Kid Does Not Want To Learn

[Sarah L.]

I am new here, and this is our first year of homeschooling. My DD is 11 and in 6th grade. She spent 4 years in public school and we have taken a steady approach to school this year (nothing crazy intense), but nothing seems to be sticking at all. She seems to refuse to take ownership of her lessons and her learning, does not follow directions (I wonder if she even bothers to read them judging by the work she turns in), and complains about the house being "too distracting" (no one else is home but her and I). She does have ADHD and we have lots of different ways for handling that, but it seems like she is just rushing through her work and doing the minimum she needs to get by - which isn't even cutting it. She has no pride in her work and is careless when she does it.

 

I also feel like she isn't connecting anything to anything. Nothing relates at all for her, even if I spell it out for her. I am beyond frustrated right now. :cursing:

 

How have others dealt with situations like this? I don't expect homeschooling to be easy, of course, but it just seems like she does not care! Even worse, is my ability to cope with this. In my frustration with her, I have said things I probably shouldn't have said. :sad:

 

Thanks,

Sarah

 

Mom to DD11 (homeschool), DD 10, DS7, DD6 (all in public magnet schools)

[ondreeuh]

Everything you mentioned points to unmanaged ADHD. I have a child with ADHD and even if I gave him a perfectly quiet environment and all of the adaptions I could, he would still be unable to work. Medication is necessary for him to function. I realize that not all kids with ADHD are that severe, but from what you wrote, I would assume that your dd does not have the executive function abilities to tune out stimuli, pay attention to detail, and care about her work. She probably did better in public school because she was micromanaged by her class to some degree, and you are probably expecting her to work more independently (plus, homeschool materials at her level are often written for the student to do independently). Homeschool is a LOT different from public school. My dd17 has ADD and she falls apart when working independently because she doesn't have the mental organization skills or time management skills to work well. In school, she just has to coast along with the class and she has a much easier time.

 

It may be time to look at a different approach (more discussion & interaction) or medication for the ADHD.

[fairfarmhand]

What programs are you using? People may be more able to offer suggestions if we know the approach that you are using.

 

Also, some 6th graders need lots of handholding, sometimes even more so from being in school. She probably needs you to sit down and read through directions with her, watch her do a few problems. Then you probably need to watch her as she works. If she starts getting careless or sloppy, you may need to correct it. You may not be able to walk away from her while she is working for quite awhile.

[Sarah L.]

Everything you mentioned points to unmanaged ADHD. I have a child with ADHD and even if I gave him a perfectly quiet environment and all of the adaptions I could, he would still be unable to work. Medication is necessary for him to function. I realize that not all kids with ADHD are that severe, but from what you wrote, I would assume that your dd does not have the executive function abilities to tune out stimuli, pay attention to detail, and care about her work. She probably did better in public school because she was micromanaged by her class to some degree, and you are probably expecting her to work more independently (plus, homeschool materials at her level are often written for the student to do independently). Homeschool is a LOT different from public school. My dd17 has ADD and she falls apart when working independently because she doesn't have the mental organization skills or time management skills to work well. In school, she just has to coast along with the class and she has a much easier time.

 

 

It may be time to look at a different approach (more discussion & interaction) or medication for the ADHD.

Yes - you could be right about the medication. She has been off of it for over a year, namely because of the severe side effects she experienced. We have approached homeopathically and with diet, but have gotten a little lax. Probably time to buckle down and address those things. You're probably right that she does not have the mental organization skills to work well independently, and I would do well to invest heavily in working one on one with her instead of expecting her to work alone. Thank you!

 

What programs are you using? People may be more able to offer suggestions if we know the approach that you are using.

 

Also, some 6th graders need lots of handholding, sometimes even more so from being in school. She probably needs you to sit down and read through directions with her, watch her do a few problems. Then you probably need to watch her as she works. If she starts getting careless or sloppy, you may need to correct it. You may not be able to walk away from her while she is working for quite awhile.

 

 

We are using Saxon 7/6, Teaching the Classics, Hake Grammar (just started), and LifePack History/Geography (5th grade - she had little exposure to this in public school), Spelling Power (G). We have Science Fusion for science, but it's been so difficult to get just those few things done that it's been on the back burner. We tried doing Science Olympiad with a local homeschool group, but since she isn't a self-starter and I work part-time (though she comes with me to work), it's been a bit of a disaster. I wanted to take a full classical approach this year, but I definitely wasn't prepared for the amount of time I would have to invest. I had to back off and take a different approach. She loves art and we have done some notebooking as well. I am going to try your suggestion. Maybe I have unreasonable expectations for her, and I would do well to lower those.

