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Crossing the Tiber - The Master Thread


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I've got a question for those of you who prefer TLM. Is there a catechism for adults that's the equivalent of the Baltimore Catechism? Also, is there a history of the development of the mass? I'm especially looking for something that's written by a Catholic equivalent of Jaroslav Pelikan (whose works I highly recommend for everyone to read!).

 

Klauser's Short History of the Western Liturgy is the one I hear about, but I haven't read it myself.

 

I think the #4 Baltimore Catechism is supposed to be the teenager/adult level.

 

 

 

The Baltimores are available free, on Kindle.

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They haven't kicked me out yet! I still consider myself RC, but had my children baptized, and they are being raised, in an Episcopalian church.

 

 

You will never get kicked out, you bring the laughter and the wine. And the more than occasional reality check.

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I looked back and didn't see the original post where it talked about someone receiving the Eucharist at both the RC and EO church. Maybe I misunderstood? My apologies if so.

This has been brought up a time or two over the years. I think (and I may be wrong since things could have changed since I last looked into it) an EO is "allowed" by the RC to receive at an RC. This, of course, may be against what is "allowed" by the EO. I think you ( or mommaduck) told me that an RC is not allowed by the EO to receive at the EO.

 

I think we are only allowed to receive from an EO if it is a dire circumstance or if that is all that is available if the EO priest agrees. And I think (I may be wrong but I don't think so) that if a RC was hit by a bus in front of the only church in 100 miles which happens to be EO, said RC is allowed to ask the EO priest who comes to the aid of the injured RC to hear his final confession. But the EO priest has to agree. And again only in dire circumstances or when facing death.

 

These are those things that I asked about long ago. I would ask a lot of questions that began with, "Well, what if..."

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I think most people who join the Church feel that way. I still do, even after 17 years.

 

I sure do. I converted in 2009 and I am still clueless about so many little things. The theology I've got a handle on, the culturally Catholic aspects of participating in parish life and celebrating the liturgical year at home are baffling to me at times.

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It was my post. It's partly speculation, of course, just because they attend both doesn't mean that they receive at both (I do this - I can't receive because I was married outside the OC - and I'm not in the habit of watching to see who goes up to receive). But, I wouldn't be surprised if they do receive in both churches. Which would be okay from the Catholic point of view, but not the Orthodox. As I said, this sort of thing did happen in the Ukraine at least during Soviet rule. Many Eastern Rite churches were shut down or converted to Orthodox churches and people just went to the Orthodox church. They still thought of themselves as Catholic, but what else was there to do? The habit probably just continued.

 

Again, that whole post was to simply point out that how mass or divine liturgy is celebrated by the laity: who participates and how much really just depends on the customs of the place. It is unfair to compare a single Latin mass funeral to the divine liturgy based on the fact that there was lack of participation and you couldn't hear the priest because more likely than not someone could have a similar experience at a divine liturgy as well.

 

Which is why I asked the question if the Western Rite Orthodox mass is all that different an experience than the low TLM that the poster attended.

 

As it happens,we attended a western rite Liturgy just Sunday before last for the first time. It was exactly like all the best parts of my pre-Orthodox parish--a very high church Anglo-catholic Episcopal church--singing, hymns! (Swoon), all in English, all audible. So in my extremely limited experience, yes, pretty different. :)

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Why is any harder to have a high mass than a low one? I know there's more singing, but otherwise, what is the rationale?

A Solemn High Mass (as in

) requires a priest, a deacon, a subdeacon, and several servers, as well as the choir. They all have responsibility for different parts of the liturgy -- for instance, the subdeacon chants the Epistle, and the deacon chants the Gospel. The Solemn Mass is normative for the Extraordinary Form, and the others are sort of reduced versions.

 

A Sung Mass, or Missa Cantata, is meant for situations where a deacon and subdeacon aren't available. It needs one priest, at least a couple of servers, and the choir. I don't think it's technically considered a High Mass, but it's often referred to as one.

 

The Low Mass just needs one priest and one server, so it's a lot more feasible for small communities.

 

On the other end of the spectrum, the Pontifical Solemn Mass (with a bishop) has even more roles to fill.

