Colleges will not accept 10th grade AP for credit?

[MtnTeaching]

I was told at the Midwest Convention that only 11th and 12th grade AP scores will be considered for "college credit". Is this true?

 

If this is true... please tell me why I would consider spending $650.00 for the PA Homeschoolers AP Human Geography class for my 10th grade ds next year.

 

For that matter, why would I pay $650.00 for any AP class when my local (highly-rated) state university costs about $350.00 for that class. Also, if I understand correctly, if he decided he wanted to attend an upper-tier school, they probably would not accept this AP class for credit even if he was in 11th or 12th grade.

 

I truly am befuddled. Do people take these classes before 11th grade mainly for the "legitimization" of homeschooling on the transcript?

 

Am I missing something here or do I have bad info?

[Teachin'Mine]

:blink: I would consider that bad info for sure. :001_smile:

 

Not all colleges give credit for AP or dual enrollment, but for those who do accept AP, it doesn't matter which high school year they're taken. I have heard that some won't accept any from before 9th grade. Some take AP classes for college credit and/or grade validation - some do the same for dual enrollment.

Edited May 8, 2012 by Teachin'Mine

[Sebastian (a lady)]

I was told at the Midwest Convention that only 11th and 12th grade AP scores will be considered for "college credit". Is this true?

 

If this is true... please tell me why I would consider spending $650.00 for the PA Homeschoolers AP Human Geography class for my 10th grade ds next year.

 

For that matter, why would I pay $650.00 for any AP class when my local (highly-rated) state university costs about $350.00 for that class. Also, if I understand correctly, if he decided he wanted to attend an upper-tier school, they probably would not accept this AP class for credit even if he was in 11th or 12th grade.

 

I truly am befuddled. Do people take these classes before 11th grade mainly for the "legitimization" of homeschooling on the transcript?

 

Am I missing something here or do I have bad info?

 

Let me guess that you were in a workshop with Jean Burk . . .

 

At least that was the workshop where I found this presented (both verbally and in the Powerpoint notes). I stayed afterwards to talk to her about this and she insisted that this was what she is being told by her local principals. (I still don't understand why that would be binding at all on students outside those schools & districts.)

 

I know someone else gave a nice link in another thread about this that showed there were not grade prerequisites. I did ask the College Board reps who were at Midwest and they said that there was definitely no grade requirement. That presenter was simply wrong.

[MtnTeaching]

Let me guess that you were in a workshop with Jean Burk . . .

 

At least that was the workshop where I found this presented (both verbally and in the Powerpoint notes). I stayed afterwards to talk to her about this and she insisted that this was what she is being told by her local principals. (I still don't understand why that would be binding at all on students outside those schools & districts.)

 

I know someone else gave a nice link in another thread about this that showed there were not grade prerequisites. I did ask the College Board reps who were at Midwest and they said that there was definitely no grade requirement. That presenter was simply wrong.

 

YES! This was the one. I also questioned her afterwards and there were several people there, as well. She was quite adamant about her information.

 

Were you at the convention this year? I enjoyed meeting you last year and missed you at the meet-up this year.

[claussenpc]

Our local school district will not allow dual enrollment or AP classes for anyone under 11 the grade. This might be the info that Jean Burke is getting in her area as well. This is a school district specific rule for enrolled public school students- nothing to do with the college board. My guess!

[Riverland]

My dd took AP Human Geography in 9th grade and scored a 4. Her college accepted it for credit with no hassle.

[MtnTeaching]

Our local school district will not allow dual enrollment or AP classes for anyone under 11 the grade. This might be the info that Jean Burke is getting in her area as well. This is a school district specific rule for enrolled public school students- nothing to do with the college board. My guess!

 

Well, I made sure that I was clear about the question and she was very clear about her answer. It had nothing to do with whether the schools were offering or allowing grades below 11th to take it.

 

She was adamant that colleges would not accept any AP's for credit if taken before 11th grade. Good to hear that information is incorrect. It really had me scratching my head.

