Tapestry of Grace--a lot of books!

[lilbean05]

Tapestry of Grace looks great, but it seems like there are a lot of books required--if you have 4 kids, you would have almost 200 books to buy that year! If you use Tapestry of Grace, do you buy all of the books? Do you think it is too many? If you haven't bought it, is it because there are too many books?

[momacacia]

This is my fear as well, as we consider TOG for next year. :big ears:

[IceFairy]

Its on my short list, but I think the book costs are prohibitive for me, even with one child doing the program at a time. I am looking at Beautiful Feet, because I can at least get all the books at one time AND can buy a semester at a time.

[freesia]

We started TOG at the dialectic level. I only buy for the Dialectic level. I use Story of the World (one of the alternate choices) the library and substitutions from our Sonlight years for the Grammar and Upper Grammar. There are no discussion questions keyed to the Grammar levels so any books that cover the subject are fine. I also don't buy all the dialectic level books as we have an excellent library. Most of the TOG folks I know do the same.

[lexi]

We are using TOG but my kids are all Lower Grammar level. I am buying most of the books but I only have 1 level to buy right now. We use SOTW as our spine and I add in the TOG books that I choose. My kids really enjoy the book choices and want to read them over and over again. So, I don't mind buying them and keeping them in our library. I also have 4 other kids that will be using those book choices as my oldest is the only one who does TOG with me (my son sometimes listens in). We recently moved to a new area with a better library system. Our old library was worthless and that's why I started buying the books. I prefer to buy them because books disappear in our house and I was never organized enough to put my books on hold and pick them up from the library before we started a new week. The constant library trips became such a pain! But I use my swagbucks gift cards to purchase most of my books so many I've gotten for free. Otherwise, my budget would be gone!

[swellmomma]

I have wondered this too. We are looking at TOG year 3 next year with 3 levels being taught. Now I am sure I already own many of the books from when I bought SL books but opted not to do the cores in the end. But it is still a lot of books. I have already made my list so that I can keep looking for them at good will etc from now until sept. which is how I bought most of my SL ones. That puts the cost at a fraction of what it would be if I tried to buy them all new

[3Blessings]

I was advised (by folks here) to get similar books for lower grammar from the library and buy only upper grammar books if I can't find them at the library. I find plenty of books for the topics that aren't on the list (for lower grammar) and I use STOW as a "spine".

 

As I mentioned above, I do upper grammar, too, and I only buy upper grammar books if they are used (in the curriculum) for more than two weeks. I am blessed with a good library, however, and I think I would have a hard time spending the money on all those books if I wasn't near such a good system.

 

Next year will be year 2 for us and I have decided to purchase in the same manner. Here's hoping it works out as well . . . :drool:

[coffeegal]

We're using TOG with 3 levels, and no, I don't buy all the books. The books are wonderful, and I've enjoyed the selection, so I don't consider TOG having too many books. Rather I'm grateful I have a good library so we can appreciate the quality of the books before returning them for someone else to read. :D

[besroma]

You really can do it either way. If you have room to store all of the books and do not want the hassle of reserving and checking out the books at the library, I recommend watching the TOG sale board and the sale board here for someone selling their used bundle of books for the levels you need. Because there are so many books involved, unless the seller bought theirs used, they are usually in great shape because they often have been read only once.

 

For LG and UG, it is very easy to substitute similar titles for those on the TOG book list. If you don't mind the work involved, you can just get them at the library.

 

I like having the books on my shelves (owning them) because it cuts down on my planning time *and* my children choose the books to read during free reading time. Therefore, they are often exposed to the subject matter more than once. Also, when you have four children as you do, it is nice to be able to pull out my bin of books that you already own when a child moves to a new level.

 

You really can do it both ways. If you have room to store all of the books and do not want the hassle of reserving and checking out the books at the library, I recommend watching the TOG sale board and the sale board here for someone selling their used bundle of books for the levels you need. Because there are so many books involved, unless the seller bought theirs used, they are usually in great shape because they often have been read only once.

 

For LG and UG, it is very easy to substitute similar titles for those on the TOG book list. If you don't mind the work involved, you can just get them at the library.

 

I like having the books on my shelves (owning them) because it cuts down on my planning time *and* my children choose the books to read during free reading time. Therefore, they are often exposed to the subject matter more than once. Also, when you have four children as you do, it is nice to be able to pull out my bin of books that you already own when a child moves to a new level.

