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I'll have a 10th grader next year, and he needs something for literature. He is below grade level when it comes to comprehension, due to CAPD. I'm working intensely with him on that (Wordly Wise for vocabulary, Reading Detective for all-over comprehension, and Building Thinking Skills because his critical thinking stinks). This year he is doing Movies as Literature as an intro to literary elements, and that has been going OK. It's a good bridge for him to work on the literary elements without the reading comprehension getting in the way.

 

So now I'm looking for next year.

 

I'm not even familiar with all the lit programs out there. So far I've been looking at Lightning Lit, Smarr, and Literary Lessons from LOTR. In a way I think LOTR would be good because he's familiar with it, but in a way that would be bad because he'd constantly trying to think of it in terms of what the movies did.:lol:

 

Suggestions? Would the 8th grade Lightning Lit be TOO light, even considering his language issues? I looked at the American Lit program, and I can't see him understanding a single word in those books LOL.

 

Can anyone compare Lightning Lit and Smarr? I have no clue what either one is like.

 

Anyone have a favorite or an absolute NOT favorite? Why?

 

Anyone have any other suggestions?

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Not familiar with CAPD, so I did a quick search and read a page or two on it. Between that and your post it sounds like you'd want something that would help continue with comprehension AND would move into gentle, beginning literary analysis -- do I have that right?

 

From my limited experience with SMARR, it is about comprehension questions, but has virtually no literary analysis guidance or development. LL7 and 8 have a few comprehension questions, and then gently develop one literary element per book. Some people find LL7 and 8 to be "lite" on the literary analysis, but my opinion is that it is only true if you already are familiar with literary analysis.

 

To continue a gentle exposure to literary elements to build on Movies as Literature, you might go through Figuratively Speaking together, and do one or two literary elements a week, while doing whatever Literature program you select. Then you can also practice looking for those elements while you read works from the Literature program.

 

JMO, but I do think LL8 would work well as a beginning literature program. 2 of the 3 short stories will be a little rough going, but I think the rest of the program would be fine. You may want to first watch a faithful version of a Christmas Carol, and of Treasure Island first before reading to help with the Victorian language hurdle. And if you feel that the LL8 program is "lite" for DS, you can add in additional lit guides. (The Discovering Literature series from Garlic Press Publishers have a good guide for To Kill a Mockingbird.)

 

I also think LLftLotR is another wonderful, gentle intro into literary analysis -- BUT, if DS is very literal, I can see how the movies would be a stumbling block to being able to read and enjoy the books. There are powerful, poignant themes in the books that were just stripped away by the movies for the sake of visual spectacle... but I digress towards a personal rant. ;)

 

Sounds like your Movies as Literature decision has been a good one! You may want to continue that trend and try *watching* a film version of *whatever* literature you do first; that will at least clear up some plot and character confusions, so that frees you up to focus on reading the language, comprehension, and then actual literary analysis. Sparknotes and Cliff's Notes are well worth looking at for the summaries of each chapter, and they are free online resources. Plus, each then goes into some analysis of theme, symbols, and characterization. Be aware that they assume you've already read the WHOLE book, as they give away spoilers in the analysis. Also, Sparknotes takes every opportunity to insert any possible Freudian, sexual, and feminist interpretation the literature *might* support, which gets a little tiresome. sigh...

 

Glencoe Literature Library is a third helpful "supplement" to add more meat to any literature program you might go with. And one more recommendation: check out the Parallel Text Shakespeare materials when you go to do a Shakespeare play; these are great because they have side-by-side original text and modern translation, and the student workbook and teacher guides are very good at gently guiding you into both comprehension and deeper understanding of themes. (Side note: the BEST way to tackle Shakespeare, esp. with DS's CAPD, would be to read a summary of the play to nail down the main characters and plot twists, and then to watch a live or filmed production of a play. And then go back and read a few key speeches together. JMO!)

 

Below are more details on what LL8 is like. I have only used one individual guide from SMARR (not a full-year program), for Epic of Gilgamesh, and I was greatly disappointed by the slimness, the focus on vocabulary lists and comprehension questions, and the very limited quantity of background info, analysis, guided discussion questions, and writing assignment ideas. HOWEVER, I understand from Katia on this board that the complete SMARR programs must be different from the individual guides, and have more meat to them. And if you are wanting more comprehension work, SMARR could be a good match.