[plansrme]

This rumor went around about this time last year, and I contacted a couple of colleges because my daughter has a 7th grade AP (world history) and will have 4 in 8th grade. One of the colleges was UNC-Chapel Hill. I don't remember the other, but both said there was no time limit on APs. I specifically asked about APs in 7th grade. The College Board will certainly charge us to retrieve the scores, but that is a different question.

 

I understand that a lot of colleges do not give credit for human geography, but that has nothing to do with when it is taken but, rather, with the rigor of the exam.

 

Terri

[MtnTeaching]

This rumor went around about this time last year, and I contacted a couple of colleges because my daughter has a 7th grade AP (world history) and will have 4 in 8th grade. One of the colleges was UNC-Chapel Hill. I don't remember the other, but both said there was no time limit on APs. I specifically asked about APs in 7th grade. The College Board will certainly charge us to retrieve the scores, but that is a different question.

 

I understand that a lot of colleges do not give credit for human geography, but that has nothing to do with when it is taken but, rather, with the rigor of the exam.

 

Terri

 

Well, this is good to hear that you contacted the colleges about it. I feel better about this.

 

As for the human geography class, if a lot of colleges are not giving credit for it, then I am bemused as to why anyone would pay $650.00 at PA Homeschoolers for the class? I am not trying to me snippy, I really am questioning this. The course description sounded like a very good class and this is something my ds is very interested in. I just have a very hard time justifying the cost.

[MtnTeaching]

My dd took AP Human Geography in 9th grade and scored a 4. Her college accepted it for credit with no hassle.

 

 

Again, that is good to hear. Did your dd take the course through anyone or did you teach the class?

[Sebastian (a lady)]

YES! This was the one. I also questioned her afterwards and there were several people there, as well. She was quite adamant about her information.

 

Were you at the convention this year? I enjoyed meeting you last year and missed you at the meet-up this year.

 

Yep, I was at the workshop Thursday evening and stayed afterward. I was more than a little surprised that she insisted on sticking with that guideline.

 

It would have been fun to chat with you again. Unfortunately, after driving from DC, I was wiped in the evenings.

[nancy in nj]

The reason that people are willing to pay for PA Homeschoolers classes is quite simply they are extemely high quality, they prepare teens very well for both the AP exams and future college classes, and they allow teens to have the benefit of interacting with an extremely bright peer group. Really, to many of us, the quality of the class experience and having high AP scores on the highschool resume is a a priority and college credit is secondary. Credit typically is somewhat related to the selectivity of the college and can be hard to predict unless you have the college choices narrowed down.

 

In terms of AP Human Geography, yes it is a less rigorous AP and fewer colleges seem to award credit for it. However, it is a nice starter AP for a 10th grader rather than jumping straight into one of the much, much more demanding history or science AP's.

 

There are other high quality non-AP level providers that charge comparable or higher rates for their online classes, so really the PA Homeschoolers classes are not exhorbitantly priced.

[MorningGlory]

As for the human geography class, if a lot of colleges are not giving credit for it, then I am bemused as to why anyone would pay $650.00 at PA Homeschoolers for the class? I am not trying to me snippy, I really am questioning this. The course description sounded like a very good class and this is something my ds is very interested in. I just have a very hard time justifying the cost.

 

I agree. I do not understand why this course is so expensive. Many of PA's other offerings seem more reasonably priced.

 

I'm especially hesitant after reading Ellen's comment in post #8 on this thread:

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=377686

 

I am pretty disappointed with PA Homeschoolers Human Geography class because there is no way to know what my son is getting in the class. The grade book is very out of date.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Absolutely wrong. Hope College is giving Ds18 credit for AP Physics B taken in 10th grade. The people to ask are not the local principals, but the colleges, since they are the ones who make the decisions.

[readinmom]

Bad advice...

 

I know that our UCs and local state universities only accept grades for 10th and 11th grade, and of those, only a certain number of honors and AP grades are allowed to be used.

 

If you think of the argument, then any AP course taken as a senior would not count!

 

I would contact the admissions office of any prospective college that dc are thinking of applying to.

[creekland]

Our local school district will not allow dual enrollment or AP classes for anyone under 11 the grade. This might be the info that Jean Burke is getting in her area as well. This is a school district specific rule for enrolled public school students- nothing to do with the college board. My guess!

