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Lyn

Word of caution about Hillsdale College

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The way I understand it the answer is: no. Although Grove City is an excellent school, I realized that it would not be a good choice for my son who has ADHD when I called them to inquire about their disabilities services. The very nice person at the switchboard said a Mrs. Whatever handles that but they do not have a disabilities services office. Sometimes schools without experienced professionals have a very simplistic, uniformed understanding of the different disabilities students have and what services they need. Simply having a lower teacher to student ratio is not necessarily the answer.

 

Yolanda

 

PS -I took a look at Hillsdale's website and couldn't find any mention either. Interestingly, when I searched the website I found that their high school doesn't either. Their approach to learning disabilities is: lower teacher to student ratio using "traditional teaching methods".

 

Yes, I agree that people who aren't experienced with LD's don't often understand what those kids go through. I feel like I am still really learning about what dd needs and appreciating how her dyslexia impacts different areas of her life, especially this year as she's transitioned from homeschool to a bricks & mortar school.

 

I found the same thing when I looked at Hillsdale's website, and it's one of my bigger concerns. A lower student to teacher ratio is a good start, but not the end of the discussion. Well, that's what the visit is for!

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I know it is important to find the right fit in a college. My daughter was accepted at Hope but found the visit to be quite a turn off (tour guide, classroom visit, lunch in cafe.).

 

On the other hand, her visit to Hillsdale was great. The Palin look alike receptionist was nice and the look was very flattering on her. The interview with admissions was wonderful ( a year later the interviewer still had her hand-painted thankyou card on his desk) and the cafeteria visit was nicer than the other colleges we visited (Wheaton and Hope among others). When we have stayed at the conference center we have never had bug bites.

 

DD is just finishing her first year at Hillsdale and LOVES it, Hillsdale was the perfect fit for her. She has been visiting a church in town and she called me yesterday to say that even though she has only visited there 3 -4 times, they brought all the visiting students a gift bag of snacks and items for finals week. At the beginning of the year she was "Adopted" by a local grandmother who has had college students for dinner, for tea, she has offered her house for our family when visiting, she brings cookies and treats to my daughter. This woman has been doing this for years and some of her "adoptees" are now second generation. My daughter volunteers at a local non-profit in town and has spoke of how appreciative the employees have been.

The professors we have met at conferences have been easy to talk to and my daughter has found them very approachable for help.

DD's roommate is gluten-free and she and her parents have expressed to us how wonderfully accomodating Saga has been with her special requests.

No college is perfect, but we have had a WONDERFUL experience with Hillsdale.

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I don't know anything about this Hillsdale college, but I've lived in a university town for 30 years. We are considered "townies" and I've never met anyone who thought that was a derogatory term. Community and student conflicts are pretty common and our city just spent $26,000 for police and SWAT to break up an out of control drunken party thrown by college students. I would never judge a college by the way a few people in town talked about it!

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Firstly, it's obviously very important to make the college visit. Secondly, just as Lyn has mentioned I encourage all of you reading not to take her "cautionary tale" as fact and visit just as she did. I sent two of my kids to Hillsdale. We've visited multiple times. My kids have been treated like gold from the beginning. We met the entire staff on campus during visit weekends, met professors and were very pleased with the caliber of students--both in character and intelligence. Our admissions counselor was prompt and caring. Hillsdale is very student centered--it's all about cultivating a well rounded, high-minded adult who knows how to think critically. They also just created two new positions and hired two full-time, well qualified staff to bolster and grow their career planning department.

 

Certainly the purpose and benefit of these sites is to broaden our knowledge and minds a bit more through other people's experiences, but I must say--this poster's credibility went right out the window when she took it upon herself to mock a lovely woman's hair and style. I know exactly who she is talking about, and this woman is nothing less than completely herself--definitely not trying to be Sarah Palin. And, even if that were true, why in the world would it matter? I found your post ineffective, immature and If I were a betting man I'd put money on you and your student being pretty darn tough to please.

 

Also, I know in the Admissions process that Hillsdale has more applications visits and inquiries than it can probably handle. Unfortunately, this means they have to focus their time and attention on their top students, and they rely on their interviews to define those students. Perhaps your student just wasn't the best fit for Hillsdale--sounds like it was mutual.

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Certainly, every family is different and will select a college based on their own priorities. It would be a problem if we all liked the same college.:001_smile:

 

It is obvious that we have some pretty staunch Hillsdale defenders on this board. Before visiting, I probably would have thought that there couldn't possibly be anything wrong with this institution. In fact, we have been donors. Received their lovely mailing with the $2 bill a couple days ago soliciting funds for their new on-line constitution program.

 

Anyway, I am no longer impressed.

 

Some pointed out that the town/gown issue is not all that uncommon. However, you need to realize it does make a difference to some families. Some college ranking services even break out schools by whether there is tension between the college and the town.

