Jump to content

Menu

Midwifery for Doctors?


PIE!
 Share

Recommended Posts

I'm always amazed at how much the hive knows. DH hasn't had much luck finding an answer to a question, so I thought I'd see if the Hive can.

 

DH is almost done with medical residency. He's a family physician who has been trained in all sorts of things so he'll be able to help fill the needs of rural America.

 

He's perfectly comfortable delivering babies in a hospital - but he was wondering about getting training for home birth. He hasn't been able to find where a doctor would go to learn the procedures for home birth.

 

Our state doesn't allow midwives to attend home births - so the midwives he knows at the hospital don't really know much about resources available.

 

So - do any of you know if there is such a thing as a midwifery for doctors course somewhere?

 

I should probably add that we aren't sure how much he would use this skill. We don't know yet what the demand for home birth is wherever he ends up practicing. He'd still prefer to deliver in the hospital, but he'd like to know how home birth works anyway. He's not against home birth at all, and is curious if he could get some training in case he ever has patients who are set on a home birth, even if it's just is own wife :tongue_smilie:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Contact MANA...it is the biggest group of midwives for the country. What state are you in? Are you sure there are not midwives that attend homebirth? Often the CNM's at the hospital won't, but CPM's will. http://mana.org/

 

Thanks for the link!

 

We're in Nebraska, one of the two states where it is illegal for midwives to attend home births. There are probably ones who do, but it would not be something they would admit for fear of legal action.

 

We will be moving to another state after residency though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd contact the nearest midwife school and ask do they have some type of fast tracked training for Doctors.

 

And I'm sure he will have a demand - it's quite difficult in some places to find a midwife or OB willing to do a home birth.

 

Good idea! living in a not-home-birth-friendly state, I don't know if the nearest midwife school would be the best choice. I don't know if there are any around here at all - but I'll check :)

Traveling is an option. How does one pick out a good school?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good idea! living in a not-home-birth-friendly state, I don't know if the nearest midwife school would be the best choice. I don't know if there are any around here at all - but I'll check :)

Traveling is an option. How does one pick out a good school?

 

No idea. I do know a lot of midwives who go to the school in El Paso, TX or there is one in Florida.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd have him check first to make sure he would be allowed by his malpractice insurance to do homebirths. The midwife who delivered dd had to quit midwifery when she got her nursing license because her malpractice insurance wouldn't cover her if she continued.

 

good point. so far this is just an idea - there are certainly a lot of things to think through first. that is definitely something to look into.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

He might want to try contacting the few doctors left that do do homebirth...there are only a few in the country. Not sure how to find them though.

 

And there are LOTS of midwifery schools...I know of 4 or 5 in Florida alone, one that is run out of a community college.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My family doctor used to attend homebirths but his malpractice insurance forbids it now.

 

He still makes the occasional housecall. He went to my sister's house to see her sick baby. He was concerned my nephew had to be admitted, so he went to the house rather than make her bring the baby to the office only to go the hospital.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Great idea! And even if he doesn't end up doing homebirths, he could be the backup doctor for midwives that do, and that would be fantastic! Plus, he could learn what it is women expect in those kinds of births, so that women that risk out of homebirth could still get good, non interventive, evidence based care even if they have to go to the hospital.

 

Your hubby is my hero!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm always amazed at how much the hive knows. DH hasn't had much luck finding an answer to a question, so I thought I'd see if the Hive can.

 

DH is almost done with medical residency. He's a family physician who has been trained in all sorts of things so he'll be able to help fill the needs of rural America.

 

He's perfectly comfortable delivering babies in a hospital - but he was wondering about getting training for home birth. He hasn't been able to find where a doctor would go to learn the procedures for home birth.

 

Our state doesn't allow midwives to attend home births - so the midwives he knows at the hospital don't really know much about resources available.

 

So - do any of you know if there is such a thing as a midwifery for doctors course somewhere?

