Need input/advice - re: 15yos

[BakersDozen]

My ds just spent over an hour talking with me, tearfully sharing how overwhelmed he is with not only his schoolwork but the homework load. I am at a loss at this point and desperately need advice.

 

Right now his schedule is as follows:

 

8:30-10:45 History (MOH II)

10:45-11:30 Mom's helper (all of my dc age 7yo and up take some time with their younger siblings)

11:30-12:15 Lunch

12:15-1:15 Spanish (Destinos)

1:15-3:00 Math (Alg. II M/T; Geometry Th/F)

3:00-3:30 Co-op work (we have Speech and Health co-op on Wednesdays; to help my dc complete their work I set aside 30 minutes/day that is only for co-op work)

4:00-5:00 Free time (or, according to my ds, homework time...as is after dinner...and weekends...)

 

Some additional information:

 

Ds reads slowly. He doesn't have a learning disability yet he also can't fly through a book and get out of it what his sisters can. He is super detailed so when he takes notes, he takes a long time. I've admonished him to change how he is taking notes on the MOH lessons (move to a key word outline rather than almost rewriting the lesson) and he has resisted me...which leads to another point:

 

Ds resists most of what I ask/tell him to do. He is rarely disrespectful now yet he is prideful and stubborn and foolish. His sister changed to my suggestion of taking notes and found herself with a bunch of extra time to complete activities; my ds continues to slog through his note-taking and finds himself running out of time.

 

I am at a loss. I moved to block scheduling for most subjects due to frustration on everyone's part at not having enough time with our original schedule (1-hour blocks).

 

I believe my ds's major problem is pacing himself - doing good work yet at a speed that helps him get done! He doesn't want to fly through his work and not get what he could out of it yet for goodness' sake, he will be schooling all summer (again) if he doesn't learn to move it!

 

Please tell me what you would do? I could drop another subject yet this kid will be on a 5-year high school plan if I do that. We are supposed to start Science in January (History will be done in December so Science will take its place) yet if this kid doesn't finish History and I add Science, it will be a disaster.

 

This is a bright kid, so what is the problem here??

[dbmamaz]

Just to clarify, are you saying that you give your son so much homework that he never gets any free time? What is the purpose of this? It sounds like more work than public school . . what are his goals for himself? Is he college bound? If he is in tears, likely something needs to change. Its ok for him to have a different style, its ok for him to not be as strong academically as his sister. Whats most important at this age is preparing him for life, for what he wants after homeschooling. And if a 5-year high school plan gets him there without a nervous breakdown, what's wrong with that?

[regentrude]

My ds just spent over an hour talking with me, tearfully sharing how overwhelmed he is with not only his schoolwork but the homework load. I am at a loss at this point and desperately need advice.

 

Right now his schedule is as follows:

 

8:30-10:45 History (MOH II)

10:45-11:30 Mom's helper (all of my dc age 7yo and up take some time with their younger siblings)

11:30-12:15 Lunch

12:15-1:15 Spanish (Destinos)

1:15-3:00 Math (Alg. II M/T; Geometry Th/F)

3:00-3:30 Co-op work (we have Speech and Health co-op on Wednesdays; to help my dc complete their work I set aside 30 minutes/day that is only for co-op work)

4:00-5:00 Free time (or, according to my ds, homework time...as is after dinner...and weekends...)

 

 

I see big problems with the schedule:

1. Your DS gets only two hours of work time in the morning and has his major academic load in the afternoon and evening. This would not work for any of my children because they work best if their minds are fresh.

2. A 1.5 hour interrupotion in the middle of the day kills momentum and would make it harder to get restarted.

3. The block for math is very long; most students are unable to do quality concentrated work for almost two hours.

 

After a day with a structure like this, doing homework immediately after finishing school is not productive.

 

I would make the following changes:

start earlier in the morning

shorten blocks for individual subjects, particularly math. If he did not get done with a shorter amount of time, critically evaluate of the extra time leads to a proportional accomplishment; my experience leads me to suspect that it probably won't.

move non-academic comittments (mother's helpler) to the afternoon- his academic work should be performed at the time of day when he is at his best concentration and ability.

[elegantlion]

Is he doing any English besides the speech? Writing instruction, grammar, or vocabulary? What about literature?