 

Thank you both!!

Sarah (AND Maddie)

[fairfarmhand]

With math....

 

Teach her the lesson. Do a few example problems for her and then let her do a few to make sure that she understands the concepts. My kids do SO much better when I teach on a marker board and they do their problems on the boards too. I'd let her do one problem on the board at a time, with me checking as she worked. This will seem like it takes awhile, and it will, but it will be much more effective.

 

I am not familiar with many of your choices, but I do know that Lifepac is very workbooky, repetitive. So you may need to do it as a read-aloud and work through the questions with her. you could just dump the worksheets of lifepac and let her do it notebooking form instead.

[Mom22ns]

An 11 yo with serious ADHD (and some without it) cannot be expected to work independently. She is not ready to take ownership yet. You will have to take ownership, teach her your expectations, in detail, then gradually, nope more gradually than that, allow her to gain independence.

 

For now, I would sit beside her at all times and watch her work. If a sentence is written to sloppily or a problem not worked in a reasoned manor, I would correct her immediately. If she isn't focusing I would remind her to focus. I would read all the directions with her, or have her read them all to you.

 

Honestly, In ps the teacher reads the directions for every assignment, then repeats herself 3 times as the kids ask "What am I supposed to do?". You can't take a child from that environment and expect her to read the instructions and turn in quality work. A few kids can do it, but not the majority and not those with issues.

 

Ask me how I know? We started homeschooling at the beginning of my ds's 6th grade year. He is ASD. Dd started at the beginning of 5th grade. She is NT and could work independently, but will invest herself proportionately to how much I invest myself in her work.

[Sarah L.]

With math....

 

Teach her the lesson. Do a few example problems for her and then let her do a few to make sure that she understands the concepts. My kids do SO much better when I teach on a marker board and they do their problems on the boards too. I'd let her do one problem on the board at a time, with me checking as she worked. This will seem like it takes awhile, and it will, but it will be much more effective.

 

I am not familiar with many of your choices, but I do know that Lifepac is very workbooky, repetitive. So you may need to do it as a read-aloud and work through the questions with her. you could just dump the worksheets of lifepac and let her do it notebooking form instead.

 

 

We've started doing that with the math and it does seem to help.

Re: LifePac - it IS workbooky - which is why I opted to avoid it when I was choosing our curriculum for the year. I initially picked SOW Ancients, which she was very interested in, yet we seemed to make no progress. I felt like I needed something with a bit more structure, but I don't know that this is working well either. Maybe I will just throw out the worksheets and let her notebook on the concepts.

 

An 11 yo with serious ADHD (and some without it) cannot be expected to work independently. She is not ready to take ownership yet. You will have to take ownership, teach her your expectations, in detail, then gradually, nope more gradually than that, allow her to gain independence.

 

For now, I would sit beside her at all times and watch her work. If a sentence is written to sloppily or a problem not worked in a reasoned manor, I would correct her immediately. If she isn't focusing I would remind her to focus. I would read all the directions with her, or have her read them all to you.

 

Honestly, In ps the teacher reads the directions for every assignment, then repeats herself 3 times as the kids ask "What am I supposed to do?". You can't take a child from that environment and expect her to read the instructions and turn in quality work. A few kids can do it, but not the majority and not those with issues.

 

Ask me how I know? We started homeschooling at the beginning of my ds's 6th grade year. He is ASD. Dd started at the beginning of 5th grade. She is NT and could work independently, but will invest herself proportionately to how much I invest myself in her work.

 

 

Thank you for your comments. You are absolutely right, and I appreciate that you were straightforward with your response. Maybe I ought to retitle this post: "Kid Wants to Learn; Mom Clueless!" :blushing: I should know better. I can't expect my ADHD kid to work the same way a kid without a Dx works. I am taking all of these suggestions to heart. Thank you again.

 

Sarah

[Elizabeth in MN]

I have found over the last few years that this reaction by your DD is typical. Generally speaking it's normal from 10-13 years of age with home schooled kids. I've struggled with this issue with my daughter for two years now. We've done it all - radically switch education styles, done a completely new curriculum dropped what she hated, upped everything she loved and NONE of it made a difference in attitude. Things seem to get better around the age of thirteen.

