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NJ hsers -- what were your experiences with your local school system?


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I've always heard NJ is great for homeschooling. I looked at the NJ DOE FAQs, which seems to bear this out.

 

http://www.state.nj.us/education/gen...homeschool.htm

 

But I also found this older (1997) doc from the State which has a much stricter interpretation of what info parents must provide. (Mentions potential grounds for disorderly conduct arrest if compulsory schooling standards are not met.)

 

http://www.oocities.org/heartland/prairie/4195/home_school_nj_booklet.htm.tmp

 

I am wondering why the difference, as I am not aware of big changes law/regulations. Why would one document say parents are advised to provide quite a lot of info, while the other document doesn't?

 

Any and all advice/opinions welcome! (I don't need to know your specific town/area obviously -- I'm looking for general info on how NJ law has been interpreted -- the good, the bad and the ugly.) Please feel free to pm me if you prefer not to share on the board.

 

ETA Second link changed so that it works

Edited by Alessandra
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Your second link wasn't working so I don't know what that said but I've never dealt with my school district at all and neither have any of the homeschoolers I know.

 

I'm certainly going to go by the current state law rather than some old document that was on a geocities website.

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Your second link wasn't working so I don't know what that said but I've never dealt with my school district at all and neither have any of the homeschoolers I know.

 

I'm certainly going to go by the current state law rather than some old document that was on a geocities website.

 

Sorry about the second link. I changed it so that the link works -- it looks like a scan of a (1997) booklet published by the NJ DOE.

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the only trouble I had was getting records from when my children attended. the school wouldn't give me copies saying they would only provide copies to the 'next school'. they didn't 'get' that I WAS the next school. a few hours of internet research on parental rights and an email citing those links was all it took. they called me an hour later saying their records were waiting for me in the office.

 

Robin in NJ

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We have no interaction or communication with the school or the district at all. We are not required to contact them at all, so I don't. And I don't know anyone who has except those pulling their kids out to hs.

 

 

Ditto. You are not required to do anything in regards to the district and there are no ramifications to not doing anything. And, quite frankly, the district does nothing for us (at least, my local district, Hunterdon County). A friend recently asked about getting her son involved in the high school swim team, and although a recent law has been passed allowing hs'ers to participate in school sports, they will not allow him on the team. The coach was eager to have him, the superintendent squashed it. Their loss. But it's really a shame.

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A friend recently asked about getting her son involved in the high school swim team, and although a recent law has been passed allowing hs'ers to participate in school sports, they will not allow him on the team. The coach was eager to have him, the superintendent squashed it. Their loss. But it's really a shame.

 

From what I understand, the NJSIAA will disqualify a team if there is a homeschooler on it -- I'm talking about interscholastic high school sports. It has to do with athletes having to maintain a certain academic average -- my guess is that failing athletes could be pulled out and "homeschooled"??? I hope I've got this right -- it didn't pertain to out family so I didn't bookmark anything.

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Go with the first link. That second link isn't reflective of actual NJ law...just by a quick read. Plus it is 15 years old!

 

The second link still had me worried. But I did find some good advice on the ENOCH web site -- to ask for a written copy of any requests and the law behind the request. I have to remember that!

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I believe that one of the reasons the current FAQ exists is because of the old document, which offered suggestions and "shoulds " which were not reflective of actual law.

 

Realize in NJ, a complaint can be brought. We are to be in compliance of the law and should be able, on short notice, to provide information attesting to that. At the beginning of the year, I type up a one page outline showing the materials we have to cover our intended studies. I keep it in my desk drawer, along with a copy of the DoE FAQ ;) should someone ever come knocking.

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I believe that one of the reasons the current FAQ exists is because of the old document, which offered suggestions and "shoulds " which were not reflective of actual law.

 

Realize in NJ, a complaint can be brought. We are to be in compliance of the law and should be able, on short notice, to provide information attesting to that. At the beginning of the year, I type up a one page outline showing the materials we have to cover our intended studies. I keep it in my desk drawer, along with a copy of the DoE FAQ ;) should someone ever come knocking.