 

This is the way our school does things too - except we don't offer AP (except possibly AP Euro). Our community colleges won't accept anyone earlier than junior year.

 

I understand that a lot of colleges do not give credit for human geography, but that has nothing to do with when it is taken but, rather, with the rigor of the exam.

 

Terri

 

This has been true in our college search.

 

For that matter, why would I pay $650.00 for any AP class when my local (highly-rated) state university costs about $350.00 for that class. Also, if I understand correctly, if he decided he wanted to attend an upper-tier school, they probably would not accept this AP class for credit even if he was in 11th or 12th grade.

 

 

 

My guy self-studied AP and saved a bit of $$ while still getting 5s, so you don't need to pay the $$ if you have a motivated student. Simply find out what book(s) are good, buy the Teacher's Edition if you can, and then get good prep books. For Calc, Thinkwell has worked nicely at a fraction of the price. (NOTE: My guy is not taking AP Calc due to going pre-med and not wanting the credit for college, but I sincerely think he could and would do well. Others have taken the AP after Thinkwell and done well.)

 

As to why AP and not dual enrollment? There are several colleges who will give credit for a 4 or 5 on most AP tests, but who won't give credit for dual enrollment classes. These are usually higher tier colleges. When I've asked for reasons professors tell me they know the content from AP, but not from any particular cc (or other 4 year school). They've had bad experiences with transferring in cc credit and students being underprepared. Some students do well, but not the majority - hence - the move to not offer credit. Some colleges still will for things like Calc if a placement test is passed.

 

We did a combo of cc and AP to enhance the college app. We didn't do any with college credit in mind. Oldest got credit for his cc class (didn't do AP). Middle is getting credit for his AP, but not his cc classes. Middle is going to a higher level college than oldest, but both are going to good fits for them. The cc classes have the benefit of showing homeschooled students can do well in a classroom setting (a big plus).

 

Since our school doesn't offer AP, I'm going to try to have youngest (at ps) self study for two next year (Bio and Psych). I've found that students without AP are at a disadvantage at higher level schools. We have several from our high school who don't make it in to higher level schools year after year... This year one had an 800 on an SAT II test and a reasonable SAT score along with our school's dual enrollment classes, but still didn't make it in to desired LACs. IME, colleges don't like the dual enrollment classes nearly as much.

[Muttichen]

The College Board will certainly charge us to retrieve the scores, but that is a different question.

Terri

 

My sons took AP French in 8th grade. The scores stayed on the list along with all his other scores. We didn't need to do anything special to retrieve the eighth grade score. I think the "four year" rule is for people who take time off and then decide to go to college. My son didn't end up getting credit because he is at a school (Harvard!) that doesn't give any credit for APs.

[Gwen in VA]

The reason that people are willing to pay for PA Homeschoolers classes is quite simply they are extemely high quality, they prepare teens very well for both the AP exams and future college classes, and they allow teens to have the benefit of interacting with an extremely bright peer group. Really, to many of us, the quality of the class experience and having high AP scores on the highschool resume is a a priority and college credit is secondary. Credit typically is somewhat related to the selectivity of the college and can be hard to predict unless you have the college choices narrowed down.

 

:iagree: We consider the cost of AP classes to be part of the cost of homeschooling. My kids have had a variety of experiences with different AP classes, but overall they are truly excellent. y kids have also cherished getting to know some real high-achieving kids online -- seeing other kids do the unusual/impossible has expanded my kids' definition of the possible.

 

For us, doing AP classes was purely about providing my kids with a great education. The "outside verification" was a happy by-product of the AP classes.

 

And while my older two kids were able to double and triple major in four years because of AP credits, my younger son will receive no AP credits whatsoever because his college doesn't give transfer credits, period. Even for him, the AP work was not a waste of time, since we did it for educational reasons and not purely for college credit.

Edited May 9, 2012 by Gwen in VA

[creekland]

I don't understand why these conventions allow this to happen. That's a BIG convention. They should be notified that they are charging a premium for bad information.

 

:iagree: It's sad to think that so many probably listened and went away believing wrong info - and paid for the privilege.

