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Stacy in NJ

What made Americans fat..........

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These are ((deaths)) from heart disease not the rates of... How can you compare first world Western European countries to Eastern European countries with very scary, at best, health care systems? The site given says the French only get 15% of their calories from high fat foods, so none of them eating bacon and cheeseburgers all day long. Why not just have a stick of butter for a snack? :tongue_smilie:

 

That only shows that any set of numbers can be put on a graph to make it look like the numbers support your case. One needs to remember that correlation does not automatically mean causation.

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My children. Hands down. They both do competitive swimming, one is a new teen, one a pre-teen, and they need tons of food, good food and snacks. And I partake/

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What cultures eat diets that are heavily based on carbs that don't have obesity problems? Perhaps the Japanese (much rice)? These cultures use practically no sugar. Carbs minus sugar can be eaten in moderation. Add sugar to the equation and any significant intake of all carbs leads to insulin resistence.

 

The physical activity issue is also unproven.

 

Agree!!!  Two books I highly recommend on this topic are:

 

Big Fat Lies http://www.amazon.com/Big-Fat-Lies-industry-ebook/dp/B007FVVCS6/ref=sr_1_8?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1380201127&sr=1-8&keywords=sweet+poison

Sweet Poison http://www.amazon.com/Sweet-Poison-ebook/dp/B007Y6B5QG/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1380201127&sr=1-1&keywords=sweet+poison

 

both by David Gillespie.  They are available on Kindle.

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:iagree::iagree:...gmo.....Monsanto....Fast food...slow movement.

 

:iagree: Everyone messing with our food! Not being able to buy fresh and local easily or for less than processed garbage, particularly for the working poor and those on an extremely limited budget. Imported, corrupted meats.

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I'd be interested to hear the progress of anyone else who's trying to increase fat and reduce carbs, and if anybody cares to know I can update y'all with my progress as well..

 

Note that there is a LCHF social group - hasn't been active lately but you're welcome to add some activity :) - it would be nice to hear some updates.

 

You might also like the two books by Phinney and Volek

http://www.amazon.com/The-Art-Science-Carbohydrate-Performance/dp/0983490716/ref=pd_sim_b_1

 

 http://www.amazon.com/The-Art-Science-Carbohydrate-Living/dp/0983490708/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1380220601&sr=8-1&keywords=art+and+science+of+low+carbohydrate+living

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I think everybody should read "Pandora's Lunchbox", "Salt, Sugar, Fat", and "Wheat Belly."  You can hear two of the authors on NPR:

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/2013/03/live-chat-with-pandoras-lunchbox-author-melanie-warner.html

 

http://www.kera.org/2013/02/28/salt-sugar-fat-and-the-food-biz/

 

 

 

The science of addiction that is used by food companies in our food is astonishing.  Also, kind of remarkable, is that most of the execs in the books wouldn't eat their own company's food.

 

It's not just carbs...it's Frankencarbs.  There's no satiety factor with the new Monsanto-altered wheat, highly refined crap.

 

It's also becoming clearer that it's our gut microbiome.  You can feed two people the same foods and they will absorb calories differently because of the bacteria in their gut.  Research is just starting on this...but it's fascinating.  Now, what affected so many people's gut?  Is it all the antiobiotics in our food supply...the petro-chemicals...???

 

I'll also add...that fat is not necessarily bad.  Read up on the obesity paradox.  BMI up to 35 for many is fine...as long as their blood pressure, blood sugar, and cholesterol are in check.  

 

Inactivity is an issue...and some say that "sitting is the new smoking" in terms of just how bad it is.

 

 

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I whole-heartedly agree with your post! Thanks for the links.

 

It makes me chuckle to see the food pyramid labeled the "old way of thinking" since for many of us 40 and above it was the "new way". I grew up learning about the "Basic 4" food groups. In school we were taught that a healthy diet was to be balanced between the 4 groups (meat, grains, fruit/veg, and dairy) and not majoring on grains/carbs. The idea that fat was bad was just being introduced when I was a kid.

those cultures generally eat very little sugar though. And the latest research shows that fructose (in sucrose or high fructose corn syrup) has a very different metabolic path than glucose, which is what rice and bread break down to. 

