Math and going back to PS

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

DS1 wants to go back to school in 6th grade. He's now currently in 4th grade. I don't want him to think I'm not "letting" him go to school, so I agreed he could go back. I've been trying to talk him into going back in 5th grade, though, because I think it will be much easier on him to go back when they still have recess and eat lunch with their class and don't have to change classes and have lockers, etc., like they do in 6th grade. He is my Aspie, and too many adjustments at once will send him over the edge.

 

Even with going back to 5th grade, it might be too much, and then I will let him come back home, but in case he likes it and thrives and wants to stay, I have a question.

 

We've been doing MUS for the past 3 years. We are on Delta this year, which is all about division. As most of you know, MUS's focus is very narrow, but deep. Our school system uses Everyday Math, which has a wider, but much more shallow focus. So, anyway, I purchased a test prep book to see what 4th graders are expected to know according to the common core stuff, and there are several things we haven't learned, yet, like adding and subtracting fractions, for example.

 

Finally, the question- should I keep plugging along with MUS Delta, or should I branch out and cover the stuff in the test prep book, just in case he really likes going to school?

[caroljenn]

I would make sure he knows everything (and more) that they know. Use the test book as your guide, and get at least the 5th grade one to go off of as well. If he is solid in math, it will make his transition that much easier when he gets there.

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

Suggestions for materials to use for fractions and decimals? Should I get MUS Epsilon and Zeta and try to do them simultaneously with Delta? It seems like fractions and decimals figure prominently in this test prep book. Other ideas?

[ccolopy]

The dark blue books from Math Mammoth might be easier to move through quickly than MUS Epsilon and Zeta. I'm considering switching DD out of MUS after Delta, and that's my plan right now.

[Susan in KY]

Suggestions for materials to use for fractions and decimals? Should I get MUS Epsilon and Zeta and try to do them simultaneously with Delta? It seems like fractions and decimals figure prominently in this test prep book. Other ideas?

Use Singapore Math. You can get some free materials from Singapore's Ministry of Education website, but definitely get the text books and trace the trajectory up though 4th grade. Make all of his learning very hands-on. By the time you get through the 4th grade materials he will have a strong handle on fractions. Decimals are taught using fractions. It is one of the most elegant presentations of part/whole concepts I have ever had the pleasure of teaching.

[Deniseibase]

I've tutored ps kids who have used Everyday Math. The treatment of fractions in 4th grade is very brief and shallow. In fact, my most recent 4th grade student, after spending extra sessions with me for two weeks to give her a better understanding of the fractions material they are covering, then came on the third week and announced that the teacher said the entire class will skip the fractions test because nobody understood it. (Yes, really.)

 

One of the core ideas of Everyday Math is that lots of topics get covered every year, very lightly, and the theory is that eventually it will sink in from repeated exposure, even if that exposure is very light. In other words, it is the exact opposite of what you have been doing with MUS. But, the good news there is that any gaps in his math knowledge that he has from using a different curriculum, those topics will be covered again in 5th grade.

 

That said, whatever you want to do to help him prepare will certainly help. But I think, if he is Aspie, just preparing him for the extreme change in curriculum style may be important - it may be particularly difficult for him to transition to a style where he is only expected to approach a topic very superficially when he is used to going in depth. And the pace of Everyday Mathematics is bizarrely fast in some spots - like the 4th grade fractions unit, I remember one day my student came over with a worksheet where she had to color in, say, 3/4 of a square, and two days later she had a worksheet where they were supposed to add fractions with different denominators. She was in tears, and I don't blame her. But all these areas where things move really fast like that always end up being things that will be gone over in slightly more depth the next year. But it's amazingly frustrating to work like that for a kid who expects to really understand a topic before moving on.

[creekland]

Everyday Math is horrible IMO. I liked it when my son first started using it because it seemed like they were doing a ton more advanced. In reality, the kids weren't getting the more advanced stuff (other than naming polygons) and were losing out on the basics. We've had VERY poor math knowledge come up to the high school. EM encourages calculator use from very early on, so kids learn to memorize what buttons to push. Those without a good memory do very, very poorly. They neither know the math/concepts nor remember what button to push and when.

 

My suggestion would actually be to keep afterschooling with REAL math and you could introduce fractions now so he won't be totally new to them when they cover it later. Seriously though, when I was doing 8th grade math, very, very few understood fractions coming from EM. They aren't any better in high school. They are only "ok" if allowed to use their calculators (that do fractions in fraction form for them).