[MtnTeaching]

My guy self-studied AP and saved a bit of $$ while still getting 5s, so you don't need to pay the $$ if you have a motivated student. Simply find out what book(s) are good, buy the Teacher's Edition if you can, and then get good prep books.

 

I looked on the College Board site and they do have a lot of interesting info - including sample syllabuses. Did you or your ds use any of that info when planning your class?

 

 

As to why AP and not dual enrollment? There are several colleges who will give credit for a 4 or 5 on most AP tests, but who won't give credit for dual enrollment classes. These are usually higher tier colleges.

 

I've found that students without AP are at a disadvantage at higher level schools. We have several from our high school who don't make it in to higher level schools year after year... This year one had an 800 on an SAT II test and a reasonable SAT score along with our school's dual enrollment classes, but still didn't make it in to desired LACs. IME, colleges don't like the dual enrollment classes nearly as much.

 

Well, it definitely looks as if I need to focus on getting my ds introduced to AP work. I was hoping to have him take the PA Homeschoolers Human Geography because I had heard that it was a good intro AP class, as well as being something that he is very interested in. The cost was what really stunned me.

 

I am curious as to where people are taking their AP classes online other than PA Homeschoolers. I see that Patrick Henry has some also, but know there has to be others offerings. Posters have mentioned that there are very good classes out there. Maybe I need to start another thread on that one.

[MtnTeaching]

:iagree: We consider the cost of AP classes to be part of the cost of homeschooling. My kids have had a variety of experiences with different AP classes, but overall they are truly excellent. y kids have also cherished getting to know some real high-achieving kids online -- seeing other kids do the unusual/impossible has expanded my kids' definition of the possible.

 

For us, doing AP classes was purely about providing my kids with a great education. The "outside verification" was a happy by-product of the AP classes.

 

And while my older two kids were able to double and triple major in four years because of AP credits, my younger son will receive no AP credits whatsoever because his college doesn't give transfer credits, period. Even for him, the AP work was not a waste of time, since we did it for educational reasons and not purely for college credit.

 

This was very good advice, thank you. Did you use PA Homeschoolers or other some other online classes?

[MtnTeaching]

:iagree: It's sad to think that so many probably listened and went away believing wrong info - and paid for the privilege.

 

I think the thing that really disturbed me was the fact that she was so adamant about it. There was no doubt in her mind that this was true, even when people around her were telling her they disagreed.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Her attitude when people were suggesting that she was extrapolating a rule from a narrow data set bothered me enough that I didn't buy her materials or go to her other workshops.

 

On the other hand she did have a lot of info that was useful. For example she was promoting early sat/act testing as well as making sure your kids do PSAT in 11th grade.

 

Trust but verify.

[creekland]

We did not call our class AP classes, but rather, listed them as "Statistics w/AP test score = 5" on our transcript. It worked out just fine. You'd have to get a class approved to call it AP Statistics.

 

We didn't use a syllabus or anything like that. I came on here and asked for suggestions from others who had done well for textbooks and test prep books (some ideas for these I got from College Confidential). Then I let my guy do his own pacing.

 

You need a motivated student to self-study, but the bonus is admissions counselors like to see it (so I was told). Being willing to do so - and do well - is a trait many like to see.

 

If your student isn't motivated, I'd go with a class and consider the fee worth it. Like you, I'd check for good references before paying.

[MtnTeaching]

We did not call our class AP classes, but rather, listed them as "Statistics w/AP test score = 5" on our transcript. It worked out just fine. You'd have to get a class approved to call it AP Statistics.

 

We didn't use a syllabus or anything like that. I came on here and asked for suggestions from others who had done well for textbooks and test prep books (some ideas for these I got from College Confidential). Then I let my guy do his own pacing.

 

You need a motivated student to self-study, but the bonus is admissions counselors like to see it (so I was told). Being willing to do so - and do well - is a trait many like to see.

 

If your student isn't motivated, I'd go with a class and consider the fee worth it. Like you, I'd check for good references before paying.

 

Very good info - thank you! With my guy, I think we will need to start with a class. Self-motivation tends to undulate.