 

Also, yes, exercise offers a protection against insulin resistance, so attacks the same issue. However, for many people that level of physical activity is difficult to mimic in their every day lives, but a low carbohydrate diet is pretty feasible. 

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Americans are fat because they eat too much. Just look at American restaurant portions vs. European portions.

 

Sorry, but I could care less where a calorie comes from. A calorie is a calorie is a calorie. It's the same whether it's from fat, sugars, or proteins. There is some minor processing differences, i.e. fat triggers satiety, proteins trigger some liver enzymes, etc. But it still boils down to too many calories in the American diet for the amount of expenditure.

 

Science is trying to make, "Close your mouth and get active" something more complicated than it is.

 

But science has shown that certain calories are metabolized differently. Such as alcohol. That has vastly different effects on your biochemistry and body than say, bread. And fructose does too. Sugar is not the same metabolically as protein.

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I saw this thread got bumped, and I just wanted to say thank you to the OP and to everyone who has recommended Good Calories, Bad Calories. I've read much of this thread, but not all, as I didn't think some of the discussion was that productive. Others shared the research, so all I can add is my own experience.

 

I've been a vegetarian for about half my life (early 30's now) and didn't have a weight problem until getting pregnant for the first time about 7 years ago. I gained crazy amounts of weight with each pregnancy and wasn't able to get it off. I worked out long and hard and cut calories a little, then more, then a LOT, but I still wasn't getting good weight-loss results and in the long run my body fat percentage was actually going UP. I did see some people in this thread suggesting that people who aren't losing weight with exercise don't know what hard exercise really is, or that they don't know what reasonable portion sizes are. Well, in the past I would measure my food and track all the calories and nutrients obsessively using websites like Sparkpeople and Loseit. At one time I kept a food diary where I took a photo of everything I ate before it went in my mouth.

 

I took up hard daily exercise, mainly in the form of group exercise classes that sort of forced me to work hard the whole hour because everybody's looking at you! I had friends in these classes and you better believe they'd be ragging on me if I took it easy. The classes were varied- step aerobics with weights, tae bo with abs, BodyPump and other full-hour weight training classes, circuit-training, boot camps, etc. There was one period of several months when I was doing anywhere from 12-18 hours of these classes every week, but 5-7 hours a week was more typical. I felt good, I slept well, but I was still fat. So I cut calories more, experimenting with different numbers, generally anywhere from 1500 down to 800 calories a day. I know most experts would advise no less than 1200 a day, but at that level I wasn't losing weight and my body fat percentage was still going up, but more importantly I was HUNGRY all the time and started feeling exhausted by exercise rather than energized by it. Bumping my calories up a bit so that I had more energy for exercise led to weight gain. I was obese according to my height vs. weight but more concerning was my really high body fat percentage.

 

I endured comments from doctors/nurses and a forced visit to a dietitian who told me my protein intake looked fine but my fat intake was too high at around 30% (while I was pregnant!) and that I should reduce that to closer to 25%. As for the type of food I was eating, we've never bought many packaged foods other than "healthy" whole grain cereals and 100% whole wheat bread- and for about 2 years I made my own whole wheat bread so it wouldn't have any extra junk in it. As a vegetarian, I ate plenty of fruits and vegetables, beans, and nonfat dairy. (No fake meats here- can't stand the taste or texture of real meat and the fake ones are pretty convincingly gross to me.)

 

Before I read Good Calories, Bad Calories, I really thought low carb/high fat was total bunk. The research in the book - which is NOT a diet book, by the way, in case anyone is not familiar with it - convinced me that it could actually be the sensible portions of Kashi cereal (As much protein as an egg!) homemade granola bars (no additives!) and brown rice (oh, the fiber!) that were keeping me fat. I'd been very suspicious recently that weight loss could not be as simple as eating less and exercising more, because I had been doing that for years and getting no satisfaction. The book is fascinating because it names the researchers who were responsible for certain trends in dietary recommendations in the U.S. and details the research (or lack thereof) that led to the recommendations. Although the book doesn't really make suggestions about what to eat, by the end I was convinced that I'd be a lot better off increasing my fat intake by a lot and cutting those "healthy whole grains" way down. Now if you're someone who thrives while eating sensible portions of healthy whole grains, then by all means continue to do so! I'm not addressing you, I'm talking to those who have made healthy lifestyle changes and have not been rewarded by returning to a healthy weight. 