[Kathryn]

My son is doing both lower and upper grammar, all the books. We mostly use the library, though I bought ones that we use for a long time or ones I really wanted. I think we bought about twenty books altogether for Year one.

[bluemongoose]

I have a LG and an UG here. Here is what I do:

 

Check to see if the library has a copy.

Check to see if there is a cheap or free version for kindle (there often is for the classics in D and R levels.)

List all the books needed at paperbackswap and get as many as I can.

Look at goodwill and used bookstores.

Look for ones at amazon that count for the 4 for 3 deal.

If it cannot be found in any of these ways, look for the best new price I can find.

 

The other thing I do is list the next TOG years books in paperbackswap ahead of time because you have to wait in line for most of them.

 

And then I remind myself that for the amount of kids I have and the fact that they will be used again by the younger set, the price does spread itself out nicely.

[Hedgehogs4]

I have an LG and D. I do not buy all the books. I learned quickly last year that books for LG and UG that are mostly "information" can easily be subbed at the library, and for D level I find many of the recommended books at the library. If I cannot and it seems to be a really important book, I buy it. For instance this year it was essential to buy the World Wars book, and I am so glad we did. My ds loves it and it will be one for the library for our grandchildren, I'm sure. I usually buy the lit. selections that we choose to cover, both in paperback and / or audible. We are big on the lit. here, and we often listen to the book together, as well as read it, at least portions of it for the purpose of analysis.

[kristi26]

I have an LG, a UG, and a D level. We haven't bought all the books. We are using SOTW for the spine for the younger two and were reading many of the reading options for the D level.

 

However, I'm not loving TOG. I want to, I just don't. :( It seems great and has lots of ideas but I just don't enjoy it. Sigh...so we haven't been following along with it really, just checking the chart for SOTW with TOG, reading those chapters...doing summaries...ODS is trying out Ambleside...I feel like we are getting all over the place here.

[mhaddon]

It would be cheaper for me to buy them because I am horrible at library deadlines...

[Georgiana Daniels]

Our library is pitiful so we purchase them. I hadn't realized that ToG has a sale board, so I'll be checking that before our next purchase! For those of you doing multiple levels, I applaud you. We totally have our hands full just doing LG with some UG mixed in.

[Candid]

For UG and LG I would say you can substitute freely. The only books I would buy are those that used for almost the whole year. For instance there is an Usborne Ancient History book used the whole year of Year 1 UG, buy that. Everything else substitute freely. Also, ask about specific books if you want to know more. You may have to ask here and their forum and maybe on the email group before you find people who know about a book.

 

For D begin to more selective and stick closer to Tapestry's suggestions. I found for lit I could substitute pretty openly, for some history selections I wanted to use what Tapestry did because they covered specific topics that weren't easy to come by. Again any books used for long periods of time are worth the price.

 

At R level, I would stick pretty close to their recommendations. The good news, is that some things can be found used or at the library. I'm in a co-op where one mom uses the library she told me she couldn't get a copy of Much Ado About Nothing, I told her to go back and look in the Shakespeare collections, Much Ado, is Much Ado in almost all variations. (Although in year 3 I think they do use some abridged works those are worth getting exactly).

[besroma]

Our library is pitiful so we purchase them. I hadn't realized that ToG has a sale board, so I'll be checking that before our next purchase! For those of you doing multiple levels, I applaud you. We totally have our hands full just doing LG with some UG mixed in.

 

 

 

Buying the books in bundles saves a tremendous amount in shipping. I used to buy them used on Amazon, but $3.99 per book adds up fast, even when you are getting a great deal on a used book.

 

Additionally, I have often found some OOP books included in the lot, which was fantastic (especially for dialectic and rhetoric).

[Heidi]

Tapestry of Grace looks great, but it seems like there are a lot of books required--if you have 4 kids, you would have almost 200 books to buy that year! If you use Tapestry of Grace, do you buy all of the books? Do you think it is too many? If you haven't bought it, is it because there are too many books?

Yes. I've looked in to TOG many times. Almost bought it once, but board members talked me out of it. I'm a "less is more" sort of person anyway. TOG has too many books, costs too much money, and takes too much time for the subject matter, imo.