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This thread here is interesting. I always get a bit intimidated when Catholics start discussing TLM vs. NO. I have an inferiority complex, I guess. I am a cradle Catholic that left the Church for about 15 years and then slowly, slowly, slowly reverted. Now I am so happily in love with my faith and thank God everyday for it. Truly it is such blessing! But I have to admit Mass is Mass to me. I go to any and all! I enjoy what each different style might offer but it all comes down to the Holy Sacrifice of my beautiful, beautiful Savior. And to me that happens whether the Mass is in Latin or not, whether the music is good or not. For some reason I simply can't get passionate about it the way many seem to. I feel kind of lost in these conversations. I went to a TLM once and it was gorgeous! That was a high Mass. Then we went to a low Mass and I found it very strange. So quiet I could hear the guy sitting three pews up from me's stomach growl! And not one but 4 cell phones rang during the course of it. I mean come on! When that first cell phone rang didn't everybody else quickly go to check their own? Nope. Four times! I just couldn't follow it at all. I couldn't relax and pray. Really that was my one bad Mass experience! I know I should give it another chance but the truth is I like my parish so very much that I don't like to not go to it every Sunday. And here's the big confession, the Mass we usually go to is the guitar Mass! That's because of the time it is held. My dh isn't Catholic. He happily goes to Mass with us most of the time though. He is very supportive, but he does like to be able to sleep in and then have a nice breakfast, so we wind up going to the 11:45 which is the folk Mass. Even so, I have to say I find it a very reverent experience. These folks have been singing in the same choir for 30 years. Our pastor is such a lovely, good man. As someone once said, it's like having St. Francis of Assisi as your pastor. He just exudes gentleness and kindness. He's actually really orthodox in his homilies and very obedient to our bishop. It is a really vibrant parish with lots going on. Once you get involved you realize how many people there love the Lord and are trying to follow Him. It is like a shelter from the storm, faith-wise. So I forgive it entirely for any less than perfect music. But I do occasionally like to go to other rites. My sister married a Byzantine Catholic and I have gone to several Masses there. Their men's choir chanting the liturgy in Slavic was so thrillingly moving. Very, very beautiful. I have been to some really gorgeous Masses at the National Shrine in D.C. They were NO but done to the highest level and very beautiful. We have a parish near here that has the Novus Ordo in Latin with a beautiful choir. I've attended there a couple times. I do really want to go to the nearby Melkite Church for their liturgy. I've been to Vespers which knocked me off my socks, it was so beautiful. And just recently another parish within driving distance is now doing the Anglican Catholic rite using the Book of Common Prayer. I would love to go to that one too. I do think it is wonderful to be able to explore the different liturgical heritages of our Church. But primarily I am still a guitar Mass goer, as shameful as that may be, LOL!

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Of C-and c-atholic interest, just heard an interview with author, John Scally, reviewing his book which spawned from an interview he did with Mother Teresa...http://www.catholicbook.net/products/As-I-Have-Loved-You%3A-A-Conversation-with-Mother-Teresa-by-John-Scally.html

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The wild situation "what-ifs" are interesting, but not the standard doctrine or teaching in any church. They are for mercy's sake, not for laxity. I know you know that and I know I am sounding like a jerk. But I don't mean to.

 

Rome allows EO to receive the Eucharist in RC churches. But EO does not allow EO to receive outside the EO church, nor does it allow any non-EO to receive at an EO church.

 

I know that there have been notable exceptions made to this rule, but they are exceptions, and not always agreed upon.

 

The same is true in the RC Church. I recall that a non-Catholic Taize leader was welcomed to the chalice at Pope John Paul II's funeral. This caused an uproar on both sides of the question--those against and those for the decision. But it didn't become a standard of practice. It was an exception for THAT man on THAT occasion.

 

To add to this, the Catholic Church allows EO to receive communion but encourages them to follow the regulations of their own authorities. Here's the official link to the USCCB.

 

There should be a whole separate thread on Catholic/Orthodox relations or something. We could discuss Soloviev, Berdyaev and Florensky.

 

Look, I didn't bring the topic up. I was just elaborating on some points. No need to slap at me. I really don't appreciate it. I did point out numerous times that it was not the norm and I think everyone understands that.

 

Patty Joanna, I don't think you'd like one of us being flippant about sounding like a jerk if we came over to your group. Please play nicely.

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This thread here is interesting. I always get a bit intimidated when Catholics start discussing TLM vs. NO. I have an inferiority complex, I guess. I am a cradle Catholic that left the Church for about 15 years and then slowly, slowly, slowly reverted. Now I am so happily in love with my faith and thank God everyday for it. Truly it is such blessing!

 

I'm very glad you found your way home.

