I started researching nursing homes for my dad, and now I'm terrified.

[*********]

If you've ever had to pick a nursing home for someone, please, I need help.

 

I just looked up the nursing home my mom has selected for dad. It gets a ONE out of five star rating from the Medicare review site. That's the LOWEST possible rating.

 

I have no idea what criteria mom used to pick this place, but there is NO way I want dad there.

 

Now, to be fair, there are only TWO nursing homes in the whole city Flint (where they live) that get either 4 or 5 stars.

 

I don't know what to do. Of course I'll talk to mom about it, but knowing her, it won't matter. She's already picked it out. What resources should I point her to to help her find a different one?

 

I'm just freaking out a little here.

[Impish]

There are a few issues at hand.

 

I can tell you, from a staff pov, what to look for, what to ask. Clueless about from a resident/family pov though.

 

First, availability. Some places have waiting lists. I don't know, but perhaps that's a factor...this may have been the only available space.

 

Ask about staffing ratios. Training. Turnover. Certifications. Wages. Is it a union shop?

 

Absolutely go on a tour. Use all your senses. Does it smell like urine? (Seriously, I went in one place for a job interview, and the smell walking in the door had me refuse the offer). Look at the residents. Do they look cared for? Ask about rehab programs, social/recreational programs, dietary programs. Eat in the dining room. Ask how often residents get bathed. (Pretty much everywhere I worked, ppl who weren't independant on their ADL were tub bathed 1x/wk, but bed baths were x2 a day, morning and night...bed baths incl face, hands, peri area). Is there a locked ward? Folks w/dementia allowed to wander are a safety risk.

 

Ask about the rating. Any reviews they've had recently, what the problems were, how they've been addressed. You could likely also find out that info from whoever does the inspections/reviews...pretty sure that's to be public knowledge.

 

I'm not fully caffeinated yet, so if I think of any more, I'll be back.

[Abeille]

I don't know much about picking a nursing home, but I do know from personal experience (I trained and was licensed as a nurse's aide, though I didn't end up working as one) that one of the best things you can do for a family member in a nursing home is to remain an active part of their lives. Visit often at varied times, get to know your resident's caregivers, and don't be shy about asking questions. Staying involved helps ensure your family member will get the best care possible, and will also allow you to identify any problems quickly. I believe that most nursing home staff truly care about their residents and do their best for them. However, once you see the workloads at most facilities you realize that staff often just don't have the time to provide the superior level of care we all want our loved ones to receive.

 

I'm sorry you're having to go through this with your dad. I can only imagine how scary and stressful it is for you. :grouphug:

[*********]

OH MY WORD.

 

I texted my mom to ask how she picked the nursing home because it gets awful reviews.

 

Because it's close. That's how. She did NO research.

 

I feel physically ill.

[Impish]

I'm sorry, Bethany. :grouphug:

[hana]

Bethany,

 

You are right that the choices in the area are scary--you might have seen my comments in your other post. MediLodge in Montrose is supposed to be AMAZING (at least in comparison to others around)! (I know that will seem far to your mother, but, trust me, it would be worth the drive--If I had it to do again, I would have had my partner go there and paid out of pocket--that's how strongly I feel about it. But we were only looking at two weeks.) My visit there was really good, and I have two friends who have had loved ones there, who were quite satisfied. Other MediLodge are NOT good--my resilient/tough partner stayed at the one in Howell (because we couldn't find a good one covered by our insurance in the Flint area) and she called crying just hours after being there, needing me to get her released. It was 3 stars on the Medicare site.

 

I have a friend who stayed at Coldwater Place (he said Briarwood, but he said it was at Coldwater and Genesee, so maybe it's part of the chain?). He was satisfied, but he was there for shoulder rehab, so was quite mobile, and he's VERY social.

 

Do NOT choose one (if you end up having any voice) without spending some time there. Seriously. I thought I had one chosen, then went to visit and it was an unclean, sad nightmare.

 

Honestly, if I were in your shoes, I would see if MediLodge in Flushing is covered by your dad's insurance; if so, see if they have beds available for his needs; and visit them. If that one can't work, insist that your mom actually go and visit the nursing home she's considering. Go with her if you can.

 

Oh, is in-home care an option?

 

You're in my thoughts,

Hannah

[aggieamy]

Can you casually let her know you'll put her in the same nursing home your dad went to when the time comes? When we looked for homes for DHs parents that thought helped me really do my research.

