If you are a Christian, could you help me (Non-Christian input welcome too..)

[milovany]

Milovany,

I find your posts so loving. Really and truly I do. :)

Please don't interview my husband and kids! It's wee bit easier being loving on the internet but they may not vouch for me. {Sigh.}

 

she is a dear! I know her IRL. :D

Thank you, Jennifer. I look forward to seeing you again sometime.

Edited September 26, 2012 by milovaný

[GWOB]

As a professing "Christian", the whole definition of Christian just blows my mind.There is just so much baggage attached to that term (for me).

 

I was christened Catholic. My parents raised me FLAMING Southern Baptist. I left the Church for a while before finding my home in the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod. I've pretty much been there, done that in the Christian spectrum.

 

Look, if you follow Jesus, your are a Christian. That includes Mormons, JWs, Catholics, EOs, Methodists, Pentecostals, Presbyterians, Evangelicals, Episcopalians, whatever. Jesus is the key to Christianity, hence the term "Christian", ya know, referring to Christ and all that;).Everything else is just gravy. And I say that as a confessional Lutheran who recites either the Apostle's or Nicene Creed every Sunday. Who cares about the details? It's about Jesus!

[GWOB]

Milovany,

I find your posts so loving. Really and truly I do. :)

 

:iagree: she is a dear! I know her IRL. :D

 

Seriously, that woman needs to stop posting! She is making me want to convert right this second to the EO church!

[milovany]

Seriously, that woman needs to stop posting! She is making me want to convert right this second to the EO church!

 

 

Oh, please -- Let the church convert you if that's a road you want to walk, not me. (Not that I could convert anyone anyway, LOL!)

Here's me as an Orthodox Christian::willy_nilly: | Ask my priest. "Take a deep breath, milovany. Relax." That's his oft-repeated council to me.

 

Come over to the EO social group if you'd like (see link below). Wonderful bunch of women (Orthodox and not) talking about things of the ancient faith.

 

 

ETA -- did my "oh, please" come across the way it was intended? Not "{eye roll} Oh, puh-lease!" but more "dear, me, please let it be the church, not me -- "

Edited September 26, 2012 by milovaný

[Pawz4me]

I believe anyone who says they're Christian. First because the Bible clearly says it's not my place to judge. And secondly because I like to keep my faith simple. The thief on the cross professed Jesus as the messiah. As far as we know he wasn't baptized and had certainly never uttered an as-yet-to-be-composed-by-men creed. And Jesus said to him "Today you will be with me in paradise."

Edited September 26, 2012 by Pawz4me

[Cassy]

I believe anyone who says they're Christian. First because the Bible clearly says it's not my place to judge. And secondly because I like to keep my faith simple. The thief on the cross professed Jesus as the messiah. As far as we know he wasn't baptized and had certainly never uttered an as-yet-to-be-composed-by-men creed. And Jesus said to him "Today you will be with me in paradise."

 

:iagree: I no longer consider myself a Christian, but this expresses the spirit of the Christianity I grew up with, and the Christ I understood and believed in.

[Kathryn]

Our former priest liked to say that to be a Christian all you had to believe was 1. that the person of Jesus was who he was from conception (God didn't just see a nice guy and say "I'll make HIM part of my plan," 2. that he really died, and 3. that he was really resurrected. He'd throw in that the Nicene Creed was a good guideline as well, but those three basics have you covered.

 

And that is determining whether or not you yourself are a Christian. It's none of your business whether anyone else is who says they are.

[Parrothead]

Be baptized, and believe in the Nicene Creed.

 

Where ever they are from that point is between them and God. And, it takes a lifetime (Which a very smart nun was teaching on tonight).

 

( I was talking with an incredible priest this past week and he was reiterating that All Jesus said to do was to be baptized, and believe. So, the Nicene creed would be kind of a statement of faith, that this is what 2000 years of Christians believe)

Exactly this. :iagree:

[mathwonk]

i always thought being a christian should involve, in addition to abstract beliefs, actually doing some of the things Jesus advocated or commanded. In practice i found this rather tough myself. E.g. in chapter 5.12 of Matthew, in the sermon on the mount he seems to ask one to "give to him who asks of you". I tried this briefly and was entirely cleaned out by beggars before getting out of the train station in Naples. Somewhere else here I believe I also recorded a frustrating sequence of events over several months involving a beggar I repeatedly helped who came to our home, sometimes at midnight when I was out of town, frightening my wife. Jesus also said that loving ones neighbor as oneself was one of the two primary commandments. That is sometimes also beyond me, not to mention forgiving those who transgress against me "seventy - times - seven times". He even advocated taking "no thought for the morrow, neither what you shall eat nor drink nor wear". It dawned on me that even Jesus did not survive very long following his own principles, at least not in our society on earth. No doubt as mathematician I take everything too literally, but even if succeeding at being a practicing christian is challenging to me, maybe if I can just remember to keep trying his ideas within my own limitations....

