milovany Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Christianity is supposed to be about your experience with God and your relationship with God. If you end that because other people are annoying you ... well, it doesn't make any sense. It seems to me that you were being a Christian because other people were and not based on personal convictions. [NOTE - Please read entire thread; this one went a little roller-coastery.] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justLisa Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 [NOTE - Please read entire thread; this one went a little roller-coastery.] uh yeah..... And whatever. PEOPLE can definitely make religioun suck. But read an entire thread before you go quoting people. Wow I'm on a roll today! I think I've reached my quota of annoying already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luanne Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 It still sounds like you were basing your experience with Christ on other people and I was just pointing out that your experience with Christ should be based on your experience ALONE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 It still sounds like you were basing your experience with Christ on other people and I was just pointing out that your experience with Christ should be based on your experience ALONE.Agreed. If no churches existed I would still be a Christian. Because I belong to Jesus. I have friends that are Christians but not yet outwardly as they work out where to live, how to survive, how to not lose their children. But they belong to Jesus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milovany Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 (edited) Agreed. If no churches existed I would still be a Christian. Because I belong to Jesus. And yet, this is just. not. possible. It's like saying, "If there was no blood, I'd still be a human being." It's a non-sensical argument because bodies are a necessary part of blood and blood is a necessary part of bodies. The Church is the Body of Christ. It's a physical, tangible Body. That's why God gave us that analogy in the Scriptures. There just could be no Christianity without the church because starting the Holy Church is what Christ came to do. "On this rock, I will build my church." His supreme plan was for His life to lived out in communion with others through this living, breathing organism that is the church. Edited October 11, 2012 by milovaný Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosie_0801 Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 And yet, this is just. not. possible. It's like saying, "If there was no blood, I'd still be a human being." It's a non-sensical argument because bodies are a necessary part of blood and blood is a necessary part of bodies. The Church is the Body of Christ. It's a physical, tangible Body. That's why God gave us that analogy in the Scriptures. There just could be no Christianity without the church because starting the Holy Church is what Christ came to do. "On this rock, I will build my church." His supreme plan was for His life to lived out in communion with others through this living, breathing organism that is the church. I understand what Lovedtodeath means, I think. If my children both died, I'd still be a mother. Rosie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milovany Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 (edited) I understand what Lovedtodeath means, I think. If my children both died, I'd still be a mother. Rosie I can see that example as being true, and I'm especially loving it today since my oldest was born on this day. That is a situation that can actually occur in real life, though. What I was trying to say was that a situation where there is no church just can't occur; it's not possible. So the argument that you could still be a Christian even if there was no church is -- what do they call it in division? -- indeterminate or undefined. That's what I was trying to say with my analogy. Edited October 12, 2012 by milovaný Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KatA Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 I can see that example as being true, and I'm especially loving it today since my oldest was born on this day. That is a situation that can actually occur in real life, though. What I was trying to say was that a situation where there is no church just can't occur; it's not possible. So the argument that you could still be a Christian even if there was no church is -- what do they call it in division? -- indeterminate or undefined. That's what I was trying to say with my analogy. I wonder if I might take a stab at this. I think what LTD might have been referring to is a physical church building. If my local area were to come under a wave of persecution and all the church buildings were burned or destroyed, my faith would be the same, because my faith is in Christ. I also strongly believe in the communal meeting and fellowship of believers. There is no lone Christian, IMO. But, if there were no church buildings, there would still be believers. And those believers would still meet, and the "church" would never disappear. Yes, I agree that the church (a community of believers) is a constant. But again I think what LTD was referring to was the church building, or a physical building to meet. God provides. Yahweh-yireh. Just my 2 cents. If no churches existed I would still be a Christian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 What I was trying to say was that a situation where there is no church just can't occur; it's not possible.I see.I wonder if I might take a stab at this. I think what LTD might have been referring to is a physical church building. If my local area were to come under a wave of persecution and all the church