LisaKinVA Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 EeJust got home, and my daughter is really upset. I can't really blame her. They had a swimathon last week while I was out of town. She claims (and 3 other girls back up her story including the "winning" girl) that she lapped her friend 4-5 times, but she somehow finished 2nd. There is an end of year award involved, which IMO isn't worth purposely not counting a 10 yo's laps... And now I find myself wondering if this same mom was purposely DQing my daughter during the season, so her daughter would score more points and win the MVP award, too. Part of me wants to take the heaping coals of fire approach...but this method assumes she has a conscience. AAARGH. It feels petty to confront someone over this, or to inquire about the DQs. But I also feel a need to stand up for my girl. Ugh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 That's just plain bizarre. I'd be making enquiries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TammyinTN Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 This would drive me nuts!:glare: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettyandbob Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 what a yucky situation. I don't know how to handle it. I know if I tried to do something/say something I'd probably end up sounding/looking like a meddlesome and obnoxious mother, rather than someone trying stick up for my dd. In other words if it were my kid who was treated unfairly I'd probably make the situation worse. I'm just no good at this stuff. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 We had an incident at the parade of a parent being obnoxious like that. No it wasn't a sport but geeze you'd think getting candy was. She was actively encouraging her 2 kids to run and take the candy and other prizes that were placed essentially at the feet of other kids. In order to prevent kids from running into the middle of the street and getting hit by a float, they try to toss a handful of candy or treats nearly to the feet of every cluster of kids. This mother was cheering her kids on as they ran down the length grabbing all the candy sometimes taking it away from kids that already picked it up, rather than doiong what every other family was doing which is sticking with the candy tossed to their group of kids. Then the mother got in on the grabbing. For example daycare girl had a blue toddler sized tshirt tossed right on top of her toes, before she could bend and pick it up, this mother grabs it and hands it to her 8 yr old, She even tried to grab the football I caught right out of my hands. She was taking them right up to the floats to hold their bags open like trick or treating. SHe even went as far as to loudly and with cussing complain about how a different family got a beach ball and her boys didn't, and then tried talking to the little girl maybe 5 that got that ball and guilt her into giving it to her 2 yr old son. This is the kind of mother that when her kids become old enough for sports would cheat there too just so her kids could win. Some parents take having their kids win far too seriously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 i thought you must have been in my living room this morning when I cheated at Candyland so my son would win and the game would finally end... Jennifer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmoe Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 i thought you must have been in my living room this morning when I cheated at Candyland so my son would win and the game would finally end... Jennifer :lol: This made my day to know I'm not the only one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 This is poverty. The woman feels she and her kids don't have enough. What we did when our kids were little was take a handful and give the rest of the candy bag to those families or just walk over and put it in their bag. We see it at Halloween too - they'll refuse what they are offered and ask if they can grab a fistful. Each adult will have a bag for a child who is 'too sick to come' or an infant. oh no this wasn't poverty. I live in poverty. This woman and both kids including the 2 yr old had professional dye jobs(the older boy had orange mohawk with designs shaved into the sides, 2 year old had orange mohawk, mother had weird punk 3 color dye job shaved one side spiked up the other), her nails clearly salon done, drove up in a very nice SUV, She was telling them that after the parade they were going out to eat at BPs(which is one of the priciest places to eat in town) before they go to the fair etc. We live in poverty, we had pb& j sandwiches on day old bread when we got home, no fair for us because we could nto even afford the admission prices let alone rides etc). My kids still didn't act like that. In fact ds8 made sure that dd4 got the bulk of what was picked up, if he only picked up 1 piece he gave it to her, if he picked up 3, he gave her 2 and him 1. If he picked up a handful he gave to daycare girl(her dad came to sit with her so he was already helping her) and the kids on the other side of us etc. I was just a sense of entitlement pure and simple. Feeling her kids should be given everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsMe Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 It's the same thing when the mom or dad builds the Pine Wood Derby car, posts on facebook how their kids hates it and the work "they" (parents did on the car), then the kid gets first place over a kid who actually creates, builds and paints their own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawndrese Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 i thought you must have been in my living room this morning when I cheated at Candyland so my son would win and the game would finally end... Jennifer This is totally what I thought this thread was going to be