Time Utilization

[Susan in TN]

I'm sorry if this is discussed ad nauseum.

 

If you had an 11th grader who by all accounts is responsible, has a generally good attitude and is a "good student", but continually fell behind in school work, how would you go about diagnosing the issue?

 

We've had numerous discussions over scheduling, prioritizing, goal setting, working ahead on weekends, etc. We've asked him what he thinks would help him. He's cut back his extra activities from 6 to 2 (his own decisions). Still he struggles and it frustrates me to no end.

 

I'm wondering if I should tail him for a day and see how his school day goes - find out if he's really utilizing his time well or if there is some other issue? At his age I hate to act like a babysitter, but honestly, it seems he might need one :tongue_smilie:.

 

Any other suggestions?

[regentrude]

My kids are required to write down every day how much time they spend on which subject - we started this in middle school. This way, we can easily see where the time goes and if they even put in a sufficient amount of time on task.

I would suggest first to have your student keep a detailed log of his activities every day for a week; have him log his school work and breaks and recreatinon and activities in 15 minute increments This way, you will see if he spends enough time at all or takes too many breaks.

If you find that the student does devote sufficient time to his work, I would then sit with him for a few days to find out why putting in the necessary time does not translate into an adequate progress. It can be distraction, bad match of curriculum to learning style, inefficient work habits. This may be hard to diagnose. (I sometimes have college students who spend the necessary time but do not succeed. For them, simply increasing time spent will not help; we have to find ways how they can use the time differently.)

But first and foremost, one needs to make sure the student spends enough time on task.

[Mom22ns]

I track my kids days too. Ds spends 6-9:30 with me doing math and science each morning, then goes off to work on his own. At lunch I ask what he did for the last 2-3 hours. I think it really helps him too. Sometimes he realizes he just spent 3 hours making minimal progress on one subject.

 

Have your ds track the time he is spending on each subject or ask every few hours what he has done since you saw him last. Help him realize where his time is going.

[Susan in TN]

He does have a daily schedule and I ask periodically what he needs to be working on now/how much he needs to accomplish/what he has been working on/accomplishing, etc. He has kept a written track before and I don't know that it has helped him - at least not long term. I'm sure he resents being "babysat", but honestly, I don't know what else to do for him. It's also very difficult since I have several youngers who *really* need my help with their lessons.

 

I think part of his problem comes when he gets behind in one subject and so uses other time during his day to catch up, which makes him get behind in other subjects. Does that make sense? Right now he's reading his literature assignment which is due to be done this afternoon, even though he's had since last Friday to read it (a very short book). Thus he has skipped piano practice and math, and would have skipped rhetoric if I hadn't actually gone downstairs and asked him what he was *supposed* to be doing. And now he's gone back to reading. I'm glad he's trying to get his assignment done - literature is one thing he is always lagging behind in despite the fact that he has 3 hours every afternoon dedicated to history and literature reading.

 

Maybe we should make sure he completes his literature or history reading over the weekend? That would certainly help him.

 

He has a fun activity scheduled for Saturday - do you think we should make attendance conditional on getting a certain amount of work done? We haven't done that for so long with him...:tongue_smilie:

[regentrude]

I think part of his problem comes when he gets behind in one subject and so uses other time during his day to catch up, which makes him get behind in other subjects.

 

Robbing Peter to pay Paul?

the question is WHY does he get behind in the first place. Once he is behind, it carries a chain reaction.

 

literature is one thing he is always lagging behind in despite the fact that he has 3 hours every afternoon dedicated to history and literature reading.

 

Is the work load to heavy? Is he reading slower than you think he is? Is he distracted while working?

 

Maybe we should make sure he completes his literature or history reading over the weekend? That would certainly help him.

 

I don't see why not; doing some reading is not a hardship. My DD has homework every weekend; she has to work hard for her dual enrollment classes and has several hours of actual work to do over the weekend.

 

He has a fun activity scheduled for Saturday - do you think we should make attendance conditional on getting a certain amount of work done?

 

I would only resort to this if you can pinpoint that he is actually at fault by not putting in enough time. I would not punish a student if the assigned work load was more than he could handle in the allotted time. I also think that fun activities and recreation are extremely important to recharge and would be very reluctant to impose restrictions - unless, of course, the student was really neglecting his work.

 

It all goes back to the question: WHY is he getting behind in literature?

[Candid]

David Allen's Getting Things Done is a good book that is geared towards business professionals but might help him figure out his own priorities.

