WWYD? teens and homeschooling

[fairfarmhand]

suppose you as a homeschooling mom, were orally giving your teen a quiz on biology.

 

Suppose that the teen did not study as well as she thought and grew frustrated in the midst of the quiz.

 

Suppose that the teen grew argumentative during the quiz, tossed down her materials and stomped off in frustration.

 

Would you grade the questions that the teen had already answered and let that be the final grade for the quiz, or would you allow the teen to try again later?

[dangermom]

Would you grade the questions that the teen had already answered and let that be the final grade for the quiz...

 

This one. That kind of thing will not fly outside the house, so it shouldn't fly inside the house either.

[Aunty Social]

.

[fairfarmhand]

This one. That kind of thing will not fly outside the house, so it shouldn't fly inside the house either.

this is what I am leaning toward

Depends. How old is the teen? Have they had this level of work before? Is this common behaviour?

 

For ex. - if it was a 13/14 yo taking this type of course at a higher level for the first time, and this was the first or second 'real' test, I'd probably extend some grace, talk to them about how and what to study, and retake the test in two days.

 

If it's a 16 yo who has a couple years of high school level work under their belt and knows the higher level of expectation - well, then I'd grade what they did and let them deal with the consequences. I'd also assign them some sort of essay about how to properly study and treat their teacher.

 

this is common behavior. My problem with this approach is the temper tantrum aspect. If she'd sat through the rest of the quiz, even shedding some tears, I probably would allow a retest even if it was not asked for.

[Rebel Yell]

Depends. How old is the teen? Have they had this level of work before? Is this common behaviour?

 

For ex. - if it was a 13/14 yo taking this type of course at a higher level for the first time, and this was the first or second 'real' test, I'd probably extend some grace, talk to them about how and what to study, and retake the test in two days.

 

If it's a 16 yo who has a couple years of high school level work under their belt and knows the higher level of expectation - well, then I'd grade what they did and let them deal with the consequences. I'd also assign them some sort of essay about how to properly study and treat their teacher.

 

:iagree:

[eternalknot]

If it were an exception and not the general rule (in terms of behavior/attitude), I'd be firm that it had better be an exception and not the rule and give a one-time pass.

 

If it was a repeat showing of an on-going problem, I'd give a small time-out period (which the teen seems to have taken on his own) to calm himself down (because learning to work through frustrations is just as valid a lesson as biology, and sometimes even harder!) and after 15 minutes or so, call him back to finish the quiz. Not in a nagging way, in a "I get you were frustrated, this still has to be done" firm but understanding tone. If he came, we'd finish; if the attitude increased, quiz over.

 

(And quiz would be over and graded, but I think I'd assign extra work such as writing out the quiz on his own time -with no grade for work done, though this doesn't need to be shared when assigned- or doing a small paper in lieu of the quiz.)

[Danestress]

I wonder if the interpersonalness of it is counterproductive.

 

I don't think I am an annoying person. But I think I annoy my 14 year olds sometimes in ways I can't really anticipate. And recalling my own teens years, sometimes just having a mom was annoying at that age.

 

No criticism of you at all. But I might just think about whether there are ways to evaluate her knowledge that would be more neutral interpersonally. If you gave her a written test, she could complete what she could, see what she misses, and go over it with you all at once rather that seeing the look on your face or the slightly raised eyebrows or even oral feedback as she answers each question.

 

I probably would tell her to study and retake the quiz when she is calm.

[FaithManor]

This one. That kind of thing will not fly outside the house, so it shouldn't fly inside the house either.

 

:iagree: BTDT and the big "F" went into the grade book. Make-up work was assigned. Semester grade was lower than expected. Teen decided not to get mouthy or huffy with me about his own lack of preparation. Grades have been quite satisfactory since then.

 

It's hard....really, really hard because we want them to succeed. However, it's the best preparation for the world outside the house at 18. The college professor won't have it, the employer won't have it, the instructor at the Vo-tech center won't have it, etc. it just doesn't fly and with teens, they need to understand this because it won't be long before they live in an adult world with adult consequences.

 

Faith

[katilac]

I wonder if the interpersonalness of it is counterproductive.

 

I don't think I am an annoying person. But I think I annoy my 14 year olds sometimes in ways I can't really anticipate. And recalling my own teens years, sometimes just having a mom was annoying at that age.

 

No criticism of you at all. But I might just think about whether there are ways to evaluate her knowledge that would be more neutral interpersonally. If you gave her a written test, she could complete what she could, see what she misses, and go over it with you all at once rather that seeing the look on your face or the slightly raised eyebrows or even oral feedback as she answers each question.

 

I probably would tell her to study and retake the quiz when she is calm.

 

:iagree: Unless there is some compelling reason for it, such as needing accomodations, I would not give oral quizzes.

[Hoot]

Since you said that this is a common attitude problem with her, I would grade the problems that she did and mark the rest wrong. She will get the chance to redeem that grade by working her butt off, improving her attitude and studying next time. I'm a big fan of natural consequences.