 

EM might drive an Aspie crazy unless their brain naturally works that way. Most Aspies at our school are driven crazy by it... They figure the math out their own way, but that's not acceptable in the program... unless you end up with a kind teacher. EM gets picky on the details - done the way the book wants them done. They also require group projects and like group projects pretty much anywhere in ps, one or two will do the work, the rest freeload and only learn copying skills. If someone disagrees with the group - too bad for them. They still get the score the group gets (even if their work would have been correct - the group overruled it).

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

I've tutored ps kids who have used Everyday Math. The treatment of fractions in 4th grade is very brief and shallow. In fact, my most recent 4th grade student, after spending extra sessions with me for two weeks to give her a better understanding of the fractions material they are covering, then came on the third week and announced that the teacher said the entire class will skip the fractions test because nobody understood it. (Yes, really.)

 

One of the core ideas of Everyday Math is that lots of topics get covered every year, very lightly, and the theory is that eventually it will sink in from repeated exposure, even if that exposure is very light. In other words, it is the exact opposite of what you have been doing with MUS. But, the good news there is that any gaps in his math knowledge that he has from using a different curriculum, those topics will be covered again in 5th grade.

 

That said, whatever you want to do to help him prepare will certainly help. But I think, if he is Aspie, just preparing him for the extreme change in curriculum style may be important - it may be particularly difficult for him to transition to a style where he is only expected to approach a topic very superficially when he is used to going in depth. And the pace of Everyday Mathematics is bizarrely fast in some spots - like the 4th grade fractions unit, I remember one day my student came over with a worksheet where she had to color in, say, 3/4 of a square, and two days later she had a worksheet where they were supposed to add fractions with different denominators. She was in tears, and I don't blame her. But all these areas where things move really fast like that always end up being things that will be gone over in slightly more depth the next year. But it's amazingly frustrating to work like that for a kid who expects to really understand a topic before moving on.

 

 

 

Everyday Math is horrible IMO. I liked it when my son first started using it because it seemed like they were doing a ton more advanced. In reality, the kids weren't getting the more advanced stuff (other than naming polygons) and were losing out on the basics. We've had VERY poor math knowledge come up to the high school. EM encourages calculator use from very early on, so kids learn to memorize what buttons to push. Those without a good memory do very, very poorly. They neither know the math/concepts nor remember what button to push and when.

 

My suggestion would actually be to keep afterschooling with REAL math and you could introduce fractions now so he won't be totally new to them when they cover it later. Seriously though, when I was doing 8th grade math, very, very few understood fractions coming from EM. They aren't any better in high school. They are only "ok" if allowed to use their calculators (that do fractions in fraction form for them).

 

EM might drive an Aspie crazy unless their brain naturally works that way. Most Aspies at our school are driven crazy by it... They figure the math out their own way, but that's not acceptable in the program... unless you end up with a kind teacher. EM gets picky on the details - done the way the book wants them done. They also require group projects and like group projects pretty much anywhere in ps, one or two will do the work, the rest freeload and only learn copying skills. If someone disagrees with the group - too bad for them. They still get the score the group gets (even if their work would have been correct - the group overruled it).

 

 

Thanks for both of these replies. Everyday Math was one of the things that drove me crazy about the ps when my kids were in K and 1st. It was so ridiculous. I think I'm going to keep going with MUS and supplement with some fractions and decimals one day a week. He dislikes math to begin with, so I don't want to frustrate him too much. I'm just worried that he'll be viewed as "behind" in math because the people I dealt with before in the school system were a little obtuse about certain things, and would not understand that we've had a different scope and sequence in math. In fact, I'm pretty sure the principal of the old school would not even understand the meanings of the words "scope" and "sequence". :glare: But, I digress.

 

I went through the whole IEP process with him when he was in 2nd grade, even though I was homeschooling at the time, just to see what services would be available to him if he were at the school. I'm fairly confident that I could get some allowances in the math department written in to his IEP. In fact, if he thrives at school but finds math to be a challenge, I may see if I can get him to be "excused" from the math instruction at school and just keep afterschooling him in MUS. My hope is that he realizes the benefits of homeschooling over public school and wants to return home. He has started a list of pros and cons of going back to school, and it's pretty much neck and neck right now in his mind.

[merry gardens]

If you are happy with the math program that you are using, I'd stick with it for the rest of the school year, (especially since the material you've chose sounds stronger than the school's.) The summer before sending him back to public school, I'd compare what he knows to what he's expected to know for school. In all likelihood, he can catch him on anything he'd need for public school over the summer.