[Laura in CA]

This rumor went around about this time last year, and I contacted a couple of colleges ...

 

Absolutely wrong. Hope College is giving Ds18 credit for AP Physics B taken in 10th grade. The people to ask are not the local principals, but the colleges, since they are the ones who make the decisions.

 

:iagree:

 

This is what I was going to contribute -- ask the colleges!

 

I know that our UCs and local state universities only accept grades for 10th and 11th grade, and of those, only a certain number of honors and AP grades are allowed to be used.

 

I think this is a slightly different issue -- the UCs calculate their own "UC GPA" when ranking applicants to make admissions decisions, and to get this GPA they don't look at 9th-grade classes and, as you say, allow only a certain number of honors and AP grades to be used in this UC GPA. And I *think* (but we're not there yet ... next year!) they only count "a-g" courses in this GPA.

[creekland]

:iagree:

 

I think this is a slightly different issue -- the UCs calculate their own "UC GPA" when ranking applicants to make admissions decisions, and to get this GPA they don't look at 9th-grade classes and, as you say, allow only a certain number of honors and AP grades to be used in this UC GPA. And I *think* (but we're not there yet ... next year!) they only count "a-g" courses in this GPA.

 

Many college recalculate GPA in order to get a similar number for all applicants. Most unweigh anything (though still expect rigorous classes), and some just use the core 4 classes (eliminating what they see as "fluff" classes). Some do the core 4 plus languages. Those who chose this route told us they do note if there are any low grades in those fluff classes...

[dirty ethel rackham]

I agree. I do not understand why this course is so expensive. Many of PA's other offerings seem more reasonably priced.

 

I'm especially hesitant after reading Ellen's comment in post #8 on this thread:

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=377686

 

I wanted to note that I posted a clarification of our experience with AP classes, especially PA Homeschoolers. I was venting frustration and placed an inordinate amount of blame on them when it should have been shared by my own boys who have been less than forthcoming with information on their progress.

[Riverland]

Again, that is good to hear. Did your dd take the course through anyone or did you teach the class?

 

 

She took it at the public school. However, I think it could certainly be self studied with the textbook and study guide.

[MorningGlory]

I wanted to note that I posted a clarification of our experience with AP classes, especially PA Homeschoolers. I was venting frustration and placed an inordinate amount of blame on them when it should have been shared by my own boys who have been less than forthcoming with information on their progress.

 

Thanks for adding that clarification, Ellen. I still don't understand the high price for that particular course, but after looking more carefully at PA's site, I see that a lot of their AP courses are that pricey. The other two that I was seriously considering were much more reasonable (Gov & Stats), so my comparisons were limited. :)

 

My son is taking and excelling in an online course this year, but I don't think he would want to have more than one or two online courses going at once. So it is encouraging to hear how many WTM families have had success with self study!

[RanchGirl]

:iagree: It's sad to think that so many probably listened and went away believing wrong info - and paid for the privilege.

 

I agree. It kind of bothers me that this woman is getting paid to repeatedly spout off false information and she hasn't even bothered to confirm her information despite being questioned multiple times. Does anyone have her email address? Maybe we should email her with a link to the college board. Here's a document addressing students below 11th grade I found with a quick search, and I know I've also seen lists of exam scores by grade that went below 9. http://apcentral.collegeboard.com/apc/public/repository/Appropriate-Grade-Levels-for-AP-Courses.pdf

[Sebastian (a lady)]

What about if you contacted the organization that put on the convention??? I would not only contact them, but contact any place where she is scheduled to speak. I'm sure if you looked on her website, you could see where she would be. Those of you in this state mobilize your friends. Stop the misinformation.

 

I think that correcting what she is saying on one point would be better than trying to have her excluded from future conferences.

 

As much as this item annoyed me, most of what she put out was correct and not something that many homeschool speakers are spending time one.