[prairiegirl]

We started using TOG with UG and 2 Dialectic. I only buy the literature books and the spine. The rest is from the library. We have an awesome library system so I am able to get most of the books this way. Maybe you should look at your library first to see if they have most of the books before you make a decision.

[....]

I started a similar thread about a year ago. I was completely sold on TOG, researched the program, looked over the samples, etc. Then, I added up the number of books + the cost (I also have 4 children). :eek: I just couldn't afford it (and our library is awful, so that wasn't much help). As it turns out, this was a big year of change for my older two kids (so I'm glad we didn't go with TOG). It does look like an incredible program!

[Amy M]

I have drooled over TOG since I heard about it a year and a half ago, but I ended up not buying it since there were so many books that the cost would be prohibitive to buying any other books (like SL titles) in addition. I added up all the prices for all 16 lists of books (which is what my family would need), cutting out some I had or could get free on the Kindle, and the price came to $10,891. Then add about $400 for the year plans (digital)--comes to about $12,500. I would have to buy the books and ship them to where we live overseas. If I lived in America with a good library, I'd probably do it; and I still think I may use TOG for high school, since I am so impressed with their scripted Socratic discussions. I've heard many people say they use SOTW for the spine and some use the SOTW AG instead of the arts/crafts books that TOG suggests for the LG/UG levels. In that case, I wonder, why say you're doing TOG? Why not rather say you're doing SOTW? (SOTW also provides lit selections, or you could just follow TOG's book lists on the web.)

[....]

I added up all the prices for all 16 lists of books (which is what my family would need), cutting out some I had or could get free on the Kindle, and the price came to $10,891. Then add about $400 for the year plans (digital)--comes to about $12,500.

 

LOL. I added up our curriculum costs for the next semester (jan) and it was $200. I felt bad about that!! Now, I feel much better!

[Kathryn]

I have drooled over TOG since I heard about it a year and a half ago, but I ended up not buying it since there were so many books that the cost would be prohibitive to buying any other books (like SL titles) in addition. I added up all the prices for all 16 lists of books (which is what my family would need), cutting out some I had or could get free on the Kindle, and the price came to $10,891. Then add about $400 for the year plans (digital)--comes to about $12,500. I would have to buy the books and ship them to where we live overseas. If I lived in America with a good library, I'd probably do it; and I still think I may use TOG for high school, since I am so impressed with their scripted Socratic discussions. I've heard many people say they use SOTW for the spine and some use the SOTW AG instead of the arts/crafts books that TOG suggests for the LG/UG levels. In that case, I wonder, why say you're doing TOG? Why not rather say you're doing SOTW? (SOTW also provides lit selections, or you could just follow TOG's book lists on the web.)

 

16 lists of books?

 

Never mind, I figured it out as soon as I posted. I spent about $200 buying Year one both upper and lower grammar books. So, even if I spend the same amount on each level from here on, that's just $2400. I'm also not sure where you got your costs for the year plans. Digital, which is what you said you were quoting the cost of, is $170. Four year plans would be $680. Even if you got the DE+Print, it would be $315 per year, which adds to $1260 total, which doesn't add up to your total.

[coffeegal]

I've heard many people say they use SOTW for the spine and some use the SOTW AG instead of the arts/crafts books that TOG suggests for the LG/UG levels. In that case, I wonder, why say you're doing TOG? Why not rather say you're doing SOTW? (SOTW also provides lit selections, or you could just follow TOG's book lists on the web.)

I'll likely be doing this with the tots in a couple of years. TOG assigns SOTW chapters to read most weeks, but the chapters are out of order for SOTW. We will still be reading many of the TOG books along with SOTW, and my older children are doing full TOG. It's just easier for everyone if the tots are the same page as the older kids.

 

16 lists of books? Never mind, I figured it out as soon as I posted. I spent about $200 buying Year one both upper and lower grammar books. So, even if I spend the same amount on each level from here on, that's just $2400. I'm also not sure where you got your costs for the year plans. Digital, which is what you said you were quoting the cost of, is $170. Four year plans would be $680. Even if you got the DE+Print, it would be $315 per year, which adds to $1260 total, which doesn't add up to your total.