 

LL8 has a student book (where the "meat" of the program is), and a teacher book with answers, a schedule, some teaching tips, and some discussion questions. The Student Book has 2 parts:

 

1. Student Guide (LL7 = 8 units; LL8 = 12 units) each unit contains:

- a page intro about each author, and tips on what to look for as you read.

- vocabulary list with definitions to make reading the book easier.

- comprehension questions to help student focus on key details.

- 6-10 teaching text pages (written to the student) about a literary element and examples of how that literary element is used in the work being read to go with that unit.

- a 2-3 page "mini-writing lesson" with information/tips on various aspects of writing (examples: how to cite sources; how to take notes; etc.)

- choice from 4-8 longer writing assignment ideas for finishing up each unit

 

2. Workpages Section contains:

- 8-10 worksheets per unit to help student practice the literary element, occasional grammar aspect (punctuation, capitalization, etc.), or beginning analysis of an excerpt from literature.

- Sometimes a short story or a segment of a longer work is reproduced for the student to read/analyze.

 

 

1. "A Crazy Tale" (short story)

literary lesson: author's purpose

mini writing lesson: taking notes

 

2. Treasure Island (adventure novel)

literary lesson: setting

mini writing lesson: rewriting in your own words

 

3. poetry unit -- 6 poems

literary lesson: vivid imagery

mini writing lesson: free verse and the ballads

 

4. A Day of Pleasure (autobiography)

literary lesson: sharing your culture

mini writing lesson: rewriting in your own words

 

5. "Wakefield" (short story)

literary lesson: details in writing

mini writing lesson: citing sources in a paper

 

6. A Christmas Carol (novella)

literary lesson: character development

mini writing lesson: the narrator

 

7. poetry unit -- 8 poems

literary lesson: figurative language

mini writing lesson: fun poems

 

8. The Hobbit (fantasy)

literary lesson:conflict

mini writing lesson: genre fiction

 

9. "Reflections" (short story)

literary lesson: symbolism

mini writing lesson: sentence structure

 

10. My Family and Other Animals (humorous novel)

literary lesson: humor

mini writing lesson: bibliography

 

11. poetry unit -- 8 poems

literary lesson: meter in poetry

mini writing lesson: the sonnet

 

12. To Kill a Mockingbird (realistic novel)

literary lesson: writing a literary analysis

mini writing lesson: writing a conclusion

 

 

Here are past threads which may be of help! BEST of luck in finding the best fit for DS! Warmest regards, Lori D.

 

 

Smarr vs Lightning Literature (high school level)

If you use (or have used) SMARR for Literature

Progeny Press vs SMARR

Favorite Literature Guides (SMARR, LL, EiL...)

Excellence in Literature [EiL] or SMARR

I am considering SMARR lit guides

9th grade American Lit: SMARR or Lightning Lit?

Has anyone here used SMARR lit guides? Opinions?

What do you think of Lightning Lit?

Lightning Lit questions

Can you tell me about Lightning Lit?

Have you used Lightning Lit 7 or 8?

Edited by Lori D.
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Lori gave you tons of great info and advice, but I want to chime in and agree that Lightning Lit 8 could be a great choice. As I was reading your post, I was thinking it could be just what you need, and when you asked about it, I just wanted to shout -yes! :lol:

 

I think it is a great lit program that doesn't go too deep, but does teach some beginning analysis. With your sons disability, it really seems like a wonderful step.

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Wow, thanks, Lori!

 

With Lightning Lit 8, is it "best" to have the student able to discuss things in a group? I was looking more at LOTR today, and that was one thing it said. Well...that won't be happening here LOL.

 

Also, what all is expected from me as a teacher in teaching LL8? I will be teaching 5 other kids next year, so I won't have time to sit down with him for 30 minutes a day to discuss things.

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Well, both LLftLotR AND LL8 are written to the student, and designed to be done independently. But, as with any subject, the more you can do alongside with the student and *discuss* and *analyze* together, the more I think the student tends to get out of it. Also, ANY student, whether they have LDs or other issues or NOT really needs some parental guidance as they make that transition into learning how to read, think about, discuss, analyze -- just SEE -- what is going on in Classic Literature.