 

From my perspective this was just another sign that arrogance, rather than humility, was promoted at this institution. We saw arrogance in the attitudes of almost everyone we dealt with at Hilldale. The comments from the towns people supported what we were seeing ourselves. The people did not seem genuine and honest. We prefer to have our child in an environment that will promote humility not arrogance.

 

Don't forget that this institution does not have a whistle blower policy. This is certainly unusual and not very reassuring.

 

The issue we had with the food service was multifaceted. Our initial inquires were ignored. Then our questions were not answered honestly. Basically, they did not want to admit that they were cutting corners.

 

Regardless, of the fact that my ds has a food allergy, I would not have been comfortable sending him away to a school that uses oils with trans-fats to prepare their foods and serves milk with rbgh. As you can see from links in my earlier post, it is not common practice in the college dining industry to use these types of things...they are unhealthy. They are also cutting corners on the salad bar as I mentioned above. This is the info. I was able to obtain in a couple of visits so there are probably other ways that they are cutting corners that I did not see. While this will be of concern to some of the 3,000+ viewers of this thread, to others it will not. We happen to be health conscious.

 

Someone brought up ADA issues in response to my mention of them requiring Drs. notes for food allergies. Well, I am not sure that a food allergy is a disability. Disability is defined differently under different statues. However, no other school we visited required any kind of rx in order for a student to avail themselves of a special diet. Special diets seem to be no problem whatsoever at the majority of schools. This again is a reflection of the attitude at Hillsdale.

 

Again my overall impression is that there is a undercurrent falseness at this institution. Why mention the Sarah Palin double? Perhaps she is just a visual that underscores the overall feeling of a facade.

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I have no dog in this race, but one thing I've found in my two college searches so far is that one can find staunch supporters and detractors from every single college out there. It's important to read pros and cons, then consider what is important to the individual. It's also important to visit places and get your own feel. Colleges my guys have chosen have people who feel pretty negatively toward them too, but my oldest is 100% happy with his choice and I expect middle son will be too.

 

Fit is equally important to content IMO. No one college meets the fit need for all students.

 

I would not hesitate to consider Hillsdale for my guys if it met their needs in other ways.

 

If in doubt, contact recent alumni and see what they have to say and whether they feel it was worth their 4 years or if they'd have chosen elsewhere if they had it to do again. That will show a better overall view than a prospective touring the place (any place).

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Once again, I'm amazed at how this poster went from (supposedly) being a donor and having her son apply early decision to not having *one good word* to say about Hillsdale. Not one.

 

It's unusual on these boards for someone -- especially someone with a tiny handful of previous posts -- to come on and bad-mouth an institution as rabidly as Lyn has done here. She is being downright spiteful about this college.

 

I don't think this thread has anything to do with "giving us information so we can make up our own minds." I think Lyn is doing a hatchet job on Hillsdale for reasons she has not revealed to us. An honest poster who wanted to share her college visit experiences would carefully tell us good points and bad points, trying hard to stay polite and fair. Lyn's blatant malice toward Hillsdale makes it hard to take anything she says seriously.

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Yes, where did you decide WAS good enough. Hillsdale wouldn't be a good fit for my child, but the tone of her post...oh my goodness. And so few posts. If you are legitimate. What was good enough????? People have asked you several times and you won't say.

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Why are so many posters feeling so defensive about Hillsdale?? I know absolutely zero about this school. But obviously there is something about it that has made people very emotional about it. How different is it for Lyn to make her statements than it is for a totally new poster, someone who knows NOTHING about these boards or this community, show up to tell us how wonderful Hillsdale is??

 

I'm headed now to Hillsdale's site to find out what the "issue" is.

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OK, I get it. "Citadel of American Conservatism" is how The National Review described it. Ahh, everything is so much clearer!

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I'm not even remotely surprised by Lyn's report. Better to find out before you enroll.

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How different is it for Lyn to make her statements than it is for a totally new poster, someone who knows NOTHING about these boards or this community, show up to tell us how wonderful Hillsdale is??

 

:iagree: What a doozy for a first post here!

 

Lyn's reviews are just her own opinions of her experience. She has not even remotely broken any (well-thought-out) board rules in expressing her opinions. Her past posts on the forums are normal asking-for-help or giving-help posts one would expect here. As for the fact that she hasn't mentioned where her son has decided to go...well, maybe he hasn't decided yet, or maybe she just doesn't want to share private information. She is not obligated to do so just because she wrote opinions that some don't agree with.

 

She is entitled to politely share her opinions here, governed by the board rules, just as we all are. Lyn, I applaud you for how you've expressed yourself in this thread. Thank you for adding your voice - I'm sure people will find your review helpful.

 

One question - what is a whistle blower policy?

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:grouphug:I really hate to get involved in threads like this but what is the purpose of these boards if we can't express ourselves without fear of being attacked.