 

I would also have her study and re-take the quiz (written, not oral) for zero points. This is less about punishment and more about being sure she understands the material before moving on. I always have DS fix the problems that he has missed. Occasionally, I will give him 1/2 points back for the corrected problems but only in certain circumstances.

Edited September 24, 2012 by contessa20

[fairfarmhand]

I wonder if the interpersonalness of it is counterproductive.

 

I don't think I am an annoying person. But I think I annoy my 14 year olds sometimes in ways I can't really anticipate. And recalling my own teens years, sometimes just having a mom was annoying at that age.

 

No criticism of you at all. But I might just think about whether there are ways to evaluate her knowledge that would be more neutral interpersonally. If you gave her a written test, she could complete what she could, see what she misses, and go over it with you all at once rather that seeing the look on your face or the slightly raised eyebrows or even oral feedback as she answers each question.

 

I probably would tell her to study and retake the quiz when she is calm.

usually I do this. But I had a computer virus and no computer access this weekend, so we had to deal with it. FWIW, I could not see what she was writing at all. Had no idea that she was struggling if she hadn't been so hateful.

[Pink Fairy]

Is this a special needs kid? If not, then I would let the grade stand. But if this is a kid with impulse control issues (I have one--out of five), I'd handle it differently. I know from experience that consequences have no meaning for him in the moment.

[labst60]

I don't have a teenager - so keep that in mind when reading my answer - BUT....

 

I would give a retest on the material and separately punish the poor behavior.

 

My thought is the course grade should really represent the knowledge of the course - if there are behavior problems - they should be addressed separately.

 

For instance- we had a biology teacher in high school who would deduct a LOT of points for format/handwriting, etc - for example - your margins needed to be EXACTLY one inch. Your name/his name/course, etc in a certain order at the top. If you made a mistake, he took off 50% or something crazy like that. We were 13/14 at the time. It could kill your grade. In retrospect, I guess it shouldn't have been that hard - but I was *not* a detail oriented kid and had some health problems that year and was more in a "get it done" mindset. His "rules" killed my SCIENCE grade. So I knew more SCIENCE content than I got credit for - I think I got a C for a final grade - which played into my GPA, class standing, etc. Does it REALLY matter now, probably not - but I think you get my point.

 

Especially for homeschool - I'd have their subject grade reflect their knowledge in the subject and separately address any unacceptable behaviors separately for that reason.

[Lizzie in Ma]

This one. That kind of thing will not fly outside the house, so it shouldn't fly inside the house either.

 

:iagree::iagree:

[TranquilMind]

suppose you as a homeschooling mom, were orally giving your teen a quiz on biology.

 

Suppose that the teen did not study as well as she thought and grew frustrated in the midst of the quiz.

 

Suppose that the teen grew argumentative during the quiz, tossed down her materials and stomped off in frustration.

 

Would you grade the questions that the teen had already answered and let that be the final grade for the quiz, or would you allow the teen to try again later?

 

Try again later, after more required study.

 

I have two teens. This WILL happen, upon occasion, whether you "allow" it or not.

[Murphy101]

Ug. The frustrating thing for me is that grades have absolutely zero effect whatsoever on one of mine. Same as I was. If I got an F then I didn't care. Just give me the F and move on already. What a relief even. Mostly I remember standing there wishing they'd just shut up with the lecture.

 

What do you do with a kid that doesn't care about grades?

 

I have never understood why anyone cares about grades. So I do sympathize with the sentiment. Not that it helps me at all in dealing with my kid. We were just born haters of beaucratic systems. :tongue_smilie:

[phathui5]

:iagree: Unless there is some compelling reason for it, such as needing accomodations, I would not give oral quizzes.

 

Yup. :iagree:

[Jean in Newcastle]

One of the beauties of homeschooling my teenager is that I get to work with him on character issues like self control, handling emotions and hormones etc. Yes, I know that he wouldn't get to pull stunts like this at a B & M school and I do remind him of that. But I also have the opportunity to talk to him about how to handle frustration etc. in a proper way. I don't think that I learned to handle these things well in school where my anger and frustration were just pushed deep inside of me and came out in other ways. This year has been a year where we've worked more openly on these issues with me coming alongside of him, instead of just yelling at him like I did last year.

 

I don't know what kind of a relationship you have overall with your teen so all my comments are based on my own relationship with my son and it's peaks and valleys. I've found that it is best to make expectations clear up front. Yes, I know that I can't anticipate everything and some basic behaviors are basic enough for him to expect. But it has been helpful for me to go over with him what are the expectations. For instance, in the case you mentioned, I wouldn't mark him off for giving himself a time out (which I've suggested to him as a way to handle frustration) unless I told him up front that this was a timed test or otherwise needed to be done in one sitting and that getting up and leaving would mean getting marked down.

[GoodGrief]

For me, it would depend on whether grades were a motivating factor for the teen.