 

You could also check out Cal Newport's materials: http://www.amazon.com/Cal-Newport/e/B001IGNR0U/ref=ntt_athr_dp_pel_1 AND http://calnewport.com/blog/ (you'll need to search on his blog as his study for high school student posts are older).

[Susan in TN]

Robbing Peter to pay Paul?

the question is WHY does he get behind in the first place. Once he is behind, it carries a chain reaction.

 

Is the work load to heavy? Is he reading slower than you think he is? Is he distracted while working?

 

Maybe. This weeks assignment is to read Animal Farm. Really, a Jr. High level book, so I didn't think it would take more than what - 5 hours to read, plus an extra hour to answer questions? I know he spent time reading over the weekend, but he may have been trying also to finish reading from the previous week which was roughly 12 poems by Robert Frost and T.S. Eliot (portions). And the (2) weeks before that was All Quiet on the Western Front - again, not "difficult" reading.

 

I don't see why not; doing some reading is not a hardship. My DD has homework every weekend; she has to work hard for her dual enrollment classes and has several hours of actual work to do over the weekend.

 

And in our Friday meetings, we discuss the next week's assignments and I remind them to work on completing some of it over the weekend. So he knows this, just doesn't get it done.

 

 

I would only resort to this if you can pinpoint that he is actually at fault by not putting in enough time. I would not punish a student if the assigned work load was more than he could handle in the allotted time. I also think that fun activities and recreation are extremely important to recharge and would be very reluctant to impose restrictions - unless, of course, the student was really neglecting his work.

 

Yes, and I hesitate so much with this because until the past year, he really had no real social outlets that interested him. Now he has occasional opportunities with his church youth group that he loves.

 

It all goes back to the question: WHY is he getting behind in literature?

 

Yes. I know he CAN read well :) since he often reads aloud at story time and can read/sing complex choral music. I'm not sure what else I can do to figure out what the problem is. Maybe he struggles with focus?

 

:tongue_smilie:

[nancy in nj]

I would ask whether your schedule is realistic for a junior in highschool? We've found that as the material gets more difficult, a fixed schedule of spending 1 hour on math, for example, at this particular time of day is actually counter-productive. Sometimes the material is difficult and just plain requires more time to understand or devote to a particularly difficult problem set. While it is perfectly reasonable to allow 1.5 hours per day for precalc (on average), of course this would fluctuate depending on the topic. I would think it is perfectly normal to "get behind" a daily schedule for any number of legitimate reasons.

 

My daughter has found that looking at the big picture of work required for the week, and then breaking it down into chunks is a much more effective way to work, and even then her schedule is constantly adjusted depending on the daily demands of her work. Some subjects, such as AP Calculus BC get done daily and, while she has estimated 2 hours per day (on average), some days are longer, some shorter. On a long, difficult Calc day, it is not unreasonable that she would put in less time and effort on AP Chem that day--instead she might switch things around and focus more than initially planned on AP Lit or AP US History which are her "fun" subjects, freeing up future time for AP Chem.

 

We don't stress about these daily "deviations" from schedule and consider this good preparation for managing her college workload next year.

 

 

We have found the planner pad (where you funnel weekly requirements down into days very useful in scheduling my daughters' work. It has really helped her take ownership of her own schedule and has taken me out of the picture entirely! :D

 

Nancy

[Susan in TN]

 

. I would think it is perfectly normal to "get behind" a daily schedule for any number of legitimate reasons.

 

Right, except that he's not a couple days behind in math - more like a month. He should be about finished with chapter 5 by the end of next week (the end of the quarter) and I think he's just starting chapter 3. It's not a challenging course. He says it's not difficult for him and he understands it well. Same with his other subjects. He is not taking any AP or honors level courses.

 

My daughter has found that looking at the big picture of work required for the week, and then breaking it down into chunks is a much more effective way to work, and even then her schedule is constantly adjusted depending on the daily demands of her work.

We don't stress about these daily "deviations" from schedule and consider this good preparation for managing her college workload next year.

 

Right, and again, I'm not talking about small deviations. We talk with him weekly about his schedule...do you need to make adjustments, changes, etc? He knows the chunks of work that he needs to finish weekly/quarterly/etc. and is given freedom to make his own schedule and plan. Always his answer is that he's doing OK, but clearly he is not.