[Juniper]

Here is one little trick I learned back in the day. Make sure you or a family member marks the undersides of his bed sheets with a line everytime you visit. If they are changing sheets and bedding appropriately, when you come for the next visit the mark will be gone. If he goes way to long without change, you will have a way to prove it. If it happens, you call in the head of nursing and show her your "proof." This will clue the nursing staff into the fact that you guys are staying on top of his care.

[*********]

Can you casually let her know you'll put her in the same nursing home your dad went to when the time comes? When we looked for homes for DHs parents that thought helped me really do my research.

 

 

I'm not sure if this was supposed to be funny, but my not-quite-right sense of humor found it hilarious.

 

Mom HAS been to this nursing home before. A few years ago, she used to take her dog, who is a 'certified therapy dog' to visit residents there.

 

NO, she wasn't looking at how good of a nursing home it was. She picked that nursing home to volunteer her dog at because it's closest to her house. That's it.

 

But you see, the fact that she's actually BEEN there before means it's ok.

 

I'm just disgusted. And I can't decide if dad would be better off at an absolutely awful nursing home, or at home with mom.

 

I'm sorry, but at this point, if dad dies before mom, she can pick her own friggin' nursing home.

 

(I told you I was struggling with my feelings toward my mom.)

[elegantlion]

Right now my dh is working as maintenance in a nursing home. I wouldn't put my dog in the facility he works at because of their numerous issues, not with patient care, but business and mis management. You should be able to find complaints against a facility online. At least in our state those are public information.

 

Honestly, I'd tour some facilities and stop some of the non-medical staff and ask if they'd put a family member in the home. You might not get replies, you might get canned replies, but observing body language and such might help you make a decision. Not very tactful, but when you are entrusting the care of a loved one to a facility, I wouldn't give a rip about etiquette.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Can you involve the social worker at this point? Can she help your mom see that she should do more homework on this issue? I would tell her that you were disappointed that she couldn't care enough to do even the most cursory research on this and that your dad deserves better. I'd be flippin mad about this as well. When my mom need rehab after a broken pelvis, I visited 8 places. The one closest to my house is the place I absolutely did NOT want her to go - we go caroling there every Christmas and the conditions get worse as the years go by.

[*********]

The frustration is that mom is going to do what mom wants to do. She won't pick another nursing home for dad, regardless of what I want or do.

 

The only *possible* way I could get dad to NOT go to the awful nursing home mom has picked is to tell dad how awful it is. That would be my only chance of changing anything. But if I do that, first of all I have no assurances mom would actually do anything different. So I could end up upsetting dad, totally ticking mom off, and he'd end up there anyway.

 

Seriously, if I say anything to dad about it being a bad nursing home, mom will be LIVID. My only hope would be that dad would refuse to go there, forcing mom to pick a better place.

 

I guess my best course is to just stay as involved as I can. I HAVE alerted my sister about how bad the place is.

 

I'm mostly just disgusted at how my mom is making decisions regarding dad's care. It makes me angry, and it makes me worry even more about dad.

[*********]

Can you involve the social worker at this point? Can she help your mom see that she should do more homework on this issue? I would tell her that you were disappointed that she couldn't care enough to do even the most cursory research on this and that your dad deserves better. I'd be flippin mad about this as well. When my mom need rehab after a broken pelvis, I visited 8 places. The one closest to my house is the place I absolutely did NOT want her to go - we go caroling there every Christmas and the conditions get worse as the years go by.

 

 

I can't say anything like that to mom. Because she'll start cutting me out.

 

My older sister has quit communicating with mom because of how upset she is. It's gotten absurd. My older sister is at the hospital with dad either two or three days a week. My mother WORKS there at the hospital. And still the two of them do not communicate regarding dad's care. Sister just can't take mom anymore. She's staying involved as she can with DAD, while cutting out mom as much as she can for her own sanity.

 

Well, mom doesn't like it. Of course mom won't talk to sister about it. They've just stopped talking.

 

It's all very sad, twisted, and involved. But I can only say that if I say anything mom deems as 'offensive', she'll stop telling me stuff at all. I feel stuck.

[Stacy in NJ]

Find two alternatives and go visit them yourself. Schedule a visit for both you and your mom with the best facility. Explain to your mom why you're not comfortable with her choice and insist she consider the alternative.

 

That's the very best you can do in the circumstances.

 

People tend to do what is most convenient and easiest particularly when they're stressed out. Show her that she has alternatives. Possibly she won't listen to you and will choose the wrong place, but, at least you will have tried to actively look after your father's interests.