 

I was thinking the same thing at first until I realized that Amy lives overseas. That's the cost for EVERY book, plus the year plans, and likely shipping as well. I once added up the totals of purchasing every book I'd need for LG, UG, D, and R for one year, and it came out to about $4000. Personally, I thought it was a good deal cheaper than paying for private school for all 6 kids. :) Dh wasn't convinced. :lol: We spend a bit more than you do on books, but not much more. I concentrate on the rhetoric and dialectic books that are used for 4+ weeks and Hakim's History of US for my 4th grader. With a good library it's doable.

 

Then add about $400 for the year plans (digital)--comes to about $12,500. I would have to buy the books and ship them to where we live overseas. If I lived in America with a good library, I'd probably do it; and I still think I may use TOG for high school, since I am so impressed with their scripted Socratic discussions.

A good library really makes the difference in being able to use TOG cheaply. :)

[Kathryn]

 

I'll likely be doing this with the tots in a couple of years. TOG assigns SOTW chapters to read most weeks, but the chapters are out of order for SOTW. We will still be reading many of the TOG books along with SOTW, and my older children are doing full TOG. It's just easier for everyone if the tots are the same page as the older kids.

 

 

 

I was thinking the same thing at first until I realized that Amy lives overseas. That's the cost for EVERY book, plus the year plans, and likely shipping as well. I once added up the totals of purchasing every book I'd need for LG, UG, D, and R for one year, and it came out to about $4000. Personally, I thought it was a good deal cheaper than paying for private school for all 6 kids. :) Dh wasn't convinced. :lol: We spend a bit more than you do on books, but not much more. I concentrate on the rhetoric and dialectic books that are used for 4+ weeks and Hakim's History of US for my 4th grader. With a good library it's doable.

 

 

A good library really makes the difference in being able to use TOG cheaply. :)

 

 

Ah, overseas would make a big difference in cost!

 

I do have a fairly good library and I carry around lists of books that I'll need in the future and pick things up used pretty cheaply when I find them.

[Amy M]

16 lists of books?

 

Never mind, I figured it out as soon as I posted. I spent about $200 buying Year one both upper and lower grammar books. So, even if I spend the same amount on each level from here on, that's just $2400. I'm also not sure where you got your costs for the year plans. Digital, which is what you said you were quoting the cost of, is $170. Four year plans would be $680. Even if you got the DE+Print, it would be $315 per year, which adds to $1260 total, which doesn't add up to your total.

 

Please forgive me, I'm not sure exactly how I got that $400/year cost now, you're correct. I know the digital is $170, so I think I was counting the mid-priced one (can't get my internet to work well right now to check), plus maybe map aids, pop quiz, and evaluations for each year--whatever I was interested in getting at the time. Also, FWIW, I think I could maybe get the book costs down by half by watching sales on forums, and trying to find it cheaper on Amazon, etc., but that price did NOT include shipping overseas. I do know some missionaries over here using TOG, and they buy every book. I know another family that plans to use mainly SOTW and couple of the books for LG. After evaluating all the options, I felt I could get a better bang for my buck going another route. But I do think TOG is a stellar curriculum, and may still use it in high school, as I mentioned. :)

[Kathryn]

 

 

Please forgive me, I'm not sure exactly how I got that $400/year cost now, you're correct. I know the digital is $170, so I think I was counting the mid-priced one (can't get my internet to work well right now to check), plus maybe map aids, pop quiz, and evaluations for each year--whatever I was interested in getting at the time. Also, FWIW, I think I could maybe get the book costs down by half by watching sales on forums, and trying to find it cheaper on Amazon, etc., but that price did NOT include shipping overseas. I do know some missionaries over here using TOG, and they buy every book. I know another family that plans to use mainly SOTW and couple of the books for LG. After evaluating all the options, I felt I could get a better bang for my buck going another route. But I do think TOG is a stellar curriculum, and may still use it in high school, as I mentioned. :)

 

That makes sense. I wasn't trying to be difficult, I was just really confused!

[TracyP]

Amy, TOG may very well not be a good fit for now, but just in case you decide to take another look...

As far as the book costs go, I think you might want to take another peek at that too. I just put every book for every year in my cart, then I checked to make sure there was only one copy of each book since some books are reused in another year. My total was $6624. It is expensive, no denying that, but about on par with a brand new SL Core. And that is for EVERY book.