 

As far as LLftLotR needing a group for discussion... well, we did just fine with 3 of us (1 parent and 2 young teen boys). And I know of 2 friends who had their students do the entire program completely solo with no parent involvement and no one discussing, and the students did fine and loved it (both are BIG readers and LOVE Lord of the Rings, however).

 

However, if you will be working with other students, and you need DS to work completely independently, then I'd say try LL8 first, with LLftLotR as a close second. However -- I'd *highly* recommend YOU read as much of the books as you can on your own at night, or in advance this summer, so that you CAN sit down at least once a week to discuss.

 

 

Just to give you a feel for time:

 

For LL8, took approximately 3 to 3.5 hours a week:

- 30 minutes/day (4-5 days/week) read aloud together and discussed as we read

- 15-20 minutes/day to either read the teaching lesson pages at a rate of 2 pages/day, OR to do the workpages (usually took about 4 days to read through the literature lesson, and then another 6-8 days to complete those, doing 1 workpage, sometimes just 1/2 a workpage, a day)

- 30/minutes/day on a separate week at the end of the unit to choose/do a longer writing assignment

 

LLftLotR took a total of about 5 hours per week:

- about 1-2 hours a week to read the 2 chapters per week (less if you are not reading aloud or listening to book on tape)

- another 2 hours per week to read through the chapter notes and discuss the questions for those 2 chapters

- and then about 1 hour per week to work on the additional unit material, and/or work on an optional writing assignment

 

Just my 2 cents worth! And BEST of luck, whatever you go with! :) Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited by Lori D.
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My part of LL7 & LL8 (I've used 7 twice, will use 8 for the second time next year), is put it on my kids schedule. I give them a daily schedule, but I print it once/week on Monday. Then I meet with them once per week (15-30 min). I check the comprehension questions that they've answered that week, or the workbook pages, or the writing assignment. I read all the books when ds did the courses, so I can discuss them and give suggestions on writing assignments, but I don't think it is necessary.

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Thanks, this helps a lot! I think I'll go with LL8 for my 10th grader and then LL7 for my 8th grader (who isn't a super strong reader due to undiagnosed tracking issues). Good to know that neither program requires a ton of time out of me (though yes, I would expect it to require some!). Plus I'll get to read some fun books that I never have (or that I haven't read in a long time).:D

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Good to know that neither program requires a ton of time out of me (though yes, I would expect it to require some!). Plus I'll get to read some fun books that I never have (or that I haven't read in a long time).:D

 

 

Yes, I really enjoyed the books, too! And Kirstin -- my younger DS has LDs and it REALLY helped him for me to at LEAST start the first few chapters reading aloud with him "popcorn style" ("you read a page, I read a page") for those classics that were "tougher" language-wise for him. Once we got into the books, he would finally get the rhythm and style of the writing, but it usually took about 5-6 chapters.

 

in LL7 that was:

- Story of My Life (flowery, long sentences; unusual sentence structure; older vocabulary)

- Adventures of Tom Sawyer (old slang terms and jargon; accents -- writing words the way they are pronounced with a strong Southern drawl or other accent)

- All Creatures Great and Small (British vocabulary; vet medical terminology; accents)

 

in LL8 that was:

- A Crazy Tale (Chesterton's convoluted point of view and sentence structure)

- Treasure Island (Stevenson's Victorian language)

- A Christmas Carol (Dickens' Victorian language)

 

Hope that helps, giving you a "heads-up" on a few works that you may need to schedule a litle more time to be with DC to help DC get their "reading feet" under them. <---- :tongue_smilie:-- mixed imagery!

 

Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited by Lori D.
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Not familiar with CAPD, so I did a quick search and read a page or two on it. Between that and your post it sounds like you'd want something that would help continue with comprehension AND would move into gentle, beginning literary analysis -- do I have that right?

 

From my limited experience with SMARR, it is about comprehension questions, but has virtually no literary analysis guidance or development. LL7 and 8 have a few comprehension questions, and then gently develop one literary element per book. Some people find LL7 and 8 to be "lite" on the literary analysis, but my opinion is that it is only true if you already are familiar with literary analysis.

 

To continue a gentle exposure to literary elements to build on Movies as Literature, you might go through Figuratively Speaking together, and do one or two literary elements a week, while doing whatever Literature program you select. Then you can also practice looking for those elements while you read works from the Literature program.