 

We have found the planner pad (where you funnel weekly requirements down into days very useful in scheduling my daughters' work. It has really helped her take ownership of her own schedule and has taken me out of the picture entirely! :D

 

Yes, and he has planners ad nauseum but will not do them consistently; which again takes me back to the "babysitting" issue. I don't have time to babysit him AND his planner :glare:.

Nancy

 

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[nancy in nj]

Ah....I see. I didn't understand the magnitude of the issue.

 

Does he have any outside courses where he is accountable to someone outside the family? My daughter had similar issues with not taking mom deadlines seriously. The one thing that really helped was taking outside (online), non-self-paced courses with firm deadlines. Also, interacting with high-achieving peers seemed to "light a fire." The discipline seemed to carry over to all of her courses starting in junior year. If he doesn't have any outside accountability, is there any chance of arranging some opportunities?

 

Also, junior year is when a lot of teens naturally develop the self-discipline needed to manage their own schedules and complete their coursework on time. Something about all of the standardized testing (SAT's etc) and the college thing becoming more real seems to give them the necessary push.

 

Good luck!

 

Nancy

[angela in ohio]

At his age I hate to act like a babysitter, but honestly, it seems he might need one

 

I don't consider this babysitting at all.

 

I have a student like that (responsible, good student,) but she is still repsonsible for accounting for her time to me.

[Brenda in MA]

When I had issues like these with my older son, I found that the best way to "right the ship" so to speak was to do more babysitting for awhile -- a few days to a few weeks -- until he was back on track, and then I could back off a bit.

 

I would suggest having him make out his daily schedule for the following week during your Friday meeting. Have him break down his work into exactly what he plans to accomplish each day. Then at the end of each day, go over his plan and see what he was able to accomplish.

 

I agree with the others that I would try to avoid cancelling his Saturday outing, but if he still has work left over from the previous week, make him do at least some of it on Saturday before he goes. Also, getting a head start on reading on the weekend is a good idea.

 

I would avoid trying to have him "catch up" in math right now -- just focus on getting him up to a reasonable pace, and then see where he can catch up -- maybe a day of math on the weekends or doing some during Thanksgiving & Christmas break.

 

With my son, I found that he would get very discouraged when he'd get behind, and that would slow him down even more. By more closely helping him manage his time for a while, I was able to give him encouragement along the way.

 

The goal is for him to be able to manage/schedule himself by the end of high school. It's only the start of 11th grade, so he still has 2 years left. Some kids can schedule/manage themselves earlier than others.

 

Best wishes,

Brenda

[Jean in Newcastle]

My son is only a sophomore, but we've started a new system this year, based on some other advice I got on this board. I've typed up a syllabus for each subject. The syllabus has deadlines for each assignment. I check to make sure the work is done by that time. Tomorrow is the deadline for our first week of school in most subjects. At that time I expect to see the assignments for all of his week's geometry, logic, Latin, etc. If he doesn't have it handed in, then he has to catch up over the weekend. Having deadlines makes sure that he has the accountability he needs without babysitting.

[Susan in TN]

Ah....I see. I didn't understand the magnitude of the issue.

 

Does he have any outside courses where he is accountable to someone outside the family? My daughter had similar issues with not taking mom deadlines seriously. The one thing that really helped was taking outside (online), non-self-paced courses with firm deadlines. Also, interacting with high-achieving peers seemed to "light a fire." The discipline seemed to carry over to all of her courses starting in junior year. If he doesn't have any outside accountability, is there any chance of arranging some opportunities?

 

Also, junior year is when a lot of teens naturally develop the self-discipline needed to manage their own schedules and complete their coursework on time. Something about all of the standardized testing (SAT's etc) and the college thing becoming more real seems to give them the necessary push.

 

Good luck!

 

Nancy

 

Yes - you are so right! He has taken tutorial classes in the past and did very well. We thought we had one class lined up for this year but it fell through. rats. I'm hoping we can manage something for next spring. I often feel guilty because he does well in tutorial classes and really prefers them but we just don't have the finances for much at this time. :tongue_smilie:

 

Brenda, I think my ds is like yours and gets overwhelmed when he is behind and has a hard time functioning. (I'm the same way :blush:). I'll talk with him at our meeting this afternoon and see what he thinks is reasonable and make sure he writes it down. I may suggest that he either do all his history reading or all his literature reading over the weekends to help ease his weekday schedule.

 

Thanks everyone for your advice. I think ds saw my distress and stepped it up a notch. Dh told ds he would like to see some catch-up work done before his Saturday activity and ds actually wrote out a list this morning of what he would like to accomplish before then.