.

[Donna A.]

My understanding is that LLATL really steps up at the Green level. I *almost* bought either that or Gray for my middle schooler this year (I hadn't decided yet which one), but decided to go another route with her. However, I'm still considering LLATL for my youngest.

 

I agree that the lower levels of LLATL are really gentle. I guess it depends on one's philosophy of how language arts ought to be done in those early years as to whether it's "enough" for you or not. I'm in the "take it slower" camp for the early years, picking up the pace around 4th or 5th grade, and then again around 7th grade or so.

[LMD]

Woah! I am seriously trying to picture my 7.5 yo using the Yellow book at 6.5 and-- no way, no how! LOL She is in the Red book now, and I still scale down the writing part of it for her. The reading is easy, but we always are doing extra reading anyway. Though when you get up in the levels a bit, I do agree that some of it can be used a year ahead with no problems.

 

My DD is accelerated and we just finished the Yellow book, she's 7.5 now. Like PP I used Yellow for 2nd grade, she loved it, didn't struggle at all.

[elizsharp]

We are currently loving LLATL here. First choice of curriculum that I really liked. My son likes the lessons (as much as can be expected) since they are short and activity based. Yet he gains quite a bit of knowledge which is a nice change. We are doing the red level for him since he's 6 which I think is one level ahead. The activities appear to be on grade level but the reading is slightly ahead although not so much that he can't get through it.

[fairy4tmama]

A question for those of you who have used the spiral editions, do I need to purchase the readers if I get a spiral edition of red? And if so are the readers the same now?

[mom@shiloh]

This is a good question. I could be wrong, but I'm thinking that the earlier versions, the spiral ones, didn't really teach phonics or reading. Maybe that is one of the reasons it was revamped because the current versions do include quite a bit of reading instruction. So, the older versions use copywork to deal with mechanics and do cover some phonics instruction, but from what I remember it probably isn't a complete phonics/reading program.

[jmccumbers]

A question for those of you who have used the spiral editions, do I need to purchase the readers if I get a spiral edition of red? And if so are the readers the same now?

 

The old spiral edition of red does not use the readers from the newer editions at all. It does have some phonics instruction, but I also use Explode the Code. I'll type out part of what a sample week looks like just to give you an idea. Honestly, you can get these so cheap, it may be worth getting one just to see if it's what you're looking for. I think I paid $2 for mine.

 

Lesson Eight

 

Come over to my house.

I live on a boat.

I live in a city

of houses that float.

 

1. Read the passage with your teacher. Copy these sentences from the model, or write them from dictation. Compare your copy to the model and make corrections.

 

2. a. There is a rule you have probably heard that helps you remember what certain letters say. Here is the rule:

 

When two vowels go walking, the first one does the talking and says his long name.

 

There are two words in this verse that use this rule. Can you find them? Please underline those two words.

 

b. The letters oa go together to make the long o vowel sound. Remembering this- try to write these words or spell them aloud as your teacher says them:

boat, coat, goat, moat, float, oats

 

3. a. One way we can put words in order is by alphabetical order. ...(more about abc order)...

 

b. Take your list of oa words and put them in ABC order.

 

Day 4 is about the hard and soft sounds of 'c' and having kids try to discover the rule for which sound it will make.

 

Day 5 talks about the many places people live and asks the student to write a story of a few sentences that tells where they would live if they could live any where for a day.

 

 

The very back of the book has pages to copy where the student can mark up the lesson or if there is a lesson with cards to cut out and such.

 

[Marie131]

I've used the older editions and the newer ones and hands-down I like the old ones better. The new ones are very workbooky. In the old ones, we'd begin the week with copywork, then do a different activity or discussion every day surrounding that copywork and finish up the week using that copywork for dictation (3rd grade and up). Using the old editions, I would probably add a grammar program in 5th grade and then do a grammar review in 7th or 8th, and maybe again in high school, depending on how well I thought my child knew it. Then, I might also add something else for writing at the jr. high or high school level.

 

I've found the old versions at paperbackswap.

 

Uh oh, the new versions are workbooky? That won't work for my guy at all. Would you say they are VERY workbooky? A bit of workbook is fine, but if it is heavily workbook oriented my ds will revolt! Lol :)

[Susie in MS]

Uh oh, the new versions are workbooky? That won't work for my guy at all. Would you say they are VERY workbooky? A bit of workbook is fine, but if it is heavily workbook oriented my ds will revolt! Lol :)

 

 

In my opinion, no. It is a workbook to be sure, but only enough for convenience sake. You won't find your child labeling sentences all day long like with other programs. I am not sure if you have seen the samples . They are very good representations of what to expect. Also, just in case you don't know (this is a very common source of confusion) each lesson is a whole weeks work. Under each lesson you will see the days numbered, but it won't say the word *day*. Maybe you can print up the sample lesson of your choice and try it out to see if it is more workbook than you are looking for.

[Susie in MS]

Uh oh, the new versions are workbooky? That won't work for my guy at all. Would you say they are VERY workbooky? A bit of workbook is fine, but if it is heavily workbook oriented my ds will revolt! Lol :)

 

 

In my opinion, no. It is a workbook to be sure, but only enough for convenience sake. You won't find your child labeling sentences all day long like with other programs. I am not sure if you have seen the samples . They are very good representations of what to expect. Also, just in case you don't know (this is a very common source of confusion) each lesson is a whole weeks work. Under each lesson you will see the days numbered, but it won't say the word *day*. Maybe you can print up the sample lesson of your choice and try it out to see if it is more workbook than you are looking for.