[Impish]

I don't get why your mother is the only one making this decision. Your dad hasn't been declared incompetant, so he should get a say.

[Danestress]

Proximity is important.

 

When my dad clearly needed a nursing home, my mom picked the "best" one. It was very fancy, beautiful, well reviewed - where our wealthy citizens go in town.

 

I hated it. To start with, it wad big and my dad was easily confused, What is more, it was 25 minutes from my home, in the opposite direction of all our other activities. I knew I would only see him a couple of times a week. It wasn't much nearer to my mom, and she was healthy, but getting older, and I worried that she would end up not visiting as much. There were other things I didn't like, too, but those are the relevant ones for this discussion,

 

I convinced her to tour a place very near our homes. It was smaller, cozier, but more budget conscious. The food wasn't as nice, place was homey but not impressive looking. I don't know what the rating was, but it would have been fine. The staff was great.

 

My mom agreed to put him there. It was hard because she wanted to able to say she put him in the best place. But in the second rate place, He was five minutes from me. Until he died, I visited him almost every day, and my mom could too. In fact, we often would stop in for a second visit. I drove past it on many of my normal drives with the kids to activities, so we could pop in. I am sooooo glad we made that decision,

 

This is all to say that while your mom may be selfish, there is something to be said for picking a place near home. But not a place with a poor record that results in such a low rating. Keep looking, but don't discount proximity. It was a major factor in taking care of my dad.

[celticmom]

Can you involve the social worker at this point? Can she help your mom see that she should do more homework on this issue? I would tell her that you were disappointed that she couldn't care enough to do even the most cursory research on this and that your dad deserves better. I'd be flippin mad about this as well. When my mom need rehab after a broken pelvis, I visited 8 places. The one closest to my house is the place I absolutely did NOT want her to go - we go caroling there every Christmas and the conditions get worse as the years go by.

 

:iagree: Is there any way that your father can set something up with the social worker so that either you or your sister has to sign off on any major decisions such as this since she does not seem to be making the SAFEST decsions about your father's care?

[celticmom]

I don't get why your mother is the only one making this decision. Your dad hasn't been declared incompetant, so he should get a say.

 

:iagree:

[LMA]

Keep in mind many of the better nursing homes have waiting lists. I know many people who "picked" nursing homes for care and it turned out they had to go to whichever place had an opening.

 

There is also the issue of money. Nursing home care is paid by the patient as long as there are assets, such as a house and savings accounts. Your mother will be paying a lot, like thousands.

 

Her point about the place being close is a valid point (never mind it's rating) because going back and forth to a nursing home is taxing on the family. So it is better to pick a close place although you may want to find one with a better rating, if possible. It is stressful driving on a regular basis. My friend has gone three times a week for her MIL for 12 years and the nursing home is only 4 miles away, but it was still a lot of stress on her. And she was glad the nursing home was close.

 

The other thing is that sometimes you have to accept that certain things are out of your control unless your mother gives you control of your father. And sometimes it's not worth stressing about.

[Harriet Vane]

I don't get why your mother is the only one making this decision. Your dad hasn't been declared incompetant, so he should get a say.

 

 

Bethany, I understand the hard position you are in with your mom. :grouphug:

 

This is really, really important. Can you get the social worker to be the bad guy on this one? Or a pastor? Do some research, especially driving distance from you and your mom and your sister so that you have cold, hard facts at your disposal.

 

Can you get your dad to authorize the medical professionals to keep you in the loop on decisions?

[TranquilMind]

If you've ever had to pick a nursing home for someone, please, I need help.

 

I just looked up the nursing home my mom has selected for dad. It gets a ONE out of five star rating from the Medicare review site. That's the LOWEST possible rating.

 

I have no idea what criteria mom used to pick this place, but there is NO way I want dad there.

 

Now, to be fair, there are only TWO nursing homes in the whole city Flint (where they live) that get either 4 or 5 stars.

 

I don't know what to do. Of course I'll talk to mom about it, but knowing her, it won't matter. She's already picked it out. What resources should I point her to to help her find a different one?

 

I'm just freaking out a little here.

 

 

I'd copy and send to here exactly what you found.

 

I have been a caregiver, but I only had one living parent. Is there any way that she can get some help at home with your Dad? It would be cheaper and easier, and most older people do much better in familiar surroundings (not applicable if he is hooked up to heavy-duty medical stuff, of course). I just hired three ladies part time to help me out, as I had toddlers. It worked great for all and we were eventually able to reduce down to one, only three times a week. Side story: one of the widowed caregivers met her new husband while taking care of my Mom, so that was a nice little bonus to this job.