 

And in the grand scheme of things, Mass is Mass. It truly doesn't' matter which form one attends. What pulls us apart is the mindset that one is better or attending one form over the other makes one a better Catholic than the rest. It is our own version of "I'm a better Christian."

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Chucki, I am certain that Patty Joanna intended no offense and is not being flippant. She's saying that she feels obligated to clear up a matter of doctrine for the EO to prevent scandalizing someone ELSE who *might read* and not know about it, but is aware that all of the lovely Catholic women who've already posted in this thread know this stuff already. She's not a slappy lady, and would never mean to make you feel that way.

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I many times hit the guitar mass, but for us, the player is a classical guitarist, he's not folksy at all. Now, the songs, otoh...

 

While we were down south dh and I were very surprised at the changes to the little church we used to attend in GA. When we lived there things were very proper. When we went back there was the big screen and the guitar player. It felt like what I'd imagine a Pentecostal service would be like. Now I know why my parents don't go there.

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I'm very glad you found your way home.

 

And in the grand scheme of things, Mass is Mass. It truly doesn't' matter which form one attends. What pulls us apart is the mindset that one is better or attending one form over the other makes one a better Catholic than the rest. It is our own version of "I'm a better Christian."

 

 

It was very comforting and healing for me to realize that the differences were OK and all under the mantle of the Magistrate. It was a lesson in what true unity looked like, and how the Magesterium is a blessing.

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It was very comforting and healing for me to realize that the differences were OK and all under the mantle of the Magistrate. It was a lesson in what true unity looked like, and how the Magesterium is a blessing.

What it really boils down to is that people don't like change. And it was a HUGE, gigantic really, change to go from TLM to NO withing a blink of an eye. And considering the 2000 year history of the Mass the years just after VII were a blink of an eye.

 

It was the start of a downward spiral that I think is finally stopping. The repercussions of VII will last a while longer yet.

 

But what people are not seeing is that we now have two beautiful Masses to attend (in some areas). They tend to see "my way is right and your way is wrong." And there are NOers who say that too, so I'm not directing this at the TLMers. The NOers complaints range from "why would anyone want to go back to that" to "English is best" and on and on.

 

The ordinary and the extraordinary are both valid forms of the Mass and we are free to pick which we attend (if the TLM is available in one's area). Neither is better. They are just different. At the center of both is the Eucharist, and that is what really matters.

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Elinor Everywhere, as someone with a soft spot for Anglicans, I say yes! Come on in! We'll read some T. S. Eliot, Kingsley, and Sayers, too along with Lewis. Of course I am not running this group so maybe I am overstepping boundaries, but I enjoy all those authors and find they are enriching spiritually.

 

 

Oh yay, thanks! :)

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My comment was to point out that the Catholic attitude is "We'd have you and you'd be welcome, but your own authorities say 'no.'" Whereas the Orthodox attitude is "You're not welcome unless you deny your tradition."

 

Or, "Join with us in unity, we'd love to have you, our arms are open to all." ;) We're not about being unwelcoming, but about protecting the chalice, which I think you know/understand. BTW, not even all Orthodox present can receive the Eucharist every time it's served.

 

I do again appreciate all that I've learned on this thread, and am so thankful that the Lord saw fit to bring open eyes and understanding of church history to my life. I was one that previously thought of the Catholic church as some kind of wrong variation of true Christianity. I did not know/understand that it (and the Orthodox church) had very real roots back into the New Testament. Glory to God for all things.

 

(Oh, and agreeing with Caitilin -- I've spent much time with Patty Joanna in real life, and I can say with certainty she was not trying at all to be flippant. I re-read the post and can see a different way of reading it. If it *was* flippant, you're right, we'd not really enjoy that over on our social group thread.)

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I'm guessing this is why the social groups started.

 

BTW, Chucki, in the even of an extreme case I'd have no issue in going to an Orthodox priest for the sacraments if the priest would let me.

 

My comment was to point out that the Catholic attitude is "We'd have you and you'd be welcome, but your own authorities say 'no.'" Whereas the Orthodox attitude is "You're not welcome unless you deny your tradition."

 

And you said it much better than I did in trying not to offend anyone.

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Or, "Join with us in unity, we'd love to have you, our arms are open to all." ;) We're not about being unwelcoming, but about protecting the chalice, which I think you know/understand. BTW, not even all Orthodox present can receive the Eucharist every time it's served.

 

 

 

We have some of the exact same rules for probably many of the exact same reasons. So, yes, we do (or at least I do) understand the need to protect the Precious.