 

Trying to have her excluded from conferences strikes me as too near the pattern that makes conventions one demensional because of issues of cultural, theological and scientific orthodoxy.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

I agree. It kind of bothers me that this woman is getting paid to repeatedly spout off false information and she hasn't even bothered to confirm her information despite being questioned multiple times. Does anyone have her email address? Maybe we should email her with a link to the college board. Here's a document addressing students below 11th grade I found with a quick search, and I know I've also seen lists of exam scores by grade that went below 9. http://apcentral.collegeboard.com/apc/public/repository/Appropriate-Grade-Levels-for-AP-Courses.pdf

 

Thanks for the link. I'd been looking unsuccessfully for something along these lines.

 

I sent an email to Ms. Burk this morning.

[creekland]

Thanks for the link. I'd been looking unsuccessfully for something along these lines.

 

I sent an email to Ms. Burk this morning.

 

Awesome! I agree that correcting the misinformation is what is key. Let us know what she responds with. Hopefully she's open to changing her views when presented with the facts.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Awesome! I agree that correcting the misinformation is what is key. Let us know what she responds with. Hopefully she's open to changing her views when presented with the facts.

 

I already got a reply that she was changing the info in her High School Prep Genius book, which she is currently editing to reflect the info from the college board policy.

 

Thanks to the pp who dug up the policy. I'm expecting that her future workshops will also reflect the more nuanced information.

[creekland]

That sounds great! Glad you sent the e-mail. ;)

[moki4]

A poster mentioned limited acceptance of AP classes with the UC schools. I have to disagree. In particular, AP Human Geography is listed as an acceptable class!

[Sebastian (a lady)]

A poster mentioned limited acceptance of AP classes with the UC schools. I have to disagree. In particular, AP Human Geography is listed as an acceptable class!

 

Something to look at with Human Geography (as well as some other courses) is what sort of a class it is counted as. There were some schools I looked at that only counted it as a general education credit.

 

I decided that I'd prefer to go with straight history courses, with or without AP courses. YMMV.

[readwithem]

Just agreeing that you need to check with each specific college on its policy. My dd's college changed its AP policy during her last year of high school, and now only gives credit for a score of a 5. So it kind of irks me when people refer to a "3" or higher as "passing" - for my dd's college, a 3 is the same as a 1.:glare:

[Laura in CA]

A poster mentioned limited acceptance of AP classes with the UC schools. I have to disagree. In particular, AP Human Geography is listed as an acceptable class!

 

Yes, this is true. Here, for example, is a list of which APs UC Berkeley's colleges accept.

 

Stanford, on the other hand, accepts only math, computer science, a few of the sciences and a few of the foreign language APs (for example, no enviro sci or bio, I think). Caltech grants no credit for AP exams (or for anything else, for that matter). But as has (I hope) been thoroughly proven in this thread, for Stanford and the UCs the APs don't have to be taken in 11th or 12th grade!!

 

Sebastian, thank you for emailing Jean Burk!

[justasque]

Caltech grants no credit for AP exams (or for anything else, for that matter).

 

And yet (just to clarify) they expect pretty much everyone they accept to have done AP's. As PP's have mentioned, at such highly competitive schools APs are more-or-less needed to get in, even if they give you no credits.

[moki4]

Yes! For Caltech start taking the AP's in 9th, and continue through 12th.

I spoke to a woman in admissions a few months ago and she kept repeating, "just have your Dd take the most challenging classes she can handle", which includes AP/CC.

No credit given for the classes, but you absolutely need them to be considered for admittance.

:)

[Laura in CA]

And yet (just to clarify) they expect pretty much everyone they accept to have done AP's. As PP's have mentioned, at such highly competitive schools APs are more-or-less needed to get in, even if they give you no credits.

 

Yes! For Caltech start taking the AP's in 9th, and continue through 12th.

I spoke to a woman in admissions a few months ago and she kept repeating, "just have your Dd take the most challenging classes she can handle", which includes AP/CC.

No credit given for the classes, but you absolutely need them to be considered for admittance.

:)

 

Oh yes, of course -- I figured it was understood, but you're right, good to clarify. Same with Stanford -- although they give credit for only a few APs, in contrast to, say, Portland State & the UCs, (several of) the kids I know who've been accepted at Stanford in recent years have had 20 or more APs.