 

I should probably add that we aren't sure how much he would use this skill. We don't know yet what the demand for home birth is wherever he ends up practicing. He'd still prefer to deliver in the hospital, but he'd like to know how home birth works anyway. He's not against home birth at all, and is curious if he could get some training in case he ever has patients who are set on a home birth, even if it's just is own wife :tongue_smilie:

 

Well, good for him for wanting to do this!

 

Although, he will probably not be able to find med mal insurance that will cover him if he does. Stupid system. It worked for hundreds of years before the medical system took over.

 

If he really wants to learn how it's done, he ought to find a lay midwife who has been doing it 30+ years. They are the ones who know everything about how a woman's body really works.

 

My doctor friend said our midwife, who had delivered over 700 babies, knew far more than he would ever know about that topic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As far as I understand doing homebirths can be very very difficult for doctors. In some places a doctor could lose his license to practice just for attending a homebirth to learn.

 

But I think it would be totally awesome to have a doctor who had studied with midwives. Not so much to practice homebirth, but to learn how they deal with birth overall, which is just such a different (and more successful) model of care.

 

If you don't get much help locally, you might try to contact Ina May Gaskin at The Farm midwifery center. She is a big advocate in the US of midwifery, including at the political level, and they have internships and classes at The Farm. I am pretty sure she or one of the midwives in her group might be interested in helping doctors understand how the work and cwould have an idea how to fandangle some sort of teaching arrangement, even in your local area.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

OH, and have him read the book "Born in America", by Marsden Wagner. He is a doctor, and used to be a director in the World Health Organization. His insights into the world of medicine, liablility, etc are fascinating and I bet your husband would really like it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kudos to him for wanting to offer this!!

 

We used to have a doctor (he has since passed away) who studied midwifery in England but practiced as an OBGYN here.

 

Ditto the question about his license and/or insurance allowing him to catch babies outside of the hospital?? I know a doc who won't even come attend a home birth (in the background, just to see what it's like) because of this.

 

I don't know of any midwifery schools that have training specifically for doctors. Because the models of care are so very different, he'd probably be wise to take time and study midwifery. He'll probably have to de-school a bit. ;) Most women who choose home birth want midwifery care, not medical care.

 

He might look into CNM schools. Perhaps there is an option for admittance for medical doctors.

 

The lay midwifery (for those who want CPM credentials) schools are pretty much all correspondence-based. He would probably have to do an apprenticeship alongside the didactic learning. On the NARM PEP application there is a spot to note if one has other credentials, including MD. But the other requirements still have to be met.

 

even if he doesn't end up doing homebirths, he could be the backup doctor for midwives that do, and that would be fantastic

:iagree: I can't tell you how valuable it is having a natural-birth, midwife, homebirth friendly doctor supporting us. It's SO hard to find doctors who will even be supportive, let alone take clients for transports or transfer of care situations.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

http://www.homefirst.com/

Home first is a doctor group that does Homebirths in Illinois. They have since the 70s. I'd call them.

 

Homefirst is no longer doing homebirths. They got into a lot of trouble and lost a big malpractice case. I have been part of the natural birth community in the Chicago area for 16 years. When I was attending the births of my childbirth students, the Homefirst births scared me. I felt that they sent inexperienced, overworked nurses out to births and did not send doctors out soon enough in the process. The nurse was not the person they developed a relationship with. I am sorry, but a HBAC needs a doc there, not a nurse who just came from an 18-hour labor/birth.

 

Back to the OP - if there isn't anything official he can do, perhaps he can attend some shadow a homebirth midwife to learn from her. Either way, skills he learns at home will help him be a better practitioner in the hospital setting. Kudos to him!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think one of the best ways an MD can support birth choices is to support midwives. In my state all homebirth midwives have to have a supervising MD. Those are hard to come by these days. Unfortunately, only an OB can fill that role in this state. But, if a GP could do it, then that might be something your dh could do. I know that one around here just retired and he is sorely missed. He was a great guy.

