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Schizophrenic 10 year old Jani on Dr Phil


Katy
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The sleep deprivation really messed me up. I never shook him, but I will admit that I was exhausted and angry and yelled in frustration and stomped and threw things a few times! I'm not usually like that, but going without sleep makes me shaky, depressed, teary, overwhelmed, and unable to sleep when I do have the time.

 

I had a colic kid and I know how crazy it gets. But there's a pretty bright line.

 

I have the quote here:

 

"On night, I finally snapped and shook her, yelling, 'Why won't you sleep?!' she immediately started to cry and that shocked me out of it." I stop, struggling to find the words. "It is the worst thing I have ever done in my life. I wish I could take it bac, but I can't. I did it." p. 231, January First

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Wow. I just read Dad's story here.

 

I'm glad this child was born into this family.

 

I can not imagine.

 

Nor can I, and I have family members dx schizophrenic. But, they were adults at dx. I have never known, or even heard of, a child with schizophrenia.

 

That is so heartbreaking. :crying:

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I bet there are a lot of parents out there with kids who have similar conditions who are greatly relived that there's one family willing to bring it to the public's attention. It often takes a family like that for many of us to understand what neighbours, family and friends dealing with those issues are going through.

 

I also can see a case made for the fact that the more people who know about the girl and what she has to deal with then the more advocates and friends she may have in life.

 

I also think many of us don't understand the huge financial strain on families dealing with mental illness in children. I think a lot of parents might choose a similar route if it meant they could afford the medical bills and afford to stay home with their child to care for him/her.

 

:iagree: I used to do respite care for foster families that were "therapeutic" families for severely disturbed children. While RAD and severe FAS were my specialities, I had my occasional schizophrenic child. Don't judge! You have NO idea. The only reason the meds and doctors could even be afforded was because these kids were in the foster system and the state had to pay for it.

 

One of my severe schizophrenic children, 8 yrs. old, was in the system NOT because he had been abused or neglected by his bio's, but because their private insurance policy had run out it's lifetime limit for mental health coverage and this child's meds were $5,000.00 a month out of pocket and psyche consults were in the thousands. Added to that were the many nights spent in the psyche ward at more than $2,000.00 per day while the child was either homicidal or suicidal. The parents were going bankrupt, but dad made too much money at his day job to qualify their child to be on state medical insurance. The day his meds ran out and they had no money to buy more and the hospital said "Don't come back because you don't have any more insurance coverage" and their EMS bill from the last time medics and police had to come restrain the child during a homicidal rage and take him in ($800.00 and some dollars) and the food in the house was running out and community mental health said there was nothing more they could do for them and pharma company wouldn't give them any free meds, they took him to the police station, walked him in, said they were voluntarily placing their child in foster care, and said they were comfortable being arrested on child abandonment charges. He had been very lovingly, very well cared for, but they had reached the end of the line and had another child at home whose health and welfare had to be considered too.

 

So, the child was placed in foster care and after the one time voluntary placement allowed in Michigan had expired and they still could not afford to care for their son (no, you cannot quit your job in Michigan in order to get state health insurance, services from community mental health, or food assistance...you will be nailed for that!), they were tried on abandonment charges, sentenced to a year in jail, and their son became a ward of the court. At that point, he could then receive state health insurance, community mental health services, his foster parents could have paid for respite care, and as many days as necessary in the psyche ward were paid for without batting an eyelash and that included some very, very expensive days at Wayne State Children's Hospital.

 

That's the total, 100% stupidity of the American system. If you have a job, you are d*mned...you can be a perfectly loving, perfectly responsible family but you cannot have ANY assistance keeping your family intact and healthy. Dump them into foster care, and they can have medical care, mental health care, respite care for the foster parents, clothing assistance, meds, psychologist, psychiatrists, and therapists. It makes my blood boil that our government will fund every kind of stupidity on the face of this earth, and line their own pockets while doing it, but the very services that are provided within the foster system are NOT provided for decent families outside the system.

 

The net result is that you'd be shocked just how many mentally ill children come into care that came from decent homes, but their families couldn't keep them without support. At least in Michigan, dumping your RAD, Bi-Polar, or Schizophrenic child on the system and the fleeing the state with your other children before you can be tried for the offense, is more common than you would think. I took care of NINE children during the two years I was a respite care worker that ALL had good bio parents who just couldn't keep them anymore and when there weren't any resources left open to them, fled the state.

 

You can bet, knowing what I know from those experiences, if I thought I could make enough money from public appearances to allow me to keep my child in my home a while longer or pay for next months meds, you can bet we'd be the freak show on Dr. Phil!

 

Faith

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Wow Faith :crying: that is absolutely heartbreaking. But sadly not at all surprising. That poor family. I cannot believe they had to serve jail time to get their child help.