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Well, not quite, because in the case of the RCC, we're not asking anyone to deny their tradition, whereas the OX are. And it's even more sad with the idea that you'd have to protect the chalice from the other lung, which is how the RCC see the OX.

 

And not to single you out, Mouse, but let's let this topic drop. There is no way it can end nicely.

 

I know a many if not all of us value our EO sisters and would hate it if there were a rift. It is enough that there is a rift between our traditions. No need for a rift among friends here.

 

So, let's find the next Catholic topic to discuss.

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I know a many if not all of us value our EO sisters and would hate it if there were a rift. It is enough that there is a rift between our traditions. No need for a rift among friends here.

 

Thank you for your kindness and generosity.

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I have found this thread very interesting, but also a little confusing. Is there somewhere that describes or compares the different groups (rites?) and liturgies that have been mentioned? A chart would be very helpful. :)

 

I know that some of the liturgies mentioned were not Catholic, but I didn't realize that there were that many different types of Mass.

 

TIA

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The ministry conference I went to awhile back had several talks on The Year of Faith. One of the big suggestions was to read through the documents on Vatican II. I have never read them all.

 

Would anyone be interested in reading and discussing them with me?

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The ministry conference I went to awhile back had several talks on The Year of Faith. One of the big suggestions was to read through the documents on Vatican II. I have never read them all.

 

Would anyone be interested in reading and discussing them with me?

With hesitation I would. (The hesitation is due to being so very far behind in my reading of the CCC that I'm afraid of committing to something else. But then again, I'd love to read at least some of them.) And speaking of the CCC, is anyone else still reading (or trying to read) it this year?

 

And can I just complain for a very quick moment? I love my parish. Both our priests are very nice, and I adore our parish sister. I am very, very thankful that my children's first experience with priests and sisters is so amazingly positive. That said, though, it is as if the Year of Faith isn't even happening. :( There has not been one mention of it. No special Bible studies/groups. Not even a "hey, did you know Holy Father named this the Year of Faith? Here are a couple resources for you" thing. Going on my archdiocese's website, it seems the whole archdiocese is approaching it the same way ... by basically appearing as if it's not happening. It just makes me sad that such a potential unifying and faith building opportunity for our entire parish is being ignored. Ok, complaint over. Because really, I do love my parish and am so thankful to God for leading us there.

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I have found this thread very interesting, but also a little confusing. Is there somewhere that describes or compares the different groups (rites?) and liturgies that have been mentioned? A chart would be very helpful. :)

 

I know that some of the liturgies mentioned were not Catholic, but I didn't realize that there were that many different types of Mass.

 

TIA

Sure. Let me see if I can sort it out for you. I'm a bit confused myself.

 

Within the Catholic Church there are 7 rites.

 

The Alexandrian includes the Coptic and Ethiopian Rites

The Antiochian includes the Maronite, Western Syrian and the Syro-Malankara Rites

The Armenian Rite

The Chaldean or Eastern Syran tradition includes the Chaldean and the Syro-Malabar Rite

The Byzantine Rite

The Latin Rite which includes the Roman rite (most US Catholics belong here), the Ambrosian Rite, the Aquiline Rite, the Rite of Braga and Mozarabic rite

 

Looking at the Latin - Roman Rite we have several traditional masses.

The Pr-Tridentine mass (pre 1570)

The Tridentine mass (1570-1970)

The Mass of Paul VI (1970 to present) aka Norvos Ordo which in English means New Order of the Mass.

The Anglican use which is specific to the Anglican churches in communion with Rome.

 

After Vatican II the Mass of Paul VI (aka the NO mass) became widely used as the Ordinary Form of the Mass. As I mentioned earlier change is not easy. There were a lot of people who wanted the Tridintine mass back. (The Tridintine mass is also knows as the Traditional Latin Mass - TLM) So the Bishops agreed that the TLM could be used with permission in certain churches. But it was not to be the norm. So it became the Extraordinary Form of the Mass.

 

There is a bit of bristling between the TLMers and the NOers. I imagine the same thing happend in 1570 when the mass was changed then.

 

Without going back to read allt he posts again, There is one lady who has numerous churches available to her. She goes to the the Roman rite and the Byzantine rite (I think that was it) along with the EO rite called the Divine Liturgy.

 

The EO church has several churches in communion. If you scroll down about 3/4 of the way you'll find the listing of them.

