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Father/Daughter dances banned in RI


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I just hope my DD's dance studio doesn't drop their annual Snowflake Daddy-Daughter (or uncle, grandfather, stepfather, older brother, or sometimes even mom) dance-it's not only a major fundraiser for the older girls to go to summer workshops/intensives, but it's something the girls look forward to each year. I've already got DD's dress for this coming year in the closet, in fact!

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:banghead::banghead::banghead: People are getting RIDICULOUS!! Good grief!! OMG there is a function that doesn't include MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE?!?!?! Call the ACLU and stop this nonsense right. freaking. NOW! Everyone must be included at all times in everything...or else. :glare: Stoopid.

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Yes, I saw that and it made me sad. I don't see why one single mother had to ruin it for everyone else. It said that the law had special exemptions for just that sort of thing, but it wasn't in the general part of the laws.

 

It said that federal law had exemptions, but that RI's state laws did not have exemptions.

 

Personally, I don't understand why a public school would be hosting father/daughter or mother/son events in the first place- because this is what they were talking about, not at a private event. I have no problem with private entities hosting those kind of events, but I have to agree with the single mom on this one.

 

Even when my parents were married, I would have been excluded from this event because my father is a giant pr!ck, and would not have attended an event like this with me.

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It said that the law had special exemptions for just that sort of thing, but it wasn't in the general part of the laws.

 

The Federal law has. The Rhode Island State law does not have an exemption.

So, basically, publicly funded activities that are gender discriminatory have been against the law in RI for a long time, only nobody cared.

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Hmmm. I don't think it's a big deal.

 

They are only saying that "school" funds can't be used to put on the dance. It said that the PTO or some other organization could still sponsor the dances. *shrug*

 

:iagree:

 

Using public funds on gender specific activities starts down a slippery slope.

 

Also: why not have a children-parent dance? This way, even the children of single parents may be able to participate.

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More accurately "banned from one school district in RI and recently politicized by someone running for state office." Nothing is stopping other organizations from holding one.

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It said that federal law had exemptions, but that RI's state laws did not have exemptions.

 

Personally, I don't understand why a public school would be hosting father/daughter or mother/son events in the first place- because this is what they were talking about, not at a private event. I have no problem with private entities hosting those kind of events, but I have to agree with the single mom on this one.

 

Even when my parents were married, I would have been excluded from this event because my father is a giant pr!ck, and would not have attended an event like this with me.

 

I would've never been able to go either, but I LOVE seeing events that encourage parents to do activities with their kids, especially their children of the opposite sex. Things like Father daughter (or uncle which is what my kids had) pumpkin carving, or father daughter dances, or mother's day teas, or mother son treasure hunts. I don't want everybody else to miss out on something just because I did. If we did things that way no one would be able to do anything.

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To play devil's advocate (and as someone who lost her father at age 10), I could sort of understand. THIS made me sad:

 

The organization challenged their existence following a complaint from a single mom who said her daughter was prevented from attending a father-daughter dance in the Cranston Public Schools district.

 

It just makes me sad that this girl and many like her, whose fathers are not around because they are deceased, deadbeats, or whatever, is further alienated from her peers. It's like a slap in the face to be told "Hey you don't have a dad and that means you're not good enough to have fun with us."

 

That's just my perspective on this.

 

ETA: I still remember how stigmatizing it was when I was in school, when people asked about my dad and I had to tell them he died. I felt so different and alone because so few kids went through that. Fortunately my school district did not have such dances but I can only imagine how hurt I would have been to see all my friends preparing to go to one.

Edited by OH_Homeschooler
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I would've never been able to go either, but I LOVE seeing events that encourage parents to do activities with their kids, especially their children of the opposite sex. Things like Father daughter (or uncle which is what my kids had) pumpkin carving, or father daughter dances, or mother's day teas, or mother son treasure hunts. I don't want everybody else to miss out on something just because I did. If we did things that way no one would be able to do anything.