 

I rarely post anymore because of what I see happen at times. I've been on these boards since 2001. We are all different and yet have so much to learn from each other. These boards were meant for us to be able to share our opinions without fear of persecution.

 

I had posted briefly earlier about Hillsdale not being a fit for everyone. Many years ago, this was a consideration for our son who is graduating. I was even going to send him on the high school trip. I have friends whose high schoolers have gone on those trips. I have friends whose students attended Hillsdale and had to come back or transfer, etc.

Again, this is not against Hillsdale. It was not for them. I know those whose children have done very well.

 

The reasons we decided not to pursue Hillsdale are personal to us and I will certainly not post them after what has happened here. This is no disrespect for those whose students have excelled at Hillsdale and certainly not a judgment of you either. This particular son does not have food sensitivities. However, I have another son and that may certainly be a consideration in the future when we consider colleges.

 

I also understand that no college is perfect. Regardless of what is posted on these boards, one has to do one's own research and above all visit the college.

 

If I were Lyn, I certainly wouldn't be posting our school choice. We all make different choices and no one should be criticized for the choice they make. A post about a school is not a post against any family who has chosen said school.:grouphug:

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:grouphug:I really hate to get involved in threads like this but what is the purpose of these boards if we can't express ourselves without fear of being attacked.

 

We are all different and yet have so much to learn from each other. These boards were meant for us to be able to share our opinions without fear of persecution.

 

 

I also understand that no college is perfect. Regardless of what is posted on these boards, one has to do one's own research and above all visit the college.

 

If I were Lyn, I certainly wouldn't be posting our school choice. We all make different choices and no one should be criticized for the choice they make. A post about a school is not a post against any family who has chosen said school.:grouphug:

 

:iagree:I couldn't agree more!

 

Yolanda

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Actually, my irritation at Lyn's repeated attempts to defame Hillsdale isn't because Hillsdale is a conservative school. Hillsdale would probably be too conservative for my family (we're conservative Christians, but probably not enough so for that particular institution).

 

What I object to is Lyn showing up on this board and "cautioning" us about Hillsdale. Now, why do we need to be warned about Hillsdale? She doesn't make that clear, except that perhaps the Hillsdale cafeteria food isn't quite to her taste. Hillsdale aspires to have one of its graduates be a U.S. president one day. A receptionist wears glasses and a Palin-ish hairdo (which is actually a pretty look, though a bit dated). Lyn doesn't approve of the placement office. Lyn thinks people at Hillsdale are arrogant (but she doesn't give concrete examples to prove this). For those subjective issues, we need to be "cautioned."

 

I looked on the Hillsdale website to find out the cost of a year's tuition and expenses. It's less than $30,000 a year, which is inexpensive for a private college. Washington and Lee University costs over $58,000 a year. Amherst College costs up to $61,000 a year. (I just chose those two off the top of my head as examples of private liberal arts colleges.) My daughter's boarding school will cost close to $50,000 next year, and it serves pretty standard cafeteria food (with a vegetarian option). It's possible that Hillsdale is trying its best to keep its costs reasonable (this is just a guess), and that thrift is reflected in its cafeteria food that Lyn objects so strongly to (though other Hillsdale-knowledgable posters have said the food is perfectly acceptable).

 

Lyn stated that she has donated money to Hillsdale in the past. She lives about two hours away from the school. Her son applied early decision. And yet she just now is realizing she doesn't like a single thing about the school, and she doesn't want us to like it either.

 

Of course we should be able to express our opinions on this board. However, we need to be wary of inactive posters who suddenly appear out of nowhere making inflammatory statements about a particular school.

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Why are so many posters feeling so defensive about Hillsdale?? I know absolutely zero about this school. But obviously there is something about it that has made people very emotional about it. How different is it for Lyn to make her statements than it is for a totally new poster, someone who knows NOTHING about these boards or this community, show up to tell us how wonderful Hillsdale is??

 

I'm headed now to Hillsdale's site to find out what the "issue" is.

 

I don't think the issue is conservative/liberal or anything like it. I see the same thing coming up if anyone speaks poorly of online colleges, community colleges, state colleges, or private colleges (essentially - any college experience).

 

What is happening is people are defending their choices. I strongly suspect you'd see the same reaction for college XXX if we had people on here who went there and someone else totally dissing it just like we get when people talk about groups of colleges.

 

When I write my reviews I try to point out positives and negatives about places knowing full well that each place has a group that "fits" them and a group that does not. I think working in a public high school and seeing so many students head to such varying places and listening to their "whys" helps me see the differences. The vast majority who give reviews (on this site as well as any college review site) just give their opinion - pro or con - in a similar manner as we all have our preferences for types of college experiences to start with.

 

I read a lot about colleges when people post things on here. I now know far more about Hillsdale than I ever did before. It could be useful when making recommendations in the future. It all depends upon the student/family and fit.