 

The Catholic Church and the Orthodox Catholic Church ( informally called the EO here) were the one ancient church that Jesus founded. The Great Schism occurred in 1054 that split the church into two churches. The RC says they left, the EO says we left. Greater theologists than I debate the split with regularity. I'm not about to go there in this thread. But you can look into it if you are so inclined.

 

Did I answer your question or did I just give you more questions?

 

ETA: No, I didn't have all of this in my head. I presented quite a bit of it to my confirmation class about 3 weeks ago so it was fresh and I used my notes. :coolgleamA:

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The ministry conference I went to awhile back had several talks on The Year of Faith. One of the big suggestions was to read through the documents on Vatican II. I have never read them all.

 

Would anyone be interested in reading and discussing them with me?

Sure. I have to familiarize myself with them for my confirmation class in a couple weeks.

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With hesitation I would. (The hesitation is due to being so very far behind in my reading of the CCC that I'm afraid of committing to something else. But then again, I'd love to read at least some of them.) And speaking of the CCC, is anyone else still reading (or trying to read) it this year?

 

And can I just complain for a very quick moment? I love my parish. Both our priests are very nice, and I adore our parish sister. I am very, very thankful that my children's first experience with priests and sisters is so amazingly positive. That said, though, it is as if the Year of Faith isn't even happening. :( There has not been one mention of it. No special Bible studies/groups. Not even a "hey, did you know Holy Father named this the Year of Faith? Here are a couple resources for you" thing. Going on my archdiocese's website, it seems the whole archdiocese is approaching it the same way ... by basically appearing as if it's not happening. It just makes me sad that such a potential unifying and faith building opportunity for our entire parish is being ignored. Ok, complaint over. Because really, I do love my parish and am so thankful to God for leading us there.

Wow. That is odd. I'm already just about sick of hearing about it in my parish.

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Speaking of Vatican II, why was it necessary? Can anyone point me in the direction of a site that breaks down both Vatican Council I and II for me, in laymen's terms?

 

Thanks :)

 

This summary of VII seems pretty accurate.

 

And here is the article on the First Vatican Council.

 

Those are a decent start.,

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My parish is having a few speakers come in, but that is about it. We already have regular Bible studies, and they just brought in Christ Renews His Parish. And Why Catholic has one more session to go this Spring.

 

I keep toying with offering adult ed stuff outside of RCIA, but it is really hard to get people to commit, especially if they are doing something else. I would love to see apologetics get started. Don't get me wrong. I do appreciate that we offer those other things, but I personally would like something deeper. It seems like everything we do is beginner level, no matter how long it goes on.

 

 

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Unfortunately, given the crisis of catechisis (sp?) in the last fifty years or so, the beginning level is what is most urgently needed. That's why parishes tend to devote the most resources to that aspect of adult faith formation.

 

I understand that. There is always a need for beginning level adult faith formation. But I think we underestimate people when we never progress beyond that.

 

We have offered the exact same Bible study for 12 years. The parish has had three cycles of it, with a lot of the same people participating. The people who really need the catechesis don't come, no matter what we offer. I would just like to see an opportunity for growth and not just recycling of the same materials and topics. We are certainly a big enough parish for that, and it seems a shame to have Why Catholic as the only thing offered to the faithful, catechized Catholics we do have.

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Would you then recommend taking classes at a bigger RC than the local parish? We have a big one about 1/2 an hour away (over 4,000 families)?

 

If you are talking about RCIA, I think it depends on the parish. I have seen some very small parishes offer great RCIA programs. If you go, and the fit feels wrong, there is nothing wrong with trying another parish. We are not limited to the parish most local to us any more. Usually, the cathedrals and larger parishes have more resources and can offer bigger programs. And they are a great place to start, if you have one close to you. But don't automatically rule out a parish RCIA just based on size.

 

For adult faith formation, the cathedral and larger parishes usually have more opportunities. But not always. And you don't have to limit your participation in these just to your home parish. If your parish does not have the adult opportunities you need, it is fine to attend those programs at another parish.

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Sorry, the ipad won't let me finish my post for some reason!

 

The only caveat that I have is that where ever you are choosing as a home parish, make sure you will belong to it as home. Make sure that, even if you do attend another parish for Bible study, etc., you still have opportunities to participate in the life of your home parish. You need to meet people and get involved in the community where you attend Mass, if at all possible. It makes a huge difference, IMO, especially for people transitioning from another Christian tradition. You need that sense of community and supoort and opportunities for growth and service. If none of that is at your closest parish, then you need to find another one.

 

I just know that for me, I am a lot more likely to actively participate at a closer parish than one I have to drive to. So you have to know yourself and weigh that carefully also.