 

(Side note: I can't imagine how someone could accumulate 25 AP scores, unless they took multiple foreign languages, both AB and BC Calc, macro and micro econ, all the studio art classes and all the physics tests, etc. I've been meaning to pin one of the moms down ... :001_huh: )

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Oh yes, of course -- I figured it was understood, but you're right, good to clarify. Same with Stanford -- although they give credit for only a few APs, in contrast to, say, Portland State & the UCs, (several of) the kids I know who've been accepted at Stanford in recent years have had 20 or more APs.

 

(Side note: I can't imagine how someone could accumulate 25 AP scores, unless they took multiple foreign languages, both AB and BC Calc, macro and micro econ, all the studio art classes and all the physics tests, etc. I've been meaning to pin one of the moms down ... :001_huh: )

 

I think that it does bear repeating. It can be hard to hold all the different tests, what they're good for and when to take them in your head. Even if a college doesn't grant credit, or grants credit in an area where the student doesn't much need it, or the student will decline the actual credit (ex. AP test in a majors field); that might be the factor that gets the student noticed by admissions (or at least lays concerns to rest).

 

I'm still on the fence about how many APs I want my kids to take. The average for the flagship state school is 6-9 (IIRC, though I'm failing to rediscover where I thought I'd read this).

 

Human Geography, psychology and environmental science are APs that I've seen promoted to younger students.

[Gwen in VA]

I'm still on the fence about how many APs I want my kids to take. The average for the flagship state school is 6-9 (IIRC, though I'm failing to rediscover where I thought I'd read this).

 

I know the sheer numbers of AP's does count, but the annoying thing about a statistic like that is that the # of AP's doesn't indicate the SCORE!

 

Supposedly our top state school sent a letter to someone in my town stating that the applicant was denied due to "too few" AP's, and that a competitive applicant should have 6. BUT --

 

Isn't 4 AP's with all 5's better than 6 or 12 with all 3's? If I were an ad con, I would be more concerned with the scores than with the sheer number!

[MtnTeaching]

I already got a reply that she was changing the info in her High School Prep Genius book, which she is currently editing to reflect the info from the college board policy.

 

Thanks to the pp who dug up the policy. I'm expecting that her future workshops will also reflect the more nuanced information.

 

Thank you for doing this, Sebastian! I do think much of what she was saying was very useful. This one fact seemed to be a sticking point for her, though. I am glad she is taking the information and reconsidering her position.

[MtnTeaching]

I think that it does bear repeating. It can be hard to hold all the different tests, what they're good for and when to take them in your head. Even if a college doesn't grant credit, or grants credit in an area where the student doesn't much need it, or the student will decline the actual credit (ex. AP test in a majors field); that might be the factor that gets the student noticed by admissions (or at least lays concerns to rest).

 

I'm still on the fence about how many APs I want my kids to take. The average for the flagship state school is 6-9 (IIRC, though I'm failing to rediscover where I thought I'd read this).

 

Human Geography, psychology and environmental science are APs that I've seen promoted to younger students.

 

I am definitely struggling with this as well. I also want ds to have the opportunity in high school to explore his passions. What does he really want to go to college for? I do not want to burn him out before he even gets to college!

 

I was looking at the Human Geography AP because I was told by a school counselor that this was a good "introductory" AP (ds will be in 10th next year). It is also a class my ds finds interesting.

 

I would like to have him in a classroom setting. (at least an interactive online classroom). I want interaction and discussion with other students, accountability and timelines set by someone other than me, and a class that challenges him and makes him THINK... but I want it to be a good experience.

 

The problem is the $650.00. Ouch! Does anyone know of other AP Human Geography classes online that are recommended, but hopefully not as expensive?

 

Also, does anyone know how rigorous the AP European History course is?

[MtnTeaching]

Something to look at with Human Geography (as well as some other courses) is what sort of a class it is counted as. There were some schools I looked at that only counted it as a general education credit.

 

I decided that I'd prefer to go with straight history courses, with or without AP courses. YMMV.

 

 

This thread has really helped me to look more closely at the requirements by the colleges.

 

I checked the Univerity of Colorado at Boulder which would be considered as our state flagship university. They do accept the AP Human Geography and will give credit for the basic geography class.