 

I did catch the bit about the father shaking the baby. The doctor they were with did not feel that was related to her schizophrenia. These people never claimed to be perfect parents. It's an indicator to me that they should have been tagged as needing services much earlier in the game. I think it's easy to judge when not placed in the horrible circumstances these families are.

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(no, you cannot quit your job in Michigan in order to get state health insurance, services from community mental health, or food assistance...you will be nailed for that!), they were tried on abandonment charges, sentenced to a year in jail, and their son became a ward of the court.

So one can't quit, but one can be fired for being in jail. I'm gobsmacked.

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:iagree: I used to do respite care for foster families that were "therapeutic" families for severely disturbed children. While RAD and severe FAS were my specialities, I had my occasional schizophrenic child. Don't judge! You have NO idea. The only reason the meds and doctors could even be afforded was because these kids were in the foster system and the state had to pay for it.

 

One of my severe schizophrenic children, 8 yrs. old, was in the system NOT because he had been abused or neglected by his bio's, but because their private insurance policy had run out it's lifetime limit for mental health coverage and this child's meds were $5,000.00 a month out of pocket and psyche consults were in the thousands. Added to that were the many nights spent in the psyche ward at more than $2,000.00 per day while the child was either homicidal or suicidal. The parents were going bankrupt, but dad made too much money at his day job to qualify their child to be on state medical insurance. The day his meds ran out and they had no money to buy more and the hospital said "Don't come back because you don't have any more insurance coverage" and their EMS bill from the last time medics and police had to come restrain the child during a homicidal rage and take him in ($800.00 and some dollars) and the food in the house was running out and community mental health said there was nothing more they could do for them and pharma company wouldn't give them any free meds, they took him to the police station, walked him in, said they were voluntarily placing their child in foster care, and said they were comfortable being arrested on child abandonment charges. He had been very lovingly, very well cared for, but they had reached the end of the line and had another child at home whose health and welfare had to be considered too.

 

So, the child was placed in foster care and after the one time voluntary placement allowed in Michigan had expired and they still could not afford to care for their son (no, you cannot quit your job in Michigan in order to get state health insurance, services from community mental health, or food assistance...you will be nailed for that!), they were tried on abandonment charges, sentenced to a year in jail, and their son became a ward of the court. At that point, he could then receive state health insurance, community mental health services, his foster parents could have paid for respite care, and as many days as necessary in the psyche ward were paid for without batting an eyelash and that included some very, very expensive days at Wayne State Children's Hospital.

 

That's the total, 100% stupidity of the American system. If you have a job, you are d*mned...you can be a perfectly loving, perfectly responsible family but you cannot have ANY assistance keeping your family intact and healthy. Dump them into foster care, and they can have medical care, mental health care, respite care for the foster parents, clothing assistance, meds, psychologist, psychiatrists, and therapists. It makes my blood boil that our government will fund every kind of stupidity on the face of this earth, and line their own pockets while doing it, but the very services that are provided within the foster system are NOT provided for decent families outside the system.

 

The net result is that you'd be shocked just how many mentally ill children come into care that came from decent homes, but their families couldn't keep them without support. At least in Michigan, dumping your RAD, Bi-Polar, or Schizophrenic child on the system and the fleeing the state with your other children before you can be tried for the offense, is more common than you would think. I took care of NINE children during the two years I was a respite care worker that ALL had good bio parents who just couldn't keep them anymore and when there weren't any resources left open to them, fled the state.

 

You can bet, knowing what I know from those experiences, if I thought I could make enough money from public appearances to allow me to keep my child in my home a while longer or pay for next months meds, you can bet we'd be the freak show on Dr. Phil!

 

Faith

Wow. Faith, you are such an amazing woman. People like you who open their homes to the most disturbed are invaluable. The story you share is SO sad. So messed up. Do you know if they were able to keep their other child?

 

I'm not pointing my finger at any one person here, but I want to say it is so easy to judge when you have NO idea of the horrors some people live. Jani's dad is an amazing dad from what I have seen. Yes, we only get a small glimpse into their reality. But they are regularly involved with professionals, experts, etc. Who highly admire them both, mom and dad. Nobody has an inkling of how difficult their lives are. No, nobody should EVER shake a baby. And no, that is not what caused her problems. She was "off" from birth. I can't imagine the exhaustion of having to keep her highly stimulated, running her everywhere where there were hige crowds and the like to fill her stimulation needs, on virtually no sleep.

 

My RAD didn't allow us sleep for years. I literally felt like I was going to go insane. Unless you've experienced severe sleep deprivation for months, you simply can't understand how crazy it makes you. They slept an hour to an hour and a hald PER DAY, for months. If I remember right, Jani only slept 15 - 20 mins at a time. Then when she was awake they spent their days runing her all over to highly stimulating environments. I don't know how they managed to do all they did, even if they HAD slept. But they did it all without sleep.