 

As others have said, I do not buy every book. I will buy more and more as we move into higher levels. I will probably buy all of them next year. Since I will be done buying the actual year plans, I will have extra book money. :) I use the library pretty heavily which was hard to do with Year 1, but I have found the majority of the books (or a good substitute) at my library in Years 2 - 4. I would appreciate the convenience of having the books on hand, but it is not neccessary.

[Amy M]

Amy, TOG may very well not be a good fit for now, but just in case you decide to take another look...

As far as the book costs go, I think you might want to take another peek at that too. I just put every book for every year in my cart, then I checked to make sure there was only one copy of each book since some books are reused in another year. My total was $6624. It is expensive, no denying that, but about on par with a brand new SL Core. And that is for EVERY book.

 

Oh, my, are you kidding me? :o I remember spending hours with a calculator going through all those lists adding it up, and thinking I made such an informed, well-researched decision. It would have been so much easier and quicker to put it in my cart the way you did. I probably added doubles in my calculations. So embarrassed. I'll check it out again to get a more accurate figure for myself; however, I've already purchased the other choices I decided to go with, so no TOG for me for a while. I'm at peace with my decision, but seriously my price figure I quoted was what gave me GREAT pause in deciding to go with TOG originally! Like you said though, there is no denying that TOG is one of the most expensive options out there.

[TracyP]

Oh, my, are you kidding me? :o I remember spending hours with a calculator going through all those lists adding it up, and thinking I made such an informed, well-researched decision. It would have been so much easier and quicker to put it in my cart the way you did. I probably added doubles in my calculations. So embarrassed. I'll check it out again to get a more accurate figure for myself; however, I've already purchased the other choices I decided to go with, so no TOG for me for a while. I'm at peace with my decision, but seriously my price figure I quoted was what gave me GREAT pause in deciding to go with TOG originally! Like you said though, there is no denying that TOG is one of the most expensive options out there.

 

As someone who started TOG with a newly turned 6yo, I have stated numerous times on this board that I would have gone a different route if I had a do-over. JMO, but I think starting TOG with an 8-11 year old is the way to go. Way too complicated and expensive for the younger crowd *in my opinion*. Add being overseas, and I don't think you can beat SOTW.

[Amy M]

Amy, TOG may very well not be a good fit for now, but just in case you decide to take another look...

As far as the book costs go, I think you might want to take another peek at that too. I just put every book for every year in my cart, then I checked to make sure there was only one copy of each book since some books are reused in another year. My total was $6624.

 

Okay, I just gave it another try using this method (on their website, every book, took out the doubles, which was my error the first time, plus some books have changed), and my total for books came to $8858 for every book. :confused: Not trying to belabor the point, but these totals are coming up pretty differently! :blink:

[TracyP]

Hmmm, it could be my mistake. I'm not going to try again, that took too much time the first time. We can meet in the middle and go with the figure you just got. LOL.

 

TOG is an expensive program if you buy all the books. There is no doubt there. All the lit based programs (SL, HOD, MFW to a lesser extent) are expensive because you are buying books. I'm not trying to convince you to use it or anything - but most people don't add up all 12/13 years of SL, HOD, or MFW when trying to decide if they are a program they want to use. :) If you do that you may find that TOG is the most expensive (if you buy all the books), but it is not a huge difference when compared that way. HTH your decision!

[bethben]

I buy the books for the oldest student I have which this year means I bought dialectic. I also buy the literature for the ones who can read and write well because the activity sheets are specific to the book. I spend around $200-$300 a year buying mostly used. With year 1, I had almost all of the LG books because my oldest student had gone through that year. When we hit year 3, I will have all of the UG books for child #3 because I bought for my oldest when he went through the program as an upper grammar student and will have to buy Dialectic. With the youngers, I use story of the world or just deal with inter-library loan when we want more. Next year, I will combine my LG and UG kiddos together and just read SOTW to both of them or whatever I have on my shelves that matches the week. I do like owning the books because then I don't have to think about what I need week to week and just go to the bookshelf to get it, but I don't buy multiple levels for history. I think having multiple children with multiple ages is how this program is cost worthy.

 

Beth

[Candid]

I buy the books for the oldest student I have which this year means I bought dialectic.

 

This is a great strategy!