[TranquilMind]

 

I'm mostly just disgusted at how my mom is making decisions regarding dad's care. It makes me angry, and it makes me worry even more about dad.

 

 

Why is Mom making this decision? Is your Dad incompetent? If not, any decision is his, not hers.

[Impish]

Given that your mother works in health care, I have to say, I'm honestly stunned that she's being so...apathetic? about what facility she's choosing for her spouse. Anyone I've known that has worked in health care checks things out to the nth degree.

 

Perhaps you could stroke her ego a bit? Approach it from the perspective of, "I know how exhausting this has been for you, physically and emotionally, and that you want everything setlled. Could I help look into things a bit more, so that you're able to make the best choice possible for Dad?" Work it so you're helping her out, rather than your Dad, and that it's not a criticism.

 

Yeah, it's somewhat manipulative, but it may be the only approach that works.

[*********]

Given that your mother works in health care, I have to say, I'm honestly stunned that she's being so...apathetic? about what facility she's choosing for her spouse. Anyone I've known that has worked in health care checks things out to the nth degree.

 

Perhaps you could stroke her ego a bit? Approach it from the perspective of, "I know how exhausting this has been for you, physically and emotionally, and that you want everything setlled. Could I help look into things a bit more, so that you're able to make the best choice possible for Dad?" Work it so you're helping her out, rather than your Dad, and that it's not a criticism.

 

Yeah, it's somewhat manipulative, but it may be the only approach that works.

 

Impish, this is actually a fantastic idea, thank you.

 

Mom gave us no heads up on the nursing home. I feel like she was doing it behind me and my sister's backs. The first I heard of dad going to one was last week. She just now texted me that he's moving TODAY.

[Impish]

Impish, this is actually a fantastic idea, thank you.

 

Mom gave us no heads up on the nursing home. I feel like she was doing it behind me and my sister's backs. The first I heard of dad going to one was last week. She just now texted me that he's moving TODAY.

Holy hannah.

 

I'm sorry, Bethany. :grouphug:

[Lisbeth]

The frustration is that mom is going to do what mom wants to do. She won't pick another nursing home for dad, regardless of what I want or do.

 

The only *possible* way I could get dad to NOT go to the awful nursing home mom has picked is to tell dad how awful it is. That would be my only chance of changing anything. But if I do that, first of all I have no assurances mom would actually do anything different. So I could end up upsetting dad, totally ticking mom off, and he'd end up there anyway.

 

Seriously, if I say anything to dad about it being a bad nursing home, mom will be LIVID. My only hope would be that dad would refuse to go there, forcing mom to pick a better place.

 

I guess my best course is to just stay as involved as I can. I HAVE alerted my sister about how bad the place is.

 

I'm mostly just disgusted at how my mom is making decisions regarding dad's care. It makes me angry, and it makes me worry even more about dad.

 

I would do this. Your mom is being very irresponsible from what I've read. I would tell dad and everyone in the family the rating and how she picked it. His well being trumps her emotions any day. :grouphug:

[Impish]

Problem is, once he's in there, how hard is it going to be to move him? I know around here, if they're in a 'safe' situation, they go to the bottom of every known list, period. Those who are at risk, safety wise, will always move ahead.

[Danestress]

I agree that his input should matter.

 

I wonder too if she is panicked by the costs. She may be worried about exhausting resources she will need when she is old. Perhaps you and your sister can offer to make up the financial difference between a nice place and a cheap one.

[TranquilMind]

Impish, this is actually a fantastic idea, thank you.

 

Mom gave us no heads up on the nursing home. I feel like she was doing it behind me and my sister's backs. The first I heard of dad going to one was last week. She just now texted me that he's moving TODAY.

 

What??? Wow.

 

Is this expected to be temporary?

[*********]

The nursing home is expected to be temporary.

 

However, I believe nothing anymore. I mean, dad was supposed to be on the ventilator for three days; he ended up on life support for three weeks.

 

My biggest worry right now is that dad is going to move to this nursing home and end up dying there. I don't know why I'm being so morbid about it, but that's what I'm worried about.

 

Mom's acting like he'll be there for a week or two or three, then be well enough to come home.

 

My mind just keeps going "What in the WORLD has happened to my dad?! He's going to a NURSING HOME?!"