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Nor can I, and I have family members dx schizophrenic. But, they were adults at dx. I have never known, or even heard of, a child with schizophrenia.

 

That is so heartbreaking. :crying:

 

I had never heard of it either. Sadly, I have seen documentaries now so know their are at least four children with debilitating schizophrenia diagnosed way younger than 10. I don't understand this.

 

Desperately tragic.

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Wow. Faith, you are such an amazing woman. People like you who open their homes to the most disturbed are invaluable. The story you share is SO sad. So messed up. Do you know if they were able to keep their other child?

 

I'm not pointing my finger at any one person here, but I want to say it is so easy to judge when you have NO idea of the horrors some people live. Jani's dad is an amazing dad from what I have seen. Yes, we only get a small glimpse into their reality. But they are regularly involved with professionals, experts, etc. Who highly admire them both, mom and dad. Nobody has an inkling of how difficult their lives are. No, nobody should EVER shake a baby. And no, that is not what caused her problems. She was "off" from birth. I can't imagine the exhaustion of having to keep her highly stimulated, running her everywhere where there were hige crowds and the like to fill her stimulation needs, on virtually no sleep.

 

My RAD didn't allow us sleep for years. I literally felt like I was going to go insane. Unless you've experienced severe sleep deprivation for months, you simply can't understand how crazy it makes you. They slept an hour to an hour and a hald PER DAY, for months. If I remember right, Jani only slept 15 - 20 mins at a time. Then when she was awake they spent their days runing her all over to highly stimulating environments. I don't know how they managed to do all they did, even if they HAD slept. But they did it all without sleep.

 

 

I'm not amazing! Not even close. I went into foster homes and did weekends so parents could get mini-vacations, get away and have some time with their normal kids that actually felt "normal", try to help them keep their sanity. Occasionally, if my mom could help out with our own kids and I could afford the time off from my music studio, I would do a whole week so a family could get a true vacation. I did not live with these children and only once-in-a-blue-moon had one in my home unless they also happened to be one of music therapy students in which case, I saw them every week.

 

I am not even remotely proud of myself for my efforts. I burned out in 2.5 years and quit. That's pretty pathetic when you consider that I didn't have to live with it and families were literally despondent when I quit. But, dh was very concerned for my safety - I'd had some close calls with violent RAD kids - our own children were young and being away from them was hard, and I was very anemic. Those three things ended up convincing me to quit, something that I am sooooooooooooooooo not proud of and frantic, desperate parents, calling completely mentally done-in and begging me to change my mind, didn't make me feel any better about myself. It's only been in the past two or three years that I've come to grips with and found some peace with being a quitter.

 

Faith

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I'm not amazing! Not even close. I went into foster homes and did weekends so parents could get mini-vacations, get away and have some time with their normal kids that actually felt "normal", try to help them keep their sanity. Occasionally, if my mom could help out with our own kids and I could afford the time off from my music studio, I would do a whole week so a family could get a true vacation. I did not live with these children and only once-in-a-blue-moon had one in my home unless they also happened to be one of music therapy students in which case, I saw them every week.

 

I am not even remotely proud of myself for my efforts. I burned out in 2.5 years and quit. That's pretty pathetic when you consider that I didn't have to live with it and families were literally despondent when I quit. But, dh was very concerned for my safety - I'd had some close calls with violent RAD kids - our own children were young and being away from them was hard, and I was very anemic. Those three things ended up convincing me to quit, something that I am sooooooooooooooooo not proud of and frantic, desperate parents, calling completely mentally done-in and begging me to change my mind, didn't make me feel any better about myself. It's only been in the past two or three years that I've come to grips with and found some peace with being a quitter.

 

Faith

 

You clearly aren't giving yourself enough credit. You did an amazing thing for as long as you could and it blessed families. You should be very proud of that.

 

I can only imagine the guilt, but it is a false guilt. There really should be options, even facilities, to help these families. You are only ONE person and you did what you could.

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On most topics I'd probably agree with you, but in this case, I think they are trying to raise awareness of the lack of services for children with mental health issues. I think it's a pretty widespread problem (the insufficiency of resources) and Jani is just an extreme example of it.

 

I can't imagine how exhausting it would be to parent her. The community needs to step up for these kids / families who truly need more support. I'm a fiscal conservative, but if there was ever a good reason for collective funding, this is it.

 

:iagree:Yes, this. When I was a social worker, I had a 14 year old client who had just given birth (in the hospital). The following day, she HURLED her one-day old infant against the hard hospital floor (baby survived). Where do you even begin with such a situation?