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Vatican II was a pastoral council -- I think the first one the Church has ever had. It didn't define any doctrines, and certainly didn't change the faith, but was interested in finding ways to share the riches of Catholicism more effectively with people in the modern world.

 

There are concerns (and not just among "traditionalists") that some of the documents contain passages that are vaguely written and open to misinterpretation. Certainly, the false "spirit of Vatican II" has been invoked to justify all kinds of flaky and sometimes heretical ideas. But Church history shows us that the 50 years after a council are always turbulent. We've just reached the 50th anniversary of Vatican II this year -- and the 20th anniversary of the publication of the CCC, which brought a lot of much-needed clarity to the situation -- so hopefully things will be looking up from here on.

 

The Council itself is too big a subject to get into in depth here. I'll just say that the Holy Father has reminded us of the need to understand it in an authentic Catholic way -- one that's continuous with our tradition of centuries past, and not a departure from it.

 

I definitely agree with the suggestion of reading the actual documents, especially the major ones, e.g. Gaudium et Spes, Lumen Gentium, Dei Verbum, and Sacrosanctum Concilium. Lots to think about there. :)

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Wanna do a Catholic themed reading challenge for 2013? This might be cheating a bit because I tend to do a lot of Catholic related reading anyway, but I thought it might fun to do an official reading challenge for next year. I noticed both Robin of Mytwoblessings and Jean of Howling Frog Books have both posted in this thread! Wanna brainstorm with me? Like maybe have 10 books out of the 52 that have to be Catholic in some way. Maybe read 1 saint biography, 1 book on theology, 1 book written by a pope, maybe a couple of novels written by well known Catholic authors (Chesterton, Flannery O'Conner, Waugh, Grahame Greene, etc.), maybe try to read completely an Old Testament book and a New Testament book, 1 book that focuses on contemporary Catholic issues, 1 book on history, 1 book a contemporary Catholic author (Kreeft, Martin, Hahn, etc).

 

What categories would you come up with?

 

 

Hey Faith, I'm assuming you wanted the faith based reads to be an optional mini challenge of the 52 books challenge so I mentioned it over in the Book a Week thread, since had planned on doing a C.S. Lewis read anyway. Yes? Or were you wanting to make it part of the social group to discuss there if and when they come back up? I'm flexible.

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Let's all take a breath and sing the Anglican Fight Song! To the tune of "God Bless America," nono can lead us, a one and a two....

 

I am an Anglican

I'm C of E

Not a high church

Nor a low church

But Protestant and Catholic and free!

Not a Presby

Nor a Lutheran

Nor a Baptist, white with foam

But I am an Anglican

Just two steps from Rrrrrrrome!

I am an Anglican!

Via media! Boom boom!

 

(Next up: "Long Live the Pope!" http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=12ETqFuKJAg&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D12ETqFuKJAg )

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My parish is having a few speakers come in, but that is about it. We already have regular Bible studies, and they just brought in Christ Renews His Parish. And Why Catholic has one more session to go this Spring.

 

I keep toying with offering adult ed stuff outside of RCIA, but it is really hard to get people to commit, especially if they are doing something else. I would love to see apologetics get started. Don't get me wrong. I do appreciate that we offer those other things, but I personally would like something deeper. It seems like everything we do is beginner level, no matter how long it goes on.

.

 

A few years ago we started our own adult apologetics group. We took turns hosting it in our homes, once a month on a Sunday afternoon. First we had a pot luck meal and then the kids would go off to play while adults studied the early Church Fathers or Church councils or Scripture. Teens were welcome to sit in on the study part. We collaborated to come up with topics. It was wonderful! After a few years it sort of fizzled out and I miss the fellowship and thoughtful discussions. I'm thinking of trying to revive it. It was really not that hard to organize, and people would come back after experiencing it. We didn't have to drag them there!

 

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Let's all take a breath and sing the Anglican Fight Song! To the tune of "God Bless America," nono can lead us, a one and a two....

 

I am an Anglican

I'm C of E

Not a high church

Nor a low church

But Protestant and Catholic and free!

Not a Presby

Nor a Lutheran

Nor a Baptist, white with foam

But I am an Anglican

Just two steps from Rrrrrrrome!

I am an Anglican!

Via media! Boom boom!

 

(Next up: "Long Live the Pope!" http://m.youtube.com...h?v=12ETqFuKJAg )

Oh. My. Word. :laugh: :thumbup1:

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