Edited September 26, 2012 by mathwonk

[mommaduck]

Agreeing that you will get a wide variety of answers. The early church came up with this statement of faith, called the Nicene Creed, to define and defend the Christian faith since it was relatively new still and heresies (things the church didn't believe) were starting to arise. I would say a Christian is someone who can both confess this creed and who does this creed. Since the Church is led by the Holy Spirit and is called "the body of Christ," I trust this early church and the "fence" they put around Christianity.

 

~*~*~*~*~*~

I believe in one God, the Father almighty, Maker of heaven and earth,

and of all things visible and invisible;

 

And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the son of God, the only Begotten;

Begotten of the Father before all worlds, light of light, true God of true God;

Begotten not made, of one essence with the Father by whom all things were made;

Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was incarnate

of the Holy Spirit and the virgin Mary and became man;

And was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate and suffered and was buried;

And the third day He rose again according to the Scriptures and ascended in to heaven

and sits at the right hand of the Father;

And He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead;

Whose kingdom shall have no end.

 

And I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life,

Who proceeds from the Father, Who with the Father and the Son together

is worshipped and glorified; Who spoke by the prophets.

 

And I believe in one holy, catholic, and apostolic church.

I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins,

I look for the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come.

 

Amen.

~*~*~*~*~*~

:iagree:

[Bluegoat]

I think realistically it can mean different things in different contexts.

 

I think the most general, everyday way of using it would be to say people who define their religious/philosophical worldview in some part of the Christian tradition. That generally means some sort of relation to the early Christians and their teachings, and to the person of Jesus, to Scripture and revelation through the Church. But there is a lot of room in how those things could be understood.

 

But it can be appropriate to be more specific. If I am writing a book on the history of Christianity, do I include groups that are considered to be on the fringes, who are very theologically dissimilar to what might be called orthodox Christianity? Many people argue over whether Mormons are Christians strictly speaking, and they certainly have a very different theological structure. Or on the other hand Islam was considered at one time to be a type of Christian heresy, and it has some historical connections that could seem to justify that approach.

 

If one is looking to talk about what the early church believed we can look to define the limits of orthodox teaching, which would probably follow the outline of the Creed.

 

But I think how it's defined is going to depend on what you want to define it for.

[6packofun]

I consider a Christian to be someone who is a Christ-follower. That's what the word means... Thus, they would believe everything in the Bible that refers to Christ and was said by Him--what He says about God, about Himself, about us and our need for Him. (There's a lot in there and not just the New Testament!)

 

I, personally, believe that the Scriptures are the Word of God and that since Jesus IS God that it *all* applies, but I think that even if one ONLY believed/applied the passages that refer to Christ or that He spoke Himself, that would fit the definition of a Christ-follower=Christian. (I'm not suggesting doing that with the Bible, but if one wants to investigate Christianity--the religion based on CHRIST--I'm going to point them to Christ in the Bible first.)

 

I mean, if you want to hold to a belief system based upon a person/being, why not let that person/being define what it means to follow? One can add or take away from that to suit one's fancy or create a different belief system that includes *some* of the truth about Christ or say that one's experiences trump the basic tenets of that belief system, but that's something other than Christianity to me. This is why I believe that Christians can have different views on certain non-essentials and still be Christians, but why I would not view Mormons as Christians. (sorry, they don't believe what Jesus Himself said about Himself and have added to what He said.)

Edited September 26, 2012 by 6packofun
...

[JenniferB]

Seriously, that woman needs to stop posting! She is making me want to convert right this second to the EO church!

 

That's how I felt, and look at me now!