 

JMO, but I do think LL8 would work well as a beginning literature program. 2 of the 3 short stories will be a little rough going, but I think the rest of the program would be fine. You may want to first watch a faithful version of a Christmas Carol, and of Treasure Island first before reading to help with the Victorian language hurdle. And if you feel that the LL8 program is "lite" for DS, you can add in additional lit guides. (The Discovering Literature series from Garlic Press Publishers have a good guide for To Kill a Mockingbird.)

 

I also think LLftLotR is another wonderful, gentle intro into literary analysis -- BUT, if DS is very literal, I can see how the movies would be a stumbling block to being able to read and enjoy the books. There are powerful, poignant themes in the books that were just stripped away by the movies for the sake of visual spectacle... but I digress towards a personal rant. ;)

 

Sounds like your Movies as Literature decision has been a good one! You may want to continue that trend and try *watching* a film version of *whatever* literature you do first; that will at least clear up some plot and character confusions, so that frees you up to focus on reading the language, comprehension, and then actual literary analysis. Sparknotes and Cliff's Notes are well worth looking at for the summaries of each chapter, and they are free online resources. Plus, each then goes into some analysis of theme, symbols, and characterization. Be aware that they assume you've already read the WHOLE book, as they give away spoilers in the analysis. Also, Sparknotes takes every opportunity to insert any possible Freudian, sexual, and feminist interpretation the literature *might* support, which gets a little tiresome. sigh...

 

Glencoe Literature Library is a third helpful "supplement" to add more meat to any literature program you might go with. And one more recommendation: check out the Parallel Text Shakespeare materials when you go to do a Shakespeare play; these are great because they have side-by-side original text and modern translation, and the student workbook and teacher guides are very good at gently guiding you into both comprehension and deeper understanding of themes. (Side note: the BEST way to tackle Shakespeare, esp. with DS's CAPD, would be to read a summary of the play to nail down the main characters and plot twists, and then to watch a live or filmed production of a play. And then go back and read a few key speeches together. JMO!)

 

Below are more details on what LL8 is like. I have only used one individual guide from SMARR (not a full-year program), for Epic of Gilgamesh, and I was greatly disappointed by the slimness, the focus on vocabulary lists and comprehension questions, and the very limited quantity of background info, analysis, guided discussion questions, and writing assignment ideas. HOWEVER, I understand from Katia on this board that the complete SMARR programs must be different from the individual guides, and have more meat to them. And if you are wanting more comprehension work, SMARR could be a good match.

 

LL8 has a student book (where the "meat" of the program is), and a teacher book with answers, a schedule, some teaching tips, and some discussion questions. The Student Book has 2 parts:

 

1. Student Guide (LL7 = 8 units; LL8 = 12 units) each unit contains:

- a page intro about each author, and tips on what to look for as you read.

- vocabulary list with definitions to make reading the book easier.

- comprehension questions to help student focus on key details.

- 6-10 teaching text pages (written to the student) about a literary element and examples of how that literary element is used in the work being read to go with that unit.

- a 2-3 page "mini-writing lesson" with information/tips on various aspects of writing (examples: how to cite sources; how to take notes; etc.)

- choice from 4-8 longer writing assignment ideas for finishing up each unit

 

2. Workpages Section contains:

- 8-10 worksheets per unit to help student practice the literary element, occasional grammar aspect (punctuation, capitalization, etc.), or beginning analysis of an excerpt from literature.

- Sometimes a short story or a segment of a longer work is reproduced for the student to read/analyze.

 

 

1. "A Crazy Tale" (short story)

literary lesson: author's purpose

mini writing lesson: taking notes

 

2. Treasure Island (adventure novel)

literary lesson: setting

mini writing lesson: rewriting in your own words

 

3. poetry unit -- 6 poems

literary lesson: vivid imagery

mini writing lesson: free verse and the ballads

 

4. A Day of Pleasure (autobiography)

literary lesson: sharing your culture

mini writing lesson: rewriting in your own words

 

5. "Wakefield" (short story)

literary lesson: details in writing

mini writing lesson: citing sources in a paper

 

6. A Christmas Carol (novella)

literary lesson: character development

mini writing lesson: the narrator

 

