imhim Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 It is like pulling teeth. One day is ok, the next day she has no clue which is the subject, predicate, etc... We are finishing up Growing with Grammar 3. Someone suggested Winston Grammar. I also have parts of Michael Clay's program and I was going to buy the whole thing and do it at the end of GWG. But Winstons seems much easier (less time) to implement? Are there any resources online to help with this? Thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunnyDays Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Just so you know, MCT doesn't teach traditional diagramming at the 3rd-gradish level. (Perhaps it does in the higher levels? I don't know.) It uses something called 4-level analysis, which may actually be helpful to her, it approaches breaking it down in a different way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joyfulhomeschooler Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 It is like pulling teeth. One day is ok, the next day she has no clue which is the subject, predicate, etc... We are finishing up Growing with Grammar 3. Someone suggested Winston Grammar. I also have parts of Michael Clay's program and I was going to buy the whole thing and do it at the end of GWG. But Winstons seems much easier (less time) to implement? Are there any resources online to help with this? Thank you I thought winston grammar was for older grades? I love the look of the program, but was under the impression it was for older students. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imhim Posted March 8, 2012 Author Share Posted March 8, 2012 I do not know if Winston is for older grades, it does not have a grade level on the cover. I just don't know what to do with her to get her parts of speech right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imhim Posted March 9, 2012 Author Share Posted March 9, 2012 Help!! Anybody? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetted4 Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 For a grammar program I really like Analytical Grammar (and Jr. Analytical Grammar). At third grade, though, I know Robin Finley (creator of AG) is of the opinion that at the early grades learning spelling is enough to try to absorb and that it is better to wait on the more formal, extensive grammar study until upper elementary. Her logic makes sense to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amyrjoy Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 We're at a third grade level with Grammar and haven't quite "officially" diagrammed. My first thought- I just know my own DD isn't "quite" there yet, soon, but not yet. I think just taking your time and not getting too concerned is probably the best thing to do, but that's me, and I am really at the same point as you! LOL! If I find any other opinions when I do my own internet research, I'll come back here and share! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverMoon Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 My third grader is diagramming with First Language Lessons 3. It introduces the whole process in baby steps, and then he practices it with that new baby step for awhile before the next baby step is added. I've been having him draw his own diagrams to make it seem a smidgeon harder; he picks it up very quickly and has a "get on with the story!" attitude about it at times. :tongue_smilie: But really, at third grade, don't worry if she doesn't have it down pat. Next year, when it comes around again, she'll know it so much better than this year. Then the year after that she'll barely blink an eye. Right now it's more about exposure to the parts and pieces than making sure they have them down cold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lotsofpumpkins Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 My 3rd grader has trouble remembering things in grammar too. We are using R&S, and I just help him when he needs it. He does great once we review though. I don't worry about total mastery; everything will come up again next year. :) R&S is a great program. It starts off gently in 2nd grade and builds from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxbridgeacademy Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 For a grammar program I really like Analytical Grammar (and Jr. Analytical Grammar). At third grade, though, I know Robin Finley (creator of AG) is of the opinion that at the early grades learning spelling is enough to try to absorb and that it is better to wait on the more formal, extensive grammar study until upper elementary. Her logic makes sense to me. :iagree: MCT is a fun, gentle, but subtly rigorous grammar program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momoftwoinga Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 :lurk5: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommee & Baba Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 My third grader is diagramming with First Language Lessons 3. It introduces the whole process in baby steps, and then he practices it with that new baby step for awhile before the next baby step is added. I've been having him draw his own diagrams to make it seem a smidgeon harder; he picks it up very quickly and has a "get on with the story!" attitude about it at times. :tongue_smilie: But really, at third grade, don't worry if she doesn't have it down pat. Next year, when it comes around again, she'll know it so much better than this year. Then the year after that she'll barely blink an eye. Right now it's more about exposure to the parts and pieces than making sure they have them down cold. We too use FLL3 and my dd grasps it rather well. She mentioned to me the past couple lessons that she really doesn't like doing it because it's not right to break apart the sentences....:lol: I personally LOVE the way FLL eases into the entire process of diagramming. I've seen a couple other programs and even I was a bit intimidated with teaching it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nansk Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 This is not a diagramming problem, imo. This is a problem with the understanding of sentence structure. Your student is not able to recognise subjects and predicates in the sentences. I have not seen FLL, and knowing SWB's other books, I am sure it breaks it down to very basic steps. Another option is the KISS Grammar question-and-answer method of identifying subjects and verbs. This is decribed in detail in the KISS Grammar intro document. You don't have to do KISS grammar; you can read up how it is done and incorporate it into your routine of analysing sentences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessReplanted Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 We used Growing with Grammar last year (for second grade) and my son seemed to retain very little, if any of it. This year we are using Rod & Staff. It's more time consuming, and requires more 'work' from him, but he is REALLY learning. We will be sticking with R&S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingmydream Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 We switched to easy grammar, because the diagramming was just way too much for my son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommy22alyns Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 R&S is working well for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imhim Posted March 9, 2012 Author Share Posted March 9, 2012 Thank you for your suggestions and input - everybody. Maybe for 4th grade I will do FLL (she has done 1 & 2) I just needed something more independent. I will check out Winston and the other. R & S I heard is time consumming? I will have to look into that, too. Yes, I will check out the KISS explanation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheApprentice Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 We use Sentence Family and Climbing to Good English, which both teach it in a very gentle manner. Sentence Family is presented in story form with art, and along with the 4 types of sentences, and the 8 parts of speech; there is diagramming toward the end. My 3rd grader seems to be retaining it well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armom Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 We use Winston grammar Basic, and it is recommended for grades 4-7. My twins are in 5th using it right now. I really like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 (edited) It is like pulling teeth. One day is ok, the next day she has no clue which is the subject, predicate, etc... We are finishing up Growing with Grammar 3. /QUOTE] My son was same way. Diagramming clicked about half way through GWG 4 and I'm so happy I could spit. You might just need more time. ;) ETA: for us, the secret has been the questions. I asked them over and over. "Who or what does something or is?" "Is there a Where, How, or When word modifying the verb?" I learned these sentences from Rex Barks. Edited March 10, 2012 by kalanamak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brenda in FL Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Thank you for your suggestions and input - everybody. Maybe for 4th grade I will do FLL (she has done 1 & 2) I just needed something more independent. I will check out Winston and the other. R & S I heard is time consumming? I will have to look into that, too. Yes, I will check out the KISS explanation. I think teaching diagramming can be difficult at the independent level. I too love FLL for their approach. We have also used Rod and Staff. Rod and Staff starts out with just diagramming the simple subject and simple predicate. FLL provides the diagram to be filled out and offers the script to help your child through it. You could use both of those techniques with your current program as you finish off the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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