about! :lol: And yes, I do that too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 It's the same thing when the mom or dad builds the Pine Wood Derby car, posts on facebook how their kids hates it and the work "they" (parents did on the car), then the kid gets first place over a kid who actually creates, builds and paints their own. :iagree: We watched Down & Derby at the cub& scout sleep over before car kits were handed out to the boys. We all had a good laugh because we have all encountered parents like the ones in the movie so bent on winning they forget it is about the kids making those cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shellbelle Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 My kids participated in a homeschool science fair this year. Each child did the projects completely on their own. My 7 yo painstakingly wrote everything out in her very best penmanship, decorated her board and made the display without any assistance. It took her a very long time, but she was proud and did a great job. Most of the other projects in her age group were clearly done by a parent. :confused: I can't quite understand that. My children didn't win, but they learned a lot and could explain every bit of their project to the judges...because they were the ones who completed the projects, not their parents! They weren't disappointed about not winning because that was not our emphasis at all. My older son's group (10-12 yo) did have children crying afterwards because they did not win a prize. Every child got a medal for participating, so that was very nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elfgivas Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 :grouphug: if the "winning" girl will go with your daughter and the other 3 to the coach and tell the coach about how they all think your daughter was the winner due to the lappings and don't understand how she ended up second. then, i'd have a talk with the coach later, however it plays out, and suggest that whether or not there was "an understandable hopeful miscounting of laps", that the appearance of fairness is important, too, so that having any mother involved with scoring/judging/counting where it will affect her own child or her child's competitors is not so wise. ie. the top swimmers should not be judged by the top swimmers' moms. (however, i know in the dance world that the most involved moms are also the moms of the best dancers, so ???) :grouphug: ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgiana Daniels Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 EeJust got home, and my daughter is really upset. I can't really blame her. They had a swimathon last week while I was out of town. She claims (and 3 other girls back up her story including the "winning" girl) that she lapped her friend 4-5 times, but she somehow finished 2nd. There is an end of year award involved, which IMO isn't worth purposely not counting a 10 yo's laps... And now I find myself wondering if this same mom was purposely DQing my daughter during the season, so her daughter would score more points and win the MVP award, too. Part of me wants to take the heaping coals of fire approach...but this method assumes she has a conscience. AAARGH. It feels petty to confront someone over this, or to inquire about the DQs. But I also feel a need to stand up for my girl. Ugh. Wow--unbelievable!!! That stinks. I think it's important to stand up for kids--yours, and future kids that will get cheated out of what they deserve by this creepy mom. Calling her out on it (nicely, of course) might curb her behavior (if she has a conscience at all) or at least make her think twice before doing it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 This is poverty. The woman feels she and her kids don't have enough. What we did when our kids were little was take a handful and give the rest of the candy bag to those families or just walk over and put it in their bag. We see it at Halloween too - they'll refuse what they are offered and ask if they can grab a fistful. Each adult will have a bag for a child who is 'too sick to come' or an infant. They will knock on doors after the official t-or-t hours are over, or at houses where people have turned out the light. No, it's not poverty. It's crass, it's rude, it's entitled behaviour. I've lived more of my adult life in fear of utilities being shut off b/c the choice was btwn buying groceries or paying the power bill. I've had many times where I claimed a headache, or similar to excuse why Mommy wasn't eating. At no time would I have behaved in the way described, nor would I ever have tolerated it from my children. Being poor isn't an excuse to behave like an ack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lang Syne Boardie Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 No, it's not poverty. It's crass, it's rude, it's entitled behaviour. I've lived more of my adult life in fear of utilities being shut off b/c the choice was btwn buying groceries or paying the power bill. I've had many times where I claimed a headache, or similar to excuse why Mommy wasn't eating. At no time would I have behaved in the way described, nor would I ever have tolerated it from my children. Being poor isn't an excuse to behave like an ack. :iagree: No need to equate poverty with greed or vulgarity. We will never attend a parade in our city again. People scrambling, fighting, begging, dancing, over bubble gum. Adults pushing little kids out of the way and getting up close to the people in the parade, begging and dominating the situation. Screaming and yelling, "Give me more," literally, over candy. Snatching candy away before small children could reach it. That is not hunger. That is greed, and a total lack of upbringing. I grew up in a trailer park where my family and others suffered true hunger. This beastly behavior could not have happened in my