[LMV]

Is he moving to a skilled nursing facility? That would be my guess based on what you have written in this post. In that case insurance will likely pay for that for a reasonable (or what they consider is reasonable) period for rehabilitation with the goal of him returning home (if he is unable to return home at that point then unless your parents have LTC insurance then they may need to pay out of pocket or apply for medicaid if he would qualify). Not all nursing homes are skilled facilities which may be complicating the process and it is possible that one of the places you think might be better is not suitable for his needs or is not a skilled facility at all. Here one of the best long term care facilities is not a skilled facility so there are many patients that they just can't take. If I was looking for somewhere to place my husband's grandfather I would pick that place. Unfortunately, if he needed anything beyond custodial care (which it sounds like your dad does) it wouldn't be suitable. Fortunately he's still cognitively intact, mobile, and spoiling my kids so I'm not making these decisions and I'm sorry you are in this situation. I hope this place is a good fit for your dad. We will keep your family in our prayers.

[Twigs]

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:

[MomatHWTK]

I have been through the loss of a parent so I don't say this to be cruel. But, I sense from many of your posts that you may still be in denial. I'm sorry. He is in poor health, he may not recover fully if ever. Things tend to move very quickly at a certain stage in life.

 

My mother tried to keep my father home, it was horrible for him emotionally as he was home but unable to be who he once was. It nearly killed her physically because a grown man is hard to move and care for on your own. When he fell, she had to call 911. Sometimes what we want just isn't something that is possible.

 

There are waiting lists for nursing homes, there are cost issues, there are travel issues. You can do all the research in the world and it still won't guarantee good care or a full recovery. Some things aren't in our hands.

 

Take the situation you are in, accept the power you have or do not have, and work from there. Swim with the flow and find the best route rather than trying to jump back over the rapids. KWIM? As others have said, those with the most frequent visitors are going be in the best position because there are extra hands to help the person and extra eyes to notice their needs. :grouphug:

[Heatherwith4]

No advice, but just :grouphug: and continued prayers.

[mumto2]

About 20 years ago dh's grandmother was a resident in a nursing home that was actually closed while she was there. It was in Oakland county. Obviously the ratings must have been low but not our descision. We did not want her in one--I had just been laid off and we wanted her in the apartment next door.

 

Because it was 5 minutes from our house and I popped in at least once a day. She received great care. It smelled great. The staff was friendly. Things were great until they closed it. She was moved a half hour away. The area was not convenient to anyone in the family. The ratings were OK. But I went on a pretty predictable basis and so did her daughter--I ended up driving mil usually because it was so far. Her care there was not good. I could list the things wrong with that place but will spare you. It was dreadful. If your mom can and will go often that is important. I know you have been visiting a couple of times a week. Vary your timing. Talk to the staff. Be very friendly. They made sure I knew the facility was closing way before mil got the official letter.LOL That made her furious!

[LMA]

I am a little confused. Your first post made it sound like it was a permanent move versus a rehabilitative stay move. Is your father getting rehabilitation after being in the hospital? If that is the case, you have a lot less to worry about. When patients are moved into rehab from a hospital stay, the place they can go to depends on which facility has an open bed that day. Usually, the care he will receive is to help him get home as opposed to a permanent stay in a nursing home. And picking a nursing home in this type of situation depends on what the hospital staff can find for the day. The number of beds for this type of care is limited in most facilities. Sometimes patients end up being across town from their home. Please keep this in mind and visit your father often in the facility to check on his care. Hugs and prayers for you.

[kalanamak]

Do you have hospital friends you can ask?

Every place I've practised "everyone" knew the pits from the palaces.

[EmilyK]

When this happened with my dad, my mom was really panicked about costs. He spent a lot of rehab time in and out of a nice place near her house, and location was really important to her. My mother's fears of financial ruin and caring for an invalid really changed her. It was completely debilitating and all consuming and she did very little planning ahead, but presented as competent enough that I couldn't make the decisions. So I feel your pain.

 

That said, if your dad is on health insurance or Medicare, the timing of a move from hospital to rehab, or rehab to home or nursing home, is really driven by the insurance companies. There is little notice and it happens quickly. I too felt that things were being spring on me -- and I did feel my mom didn't do enough to plan ahead -- but the truth was, there was little to no chance about timing. They would say to her "we're moving your husband to rehab in 2 days" etc.

 

Also, I don't know your parents' finances, but if this is not a rehab place, and is a semi-permanent nursing home, it will not be covered by health insurance or Medicare and the financial issues are huge. My parents couldn't qualify for Medicaid but couldn't afford a nursing home.