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It isn't Hillsdale. My kids wouldn't even consider it. I could list about 10things that I don't like about it. However, her tone just rubbed me the wrong way. Part of it may be that so many things seemed inconsequential to me. I could care less about food, but then again my child doesn't have an issue. Arrogance... honestly, if she took the tone with them that she took in the post, then SHE is the one who sounds rude and I would have trouble being nice back. Does that make sense. Plus, she only seems to want to talk about how horrible this school is and isn't posting anywhere about much else or how wonderful some other schools are...

 

I wouldn't have minded her post if she were just a little less strident.

Why are so many posters feeling so defensive about Hillsdale?? I know absolutely zero about this school. But obviously there is something about it that has made people very emotional about it. How different is it for Lyn to make her statements than it is for a totally new poster, someone who knows NOTHING about these boards or this community, show up to tell us how wonderful Hillsdale is??

 

I'm headed now to Hillsdale's site to find out what the "issue" is.

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Why are so many posters feeling so defensive about Hillsdale?? I know absolutely zero about this school. But obviously there is something about it that has made people very emotional about it. How different is it for Lyn to make her statements than it is for a totally new poster, someone who knows NOTHING about these boards or this community, show up to tell us how wonderful Hillsdale is??

 

I'm headed now to Hillsdale's site to find out what the "issue" is.

 

Defensive? I call it being quite rude. The OP has her opinions, yet some seem to be prodding and poking like bullies. I'm used to this on the general board, but not here.

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Still waiting to hear the name of the accepted school...

 

Why are you so hot to know? Perhaps her child has not decided, perhaps she doesn't want to give out the info, perhaps she thinks you are a bit too over-zealous in wanting to know.

Go back, if you're so curious, and look at her other posts. Do any of those sound an alarm, as apparently this one does, for you? I'm asking sincerely, since you seem very aggressive here.

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Defensive? I call it being quite rude. The OP has her opinions, yet some seem to be prodding and poking like bullies. I'm used to this on the general board, but not here.

 

:iagree:

I found her posts interesting...I am years away from thinking about colleges but it's good to read about issues to think about ahead of time. Some of the other posts feel as if they are trying to censor and direct 'how' the college discussions should be.

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:iagree:

Some of the other posts feel as if they are trying to censor and direct 'how' the college discussions should be.

 

Tact is preferred on this board, esp since different people head to different colleges. When tact is lost (as with the OP in certain aspects of her posts) this board (and the high school board) can get as heated as any other. The original post even annoyed me and I'm not pro or con toward Hillsdale. Prior to this thread I knew it as a name. Before I got on this board I didn't even know that. However, I am pro tolerance and tact. One can go to any review site to see harsh comments. We don't need them here. I'm not fond of some of the responses either, but like with other threads, human nature tends to want to respond in kind.

 

Many issues that were brought up should have been (food, town/gown relationship, etc), but some really were out of line (Palin look-alike). As for losing paperwork? I'm not sure I could count the times that has happened with our college apps - from all different levels of colleges. With so many applying, it just seems to happen. Only experience lets people know that's rather par for the course... as are people who hate (or love) any individual school.

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My ds was accepted early app. he was pretty sure that was where he wanted to go (probably because he knew so many others there), but we placed deposits with other schools that he was accepted to just in case. In the end we are glad we did.

 

Just so others know, if he applied early decision, that was binding and he should be going there. If it was early action, that's not binding and all is well. However, DEPOSITS at more than one school is not ok unless it's just housing deposits and not "I'm going to be going there" deposits (which most deposits are). If schools find out you put a deposit down at more than one place MANY will rescind their acceptances. DON'T do this! It's unethical. You have until May 1st to choose or later in the case that you are coming off a waitlist. Once you choose, then you send in the deposit for that ONE school and let the others know you won't be attending. If you come off a waitlist, you generally forfeit your deposit to the first school, but it's ethically accepted - unlike multiple deposits.

 

Once one sends in an "I'm going there" deposit the school counts on you attending and it makes a difference for future acceptances from applications and waitlists.

 

Not that I want to change the focus of this thread, but Jen's post made me realize others are reading and learning so I thought it could be important to mention this aspect for future knowledge (at Hillsdale or wherever).

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Just so others know, if he applied early decision, that was binding and he should be going there. If it was early action, that's not binding and all is well. However, DEPOSITS at more than one school is not ok unless it's just housing deposits and not "I'm going to be going there" deposits (which most deposits are). If schools find out you put a deposit down at more than one place MANY will rescind their acceptances. DON'T do this! It's unethical. You have until May 1st to choose or later in the case that you are coming off a waitlist. Once you choose, then you send in the deposit for that ONE school and let the others know you won't be attending. If you come off a waitlist, you generally forfeit your deposit to the first school, but it's ethically accepted - unlike multiple deposits.

 

Once one sends in an "I'm going there" deposit the school counts on you attending and it makes a difference for future acceptances from applications and waitlists.