 

I only increased my fat and cut my carbs about 3 weeks ago, but I feel amazing, have so much energy, and have lost about 10 pounds. Most importantly, I'm not HUNGRY all the time and I feel like this could be a permanent change. It's not like I'm eating no carbs, in fact I really doubt my carbs are low enough to count as something Atkins-like, which I think would be under 20 carbs a day (somebody correct me if I'm wrong- I don't do diet books.) I eat a lot of eggs and cheese with my veggies now, and any dairy is full-fat. I'm more likely to reach for nuts as a snack rather than fruit. I pan-fry my tofu (no breading though!) and use plenty of fat when making soups, stir-fries, curries, etc. 

 

I'd be interested to hear the progress of anyone else who's trying to increase fat and reduce carbs, and if anybody cares to know I can update y'all with my progress as well..

That's great! 

 

I am a pescetarian.  I just can't get over that emotional block to meat. I eat fish and I think I could do turkey if I really tried, but otherwise I just can't.  I was primal/paleo for almost 2 years and now that I can't eat meat, it's really hard.  I was also starving continuously when my carbs were lower.  Literally stomach growling pain all day, every day.  That's why I went back to wheat, but I need to cut it back out.  I also can't eat dairy without bad stomach pain.  I feel like I can't eat anything nowadays!  When I went back on gluten, I felt great for a month, now I have IBS symptoms, ulcer like feelings, and I gained almost 20 lbs!!  NOT cool! 

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Personally I agree with Jillian Michaels on that one-- it's because people are eating so much highly processed crap/chemicals that the body does not recognize as food. So people eat and eat and are never truly "satisfied."

 maybe part of it. But I was a vegan for years and gained weight. I was a whole foods only, whole grains, fresh veggies, etc person and gained weight. The only time I don't gain weight is when I eliminate all sugar, and most grain. 

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IN an interesting observation, I elimated sugar/grains and lost some weight. Then I eliminated diet soda, and something crazy happened. My calories eaten dropped by over 400 calories. with no hunger. I wasn't trying to eat less (or at least, I had always been trying to eat less, but was still hungry. But elminating the diet drinks made my appetite drop. 

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That's great! 

 

I am a pescetarian.  I just can't get over that emotional block to meat. I eat fish and I think I could do turkey if I really tried, but otherwise I just can't.  I was primal/paleo for almost 2 years and now that I can't eat meat, it's really hard.  I was also starving continuously when my carbs were lower.  Literally stomach growling pain all day, every day.  That's why I went back to wheat, but I need to cut it back out.  I also can't eat dairy without bad stomach pain.  I feel like I can't eat anything nowadays!  When I went back on gluten, I felt great for a month, now I have IBS symptoms, ulcer like feelings, and I gained almost 20 lbs!!  NOT cool! 

 

My suggestion, if you haven't tried it already, would be to replace the grains with fat as your energy source (i.e., switch to nutritional ketosis) and leave your protein intake to a normal amount, as opposed to trying to replace carbs with protein, which doesn't work (excess protein gets converted to glucose anyway, IIRC).  The challenge then becomes how to eat enough fat...

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That thought has crossed my mind a number of times as well.

 

astrid

Unless you're taking about the Arkins diet, in which that wasn't the case. People were losing weight yet the diet promoted lots of processed foods, including zone bars, artificial sugars, and processed meats.

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Unless you're taking about the Arkins diet, in which that wasn't the case. People were losing weight yet the diet promoted lots of processed foods, including zone bars, artificial sugars, and processed meats.

Not the books actually written by Dr. Atkins during his lifetime--and I am referring to the books written before the line of products was released.

 

Not what people do now. The processed food versions (which are really not meant to be a daily thing.) and other variations people come up with on their own are not "Atkins".

 

Also, the processed food thing could be said about ANY diet. Vegan processed food exists, low fat processed food etc. Yet, when someone announces they are going vegan or low fat, no one says "Yeah, but what about all that processed food?".