 

That seems like a lot of "drill and kill" type of study, outlining, spanish (not familiar with that program), and then math, then homework. are there any discovery, exploration type assignments? What type of discussions are happening with these subjects?

 

Ugh, I have a point, but can't seem to write it coherently as my Benadryl is kicking in.

[Joani]

Why is he taking two math courses? I agree with regentrude that the math block is too long. I'm not familiar with MOH, but if there's any way to cut his workload down to about 90 minutes per day, I would.

 

How long is co-op? If it's taking up a big chunk of the day, I'd re-evaluate whether it's worth the time just for those two electives.

[Storm Bay]

My ds just spent over an hour talking with me, tearfully sharing how overwhelmed he is with not only his schoolwork but the homework load. I am at a loss at this point and desperately need advice.

 

Right now his schedule is as follows:

 

8:30-10:45 History (MOH II)

10:45-11:30 Mom's helper (all of my dc age 7yo and up take some time with their younger siblings)

11:30-12:15 Lunch

12:15-1:15 Spanish (Destinos)

1:15-3:00 Math (Alg. II M/T; Geometry Th/F)

3:00-3:30 Co-op work (we have Speech and Health co-op on Wednesdays; to help my dc complete their work I set aside 30 minutes/day that is only for co-op work)

4:00-5:00 Free time (or, according to my ds, homework time...as is after dinner...and weekends...)

 

Some additional information:

 

Ds reads slowly. He doesn't have a learning disability yet he also can't fly through a book and get out of it what his sisters can. He is super detailed so when he takes notes, he takes a long time. I've admonished him to change how he is taking notes on the MOH lessons (move to a key word outline rather than almost rewriting the lesson) and he has resisted me...which leads to another point:

 

Ds resists most of what I ask/tell him to do. He is rarely disrespectful now yet he is prideful and stubborn and foolish. His sister changed to my suggestion of taking notes and found herself with a bunch of extra time to complete activities; my ds continues to slog through his note-taking and finds himself running out of time.

 

I am at a loss. I moved to block scheduling for most subjects due to frustration on everyone's part at not having enough time with our original schedule (1-hour blocks).

 

I believe my ds's major problem is pacing himself - doing good work yet at a speed that helps him get done! He doesn't want to fly through his work and not get what he could out of it yet for goodness' sake, he will be schooling all summer (again) if he doesn't learn to move it!

 

Please tell me what you would do? I could drop another subject yet this kid will be on a 5-year high school plan if I do that. We are supposed to start Science in January (History will be done in December so Science will take its place) yet if this kid doesn't finish History and I add Science, it will be a disaster.

 

This is a bright kid, so what is the problem here??

I'd drop one of the math courses, which would help reduce the math time. In addition, I'd re-evaluate when he's helping with your younger dcs. Perhaps having him do that later would help, and not so much teaching them school when he's at his best for doing that himself.

 

Find out when he is the freshest. I'd put his hardest classes then. Not all teens are sharpest early in the morning.

 

Also, and this is very important, what is he doing to help him physically burn off the steam most teenage boys need to burn off? It could be chores that involve some heavy lifting, cardiovascular exercise, etc. All kids need exercise, but most boys really need some hard physical activity to help with all that testosterone coursing through their veins.

 

Is he getting enough sleep?

 

Honestly, most teens do resist parents in one way or another regardless of how wonderfully parents parent. It's part of the move away from their parents. There isn't one way to handle this, and it's something you have to work through. If he's not being disrespectful, you've come a long way.

 

My eldest would drag her school out indefinitely at 15, but it doesn't sound as you need to take the drastic measures we did; it sounds like you should be able to work things out so he doesn't feel so dragged down by school (we expelled my eldest into ps).

Edited October 9, 2012 by Karin

[AK_Mom4]

Just a thought - looking at that schedule, his mornings are mostly throw-away. Over two hours on history and the rest of the morning doing non academics until math at 1:15.

 

Like a PP mentioned, if he does his best work in the morning, then swap this schedule around. Break the math session in two with the co-op work in between to give his brain a chance to rest. Same thing on the MOH stuff - break it into two sections with the "helper" piece in the middle.

 

My DS16 is in the public high school. Class periods are 52 minutes with 8 minute passing periods. DS says that getting up and walking (running) to the next class is actually helpful in helping him to keep focus.