 

Ds did World History with me this year and will probably be continuing through the summer. I pounded him in this class and added a ton of extra reading, documentaries, art history, timeline work, etc. What are the chances of him doing review and several AP study guides and taking the test next year? Has anyone done this? His textbook was not on the College Board list - does he still have a chance of passing the test?

[Laura in CA]

I know the sheer numbers of AP's does count, but the annoying thing about a statistic like that is that the # of AP's doesn't indicate the SCORE!

 

Supposedly our top state school sent a letter to someone in my town stating that the applicant was denied due to "too few" AP's, and that a competitive applicant should have 6. BUT --

 

Isn't 4 AP's with all 5's better than 6 or 12 with all 3's? If I were an ad con, I would be more concerned with the scores than with the sheer number!

 

:iagree:

 

As a PP said, calling 3 a 'passing score' is irksome. Some colleges give credit only for 5s now (and, as noted above, some colleges give NO credit, but do expect to see APs). Some foreign schools spell it out -- the Swiss unis need five APs with high scores (not sure if a 5 is absolutely necessary, but of course the more 5s the better!), and Oxford wants to see 5s, maybe a few 4s are OK (which corresponds to what they say they want to see on UK students' A-levels).

 

I wonder if they meant hours.

 

I hadn't thought of that, but no, I'm sure they meant individual APs ... these are kids who were accepted at Stanford AND Harvard, for example -- way outside the norm at their high schools, definite overachievers. What confuses me is that there's only a certain number of AP exams, and many of them are foreign language, so I was scratching my head wondering if these kids really took, say, AP German AND AP French AND AP Spanish AND AP Chinese ... I find it difficult to imagine an overachiever taking both AB and BC calculus, for example (wouldn't they just do BC?), but it's possible, especially if the kid is more humanities oriented (there just aren't that many science APs, and only two English ones, right? Lang and Lit? but quite a few history ones, and hum geo, and several govs and econs ...). Like I said, I'm friends with a mom whose daughter attended Harvard and claims she had 20-something APs, so I need to pin her down :)

 

Also, these are kids at public schools, which while OK schools, certainly aren't the caliber of, say, Thomas Jefferson in VA or Harker in CA ... so my gut feeling is that having 25 APs indicates serious brainpower, yes, but also serious lack of challenge in the high school. Surely a top-notch school -- or a homeschool!!! -- could meet these kids at their level and challenge them enough that they wouldn't need so many AP classes, kwim?

 

ETA: These are kids who applied 4-5 years ago, so I'm also wondering if they took, for example, French Lang *and* French Lit. I know some of the language APs have been eliminated recently. And if the kid is a native speaker of one of the foreign languages, that might knock off two right there, plus both English APs, plus a third language ... one of my son's friends from Mexico sailed through AP Spanish Lang with a 5, and this year is taking AP Spanish Lit (which will be much harder for him than Lang!), plus he's studying French, and he could attempt the English APs ... I guess that's potentially six APs right there, if there were still two French APs ... :confused:

Edited May 11, 2012 by Laura in CA

[nancy in nj]

Leslie,

 

AP Euro is definitely a rigorous course; however, it sounds like it could be a very good fit for your son. It sounds like you provided a rigorous world history course at home this year. I would think that Human Geo. would be a step down in rigor from the world history your son did this year. AP Euro is a great next step, and I've heard great things about Mrs. Harrison's AP Euro class at PA Homeschoolers. A high score on AP Euro is definitely more impressive on a transcript than a 5 on human geography, and every college we are looking (e.g., Wake Forest, Davidson, UNC Chapel Hill) at gives credit for AP Euro. I've even seen some less highly ranked schools give 6 credits for a 5 on Euro.

 

My daughter followed a similar path...got pounded by a rigorous World History class with Scholars Online in 9th grade and then did AP Euro (with approved syllabus) at home in 10th and scored a 5 on the exam. 4 If we could do it over again, my daughter would have done Euro with PA Homeschoolers rather than self-study, mainly for the interaction with peers and the outside accountability & writing critique.

 

Nancy