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I have done Low Carb for about 3 years and found it frustrating and near impossible to stick to.  I really like the The Body Fat Solution. He gives some really sound science and advice. Incredible book. He also gives a more balanced and doable solution.  He also addresses the emotional eating in his book. As a Christian I couldn't quite get on board with some of that advice and instead use prayer. I think for obese and people who need to lose 35 or more keeping track of what you eat through calories will work. Yes, I have read all the science about calories and low carb stuff, but for quite a bit of weight one can simply count calories. Than once your reach a plateau you start to adjust your carbs, protien and fat. He lays it all out in his book and it's really fantastic. It's more doable and realistic compared to low carb. You can actually have the occasional cheat day for like a holiday or birthday. He is also very positive.

 

I have struggled with my weight since I was in Kindergarten. It has been hard, but I have never given up. Why American's are fat is incredibly complicated. I think it's a mixture of food quality, not wanting to feel uncomfortable, and also stress., People are really stressed and lots and lots of people use food to deal with that. I am not saying people in other countries do not get stressed, I am just saying her in our modern culture we deal with stress by eating or having fun. Our modern culture tells us that if you have a problem you need to fix it. One thing we are not taught now days is endurance, sometimes things are just hard and there is not a solution. Life is sometimes painful and uncomfortable and you have to just strive through it. In our modern culture we buy things, eat things and watch things to not feel pain or be uncomfortable.

 

Another book that I recommend is called Women, Food and God by Geneen Roth. This is not a Christian book, but I consider it Christian safe. She is a spiritual person and respects Christianity quite a bit. My husband and I read it together so he could help me discern. People who are not religious I think will get lots out of it as well. 

 

For me personally, almost turning 40 I have decided to stop with all the hopping from one diet to another. I am learning to pray ceaselessly saying the Orthodox Jesus Prayer and I am taking slow steps. Right now I am not changing anything about my food. Right now I make it a goal to take a walk everyday, stop drinking diet Coke, get to bed at a good time. These are three things that I can do and have the will power and energy to do right now. These are also things that science has shown to help with loosing weight and for people who struggle with emotional problems. You must exercise and you must get a good night sleep. Sleep is really important!! That itself is a good thing to research and you will come up with all sorts of important studies about the important of sleep!! Diet Coke also causes me to feel hungry and want to eat bad food. I don't eat as many fruits and veggies when I drink Diet Coke. So, I have been working on these for a couple months and they are becoming almost second nature to me, I still feel I need to keep working on it. But when I feel ready to move onto the next step I will probably do it meal by meal. I don't plan to do low carb but healthy foods like pointed out in the Body Fat Solution book. 

 

I have been overweight/obese my whole life and I have always kept trying. I find it offensive when people think all fat people are lazy and eat junk. I have probably eat healthy 85% of the time, but unfortunately times in my life and also being emotionally compulsive it only takes that extra 15% for me to gain weight or prevent me from loosing weight. In order for me to loose weight I can't mess up. Each week I have to be perfect with my eating. If I eat healthy for 5 days out of the week but than have a couple days where I fall and mess up. I will gain weight that week!! IT's really hard to have to be so perfect about something!! So, that is why I am going to do steps. 

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My suggestion, if you haven't tried it already, would be to replace the grains with fat as your energy source (i.e., switch to nutritional ketosis) and leave your protein intake to a normal amount, as opposed to trying to replace carbs with protein, which doesn't work (excess protein gets converted to glucose anyway, IIRC).  The challenge then becomes how to eat enough fat...

I ate tons of fat-evoo and coconut oil in everything. When I ate dairy during it, I only used full fat.  I ate out of the coconut cream jar all day!  IDK what it was, but I could very well have eaten an entire cow in one sitting and asked for seconds.  But one slice of bread and I'm full.

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 I think it's a mixture of food quality, not wanting to feel uncomfortable, and also stress., People are really stressed and lots and lots of people use food to deal with that. I am not saying people in other countries do not get stressed, I am just saying her in our modern culture we deal with stress by eating or having fun. Our modern culture tells us that if you have a problem you need to fix it. One thing we are not taught now days is endurance, sometimes things are just hard and there is not a solution. Life is sometimes painful and uncomfortable and you have to just strive through it. In our modern culture we buy things, eat things and watch things to not feel pain or be uncomfortable.

 

 

I think that this is a very interesting perspective.  

 

L

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