 

Your explanation is extremely helpful. It sheds light on why there are two quite different official documents, but no referenced case law between the two documents.

 

When you type up an outline, how much info do you include? I am presuming books/materials, but not the goals/objectives or comparable hours? For the materials, do you include the title of the program, or a brief description also? Do you include supplementary material? For example, when you list your math program, would you also list worksheet generators, online drill programs, etc, if you use these too?

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A friend recently asked about getting her son involved in the high school swim team, and although a recent law has been passed allowing hs'ers to participate in school sports, they will not allow him on the team. The coach was eager to have him, the superintendent squashed it. Their loss. But it's really a shame.

 

I am battling my school district over this right now. Tried the polite route. Attorney letter has now been sent. We shall see what happens.

 

Other then the sports issue I have had no dealings and/or issues with our district. It is very much "You are going to homeschool. That's great. Don't let the door hit you on the way out."

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Your explanation is extremely helpful. It sheds light on why there are two quite different official documents, but no referenced case law between the two documents.

 

When you type up an outline, how much info do you include? I am presuming books/materials, but not the goals/objectives or comparable hours? For the materials, do you include the title of the program, or a brief description also? Do you include supplementary material? For example, when you list your math program, would you also list worksheet generators, online drill programs, etc, if you use these too?

 

Are you a new HSer in NJ and worried about what the future may hold, or has something happened that has caused you to be on your guard?

 

If you're just worried about your future as a NJ HSer, don't. It is extremely easy here in NJ, and increasingly common. I'm involved in several groups here, across a wide spread of towns and counties, and I don't know a single HSer who has ever had a problem. I've been in contact with our school district a few times, including when withdrawing my oldest to homeschool her, and no one has said a word other than, "Thanks for letting us know."

 

Now, if you happen to have a local school official who looks like they're gunning for you, then yes, I'd put together as detailed a list as I could. But I'd only do that given a specific concern. In spite of a few legislative attempts to burden us, HSing rights in NJ have stood the tests of time and political support.

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I am battling my school district over this right now. Tried the polite route. Attorney letter has now been sent. We shall see what happens.

 

Other then the sports issue I have had no dealings and/or issues with our district. It is very much "You are going to homeschool. That's great. Don't let the door hit you on the way out."

 

That is the same attitude I found when I pulled my daughter out of a Burlington Co school. Followed by.. "well, you know she will have to be tested to get back IN the school".

 

We are no longer in NJ, but we had no issues with anyone while HS'ing in NJ.

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Are you a new HSer in NJ and worried about what the future may hold, or has something happened that has caused you to be on your guard?

 

If you're just worried about your future as a NJ HSer, don't. It is extremely easy here in NJ, and increasingly common. I'm involved in several groups here, across a wide spread of towns and counties, and I don't know a single HSer who has ever had a problem. I've been in contact with our school district a few times, including when withdrawing my oldest to homeschool her, and no one has said a word other than, "Thanks for letting us know."

 

Now, if you happen to have a local school official who looks like they're gunning for you, then yes, I'd put together as detailed a list as I could. But I'd only do that given a specific concern. In spite of a few legislative attempts to burden us, HSing rights in NJ have stood the tests of time and political support.

 

ETA: The only weird comments I've got have been from parents, but that has become much, much better over the years. It's a noticeable change.

 

:iagree:

There is one family I know who has received letters from our school district each year asking what their plans are for the year. It's wrong and an annoyance, but it's never been more than that. I don't know why they got letters and other families didn't.

 

Then another family had to deal with a neighbor's complaint. They police came to the door and the school district got involved. They got a lawyer friend to help. It was upsetting for the family but resolved without any issues.

 

These are the only cases I've personally known of.

 

This is our sixth year homeschooling. I did pull my kids out of public school and sent notification, and I put one of my four back in two years ago. We have dealt with two principals and many other ps teacher and staff, and have never had a single issue or negative comment. We have become very open about our hsing, so everyone at ps and in our neighborhood knows we are a hsing family. Dh has even given presentations at the school. I may be deluding myself, but if anyone in our school district questioned us, we have a lot of people who can vouch for us. It does reassure me that our dd who is in school is a strong academically and has been called "model of good behavior". (Sure wish she was that way at home!)