 

Not that I want to change the focus of this thread, but Jen's post made me realize others are reading and learning so I thought it could be important to mention this aspect for future knowledge (at Hillsdale or wherever).

 

Thank you - good info!

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Just so others know, if he applied early decision, that was binding and he should be going there. If it was early action, that's not binding and all is well. However, DEPOSITS at more than one school is not ok unless it's just housing deposits and not "I'm going to be going there" deposits (which most deposits are). If schools find out you put a deposit down at more than one place MANY will rescind their acceptances. DON'T do this! It's unethical. You have until May 1st to choose or later in the case that you are coming off a waitlist. Once you choose, then you send in the deposit for that ONE school and let the others know you won't be attending. If you come off a waitlist, you generally forfeit your deposit to the first school, but it's ethically accepted - unlike multiple deposits.

 

Once one sends in an "I'm going there" deposit the school counts on you attending and it makes a difference for future acceptances from applications and waitlists.

 

Not that I want to change the focus of this thread, but Jen's post made me realize others are reading and learning so I thought it could be important to mention this aspect for future knowledge (at Hillsdale or wherever).

 

Thank you, I really do appreciate information like this. I don't want to wait until 11th/12th grade and be overwhelmed. OTOH I realize some things will be different by the time mine are off to college.

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Why are you so hot to know? Perhaps her child has not decided, perhaps she doesn't want to give out the info, perhaps she thinks you are a bit too over-zealous in wanting to know.

Go back, if you're so curious, and look at her other posts. Do any of those sound an alarm, as apparently this one does, for you? I'm asking sincerely, since you seem very aggressive here.

 

 

Why do I want to know? Because folks ask me about colleges all the time. Because I have two more children to send off. Since the OP seemed to be looking for a conservative college (I have to assume this or she wouldn't have been putting a deposit down at Hillsdale!) and I'm always interested in conservative colleges (my oldest WENT to Hillsdale, next one to Annapolis and I would be happier if my next had not turned down West Point in favor of WY) I would like to know of this school. That's the beauty of these boards--folks come on and give information (pros and cons ideally) so those of us who cannot travel to every school that strikes our fancy can glean wisdom.

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As a mother with two children that deal with food issues, I would NOT expect a college to cater to my children. They will be adults. They will be responsible. One has been to a private highschool. We did not quiz and expect the school to cater to him. The other may be going to another private school. We merely clarified that packed lunches were acceptable (and pointed out that it would have to be at least for our child due to her medical issues). I never stated that the school had to change their menu or produce something separately. I would figure that an adult student could go into town and make decent choices for their own meals. Could they not keep a small fridge in their room? Is there not a common area where they could possibly cook a meal? Can they not eat in town? If none of these things, then, yes, the school would be out. But I would not be irate about it. Disappointed, but nothing more.

 

Also, most institutions use commonly accepted milk and lettuce. Very few cater to organic and healthier choices. That is left to the pocket of the students to go search for, find, and buy on their own. Also, a chiropractor deals with certain issues. Allergies are in the range of a medical doctor (MD or OD as previously stated). Given how many chiropractors are quacks that claim to be a cure-all physician, I would not accept something from them either.

 

I agree with the other brown haired, eye glass wearing mama...if only I could wake up looking as put together as Sarah Palin! (some things I like about her and some I don't...but dang, she knows how to pull it together!)

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I have no dog in this race, but one thing I've found in my two college searches so far is that one can find staunch supporters and detractors from every single college out there. It's important to read pros and cons, then consider what is important to the individual. It's also important to visit places and get your own feel.

 

So true. The school my oldest attends seems to be a lightening rod for opinions from all sides. We have found a majority of the opinions to be either outright false (usually this) or at least not something that we are troubled by (sometimes that.) We hesitated briefly until we visited because of the negative comments. I love the school now and wish all my children could attend but really, at this point it's probably only a good fit for my oldest. I'm praying hard that they expand their program in the next 9 years to accommodate my STEM geared son. :D

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Colleen if you google' date=' there's lots of universities which give their policy. It's in place to allow people at the university to raise issues without fear of reprisal. Here's one as an example:

 

http://hr.osu.edu/policy/policy140.pdf[/quote']

 

Thank you - that was eye-opening!

 

I wonder why a college then wouldn't have one in place?

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Came across this link which verifies there is no whistle blower policy at Hillsdale:

 

http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=3823

 

Why wouldn't they have one? Can't think of a good reason, but I can think of many not so good reasons.

 

Now I'm off to google on some different colleges out of curiosity. :)

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In regards to the question on the whistle blower policy, I see that someone provided the answer, but here is a little background:

 

http://www.nonprofitrisk.org/library/articles/employment091005.shtml

 

As you can see it is just good business practice to have such a policy in place. I'm in agreement with the comment that stated that there is no good reason not to have one, and some potentially bad reasons to avoid having one.