 

Also - look over his work environment. Does he maybe need more quiet to work with fewer distractions from active little siblings (I'm just guessing here - that sometimes goes along with the slow reading). Maybe let him do the heavy reading stuff at night after the littles have gone to bed?

[BakersDozen]

Sorry...I kept trying to come back and respond but stuff kept happening all day long!

 

This is the first year we've tried longer blocks of time per my dc's request; taking only an hour on a subject then having to move on was incredibly frustrating to them! They love having the longer stretch of time to really focus on and complete (well, sometimes) their work. Since my ds is a slower reader and very meticulous in his work, I gave him a very long stretch for History as that is very activity/research based.

 

We are doing Alg. 2 on M/T and Geometry on Th/F, hence the longer block of time. Math was one of my ds's most frustrating subjects before when he had only an hour to do his work; now he can sit down without interruption (usually) and not feel as though he has to cram his work into an hour.

 

Physical activity: Everyone goes for a run first thing in the morning then they also have a short time for exercise at lunchtime. My ds will usually go for a bike ride in the afternoon (I stop everything at 4:00 and make them do something non-school).

 

In addition, I'd re-evaluate when he's helping with your younger dcs. Perhaps having him do that later would help, and not so much teaching them school when he's at his best for doing that himself.

I've cut down his time to 30 minutes yet per his request he has kept the time right before lunch. After working on school all morning, he enjoys the break (my older ones never teach the youngers, they just play with them - fun sibling time :)). He will take them for a walk or hang out in the yard with them.

 

Sleep - I believe he is getting enough sleep because I am very strict about bedtimes, even for my teenagers. 9:00, lights out. If they don't get up on time the next morning I move their bedtime back by 15 minutes. He doesn't appear to be tired that I can see...

 

if he does his best work in the morning, then swap this schedule around.

Today he began with Spanish (8:30-9:45), then Math (10:00-11:15), Mom's Helper from 11:15-11:45, History (12:30-2:30), and Co-op work (2:45-3:30). He seemed to do OK although he still has some homework to complete (mostly in Spanish). Thank goodness he FINALLY took my advice to just outline his History lesson rather than basically rewrite it! Stubborn kid.

 

shorten blocks for individual subjects, particularly math

I shortened the math block, added 15 minutes to Spanish (per ds and dd's request), and shortened History.

 

How long is co-op? If it's taking up a big chunk of the day, I'd re-evaluate whether it's worth the time just for those two electives.

Do you mean every day or during the week? The dc have 45 minutes/day to work on co-op stuff. They enjoy what they are learning so much, it really is a highlight of their week. I think the time is worth it...I hope it is worth it!

 

Is he doing any English besides the speech? Writing instruction, grammar, or vocabulary? What about literature?

He was doing LLfLoTR (I posted about that last week). It has been shelved. ;) Next semester we will do a Literature study as well as Lively Art of Writing. Grammar we are done with because the kid is rock solid in that area and I figured why continue with something he knows inside and out? Is that wrong? Should I keep going with grammar?

 

That seems like a lot of "drill and kill" type of study, outlining, spanish (not familiar with that program), and then math, then homework. are there any discovery, exploration type assignments? What type of discussions are happening with these subjects?

History (MOH) is where this comes in for us. The discussion we have based on their research assignments is fabulous! This is why I went with MOH rather than something more dry/textbook-ish.

 

Just to clarify, are you saying that you give your son so much homework that he never gets any free time?

I lay out the assignments for the week and give my dc what I thought was ample time to either complete or almost complete their work during our regular school day. My ds, however, has struggled with having a lot of homework and not having free time. Part of the issue is that they are not used to homework (I used to think homework was as evil and unnecessary as textbooks) so it's a bit of a shock for them to actually have their "free time" taken away. I have made sure they have a block of free time every day (4-5:00pm)...whether that is the right decision or not, I don't know, yet I do know that I hate seeing any of them sitting at a desk or table doing school after a full day of schoolwork, so I boot them out of the room and tell them to go have fun.

 

Also - look over his work environment. Does he maybe need more quiet to work with fewer distractions from active little siblings

He gets the schoolroom (aka garage) to himself all morning so it is very quiet with no interruption at all.

 

I hope I covered all the questions/comments. Thank you all SO much for taking the time to give input! I'm 3 years into this high school thing and still feel woefully inadequate and unsure of everything!