buildings were burned or destroyed, my faith would be the same, because my faith is in Christ. Yes I was speaking of a church building and there is a time for many (length indeterminate) when in their world they are the only Christian. I believe that many have started out that way (like me) and others have been put in isolation. Jesus didn't want me to choose to be without a church though, and since I was already relying on him, I listen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 (edited) Actually how it happened for me, I was the lone Christian at first, having jumped into Jesus' arms, I still believed that EVERY church/denomination is Babylon the Great. And then after trying to go to a church for a while I posted this: http://onemediator.blogspot.com/2012/09/do-not-forsake-gathering-of-yourselves.html And this is where I am now: http://onemediator.blogspot.com/search/label/My%20personal%20story%20and%20thoughts Edited October 12, 2012 by Lovedtodeath Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whereneverever Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 Actually how it happened for me, I was the lone Christian at first, having jumped into Jesus' arms, I still believed that EVERY church/denomination is Babylon the Great. And then after trying to go to a church for a while I posted this: http://onemediator.blogspot.com/2012/09/do-not-forsake-gathering-of-yourselves.html And this is where I am now: http://onemediator.blogspot.com/search/label/My%20personal%20story%20and%20thoughts Thanks for sharing. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milovany Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 My humble apologies! Knowing LTD's background (prior to conversion), and with my own predisposition in this area (post conversion), I did assume it was meant if there was no overall church, not just no local parish/congregation. Not having a local parish would be difficult, but not utterly impossible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 My humble apologies! Knowing LTD's background (prior to conversion), and with my own predisposition in this area (post conversion), I did assume it was meant if there was no overall church, not just no local parish/congregation. Not having a local parish would be difficult, but not utterly impossible.What's funny is that most often when people have that misunderstanding with me they say I am using the term church incorrectly because it means body of believers, and therefore... they don't need to go to a church. Both meanings are correct and I use both meanings, but I haven't really figured out how to distinguish them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 My humble apologies! Knowing LTD's background (prior to conversion), and with my own predisposition in this area (post conversion), I did assume it was meant if there was no overall church, not just no local parish/congregation. Not having a local parish would be difficult, but not utterly impossible. FWIW I read it the way you did, and was going to hit the "I agree" smiley half a dozen times quoting your post about the Church=Body of Christ. Then I read further. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
********* Posted October 12, 2012 Author Share Posted October 12, 2012 What's funny is that most often when people have that misunderstanding with me they say I am using the term church incorrectly because it means body of believers, and therefore... they don't need to go to a church. Both meanings are correct and I use both meanings, but I haven't really figured out how to distinguish them. We (dh and I) use the word 'church' to refer to the body of believers. And then we use the word 'steeplehouse' to refer to a building decidated soley to the gathering of believers. HTH. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnylady303 Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 There was a whole lotta neverminding at the beginning of this thread. :lol: Glad calmer and more gentle spirits prevailed. Thank you for sharing this, Bethany. It is truly beautiful and spoke to me this morning. I needed some deep words to connect to my deep pain right now. I am ready to give up and this helped me hold on a bit longer. Also, you continue to be in my daily prayers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milovany Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 We (dh and I) use the word 'church' to refer to the body of believers. And then we use the word 'steeplehouse' to refer to a building decidated soley to the gathering of believers. You'd have to change that to "onion dome house" if speaking to or about any Orthodox. :lol: Nary a steeple to be found on eastern Christian church buildings. (Unless a local congregation converted a former protestant church that is, but even in that case, the plan would be eventually to replace the steeple with a dome). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovedtodeath Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 You'd have to change that to "onion dome house" if speaking to or about any Orthodox. :lol: Nary a steeple to be found on eastern Christian church buildings. (Unless a local congregation converted a former protestant church that is, but even in that case, the plan would be eventually to replace the steeple with a dome).I didn't know that. Thanks for sharing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milovany Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 (edited) Sure, you're welcome. BTW, here's an article about the architecture of Orthodox church buildings, if interested. I get a little bit giddy when approaching one that's styled with traditional architecture. Edited October 12, 2012 by milovaný Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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