[5LittleMonkeys]

I am new here, and this is our first year of homeschooling. My DD is 11 and in 6th grade. She spent 4 years in public school and we have taken a steady approach to school this year (nothing crazy intense), but nothing seems to be sticking at all. She seems to refuse to take ownership of her lessons and her learning, does not follow directions (I wonder if she even bothers to read them judging by the work she turns in), and complains about the house being "too distracting" (no one else is home but her and I). She does have ADHD and we have lots of different ways for handling that, but it seems like she is just rushing through her work and doing the minimum she needs to get by - which isn't even cutting it. She has no pride in her work and is careless when she does it.

 

I also feel like she isn't connecting anything to anything. Nothing relates at all for her, even if I spell it out for her. I am beyond frustrated right now. :cursing:

 

How have others dealt with situations like this? I don't expect homeschooling to be easy, of course, but it just seems like she does not care! Even worse, is my ability to cope with this. In my frustration with her, I have said things I probably shouldn't have said. :sad:

 

Thanks,

Sarah

 

Mom to DD11 (homeschool), DD 10, DS7, DD6 (all in public magnet schools)

 

First, hugs to you...I know exactly what you are going through. All the things I bolded above are dd13 three years ago...and to some degree up into last year as well. Dd doesn't have ADHD but she has strong ADD Inattentive tendencies. So, not the exact situation, but very, very similar.

 

I let dd read your post and she kept nodding at all of the bolded things. I asked her what she would say to your dd if she had the chance, and this is what she said:

 

"Think about what you might want to do when you graduate. Is your current attitude and devotion to schoolwork going to get you to your goals? If not, then you are making your life harder than it needs to be and you are setting yourself up to lead a life of mediocrity. Focus on those things that you must do in order to attain your goals and pursue your passions."

 

(I hear my own words echoed in her response above...she WAS listening all those times ;) ) At that point she started rambling too quickly for me to keep up (I'm horrible at dictation) so I'll just sum it up. Basically she said that what finally helped her was my conversations with her about her future and how on earth she thought she was going to have one if she continued the habit of balking at hard work and not giving 100%. She remembers the day I told her that even if she was able to get a job she wouldn't keep it for very long with the pathetic work ethic she was ingraining into her brain day after day. That apparently was a turning point for her. She is devoted to her art and knows what it is going to take for her to make a living doing what she loves. That knowledge is what drives her...not that she all of a sudden began loving schoolwork. She says that she still doesn't like doing school but that she accepts that it must be done and done well.

 

In addition to the above, I think one other thing that helped our situation was my devotion to trying to see things through her eyes. Taking her ADD Innatentive and VSL tendencies into account, I tried very hard to customize her schoolwork to her likes\dislikes, learning styles, interests, and abilities. There are some subjects that are focus subjects for her; those that she finds more tolerable or actually likes them. Then there are some subjects that we do simply because we have to do them. Math is one of those. She has dyscalculia and processing issues that make math extremely difficult for her so we picked the math program that she can work through with the least amount of struggling, and will continue through high school simply "doing enough to get by". She has to do the work and gain enough understanding to maintain a low B average, but I don't ask for above and beyond in this subject. Taking the pressure off of her in that subject alone did wonders for her attitude. We did that for every subject. Went through and decided if it was a high priority, low priority or not important at all. For example - she really wanted to become a stronger writer this year so we opted to drop science (gasp!) in order to make more time for language arts.

 

My attitude was huge in helping her overcome her habits and attitude too. The more emotional, angry, upset, and frustrated I became, the worse her behavior. I think it was two fold. First, causing me emotional distress was a control mechanism for her. If I was focusing on her behavior and trying to deal with my own I wouldn't be focusing on the schoolwork. Second, when she did upset me, she ended up feeling bad. She felt bad and so acted out, which caused me to get angry, which caused her to feel bad, which caused me....vicious circle. I had to stop the cycle and take my emotions out of the equation. I had to stop taking everything personally and had to stop feeling sorry for myself that I had such a difficult daughter. Part of her problems were caused by my inability to deal with her. I had to pull up my big girl panties and do whatever it took to reach her and to help her. It was my responsibility as her mother to retrain her and to help her learn how to self govern her behavior and attitude.