 

The comment about not having deposits with more than one college was not really accurate. There are in fact some colleges that offer more acceptances than spaces. They will state in their acceptance letter that to guarantee a place at May 1 you need to make a deposit and if you change your mind prior to that date your deposit is refundable. So different schools, different MO's.

 

It seems to me that some of the comments are being made by individuals who have not carefully read this thread. One example is the gal who would have her child with food sensitivities eat out of a fridge in his dorm room. Really!

 

First, you missed the part about Hillsdale avoiding my dining related inquiries, and then falsely answering the questions I posed about dining services. Had they answered my questions honestly from the beginning, we would have crossed them off our list, but it looked to me like a bait and switch tactic.

 

Second, what I require in regards to dining services has nothing to do with "organic produce". Where did that come from? Hillsdale is cooking with vegetable oils that contain trans-fats and serving milk that contains rgbh. This is not the standard in college food these days. See for yourself:

 

http://www.housing.umich.edu/dining/nutrition#livechat

 

http://www.cafebonappetit.com/our-ap...hen-principles

 

http://hope.edu/dining/

 

http://www.calvin.edu/admin/food/nutrition.html

 

Cafe Bon Appetit (see link above) manages the food service for a number of colleges. Now I realize that not everyone is health conscious when it comes to their eating habits, but there must be enough people demanding this level of healthiness in college food or there wouldn't be such a large number of institutions providing it.

 

One poster concluded that this is how they keep their tuition lower. Perhaps, but they should be up front with this info. when asked. Or why not put it on their website for all to read. When you think about it, would it cost that much more per student to use better milk and cooking oils. I really doubt it. However, at the end of the day I really wonder what else they are hiding.

 

Catherine, Stripe and Lenore, thanks for your wise words. On this board, especially, you wouldn't think these ladies employ argumentum ad hominem.

 

I suspect that some of the more nasty posts come from individuals with ties to Hillsdale because I can't imagine anyone getting in such a fluff over this topic. At this point, this thread has received more than 4,000 views so in retrospect the percentage of those posting vicious comments is pretty small.

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The comment about not having deposits with more than one college was not really accurate. There are in fact some colleges that offer more acceptances than spaces. They will state in their acceptance letter that to guarantee a place at May 1 you need to make a deposit and if you change your mind prior to that date your deposit is refundable. So different schools, different MO's.

 

 

 

I'm still not really following you. More acceptances than spaces sounds like housing deposits, and yes, as I stated, those are a different issue than what most people think about with "deposits." Those also tend to be refundable.

 

Otherwise, a college that accepts a student is bound to allow them in. There have been a couple of "Wow" issues where a couple of schools have made some students defer their start until Jan due to over-enrollment, but those are very rare and not the norm. Not all schools have housing for every student - hence - housing deposits are required at some to ensure a place. This is not the majority of places, but is somewhat common.

 

That said, the "I'm going there" deposit that all schools have (all I know of anyway) and is due by May 1st goes to ONE school. Many colleges will send a notice trying to make one think they have to send in their deposit ASAP, but that's just slick advertising trying to get parents to commit so they will know their numbers sooner rather than later. In reality, by law, everyone has until May 1st to commit and insisting on otherwise (by the college) is illegal. Double (or triple) depositing is unethical and there are several colleges who will rescind admission if they catch wind of it.

 

I highly encourage anyone who wants to know what's going on with college applications, finances, deposits, and anything else, to start reading at College Confidential. You have to overlook the fact that many parents/students on there have super high stats and could make one question themselves, but other than that, there's a boatload of accurate information on the nuts and bolts of heading to college. If you look at the list of where kids actually go (or are accepted), it's not all Ivy level or equivalent, so there are plenty of us "average" people there too.

 

Their homeschooling info pales compared to here - as does their info about Christian colleges, but for the nuts and bolts of everything else (including things like pre-med, art, music, or other directions), it's a great resource.

 

But the bottom line here - don't double deposit. Double housing deposits are ok. Just make sure that's what you're making the deposit for. And if a college accepts you, you can attend there even if you wait until May 1st to decide that's where you want to go.

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I figured 'tis best if I look it up for Hillsdale...

 

AND, it appears to be an admissions deposit... not just a housing deposit (since it says it's due whether or not one will be residing in campus housing).

 

However, it also looks like if you are later with it, you might not get housing. This is possibly not true, one would have to do more researching than I have time for. Most colleges will figure out housing if they have more commit than they expect.

 

The bottom line - if it's an admissions deposit, only one should have been made ethically. If you send it in, they are expecting you to come.

 

http://www.hillsdale.edu/admissions/admittedstudents/housing.asp

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Tell us where your child is going. I still think it is strange that you have one or two posts a year and then only post negative things about this college. I guess it is your right, but I would feel better about your post if you were like Creekland and posted other times about other things.