[CyndiLJ]

There are many, many Christians who do not take the Bible literally, who feel that the tenants of Christianity that so hang us all up today were essentially man-made. Resurrection? No, many Christians do not believe in a literal Resurrection (though few would self-identify publicly with that for fear of having their Christianity called into question), although they do believe in a metaphoric Resurrection either in Christ, in themselves, or both. They do not believe in blood covering sins, a virgin birth, Noah's Ark, or many other things claimed to be "absolute truth", for they feel that the Bible was written by mankind, and is a lens through which we can view God and Jesus, but that it is far closer to being mankind's understanding of God at the time, not literally the whispered word of God into the ears of those who penned each book of the Bible. Many would argue that Jesus' persona was "Super Hero'd" in order to compete with the Roman gods of the day, that Jesus was indeed extraordinarily connected to God, and did die for his beliefs...but not to wash away sins. Some believe in pieces and parts, some believe it all, and some believe little of it yet find the Bible inspirational when taken as a giant storybook with ultimate but not literal truths. It varies from Christian to Christian, and yet I think the one broad reaching statement that could be said is that they all think Jesus and his teachings are something worth following.

 

Many cite the Nicene Creed as "The Final Authority" on who is a Christian or not, and yet that was most certainly man created, so take it for what you will. Some claim Jesus was a unique prophet of God, and because of that they choose to follow him and self-identify as Christian. Some feel that if they try to do as Jesus taught them to do, that alone is enough to wear the label "Christian" honestly, regardless of whether there has been a personal salvation moment or not. Still others feel a transformation has to take place that is visible to the outside world in order for someone to truly be a Christian. Yet others need only to be willing to claim Christianity as theirs, whether they say the Sinner's Prayer or not.

 

Sadly, mankind always loves creating litmus tests, hierarchies, and labels. As a self-professing Christian myself, I find it pointless when others argue over who is or is not a Christian, whether they meet certain criteria, etc. God is, God was, God shall be. I think God is smart enough to figure it out, and does not need my opinion on the matter :)

 

Cindy:lurk5: Waiting to read what others think!

[LMD]

To quote

, a Christian is someone who is 'Bananas for Jesus'

 

:D hth

[Cassy]

There are many, many Christians who do not take the Bible literally, who feel that the tenants of Christianity that so hang us all up today were essentially man-made. Resurrection? No, many Christians do not believe in a literal Resurrection (though few would self-identify publicly with that for fear of having their Christianity called into question), although they do believe in a metaphoric Resurrection either in Christ, in themselves, or both. They do not believe in blood covering sins, a virgin birth, Noah's Ark, or many other things claimed to be "absolute truth", for they feel that the Bible was written by mankind, and is a lens through which we can view God and Jesus, but that it is far closer to being mankind's understanding of God at the time, not literally the whispered word of God into the ears of those who penned each book of the Bible. Many would argue that Jesus' persona was "Super Hero'd" in order to compete with the Roman gods of the day, that Jesus was indeed extraordinarily connected to God, and did die for his beliefs...but not to wash away sins. Some believe in pieces and parts, some believe it all, and some believe little of it yet find the Bible inspirational when taken as a giant storybook with ultimate but not literal truths. It varies from Christian to Christian, and yet I think the one broad reaching statement that could be said is that they all think Jesus and his teachings are something worth following.

 

Many cite the Nicene Creed as "The Final Authority" on who is a Christian or not, and yet that was most certainly man created, so take it for what you will. Some claim Jesus was a unique prophet of God, and because of that they choose to follow him and self-identify as Christian. Some feel that if they try to do as Jesus taught them to do, that alone is enough to wear the label "Christian" honestly, regardless of whether there has been a personal salvation moment or not. Still others feel a transformation has to take place that is visible to the outside world in order for someone to truly be a Christian. Yet others need only to be willing to claim Christianity as theirs, whether they say the Sinner's Prayer or not.

 

Sadly, mankind always loves creating litmus tests, hierarchies, and labels. As a self-professing Christian myself, I find it pointless when others argue over who is or is not a Christian, whether they meet certain criteria, etc. God is, God was, God shall be. I think God is smart enough to figure it out, and does not need my opinion on the matter :)

 

Cindy:lurk5: Waiting to read what others think!

 

:iagree: That expresses perfectly how I feel about what it means to be a Christian.

[Firefly]

To me, a Christian is at its most basic someone who professes to be a follower of the teachings of Jesus Christ-- regardless of whether or not they believe he was divine, the Bible is true, etc. etc.

 

Disclaimer: I am pagan.