 

I did say that I had no problem with private entities having functions like this. It's using public school funds and facilities for this that is my problem.

 

To play devil's advocate (and as someone who lost her father at age 10), I could sort of understand. THIS made me sad:

 

 

 

It just makes me sad that this girl and many like her, whose fathers are not around because they are deceased, deadbeats, or whatever, is further alienated from her peers. It's like a slap in the face to be told "Hey you don't have a dad and that means you're not good enough to have fun with us."

 

That's just my perspective on this.

 

:iagree:

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It just makes me sad that this girl and many like her, whose fathers are not around because they are deceased, deadbeats, or whatever, is further alienated from her peers. It's like a slap in the face to be told "Hey you don't have a dad and that means you're not good enough to have fun with us."

:iagree:

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Oh FFS!

 

Yep, we're going to H>>> in a Handbasket.

 

:iagree::iagree:

 

America has turned into the Borg, and we are becoming assimilated.

 

 

I wouldn't have been able to go. But you know what, it's not fair that MY not being able to should shut down the fun for all of the others, BEcause of ME, the rest would be deprived of a sweet memory with their fathers.

 

This is the equivalent of giving everyone a trophy for participating.

Edited by justamouse
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Personally, I don't understand why a public school would be hosting father/daughter or mother/son events in the first place- because this is what they were talking about, not at a private event. I have no problem with private entities hosting those kind of events, but I have to agree with the single mom on this one.

 

 

I Agree.

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It just makes me sad that this girl and many like her, whose fathers are not around because they are deceased, deadbeats, or whatever, is further alienated from her peers. It's like a slap in the face to be told "Hey you don't have a dad and that means you're not good enough to have fun with us."

 

I really, really, strongly agree with this.

 

I don't have a problem with it if they're allowed to substitute someone else who is meaningful to them.

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I really, really, strongly agree with this.

 

I don't have a problem with it if they're allowed to substitute someone else who is meaningful to them.

 

:iagree: I think that's the only time it has to become a problem. My kids have never taken their daddy to any of their daddy functions, but they don't feel strange or left out. There are plenty of other kids who bring an uncle or grandpa or even just a close family friend.

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To play devil's advocate (and as someone who lost her father at age 10), I could sort of understand. THIS made me sad:

 

 

 

It just makes me sad that this girl and many like her, whose fathers are not around because they are deceased, deadbeats, or whatever, is further alienated from her peers. It's like a slap in the face to be told "Hey you don't have a dad and that means you're not good enough to have fun with us."

 

That's just my perspective on this.

 

ETA: I still remember how stigmatizing it was when I was in school, when people asked about my dad and I had to tell them he died. I felt so different and alone because so few kids went through that. Fortunately my school district did not have such dances but I can only imagine how hurt I would have been to see all my friends preparing to go to one.

 

:iagree: I don't think public schools should be exclusionary in any way with public funds. I have no problem with events like that, but even a private one that didn't make exceptions for a child that didn't have a present father figure in her life would have me rolling my eyes.

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:banghead::banghead::banghead: People are getting RIDICULOUS!! Good grief!! OMG there is a function that doesn't include MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE?!?!?! Call the ACLU and stop this nonsense right. freaking. NOW! Everyone must be included at all times in everything...or else. :glare: Stoopid.

 

:iagree:

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It said that federal law had exemptions, but that RI's state laws did not have exemptions.

 

The Federal law has. The Rhode Island State law does not have an exemption.

So, basically, publicly funded activities that are gender discriminatory have been against the law in RI for a long time, only nobody cared.

 

Thank you, that part confused me.

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To play devil's advocate (and as someone who lost her father at age 10), I could sort of understand. THIS made me sad:

 

 

 

It just makes me sad that this girl and many like her, whose fathers are not around because they are deceased, deadbeats, or whatever, is further alienated from her peers. It's like a slap in the face to be told "Hey you don't have a dad and that means you're not good enough to have fun with us."