 

What would you do if your own child tried repeatedly to destroy another person, another of your children, or himself/herself? We tend to think of the mental health field as super-scientific, but really, it is a blind man in a dark room, looking for a black cat that is invisible. If you're lucky, you step on the cat's tail. :tongue_smilie:IME, most of the "mental health profession" engages daily in "best-guess" diagnosing and "best-shot" treatment, especially when it comes to children (and more so with exceptionally young children).

 

There are so few truly helpful, affordable resources for children and families like Jani's. :grouphug: My heart goes out to them.

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I would also like to say there does appear to be a correlation between exceptionally high IQ (beyond the range that is generally considered gifted 130-155/160)...we are talking about the range in which the tests aren't even available for those kids and the tester has to extrapolate/make an educated guess, and a tendency towards mental illness. Now that is not to say that every person with those IQ's ends up mentally ill, just that there may be more statistical likelihood. One of the theories is that the hyper development of a particular area of genius results in the under development of the portion of the brain related to determining what is real and what isn't as well as causing fewer hormone receptors in the brain to develop in order to "receive" the "feel good" hormones.

 

It's a theory. However, long term data collecting does seem to suggest a correlation. Causation, who knows?

 

We have one child with an IQ in the "freak me out" range and it was suggested by one psychiatrist and two psychologists that we keep a close eye on him. I am every so thankful, grateful beyond what can be expressed in words, that's he had to date, a healthy, happy, well-adjusted childhood...it's just the kind of childhood in which he's rather frustrated with how illogical everyone else is! That is something I can manage.

 

Faith

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I could see going on a tv show with my daughter who has a still undiagnosed and untreated problem if we can't get it figured out. We are not publicity hounds at all and have never desired to go on a show (except I did consider trying out for Jeopardy once). But I could see doing that if I could get my daughter help.

 

There are a lot of families suffering. The lack of resources for families where people work and are taxpayers and then a child get sick, regardless of whether the child is young or old, is frightening and disturbing. I can't see how anyone is getting SSDI for ADHD, easily treated with medications and therapy, but people who work, can't get help for such a severe problem like very serious schziophrenia in a child. Just horrible. And to think that parents are arrested for abandoning a child when the child can't get help any other way= what a travesty of justice.

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I could see going on a tv show with my daughter who has a still undiagnosed and untreated problem if we can't get it figured out. We are not publicity hounds at all and have never desired to go on a show (except I did consider trying out for Jeopardy once). But I could see doing that if I could get my daughter help.

 

There are a lot of families suffering. The lack of resources for families where people work and are taxpayers and then a child get sick, regardless of whether the child is young or old, is frightening and disturbing. I can't see how anyone is getting SSDI for ADHD, easily treated with medications and therapy, but people who work, can't get help for such a severe problem like very serious schziophrenia in a child. Just horrible. And to think that parents are arrested for abandoning a child when the child can't get help any other way= what a travesty of justice.

:iagree: Chris, our dd's have similar symptoms as well as differences. I could understand going on tv for the TEENY, tiny chance that SOMEONE out there watching will jump up and say, "I can help her!!! she has THIS!!!". I watch Mystery Diagnosis frequently in the hopes someone will present similarly so we can get some answers.

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Wow. I just read Dad's story here.

 

I'm glad this child was born into this family.

 

I can not imagine.

 

Absolutely heartbreaking. It makes my dd's mild Asperger's seem like nothing.

 

I don't blame them at all for "going public" with this whole thing. Perhaps that is the only way that they will connect with someone out there that might be able to help even the littlest bit.

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I'm not amazing! Not even close. I went into foster homes and did weekends so parents could get mini-vacations, get away and have some time with their normal kids that actually felt "normal", try to help them keep their sanity. Occasionally, if my mom could help out with our own kids and I could afford the time off from my music studio, I would do a whole week so a family could get a true vacation. I did not live with these children and only once-in-a-blue-moon had one in my home unless they also happened to be one of music therapy students in which case, I saw them every week.

 

I am not even remotely proud of myself for my efforts. I burned out in 2.5 years and quit. That's pretty pathetic when you consider that I didn't have to live with it and families were literally despondent when I quit. But, dh was very concerned for my safety - I'd had some close calls with violent RAD kids - our own children were young and being away from them was hard, and I was very anemic. Those three things ended up convincing me to quit, something that I am sooooooooooooooooo not proud of and frantic, desperate parents, calling completely mentally done-in and begging me to change my mind, didn't make me feel any better about myself. It's only been in the past two or three years that I've come to grips with and found some peace with being a quitter.

 

Faith

 

We adopted one of those children ... the ones no one else wanted. Thanks for doing the time that you did!

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