neighborhood. We all went into town for the parades every year, and we acted just like everybody else. There's just no need or reason to insult the dignified poor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Exactly, Tibbie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 No, it's not poverty. It's crass, it's rude, it's entitled behaviour. I've lived more of my adult life in fear of utilities being shut off b/c the choice was btwn buying groceries or paying the power bill. I've had many times where I claimed a headache, or similar to excuse why Mommy wasn't eating. At no time would I have behaved in the way described, nor would I ever have tolerated it from my children. Being poor isn't an excuse to behave like an ack. :iagree: No need to equate poverty with greed or vulgarity. We will never attend a parade in our city again. People scrambling, fighting, begging, dancing, over bubble gum. Adults pushing little kids out of the way and getting up close to the people in the parade, begging and dominating the situation. Screaming and yelling, "Give me more," literally, over candy. Snatching candy away before small children could reach it. That is not hunger. That is greed, and a total lack of upbringing. I grew up in a trailer park where my family and others suffered true hunger. This beastly behavior could not have happened in my neighborhood. We all went into town for the parades every year, and we acted just like everybody else. There's just no need or reason to insult the dignified poor. Exactly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobela Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 :iagree: No need to equate poverty with greed or vulgarity. We will never attend a parade in our city again. People scrambling, fighting, begging, dancing, over bubble gum. Adults pushing little kids out of the way and getting up close to the people in the parade, begging and dominating the situation. Screaming and yelling, "Give me more," literally, over candy. Snatching candy away before small children could reach it. That is not hunger. That is greed, and a total lack of upbringing. I grew up in a trailer park where my family and others suffered true hunger. This beastly behavior could not have happened in my neighborhood. We all went into town for the parades every year, and we acted just like everybody else. There's just no need or reason to insult the dignified poor. :iagree:Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaKinVA Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 :grouphug: if the "winning" girl will go with your daughter and the other 3 to the coach and tell the coach about how they all think your daughter was the winner due to the lappings and don't understand how she ended up second. then, i'd have a talk with the coach later, however it plays out, and suggest that whether or not there was "an understandable hopeful miscounting of laps", that the appearance of fairness is important, too, so that having any mother involved with scoring/judging/counting where it will affect her own child or her child's competitors is not so wise. ie. the top swimmers should not be judged by the top swimmers' moms. (however, i know in the dance world that the most involved moms are also the moms of the best dancers, so ???) :grouphug: ann After today's commentary...the "winning" girl firmly believes she won, and told my dd she could try to beat her next year. My dd was near tears. I went over the situation with her, and discussed options. 1) talk to the girls who "saw" dd pass the "winning" girl, and say something like, "Wow...I'm surprised they have XX as swimming the most laps, I could have sworn I lapped her a few times..." and see what the other girls do/say. If they are shocked...we can follow up. 2) let it go. Getting into a battle of my dd vs. the adult is going to end ugly...no matter how it happens. if my daughter wants to go with option #1, I told her she needs to be willing to lose a friend over it (and maybe two). DD and this girl have been in scouts for 2 years together and are also on the same year round swim team. This is also the same swim mom who, instead of congratulating my daughter on achieving her first B/BB time replied that her dd had "lots" of those (although, not according to USA Swimming ;)). The mom is a college professor at a local uni...and welcomed me home as if we were best buddies. She *never* does that...so I'm thinking she's having some conscience issues. Right now, losing friendships is less important to my dd than these awards. However, she is working incredibly hard in the pool and will prove herself that way. (I have a feeling the coaches would "know" too...as my dd is *known* for distance, excellent pacing and stamina...and this little girl, while she can beat dd in short distances (except in fly), as they trade leading spots regularly (the top 8 girls are within .5 of a second) cannot catch my dd in 100/200 free, IMs, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristusG Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 i thought you must have been in my living room this morning when I cheated at Candyland so my son would win and the game would finally end... Jennifer Yes, this LOL! Often! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I'm boggled at the idea that standards of behaviour are somehow connection to economic status. LisaK, wishing you and your dd all the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristusG Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 On this same topic....I cannot stand when it is a children's competition and the parents help. Our church group holds a yearly boat or car race for the kids. There's a prize for the best looking car/boat. There are SO many that are obviously helped greatly by the parents. My DD does hers all on her own. Usually it looks a mess LOL, but it is all completed by her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I'm boggled at the idea that standards of behaviour are somehow connection to economic status. LisaK, wishing you and your dd all the best. dontcha know, that's because if you are poor you are low class trash :glare: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swellmomma Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 This topic makes me wonder too how many parents (not on this board I am sure) "help" their little darlings on the mythology or latin exams to make sure they get a medal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaKinVA Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 i thought you must have been in my living room this morning when I cheated at Candyland so my son would win and the game would finally end... Jennifer This is a case in which I would probably do the same thing as you...without an inkling of guilt. Case-in-point: our 3yo loves to play the Busy Town game, but she's really more interested in doing the "find the item" than actually "playing" (spinning, moving her character, etc.). After about 20 minutes, the pieces miraculously wind up at the end...:lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdahoHomeschooler Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I completely agree about this being poverty. It is a poverty of the soul when someone approaches life as if they never have "enough." I would say that there are thousands of people who live quite below the income poverty line, that are so much richer than this woman. There is never "enough" to fill the emptiness inside of people like this. Yes, the behavior is rude and obnoxious, yet I find myself pitying her for not "getting it." Sad :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaKinVA Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 It's the same thing when the mom or dad builds the Pine Wood Derby car, posts on facebook how their kids hates it and the work "they" (parents did on the car), then the kid gets first place over a kid who actually creates, builds and paints their own. When my oldest was a Tiger, he won the award, "Car Most Likely Made by the Scout." :D He finished dead last. However, since then, we have always helped. He designs, father cuts down, he glues-up, sands, paints and attaches stuff, father does wheels and weights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldskool Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 This topic makes me wonder too how many parents (not on this board I am sure) "help" their little darlings on the mythology or latin exams to make sure they get a medal Yes! I have actually wondered this as well. We also took a class with Lukeion that very much had college prep standards and yet most of the kids were taking home "gold". Meaning all quiz questions answered at 100% plus the extra credit. Ms. Barr holds a tough (but great) class and so many perfect/close to perfect weekly quiz results often made me wonder... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybear Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Just recently I noticed that the stats on ds' baseball team are not accurate. I saw this some time back, but I figured it was the occasional mistake. At this point it's beginning to feel personal. Fortunately this isn't the only record that is kept for the season. This one happens to be online however, and quite easy to access. I'm not sure which one (or both) the coach pays attention to. I won't openly say anything because there are the two records (and I think the paper one is the "official" record), but it does irk me. I may grumble a bit.....or, I'm thinking now, just ask which is the official record for the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommyfaithe Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Happens all the time. It is one of the reasons for homeschooling....many students who are academically qualified lose out on honors & AP seats to those who have parents do the hw for them. :iagree: It burns me up. I have seen it happen repeatedly.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Yes! I have actually wondered this as well. We also took a class with Lukeion that very much had college prep standards and yet most of the kids were taking home "gold". Meaning all quiz questions answered at 100% plus the extra credit. Ms. Barr holds a tough (but great) class and so many perfect/close to perfect weekly quiz results often made me wonder... Actually, it's not true that gold = 100%. You can get some answers wrong (how many depends on the test and the year) and still get gold. On Latin I, for example, almost 12% of all students got gold medals, but only ~1% had perfect papers: out of 49,403 students who took the test, there were 5,886 gold medals, but only 522 perfect scores. Latin II = 4,632 gold medals & 368 perfect scores. Latin III = 2,066 gold medals, but only 78 perfect papers. I'm sure there are some parents who do help kids cheat on tests like that, but the fact that a rigorous, Wheelock's-based program like Lukeion has lots of kids with gold medals is not "fishy," IMHO. Jackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lolly Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Idea. If I were you, I would go to the coach and see how the situation could be avoided next year. Parents should not be allowed to count their child's laps. Next, you should probably take the class and get yourself in a position to be an official. It seems like this team might need another option to pull in for officiating the meets. Someone with more morals than the current official. I feel for your dd. Maybe an ice cream for the true winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galatea Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Getting into a battle of my dd vs. the adult is going to end ugly...no matter how it happens. This is just my way of looking at it, but I wouldn't stress about the battle, there's no talking sense into someone who thinks cheating for their child is okay. I would be worrying about the war, the overall experience your child has in swimming. Do you want her to be "beat" like this every time there's a competition? If not, don't worry about one mother, go straight to the leader/coach and talk to him/her. You don't have to say outright you saw her cheating if you don't want to or if you don't like that kind of confrontation. Just say that you're concerned about the "appearance of impropriety" and that there's been concern among parents about judging their own children. Heck, you could imply that mother was concerned herself. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdahoHomeschooler Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Poverty is not a condition of the pocketbook. Never has been, never will be. It is a condition of the mind. :iagree: This is absolutely true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldskool Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Actually, it's not true that gold = 100%. You can get some answers wrong (how many depends on the test and the year) and still get gold. On Latin I, for example, almost 12% of all students got gold medals, but only ~1% had perfect papers: out of 49,403 students who took the test, there were 5,886 gold medals, but only 522 perfect scores. Latin II = 4,632 gold medals & 368 perfect scores. Latin III = 2,066 gold medals, but only 78 perfect papers. I'm sure there are some parents who do help kids cheat on tests like that, but the fact that a rigorous, Wheelock's-based program like Lukeion has lots of kids with gold medals is not "fishy," IMHO. Jackie Actually, in this case I wasn't referring to the NLE, but the weekly Lukeion test scores that are posted. And actually, the fact that it is an excellent rigorous Wheelocks based program is exactly why I think that many high ranking weekly test scores (that are a part of the course) are "fishy". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhotoGal Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 :grouphug: This must be incredibly frustrating for your dd (and you!). I'm actually not looking forward to the kids competing in sports when they are older for this reason. :glare: There seems to be a lot of cheating (by kids and by parents) going on in a lot of kids' sports and other activities. It is so sad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunaLee Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 It happens and it's frustrating. Even at the high school level... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisbeth Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 No, it's not poverty. It's crass, it's rude, it's entitled behaviour. I've lived more of my adult life in fear of utilities being shut off b/c the choice was btwn buying groceries or paying the power bill. I've had many times where I claimed a headache, or similar to excuse why Mommy wasn't eating. At no time would I have behaved in the way described, nor would I ever have tolerated it from my children. Being poor isn't an excuse to behave like an ack. I agree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisbeth Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 For all of the sports cheating situations....videotape everything! Make sure the scorekeepers see you videotaping everything. Call them out if you see this blatant cheating. Nice people are going to have to start calling out the bums. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisbeth Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 After today's commentary...the "winning" girl firmly believes she won, and told my dd she could try to beat her next year. My dd was near tears. I went over the situation with her, and discussed options. 1) talk to the girls who "saw" dd pass the "winning" girl, and say something like, "Wow...I'm surprised they have XX as swimming the most laps, I could have sworn I lapped her a few times..." and see what the other girls do/say. If they are shocked...we can follow up. 2) let it go. Getting into a battle of my dd vs. the adult is going to end ugly...no matter how it happens. if my daughter wants to go with option #1, I told her she needs to be willing to lose a friend over it (and maybe two). DD and this girl have been in scouts for 2 years together and are also on the same year round swim team. This is also the same swim mom who, instead of congratulating my daughter on achieving her first B/BB time replied that her dd had "lots" of those (although, not according to USA Swimming ;)). The mom is a college professor at a local uni...and welcomed me home as if we were best buddies. She *never* does that...so I'm thinking she's having some conscience issues. Right now, losing friendships is less important to my dd than these awards. However, she is working incredibly hard in the pool and will prove herself that way. (I have a feeling the coaches would "know" too...as my dd is *known* for distance, excellent pacing and stamina...and this little girl, while she can beat dd in short distances (except in fly), as they trade leading spots regularly (the top 8 girls are within .5 of a second) cannot catch my dd in 100/200 free, IMs, etc. I understand this, but my take is: cheating , bad peopke count on good peopke to let it go. I would also re-examine if you would indeed be losing friends. These don't sound like true friends to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kolamum Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 :grouphug: I'd think standing up for what's right would take a lot of courage, especially when you know you were treated poorly. I hope that the situation is sorted out. I'm confused as to why parents were judging anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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