 

Some people like to stay hidden. I'm fine with being out front about hsing.

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When you type up an outline, how much info do you include?

 

 

It is a list of the subjects and the curriculum I'm using. So for Math, it says:

MATHEMATICS

3rd Grade: Singapore 3A/3B and Miquon Blue

1st Grade: Singapore 1A/1B and Miquon Orange

 

I do it for each subject. Takes about 5-10 minutes to type it up at the beginning of the year, and as an added bonus it reminds me of little supplements I want to use along the way. :tongue_smilie: Because I'm 47 and might forget!

 

As NJKelli alluded to, my concern is not with our school district, though they are the first involved after a complaint. We have someone around here who's had the police to our neighbors about 12x this summer, because of how she parks her car (legally, the wheels have to be in front of the yellow paint on the curb, but the bumper can extend over). To maximize the number of parking spaces on our block, in a shore town, in the summer, we push to the limits of the law, so everyone has a shot at parking on our street. But, if this person will call endlessly about legal parking, heaven knows what would happen if he/she heard about us homeschooling. :) I'm hopeful it is a summertime resident with too much time on his/her hands.

 

For me, it makes sense to be able to answer the door for a complaint and within seconds hand out a copy of the DoE FAQ and our particular course of study. You know the saying, "A good offense can be a good defense." ;) That's simply the way I live. That's also why our school room is in the front of the house. Anyone knocking this time of year can see in our open door and see the chalkboard, the desks, the books everywhere. It's either some homeschooling going on, or the world's smallest and most disheveled library! :tongue_smilie:

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I am battling my school district over this right now. Tried the polite route. Attorney letter has now been sent. We shall see what happens.

 

Other then the sports issue I have had no dealings and/or issues with our district. It is very much "You are going to homeschool. That's great. Don't let the door hit you on the way out."

 

Go, girl! We'll be routing for you.

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It is a list of the subjects and the curriculum I'm using. So for Math, it says:

MATHEMATICS

3rd Grade: Singapore 3A/3B and Miquon Blue

1st Grade: Singapore 1A/1B and Miquon Orange

 

I do it for each subject. Takes about 5-10 minutes to type it up at the beginning of the year, and as an added bonus it reminds me of little supplements I want to use along the way. :tongue_smilie: Because I'm 47 and might forget!

 

As NJKelli alluded to, my concern is not with our school district, though they are the first involved after a complaint. We have someone around here who's had the police to our neighbors about 12x this summer, because of how she parks her car (legally, the wheels have to be in front of the yellow paint on the curb, but the bumper can extend over). To maximize the number of parking spaces on our block, in a shore town, in the summer, we push to the limits of the law, so everyone has a shot at parking on our street. But, if this person will call endlessly about legal parking, heaven knows what would happen if he/she heard about us homeschooling. :) I'm hopeful it is a summertime resident with too much time on his/her hands.

 

For me, it makes sense to be able to answer the door for a complaint and within seconds hand out a copy of the DoE FAQ and our particular course of study. You know the saying, "A good offense can be a good defense." ;) That's simply the way I live. That's also why our school room is in the front of the house. Anyone knocking this time of year can see in our open door and see the chalkboard, the desks, the books everywhere. It's either some homeschooling going on, or the world's smallest and most disheveled library! :tongue_smilie:

 

It's been reassuring that I've been able to make friends with some local police officers. And one dd has participated in the local safety camp run by our local firefighters and EMS. I hope I will never have to call on these friends. :)

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I am battling my school district over this right now. Tried the polite route. Attorney letter has now been sent. We shall see what happens.

 

Other then the sports issue I have had no dealings and/or issues with our district. It is very much "You are going to homeschool. That's great. Don't let the door hit you on the way out."

 

This won't be a certain district that just passed a local law saying no home schoolers on high school teams would it? If so, I think another family has an attorney envolved too.

