TXMomof4 Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I am absolutely at the end of my rope with this situation and I am praying someone here has a fantastic idea! DH and I bought a 2009 VW Routan a little over a year ago. We bought it from a dealer, had a clean car fax - used with 18,000 miles. We really stepped out and bought a vehicle with every little thing we wanted. And I do like the van...BUT.... It does this weird, random thing. Sometimes it just won't start. It always starts from cold, but if I drive to the store (< 2 miles) it won't start when I get back to my car. Well, eventually it will start, but it just clicks the first few times you turn it over. The BIG problem is that if I've been driving longer, it can take hours for it to decide to start. We were stuck in Savannah for over an hour, had called the tow truck and when he got there, the car started right up. The battery was replaced in March, a new starter in May, new ignition relay in June....we did buy the extended warranty with this car (which has been a giant blessing). We've been taking the car to the VW dealership here in town. They have worked and looked and disconnected and reconnected everything in the car. We get it back and it works for a few weeks then starts up this nonsense again. This last time they said they can't figure out what the problem is. :confused: So - here's the issue. I am getting rid of this car. However, because VW vans do not hold their value we owe a few thousand more than the trade in value on the van. Besides which - we won't get much for a van with known mechanical difficulties. The dealership we've been dealing with has said they will try to get a trade allowance to get us into a new Routan, but the new vans are outrageously expensive and besides I'm a little burnt on VW vans. They have offered a little if we trade for a used car with them, but they have a limited supply of used cars and they are WAY overpriced. I can't take this car to another dealership though. IF it started, it's dishonest to give them a car that doesn't run. Obviously I would never consider selling private party. Do any of you see any options that I'm not thinking of? Unless we want to eat thousands of dollars by trading it with another dealership - but then we will start underwater on our next car and I do not want to do that. Lemon laws don't apply because we bought the car used. The problem seems significantly worse when it's hot and we're moving to a desert in the spring, so we'll have lots of hot. I can't risk being stranded for hours everytime I go anywhere. Argh! So - any brilliant, creative solutions to this? I am furious that I am just supposed to accept that my car can't be fixed. Why the h*ll did I pay for the warranty if they can't fix it. There has to be some recourse somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amo_mea_filiis. Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I had a car with this problem, and if i can remember what the part is called, i'll come back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I recently had a similar problem with my Honda Pilot. DH changed out the cable that goes from the battery to the ignition switch and put new connectors on the battery. No more problems. BUT, I had a more serious problem with the Ford Expedition that we traded in on the Pilot. All Ford trucks and SUVs within certain years have a problem with some of the body panels. They were contaminated with iron and are basically rusting from the inside out. Mine developed holes in the roof. I think it happened sooner because of living in Hawaii with the salt air, but based on the service reports, it will eventually happen with all of them. DH patched it, but the dealer knew the problem when we traded it in. The fact is, it is a common problem, so would it be shady to sell used Ford trucks and SUVs at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gingersmom Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I wonder if the dealer knew about the problem when they sold it to you? I had a minivan and the key would get stuck in the ignition. Uggh. Of course after I called AAA and wait an hour, they arrive and the key comes right out. I tried to valet park it once and the key was stuck so the car was stuck right where I left it with the valet. I was afraid to take it to the car wash. It was awful. And of course my mechanic could never figure out what the problem was (because the key would never get stuck in front of him...bashful I guess :001_smile:). I dealt with it for years and then landed donating the car to charity. I feel sorry for whoever bought the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsheresomewhere Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Take it to another dealer. Fresh eyes might see the problem right away. Has the wiring harness be replaced? I had a car that needed this replace as it would die when it felt like it, run when it felt like and the dash worked when it felt like it. Replaced the wiring harness and that car ran beautifully until it was totaled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXMomof4 Posted September 25, 2012 Author Share Posted September 25, 2012 The dealership swears up and down that they've replaced and disconnected/reconnected all the electrical components in the vehicle. The biggest problem they have is that it isn't consistent. No code comes up when it won't start. It will do it everytime you go to get in it for a week, then it won't at all for two weeks. They've had the van for about 6 weeks this summer 'working' on it. They've contacted VW and Chrysler (it's basically a chrysler with a VW sticker on it). So it isn't a known problem. It's a pain in the rear, make me want to throw the van in the ocean problem - but not a known problem. I'd just take it and trade it without saying anything, but I'm not sure it will even start for a trade inspection. It's been really bad this week. At first I thought it was related to the outside temp - we didn't have any problems through last winter and it got really bad this summer. However, yesterday it was 75* here and it did it all day. I'm really feeling completely stuck and I can't believe that you buy a car and do everything exactly right (all maintenance) and they just can't figure out why it won't start there is absolutely no recourse anywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amo_mea_filiis. Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 In my car, i think the bad part was called the ignition coil, and it was caused by an exhaust manifold leak (coil sat above manifold, leak was heating coil, coil went bad and would not let the car start when hot). I replaced the coil, had the manifold fixed soon after and the car was good to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I'm really feeling completely stuck and I can't believe that you buy a car and do everything exactly right (all maintenance) and they just can't figure out why it won't start there is absolutely no recourse anywhere. I agree. That is how I felt about my Expedition with the holes in the roof! The dealer told me that it had a 100k mile warranty and after that, I was free to take them to court. A couple of people have taken Ford to court over the issue and they won, but how many people are willing to do that? There should be more recourse for consumers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 We had problems like this with a car, years ago: random not starting when warm, sometimes you had to wait for an hour. Had it towed twice. Two mechanics could not figure out what the problem was. The third discovered that it was the fuel pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SailorMom Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I'd check into the "Lemon Laws" before you do anything else..... Every state is different, some don't cover used - but it doesn't hurt to look. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemon_law Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommie_Jen Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 We had problems like this with a car, years ago: random not starting when warm, sometimes you had to wait for an hour. Had it towed twice. Two mechanics could not figure out what the problem was. The third discovered that it was the fuel pump. My first thought too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saraha Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 My husband's friend had a problem like this, it turned out to be condensation build up from the heat of driving. Is there anyway you can drive it for a nice long time before dropping it off. Maybe idling doesn't do it, if they are letting it idle, then turning it off to test it, it might not do it. Does it seem to happen more often if it is raining? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carol in Cal. Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I had this problem, in an 89 Jeep Cherokee. It was a very cheap part, ironically enough--a bad oxygen sensor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissad2 Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 We had problems like this with a car, years ago: random not starting when warm, sometimes you had to wait for an hour. Had it towed twice. Two mechanics could not figure out what the problem was. The third discovered that it was the fuel pump. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkateLeft Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 We had problems like this with a car, years ago: random not starting when warm, sometimes you had to wait for an hour. Had it towed twice. Two mechanics could not figure out what the problem was. The third discovered that it was the fuel pump. I had exactly the same experience with my Expedition! (Incidentally, I've never had any rust issues, unlike other posters. My Ford has been more reliable than my husband's Honda.) I brought it to my mechanic, and he couldn't duplicate the issue. The third time I brought it in, he figured out it was the fuel pump. It wouldn't start sometimes when it was warm, but if I waited for a while, I could get it to start again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cin Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I'm sure it's fixable. Have you gone to a VW board and searched to see about this problem. I'll bet you'll find others who had the same predicament. I believe this is a highly rated auto. :iagree: My husband hangs out at the Toyota Hybrid boards (we have a prius and a Highlander Hybrid). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5of5 Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I had a car once that would stall (shut off) randomly, usually when idling at a stop light. None of the dealers could find the problem. Years later I learned that the computer chip was bad (it eventually became a known problem). The chip didn’t given out any error codes, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Nyssa Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Car Talk? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne in CA Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 I agree with the others about getting it fixed because I used to own an Audi and I learned the hard way the even a dealership can be clueless about German cars. You need to go to a German Car Whisperer. They exist, you need to ask around. I have never had a good experience with dealerships fixing cars correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abacus2 Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Car Talk? :iagree: This absolutely sounds like a reason to call the Car Talk show. I would set aside worrying about how to get rid of the car and focus on finding someone who can fix it. It isn't generally bad; it has one problem that needs to be fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cin Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 DH says it sounds like the starter cellenoid. (I know I spelled that second word wrong). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsMommy Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Some Routans were involved in a recall that involved the ignition somehow...has that been checked? We had to have ours fixed because of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shellers Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 We had two suburban's with electrical problems like you describe. We had an extended warranty on one of them, but it was worthless. The dealer wouldn't replace anything unless they knew it was bad. Our solution was to trade the vehicle off. I was VERY worried our Suburban wouldn't start for the dealer's test drive, but we lucked out. I did a quick Google search and there was a recall of the electrical system wiring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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