 

That's just my perspective on this.

 

ETA: I still remember how stigmatizing it was when I was in school, when people asked about my dad and I had to tell them he died. I felt so different and alone because so few kids went through that. Fortunately my school district did not have such dances but I can only imagine how hurt I would have been to see all my friends preparing to go to one.

 

My daughters father died when she was only 9 years old. Her girl scout troop had a father/daughter dance. I can't begin to tell you the angst she had over this. I even arranged to have her uncle take her, but it just wasn't the same.

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Some thoughts (I had a lot):

 

I think it's entirely appropriate for a public school to host and sponsor a family event. Such events help the sense of connection and community at the school and it's a loss when schools are only places you enter when it's time for class.

 

The whole public vs. private debate is just silly to me. They can sponsor a family dance or other events. Just sponsor something else and let any daddy-daughter dances be privately sponsored.

 

Was the daughter in question actually prevented from going with another adult in her life or was she prevented from going because she didn't have an adult male in her life to take her? Because my reaction to those is a little different.

 

I think they're probably right that the time for daddy-daughter dances has passed. I would much prefer a parent-kid dance for basically the reasons listed in the article. However, when you go about trying to change it this way, it's bound to create ire. What a waste of the ACLU's purpose.

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Yes, I saw that and it made me sad. I don't see why one single mother had to ruin it for everyone else. It said that the law had special exemptions for just that sort of thing, but it wasn't in the general part of the laws.

This. A grandpa couldn't take her? Uncle? No one? Really? :glare:

It said that federal law had exemptions, but that RI's state laws did not have exemptions.

 

Personally, I don't understand why a public school would be hosting father/daughter or mother/son events in the first place- because this is what they were talking about, not at a private event. I have no problem with private entities hosting those kind of events, but I have to agree with the single mom on this one.

 

Even when my parents were married, I would have been excluded from this event because my father is a giant pr!ck, and would not have attended an event like this with me.

Well, I guess as long as it isn't banning them altogether.

But I still think it's baloney.

I would've never been able to go either, but I LOVE seeing events that encourage parents to do activities with their kids, especially their children of the opposite sex. Things like Father daughter (or uncle which is what my kids had) pumpkin carving, or father daughter dances, or mother's day teas, or mother son treasure hunts. I don't want everybody else to miss out on something just because I did. If we did things that way no one would be able to do anything.

:iagree:

To play devil's advocate (and as someone who lost her father at age 10), I could sort of understand. THIS made me sad:

 

 

 

It just makes me sad that this girl and many like her, whose fathers are not around because they are deceased, deadbeats, or whatever, is further alienated from her peers. It's like a slap in the face to be told "Hey you don't have a dad and that means you're not good enough to have fun with us."

 

That's just my perspective on this.

 

ETA: I still remember how stigmatizing it was when I was in school, when people asked about my dad and I had to tell them he died. I felt so different and alone because so few kids went through that. Fortunately my school district did not have such dances but I can only imagine how hurt I would have been to see all my friends preparing to go to one.

Sigh. She could have taken someone else. I would have taken Grandpa if I were her.

:iagree::iagree:

 

America has turned into the Borg, and we are becoming assimilated.

I wouldn't have been able to go. But you know what, it's not fair that MY not being able to should shut down the fun for all of the others, BEcause of ME, the rest would be deprived of a sweet memory with their fathers.

 

This is the equivalent of giving everyone a trophy for participating.

:iagree:

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Some thoughts (I had a lot):

 

I think it's entirely appropriate for a public school to host and sponsor a family event. Such events help the sense of connection and community at the school and it's a loss when schools are only places you enter when it's time for class.

 

The whole public vs. private debate is just silly to me. They can sponsor a family dance or other events. Just sponsor something else and let any daddy-daughter dances be privately sponsored.