 

I could write a book on my experience the last three years with her. I won't here. You aren't alone in dealing with a child this way. I know many, many of us here could have written your post at some point with one or more of our dc. Breath, relax, keep in mind that she is young still. You can get through to her if you are devoted and have patience.

 

Oh, and one thing about her not making connections...I really think some dc just aren't able to make those connections until they are older. It's as if they move into the logic stage several years past when others do. Dd13 is just now starting to make connections between events and skills. Just keep working with her and pointing those things out and discussing them and she will get there eventually.

[Catwoman]

FWIW, this may not be an ADHD thing at all.

 

It may just be an "11 year old kid" thing.

 

I suspect your dd would prefer to daydream and procrastinate, rather than do her schoolwork. I don't think that's particularly uncommon, especially at that age.

 

Sure, it could be the ADHD, but before you worry yourself about it too much, try doing school with her, rather than having her do very much on her own, and see how it goes. She may just be bored and lonely when she has to sit by herself and do her schoolwork, and it may seem overwhelming to her to feel like she's doing it all on her own.

 

Sorry you're feeling so frustrated, but please know that you are not alone! :grouphug:

[ondreeuh]

An 11 yo with serious ADHD (and some without it) cannot be expected to work independently. She is not ready to take ownership yet. You will have to take ownership, teach her your expectations, in detail, then gradually, nope more gradually than that, allow her to gain independence.

 

 

This is my experience too. Dd17 has struggled to take ownership .... she wants to, but at the same time it is so challenging to manage everything that she gives up (and then beats herself up about it). I thought by this age I would SURELY just be a resource for her, but every time I step back and give her more autonomy, she drops the ball and I have to step in and give her the structure she can't/won't give herself. Trust me, I wouldn't do it if I could avoid it, but the alternative is watching her fail and then watching her self-destruct from the shame of it. The worst class experience she had was a self-paced distance Spanish class. She had to finish by the end of the school grading period to get credit, and she got incredibly far behind. I gave her a million strategies for managing her time, and finally resorted to requiring her to do the work on my schedule since she wouldn't stick to her own. I am so glad that this kid is in public school, because she needs to be accountable to more people than just Mom.

 

I am testing out more independence with my 11 year old. Right now I am going over the new concepts in grammar and then getting him started on his writing assignment, and then I leave the room to work with his brother. I check in on him, but he generally saves questions for the end. Then I go over his work and re-teach anything he missed. I do the same with math - I go over the previous lesson, writing the missed problems on the whiteboard so he can re-do them. Then I teach the new lesson, basically reading the book (CLE, which is very similar to Saxon) and solving the example problems on the board. Then I watch him as he does the first problems, and we skim over the lesson to see if there is anything he needs a refresher on. Then I leave him alone while he works, and answer questions at the end. History and science aren't really independent because I want to discuss those as we learn together.

[Sarah L.]

THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH! I cannot tell you how helpful and encouraging your comments have been! I have truly had an attitude adjustment and am pulling up my big-girl panties (thank you 5LittleMonkeys!) with plans to start fresh tomorrow... with an apology to her for my frustration with her and a new approach to her school day.

 

Sarah

[AKshanmar]

Eleven is what I consider the HARDEST age! Then you throw in ADHD and the adjustment to homeschooling, and you are in for a bit of a roller coaster. I agree with the other posters... you've got to sit right there with and work through everything. Only my youngest of 4 kids could ever work independently, the other three couldn't pick up their pencils without my direction! I thought I was doing something wrong, but in hindsight, and seeing the difference with my youngest, that was just them.

 

My son has very exhausting non-diagnosed ADHD! We pulled him out of school in 3rd grade. He was a piece of work. Everything was hard. When he turned 13, he started to have some sucess. It was the greatest feeling, knowing first hand, how much work went into him. He went back to school for highschool. His sophmore year, he came home one day and said "Mom, I think I have ADHD." "....Uh, duh." But you know, this year, he is homeschooling again for his senior year. He is dragging in his US history class, but your know, he got A's in all three automotive classes he took at the University of Alaska. He is the youngest, and right at the top of his class (mom brag, sorry), because he finally found something he loves.