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No, different district. I wish the family in that district good luck. The whole thing is just so ridiculous. If the kid lives in district and the NJISA has no issue with it then let the kids participate. I just don't see the big deal.

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No, different district. I wish the family in that district good luck. The whole thing is just so ridiculous. If the kid lives in district and the NJISA has no issue with it then let the kids participate. I just don't see the big deal.

 

Did you get the email on the meeting notes from it? It was funny. I wonder what they are afraid of.

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I do recall a thread on here where some of those meeting notes were shared.

My thoughts are this:

Basically, the school system is a bureacracy.

There is one agenda-preserve the status quo

If you throw up enough road blocks the person making noise will give up and go away and then the status quo is maintained.

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No, different district. I wish the family in that district good luck. The whole thing is just so ridiculous. If the kid lives in district and the NJISA has no issue with it then let the kids participate. I just don't see the big deal.

 

Well, you know, homeschooling might be catching. If the kids start talking, who knows what might happen? It could be an epidemic!

 

:001_rolleyes:

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I've always heard NJ is great for homeschooling. I looked at the NJ DOE FAQs, which seems to bear this out.

 

http://www.state.nj.us/education/gen...homeschool.htm

 

But I also found this older (1997) doc from the State which has a much stricter interpretation of what info parents must provide. (Mentions potential grounds for disorderly conduct arrest if compulsory schooling standards are not met.)

 

http://www.oocities.org/heartland/prairie/4195/home_school_nj_booklet.htm.tmp

 

I am wondering why the difference, as I am not aware of big changes law/regulations. Why would one document say parents are advised to provide quite a lot of info, while the other document doesn't?

 

Any and all advice/opinions welcome! (I don't need to know your specific town/area obviously -- I'm looking for general info on how NJ law has been interpreted -- the good, the bad and the ugly.) Please feel free to pm me if you prefer not to share on the board.

 

ETA Second link changed so that it works

 

Okay, I know it's pretty weird to quote oneself, but I found an answer to my question on the HSLDA website, and I thought that others might be interested.

 

"In September of 2010, we celebrate 10 years of relative tranquility in the New Jersey homeschool community under the FAQs, which were formally published in September of 2000 (see the Jan/Feb 2001 Court Report). It is easy now to forget the troubled times that came before.

 

Leading up to September of 2000, homeschooling in New Jersey was in turmoil because the prior Commissioner of Education (Leo Klagholz) had proclaimed a homeschool policy that was both hostile to freedom and out of line with state law and judicial precedent. Threats of litigation, confusion, and anxiety permeated the homeschool community.

 

But when a new commissioner was installed, HSLDA, major state homeschool organizations and advocates sat down with state and local education officials to work toward a fresh start. After several long and intense meetings, the result was a breakthrough.

 

The Department of Education withdrew the former guidelines and adopted the present FAQs. The FAQs were characterized by faithful adherence to state statutes, judicial precedent, and common sense. They brought an end to the “bad old days.†And they have proven their merit by withstanding the test of time.

 

Faint echoes of the old policy still linger, such as when school districts like Rochelle Park demand notice and curriculum information. But New Jersey can now be viewed as the best state overall in the Northeast region in which to homeschool."

 

This is the link

 

http://www.hslda.org/hs/state/nj/201009150.asp

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Okay, I know it's pretty weird to quote oneself, but I found an answer to my question on the HSLDA website, and I thought that others might be interested.

 

I have read this entire thread, and I'm not sure why you seem so worried about NJ regulations. According to your signature, you afterschool; you don't homeschool.

 

Do you live in NJ? Are you planning to homeschool?

 

Because, honestly, I know many NJ homeschoolers, and none of them have ever had the slightest problems with their school districts -- and they're out during the school day with their kids all the time, and it's not like the authorities are stopping them in the streets and asking them why their kids aren't in school.

 

I understand why you would be concerned about the regulations if you're considering homeschooling in NJ, but really, you have nothing to worry about! :)

Edited by Catwoman
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