7. poetry unit -- 8 poems

literary lesson: figurative language

mini writing lesson: fun poems

 

8. The Hobbit (fantasy)

literary lesson:conflict

mini writing lesson: genre fiction

 

9. "Reflections" (short story)

literary lesson: symbolism

mini writing lesson: sentence structure

 

10. My Family and Other Animals (humorous novel)

literary lesson: humor

mini writing lesson: bibliography

 

11. poetry unit -- 8 poems

literary lesson: meter in poetry

mini writing lesson: the sonnet

 

12. To Kill a Mockingbird (realistic novel)

literary lesson: writing a literary analysis

mini writing lesson: writing a conclusion

 

 

Here are past threads which may be of help! BEST of luck in finding the best fit for DS! Warmest regards, Lori D.

 

 

Smarr vs Lightning Literature (high school level)

If you use (or have used) SMARR for Literature

Progeny Press vs SMARR

Favorite Literature Guides (SMARR, LL, EiL...)

Excellence in Literature [EiL] or SMARR

I am considering SMARR lit guides

9th grade American Lit: SMARR or Lightning Lit?

Has anyone here used SMARR lit guides? Opinions?

What do you think of Lightning Lit?

Lightning Lit questions

Can you tell me about Lightning Lit?

Have you used Lightning Lit 7 or 8?

 

Lots of great information!

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I have no idea if this will benefit you, but I thought I would let you know.

 

My dd13 7th grade is dyslexic. She comprehends very well when she hears a story read to her, but is a slow reader on her own. We are using LL7 with her this year and she is loving it.

 

The thing that has helped her is that we are members of "Learning Ally" (this used to be called the Recordings for the Blind and Dyslexic). All of the books on the LL7 list are on recordings from Learning Ally and I assume the same for LL8 (I need to check that). We download the recordings onto her I-touch and she physically reads the book while listening to the recording.

 

To become a member, a person must have certification from:

A qualified professional in the field of disability services, special education, medicine or psychology must attest to the physical basis of the visual, perceptual or other physical disability that limits the applicant's use of standard print.

 

I do not know how certification would work for CAPD, but possibly you could get certification/diagnosis through your doctor? The membership to Learning Ally is then $99/year. For us, it has been more than worth it. It allows dd to see and hear the words and keep up a good pace in her reading.

 

Do you think the recordings could help your ds?

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I have no idea if this will benefit you, but I thought I would let you know.

 

My dd13 7th grade is dyslexic. She comprehends very well when she hears a story read to her, but is a slow reader on her own. We are using LL7 with her this year and she is loving it.

 

The thing that has helped her is that we are members of "Learning Ally" (this used to be called the Recordings for the Blind and Dyslexic). All of the books on the LL7 list are on recordings from Learning Ally and I assume the same for LL8 (I need to check that). We download the recordings onto her I-touch and she physically reads the book while listening to the recording.

 

To become a member, a person must have certification from:

A qualified professional in the field of disability services, special education, medicine or psychology must attest to the physical basis of the visual, perceptual or other physical disability that limits the applicant's use of standard print.

 

I do not know how certification would work for CAPD, but possibly you could get certification/diagnosis through your doctor? The membership to Learning Ally is then $99/year. For us, it has been more than worth it. It allows dd to see and hear the words and keep up a good pace in her reading.

 

Do you think the recordings could help your ds?

Thanks - I'm semi familiar with Learning Ally because my 11yo is dyslexic. (But her trouble isn't so much reading but spelling - yikes LOL!)

 

My ds wouldn't qualify because he doesn't have anything limiting his use of standard print. His problem is auditory. It just happens to manifest itself as language trouble all over, both in reading AND in hearing. (Spoken conversations can be extremely frustrating with him at times!!!)

 

Now, that said, he *claims* that when he is listening to something read and reads it at the same time, he understands better. Inflection and such helps a lot. Of course I know that it's a crap shoot when it comes to HOW things are read when getting them from Learning Ally, so I've never pursued it (especially now that there is a fee - back when we were looking into it, it was free). For a time I would record myself reading everything he needed to read. But that got to be too cumbersome, so I stopped.

 

So...in answer to your question, yes and no LOL. But I don't think he would qualify for their services anyway. My dd would due to her diagnosis, but I can't get the lady to sign the form so I gave up.:tongue_smilie:

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