 

So hang in there! Perservere where you feel like you should, but switch tracks where you can. Shake things up. Through the science in there and see if that makes things click. Life Pac's are a bit, umm, boring. My kids learned well when I read to them. So I read for hours everyday. You never know. Go to howtolearn.com and have her take the learning styles quiz. You might adjust things after that. I thought my kids should take notes, because that is how I learn, but no, they are all auditory-kinestetics. So they danced around the room, while I read, and life was good. Find that place.

[Lily_Grace]

Can I make the suggestion of not sitting down? Or at least curbing the writing?

 

DS has always done best when he had to be more involved in his lessons - moving things, manipulating stuff, making mock-ups or doing experiments. It required him to follow directions more and be more attentive because one slip could have the entire thing turn out wrong.

[Ellie]

I am new here, and this is our first year of homeschooling. My DD is 11 and in 6th grade. She spent 4 years in public school and we have taken a steady approach to school this year (nothing crazy intense), but nothing seems to be sticking at all. She seems to refuse to take ownership of her lessons and her learning, does not follow directions (I wonder if she even bothers to read them judging by the work she turns in), and complains about the house being "too distracting" (no one else is home but her and I). She does have ADHD and we have lots of different ways for handling that, but it seems like she is just rushing through her work and doing the minimum she needs to get by - which isn't even cutting it. She has no pride in her work and is careless when she does it.

 

I also feel like she isn't connecting anything to anything. Nothing relates at all for her, even if I spell it out for her. I am beyond frustrated right now. :cursing:

 

How have others dealt with situations like this? I don't expect homeschooling to be easy, of course, but it just seems like she does not care! Even worse, is my ability to cope with this. In my frustration with her, I have said things I probably shouldn't have said. :sad:

 

Thanks,

Sarah

 

Mom to DD11 (homeschool), DD 10, DS7, DD6 (all in public magnet schools)

You are in error: all children want to learn. The problem is that you want her to learn what *you* want her to learn, in the way *you* want her to learn it. Of course she doesn't care. It's schoolwork. She's a child, and doesn't yet understand the importance of schoolwork--although actually, it isn't "schoolwork" that's important; it's learning that is, and learning doesn't have to look like school.

 

Also, many homeschoolers spend at least a year rehabilitating children who have spent very much time in a classroom environment, and especially when they might have learning issues such as ADD.

 

I'm not advocating unschooling; I'm advocating a break from Official School Stuff while you re-evaluate what you're doing and reconnect with your dd.

[Ohmomjacquie]

my oldset is 8 and has a VERY hard time focusing, I literally have to sit with her or work doesn't get done. We tried the workbook stuff the past two years and it was a major struggle. Switched this year to something more hands on and realy books and it's night and day. Monday was the firsst really terrible day we've had all year. maybe try a different style for the history and such?

[ladyinthegarden]

I thought I would reply to this because I am using nearly the same curriculum choices and we have had nearly the same issue.

Hake's Grammar & Writing was a hard transition for my DS. If you use the program fully there is dictation or journal writing everyday, then a grammar lesson that follows with 30 questions. I ditched using the dictation and journal for now, and began doing the grammar lesson orally. Technically this program is more grammar than I recieved in my entire education. I like it though and he loves it now that he does it orally. We had been doing dictation lessons before we started the program but I plan to axe dictation lessons altogether for now, and maybe do them after he finishes the grammar lessons. I also plan to ease the journal prompts back in every other day. The writing lessons we do as recommended by the schedule. Today was a great day, I multi-tasked everywhere in the house with the teacher's manual in my hand. He got every answer right.

We do the Saxon lesson together after the basic math facts practice. I work with him with the mental math portion, then read the lesson, we go over the practice problems, then set the timer for 45-60 minutes and allow him to do the mixed practice on his own, unless he needs help. He started out going over the clock, now he has time to spare. I am gradually training him to have self-control and disipline for academics.

I would let go of the history and geography workbooks for now, and read aloud history and geography books, or download audio books from librivox.org for her to listen to. If you are using classic literature books you could do this with librivox.org recordings as well. It would take some of the pressure off her and you for now until you settle into homeschooling.

Science for us has always been easy; he got the science bug early on, and ran with it. This year is the first year we have seriously used a textbook and it's for botany. I would take her to the library, find the science section, and let her pick the topic once a week. I promise she will get more from doing that in one year than any single textbook. In the spring, pick up a few nature field guides.

Hang in there, and good luck.