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In regards to the question on the whistle blower policy, I see that someone provided the answer, but here is a little background:

 

http://www.nonprofitrisk.org/library/articles/employment091005.shtml

 

As you can see it is just good business practice to have such a policy in place. I'm in agreement with the comment that stated that there is no good reason not to have one, and some potentially bad reasons to avoid having one.

 

 

Thank you, Lyn. And I agree with you.

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That said, the "I'm going there" deposit that all schools have (all I know of anyway) and is due by May 1st goes to ONE school. In reality, by law, everyone has until May 1st to commit and insisting on otherwise (by the college) is illegal. Double (or triple) depositing is unethical and there are several colleges who will rescind admission if they catch wind of it.

 

 

Just an FYI - it may be unethical, but in my neck of the woods (northeast Mass), lots of parents send "yes, I'm going there deposits" to more than one school and are more than willing to forfeit their deposit just to gain more time in the decision-making process. My neighbor was shocked to learn from other parents that it is rather common practice among parents in our town and these parents, in turn, were surprised that he had not done this.

 

Yolanda

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There's definitely people with different ethical standards out there - no doubt about that.

 

Still, it helps if people know about it so they can make their own informed choice. Otherwise, many may not realize it's wrong. If they did it not realizing it was wrong and happened to be one colleges catch --> rescinded acceptance, then I'd feel badly. If they do it knowing it's wrong and get caught, I don't feel the least bit sorry for them.

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As a mother with two children that deal with food issues, I would NOT expect a college to cater to my children. They will be adults. They will be responsible.

 

Well, since a majority of colleges seem to require that freshman live in the dorms and take the largest meal plan for the first semester, having to pay for food that my child could not eat would be unacceptable for me. I would hate to spend $3000 or more for food my child could not eat and have to spend more $$$ on food and transportation to appropriate grocery stores. Those dorm fridges are not that big and that would necessitate at least weekly inconvenient trips.

 

So, I would absolutely expect a college food service (not a small high school cafeteria) to have food choices that would work for my child. That alone would be reason to not send my child there. We did eliminate one school on the basis of food alone. My super skinny son is allergic to milk and suffers from hypoglycemia. Eating whole grains, protein and high quality vegetables are a priority for keeping him healthy. This school didn't have a single whole grain in the entire cafeteria, had iceberg lettuce in the salad bar plus lots of canned toppings and few fresh nutritious offerings. The entrees were very white carb heavy and not appetizing. The closest grocery store (with limited healthy options) was a bus ride away and the bus system into town wasn't very convenient.

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I concur, most university/college towns have problems between the townies and the school kids. The first time I heard it was at Smith.

 

I agree. I experienced the same dynamic when I was in grad school at UVA: people who lived or went to school on grounds tended to look down on "townies" and vice versa. My dh noticed the same thing in law school 9 years earlier.

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...DEPOSITS at more than one school is not ok ...DON'T do this! It's unethical. ...

 

...Double (or triple) depositing is unethical ...

 

if it's an admissions deposit, only one should have been made ethically.

 

What do you believe is unethical and wrong about making admissions deposits at more than one school? I've carefully read all you've said (and all Lyn wrote) about this so far, and I cannot figure it out. If a college uses deposits as a way of figuring out numbers in the next class/ranking a waitlist/etc, then I understand why a college might rescind an acceptance if it finds out about deposits made elsewhere - the college needs to get its planning done (but, isn't that why colleges require deposits - to get the student to invest so that he/she will hopefully follow through with attending and paying the rest of the tuition?). But I don't understand why it's wrong or unethical on the part of the student/parent to make deposits at more than one school. If students and/or parents will be paying tuition, shouldn't they be able to keep their options open?

 

I feel silly asking, but I just don't get what is so unethical and wrong about it.

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Not answering for Creekland' date=' but this is from the College Board:

 

http://professionals.collegeboard.com/portal/site/Professionals/menuitem.b6b1a9bc0c5615493883234011a161ca/?vgnextoid=da4ccf9a10494110vcm-02000000aaa514acRCRD&vgnextchannel=ae62247eb2814110VgnVCM200000121a16acRCRD&vgnextfmt=print[/quote']

 

Wow, I had no clue! Thanks for that link. (not sure I agree about the unethical-ness of it all, though)

 

Sorry about my rabbit trails; I don't mean to detract from Lyn's intent of a college review.

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Wow, I had no clue! Thanks for that link. (not sure I agree about the unethical-ness of it all, though)

 

Sorry about my rabbit trails; I don't mean to detract from Lyn's intent of a college review.

 

I have no experience but I find it unethical as it's like saving seats at an event. People are not showing up (not making decisions) and it's not allowing those that show up early/on time to have a better choice.

 

If student Joe puts a deposit in on school A, B, and C knowing he will attend only one, then Jane might not get accepted at school A (her first choice) and end up at her alternate choice school. Then if Joe decides to attend school B at the last minute, Jane has lost her opportunity to be accepted at and attend school A.