 

Was the daughter in question actually prevented from going with another adult in her life or was she prevented from going because she didn't have an adult male in her life to take her? Because my reaction to those is a little different.

 

I think they're probably right that the time for daddy-daughter dances has passed. I would much prefer a parent-kid dance for basically the reasons listed in the article. However, when you go about trying to change it this way, it's bound to create ire. What a waste of the ACLU's purpose.

 

Why, I wonder? Why has the time for them passed?

It makes me sad if that is the case. :(

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This. A grandpa couldn't take her? Uncle? No one? Really? :glare:

 

 

Sigh. She could have taken someone else. I would have taken Grandpa if I were her.

 

:iagree:

 

I'm not sure she actually could have taken someone else. The article said the "girl was prevented from going" so it sounds like it had to be her dad or no one.

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I'm not sure she actually could have taken someone else. The article said the "girl was prevented from going" so it sounds like it had to be her dad or no one.

 

That's the problem I had. If she could have attended with her mom or another honored adult, I'd have no issue. I don't see the point in excluding a child who wants to be included? It is a waste of resources using the ACLU here, but why the heck was the school so hard nosed that it went this far?

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I'm not sure she actually could have taken someone else. The article said the "girl was prevented from going" so it sounds like it had to be her dad or no one.

 

If that was the case, banning father-daughter dances won't fix the issue. The school will find something else to be callous and inflexible over. It's an issue in the school, not with the dances.

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Why, I wonder? Why has the time for them passed?

It makes me sad if that is the case. :(

 

I just think our idea of gender roles is different now as a society. Certainly it is in my family. The daddy-daughter dances emphasize a sort of idea that I think has kind of passed. This is not to say that fathers and daughters shouldn't have special relationships still - more that that one image of them isn't what everyone has any more. It's not that I'm against the daddy-daughter dance, more that I'd rather see a celebration of different sorts of parent relationships.

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Well, that's dumb. In today's society they didn't have leeway for that? Sigh...

 

I wondered if it might be considered "creepy" because of the way we're so suspicious of adult men these days. :( Another whole can of worms there. But as I said, I couldn't tell if she wasn't allowed to go with someone else or if she just didn't have someone else.

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More accurately "banned from one school district in RI and recently politicized by someone running for state office." Nothing is stopping other organizations from holding one.

 

:iagree:

 

This thread is a symptom of the "culture of rage" that depends on unreality and distorting of the truth of situations to maximize anger.

 

When one reads the real story, it is ho hum. Father Daughter dances were not banned in Rhode Island. Rather it was deemed inappropriate for a school district to sponsor such events. Big difference, and the correct policy IMO.

 

Bill

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:iagree:

 

This thread is a symptom of the "culture of rage" that depends on unreality and distorting of the truth of situations to maximize anger.

 

When one reads the real story, it is ho hum. Father Daughter dances were not banned in Rhode Island. Rather it was deemed inappropriate for a school district to sponsor such events. Big difference, and the correct policy IMO.

 

Bill

 

:iagree:

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No, the dances (as described in the article) are the equivalent of a bully shoving the kid who's different into a locker.

 

Totally false. And inflating the issue far more than it is.

 

As homeschoolers, our kids deal with being different *every day* and when the socialization issue comes up, what do we do? Mutter under our breath and pull out a worn line of how our kids are very well socialized, thank you very much.

 

OUr kids don't go to dances, our kids don't go to proms, some towns forbid them from joining sports teams and WE PAY TAXES for these schools that keep our kids out.

 

Wait! Let me call the ACLU!!!!

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I would never have thought it could happen, but I think I'm agreeing with the ACLU on this one. Additionally the headlines are very misleading - there is NO ban on dances in RI. They just don't want tax money going to support discriminatory activities. I would go a step further and say that promoting these dances isn't the business of education, but that's just my opinion :p And, I just always find those father/daughter dances just a bit creepy...can't imagine ever dancing with my dad except at my wedding.