 

A GP can have a tremendous impact just by being supportive of homebirth and breastfeeding. I love the way my family GP does stuff like not have any formula advertising in the office. He doesn't have medical advertizing in general. Drug company reps are always dropping off clip boards and clocks etc to medical offices. They all have the name of some medication or formula etc. He uses the clip board, but I noticed the medicine brand name is covered in masking tape. It is little things like that that I really appreciate.

 

He is very supportive of homebirth, all his children have been born at home with a midwife. He is very open about that.

 

He doesn't ask how many ounces of formula, he asks how breastfeeding is going. He will refer to a lactation consultant when needed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Homefirst is no longer doing homebirths. They got into a lot of trouble and lost a big malpractice case. I have been part of the natural birth community in the Chicago area for 16 years. When I was attending the births of my childbirth students, the Homefirst births scared me. I felt that they sent inexperienced, overworked nurses out to births and did not send doctors out soon enough in the process. The nurse was not the person they developed a relationship with. I am sorry, but a HBAC needs a doc there, not a nurse who just came from an 18-hour labor/birth.

 

Back to the OP - if there isn't anything official he can do, perhaps he can attend some shadow a homebirth midwife to learn from her. Either way, skills he learns at home will help him be a better practitioner in the hospital setting. Kudos to him!

 

Oh, good to know. I haven't lived by Chicago in almost a decade.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This might not help you in particular, but this made me wonder: could a person go overseas to England or somewhere where midwifery is more common, to learn?

 

Well, yes. But, that training or certification etc might not be accepted in this country. In my state we have one homebirth midwife who studied in the UK. I should add that homebirth is legal in my state as long as the midwife is a midwife/nurse, etc, etc. The state did recognize and license the training of this particular nurse who moved to England to study midwifery. But, they have not done so again.

 

So, a person could go overseas and study but that person still has to meet the licensing requirements of their state in order to practice legally.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The lay midwifery (for those who want CPM credentials) schools are pretty much all correspondence-based.

 

 

:iagree: I can't tell you how valuable it is having a natural-birth, midwife, homebirth friendly doctor supporting us. It's SO hard to find doctors who will even be supportive, let alone take clients for transports or transfer of care situations.

 

Just to clarify, a CPM is NOT a lay midwife. A lay midwife is one without formal schooling or certification. Also, there are at least 4 schools in my state, and none are correspondance based.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow! Thanks for all the responses! You've all given us a lot of places to look and things to consider. Thanks!

 

He obviously doesn't need certification or anything, so I wouldn't worry about a full course of study. But some workshops at the Farm would be perfect, and a great mini family vacation as well. And doing some reading, and then attending some births. It sounds like from a malpractice point of view it would be best if he could attend some before he is in his own practice, so start looking for some midwives for him to shadow. Doulas in the area might know of some.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just to clarify, a CPM is NOT a lay midwife. A lay midwife is one without formal schooling or certification.

Yes, one can start as a lay midwife and become a CPM. Self-study is an option for the PEP route along with the apprenticeship.

 

 

Also, there are at least 4 schools in my state, and none are correspondance based.

Which schools are they? There are some CNM programs at universities but that's not what I was talking about. I was talking about programs for those of us seeking schooling to be a midwife other than a CNM. In six years I have yet to come across someone who is doing that type of schooling at anything other than via a correspondence program. Perhaps they are out there and I haven't heard of them. *shrug*

Edited by Heather in OK
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, one can start as a lay midwife and become a CPM. Self-study is an option for the PEP route along with the apprenticeship.

 

 

 

Which schools are they? There are some CNM programs at universities but that's not what I was talking about. I was talking about programs for those of us seeking schooling to be a midwife other than a CNM. In six years I have yet to come across someone who is doing that type of schooling at anything other than via a correspondence program. Perhaps they are out there and I haven't heard of them. *shrug*

 

I'm in Florida. Off the top of my head there is one in Gainesville, the Florida School of Traditional Midwifery, one run locally in the Orlando area called Commonsense Childbirth School of Midwifery, one in the Miami area through Miami Dade Community College, and there was one more down that way, but I'm not positive it is still up and running.

Edited by ktgrok
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...