 

School C might have been dangling scholarship money at Joe thinking he will attend because he made his deposit. Frank may miss out on scholarship money from school C because Joe hasn't made his decision yet. So Frank can't wait until the last minute and can't afford school C without some aid. So he end up at the CC instead of school C, because Joe couldn't decide.

 

Then Frank drops out of the CC because he isn't challenged, goes to work at Walmart, decides that life is horrible and can't support himself, so he turns to a life of crime. After four years he holds up the convenience store where Joe is working because he has commitment issues and can't find a job after getting his degree from school B. He's confused because he can't put a deposit on a job and decide later. Frank robs him and get 25.49 in cash and 3-5 years in jail.

 

Moral of the story, decide, pay one deposit, your future may depend upon it. :tongue_smilie: (okay the last part is embellished, but hey I'm bored)

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Then Frank drops out of the CC because he isn't challenged, goes to work at Walmart, decides that life is horrible and can't support himself, so he turns to a life of crime. After four years he holds up the convenience store where Joe is working because he has commitment issues and can't find a job after getting his degree from school B. He's confused because he can't put a deposit on a job and decide later. Frank robs him and get 25.49 in cash and 3-5 years in jail.

 

Moral of the story, decide, pay one deposit, your future may depend upon it. :tongue_smilie: (okay the last part is embellished, but hey I'm bored)

 

 

:lol:

 

I, too, was trying to simplify the scenario in my head to a few kids and a few schools to see how the ripple effect plays out. Nice way to show how one kid's indecision (or sense of entitlement) affects many others. I pity the schools that are waiting (and dealing with no-shows) and the kids on the waiting lists. I *think* one school (George Fox) did say "get those housing deposits in, even if you're not sure" ... but for the life of me I can't imagine why. Wouldn't it be disruptive to their housing planning to have kids pull out in late May or June?

 

I can think of only one scenario where a kid might put a deposit down (housing *and* "I'm coming") at his second-choice school -- if he's applying overseas and won't hear for sure until July from the overseas school. In this case the kid would put a deposit down at *one* school, with the full intention of enrolling there if the overseas opportunity doesn't pan out. We might be in this situation in a few years, and I'd feel uneasy doing it, but the alternative would be to potentially have nowhere to go ... I wonder if you could be up-front about it ...

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Not answering for Creekland' date=' but this is from the College Board:

 

http://professionals.collegeboard.com/portal/site/Professionals/menuitem.b6b1a9bc0c5615493883234011a161ca/?vgnextoid=da4ccf9a10494110vcm-02000000aaa514acRCRD&vgnextchannel=ae62247eb2814110VgnVCM200000121a16acRCRD&vgnextfmt=print[/quote']

 

I would consider that I have a strong sense of personal honor. I would feel bound by formal agreements with colleges. I would feel that I needed to abide by the terms of application categories. For example, Early Decision at Hillsdale is: "For students who consider Hillsdale their first choice, the Early Decision deadline offers the convenience of resolving the college application process long before regular spring admission dates. If admitted, the applicant agrees in writing to withdraw application from other institutions and deposit early as a member of Hillsdale’s incoming class." http://www.hillsdale.edu/images/userImages/bkorom/Page_4251/AdmApplication_12-11.pdf

 

However, with Early Action: "applicants receive the advantage of early notification with a May deposit date. This plan serves as the priority deadline for academic scholarship consideration."

 

I would see an honor bound decision with Early Decision that I don't think exists with Early Action.

 

I'm not sure what College Board is referring to with formal and informal agreements. I have a hard time being bound by informal agreements with an industry that sets price based on searching through my bank accounts. Or that will admit students, but tell them they can't register for a semester or a year. Or that doesn't offer enough class sections to graduate on time in four years.

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Just a thought...

I often hear homeschooling parents say they want their students treated like other applicants. We want to be held to the same, not different standards. We want our transcripts respected. We don't want extra requirements, like taking the GRE, heaped on to our kids. So, I say as parent guidance counselors we should be expected to follow the same level of ethical conduct as other guidance counselors (or perhaps even higher because we have just our kids and we are modeling for them). While some parents may not realize double depositing is unethical, it is behavior that is widely considered in the field of college admissions to be unacceptable.

 

One thing that restricts many traditional school attending students from double depositing is that guidance counselors may find out and report them. The double deposit may be discovered when the counselor is asked to send a final transcript to more than one school. Absolutely there are colleges who will rescind offers if double deposits are discovered. Perhaps homeschoolers are less likely to be caught because there isn't an guidance counselor watching out, but that still doesn't make double deposits ethical.

 

And, really, at a certain point I see it as positive thing to teach kids that it is time to make a decision and just be done. The college admissions process is already WAY TOO LONG without dragging it past May 1.

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