 

Groups in RI need to step up and provide the activities with their own funds.

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Some thoughts (I had a lot):

 

I think it's entirely appropriate for a public school to host and sponsor a family event. Such events help the sense of connection and community at the school and it's a loss when schools are only places you enter when it's time for class.

 

The whole public vs. private debate is just silly to me. They can sponsor a family dance or other events. Just sponsor something else and let any daddy-daughter dances be privately sponsored.

 

Was the daughter in question actually prevented from going with another adult in her life or was she prevented from going because she didn't have an adult male in her life to take her? Because my reaction to those is a little different.

 

I think they're probably right that the time for daddy-daughter dances has passed. I would much prefer a parent-kid dance for basically the reasons listed in the article. However, when you go about trying to change it this way, it's bound to create ire. What a waste of the ACLU's purpose.

:iagree:These are my feelings on the subject also.

 

I'd prefer to see parent-child activities. Some parents may have schedules that prevent participation. So while dd's dad is with us odds are he would not have been able to go. And if he did go, he isn't the dancing type.

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:iagree:

 

This thread is a symptom of the "culture of rage" that depends on unreality and distorting of the truth of situations to maximize anger.

 

When one reads the real story, it is ho hum. Father Daughter dances were not banned in Rhode Island. Rather it was deemed inappropriate for a school district to sponsor such events. Big difference, and the correct policy IMO.

 

Bill

 

:iagree: Really, these are the types of things should not be sponsored with public monies.

 

But, then, I don't think any school dance or purely entertainment for the sake of entertainment (no link to academic class/learning) type of event should be paid for on the public dole and especially in an economy in which schools are telling parents there won't be toilet paper in the building unless they provide it! :glare: Oh, yes...you guessed it...my local district (p.s. they raised the sports budget again, but fired eight teachers - yet, they will use tax dollars to pay for the decorations and food at the homecoming dance, but can't find money for T.P.!!!!!).

 

Really, the tax dollars need to be about education and the federal laws on non-discrimination need to be followed. If the PTO wants to raise money to host it, then that is a different story.

 

Faith

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OK, for all of you saying the $ should be spent on education, my town just put in a million dollar football field with lights that can be seen on the moon.

 

HOW is that different?

 

I don't agree with that either.

 

Why would you assume we approve of that?

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I think the dances are nice. I loved that my daughter got to do these things that I never did with my father. Girl Scouts held one every year. Not everyone HAD a father to bring, but even the girls with two mommies managed to locate a willing uncle. A mother would have been allowed to attend if no male could be ound. It was NEVER attended 100% for various reasons, but it was there for the people who were interested.

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I don't agree with that either.

 

Why would you assume we approve of that?

 

Well, no one calls the ACLU about the football fields? Mom had a hissy fit about the dance, and boom, there was a law made. THere are far more egregious sins going on with public money other than father daughter dances.

 

One of my flaming liberal pinko friends (I say that in love, I adore him) just went to one with his daughter, and posted pictures on his FB. He was quite proud.

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One of the comments on the article:

 

 

 

:D

 

I like this one

 

 

So using similar logic, because of the American's with Disabilities Act, we should outlaw ALL school dances.

 

Because obviously, some children can't dance and therefore we should prohibit all the others from dancing because it makes the disabled sad.

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I'm pretty sure that if the football team were restricted to boys who had fathers, someone would call the ACLU.

:D

 

It's about the school money, though. School money is spend in a gazillion ways that unfair, and plain old wrong.

 

This mom was mad because she thought it wasn't fair, and she broke the whole thing for all of the other kids.

 

I don't go around complaining that my kids can't play football because they're home schooled--yet I paid for that football field. No one is telling the town to raise other money for the field. I don't complain that my kid can't be prom king, or queen and be crowned at the homecoming game...

 

So, where's it end?

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