I think there is something wrong with my son and/or me...

[TheAutumnOak]

I'm debating whether even to say this, because I'm getting kind of harsh here.

 

 

Just wanted you to know that I don't think you are being harsh at all ;)

[Hunter]

:grouphug:

 

But, please consider that your expectation may not be appropriate for your ds right now.

 

I imagine that a huge part of that stress is feeling that he needs to "catch up". While that's a worthy ambition, it shouldn't be the complete focus of your home school. Homeschool moms take on alot of responsibility and that responsibility is to and for the ones we love most in the world. It's no wonder it's a stressful job.

 

Right now, he is who he is, and you need to accept him for that and not who you want and need him to be. Teach him where he's at not where you want him to be. His being "behind" isn't a reflection on you as a teacher, nor is it a relection on him as a person.

 

Even if he performs two years behind a "typical" or "average" 5th grader, that means he'll likely eventually complete four years of the Logic stage and two years of Rhetoric. It sounds like he might not proceed on a typical schedule or a typical fashion. That's okay.

 

Relax, prioritize, work hard, have fun, and love him for who he is right now.

 

:iagree:

 

Top down planning often does more harm than good. The default goal that is pushed on all of us as "success" certainly needs to be questioned harshly, before top down planning from THAT, for EVERY child.

 

Nowadays ANYTHING that prevents a child from being plugged into the default top down planning is considered a disability that needs to be treated. And access to testing for these "disabilities" is not as available to all children, as it is to those with parents who successfully managed the default goals themselves. Maybe that is a good thing :-0

 

And some children CAN reach the default goal, but do it in skips and jumps and not in the orderly pace that the books are written in. Sometimes the orderly pace that is written to facilitate the top down planning doesn't match up to the realities of child development of even precocious children, never mind the average or atypical child.

 

From past posts, I know you have some challenges that other parents here have not faced. Do not compare the progress your family is making, with their progress. And some people here...are not entirely accurate about the exact details of what is going on...so don't compare yourself to what you THINK others are doing.

 

I was never able to get my atypical son properly tested. The more testing I fought to get him, the more harm it did and the more the school system hid from and lied to me, after they saw the results. I had no health insurance and no money to hire a lawyer. the more I fought the worse things got. At times I felt like such a failure.

 

The times I just dealt with today, and let tomorrow worry about itself, were when we made the most progress.

 

I understand your pain. BTDT, and I think in a far worse situation. It's not all that bad :-) Seriously! It only looks so bad in the context you are looking at it.

 

Over 90% of what we worry about never happens. Set some REALISTIC goals based on where you are at NOW. Reach back to some of your Waldorf training and bring some rhythm and peace and healing and joy into your days. The ultimate success is mentally healthy children, not ones well on the way to typical white American upper middle class financial security myth.

Edited February 26, 2012 by Hunter

[TheAutumnOak]

Skipping a lot of pages here, what type of learner is your son? This is very important, a lot of kids struggle because they are being given the wrong materials to learn with. A see a lot of reccs here that while great for auditory learners they are disastrous for visual learners.

 

What about any other issues? Memory problems? Did he have a lot of ear infections as a toddler? Does he have white spots on his nails? Remember his dreams every morning? Issues with Anxiety? These may seem like odd questions but for us the problem turned out to be an extreme visual learner with Pyroluria and CAPD. Once I understood what was going on I could adapt and dd is now soaring and doing wonderfully but a year ago? *shudder*, life was difficult and she couldn't even remember a single sentence read to her.

 

These questions are very interesting...My son seems to be a visual learner...He remembers many of his dreams in detail, not sure about the anxiety (doesn't seem like a problem but I am not very familar with anxiety), has problems with memory sometimes (unless it is something he saw - he can remember scenes and details in scenes that I would never remember and usually don't notice), and he does have white spots on his nails...He did not have ear infections as a child, none of my boys did though...

[TheAutumnOak]

:iagree:

 

Top down planning often does more harm than good. The default goal that is pushed on all of us as "success" certainly needs to be questioned harshly, before top down planning from THAT, for EVERY child.

 

Nowadays ANYTHING that prevents a child from being plugged into the default top down planning is considered a disability that needs to be treated. And access to testing for these "disabilities" is not as available to all children, as it is to those with parents who successfully managed the default goals themselves. Maybe that is a good thing :-0

 

And some children CAN reach the default goal, but do it in skips and jumps and not in the orderly pace that the books are written in. Sometimes the orderly pace that is written to facilitate the top down planning doesn't match up to the realities of child development of even precocious children, never mind the average or atypical child.

 

From past posts, I know you have some challenges that other parents here have not faced. Do not compare the progress your family is making, with their progress. And some people here...are not entirely accurate about the exact details of what is going on...so don't compare yourself to what you THINK others are doing.

 

I was never able to get my atypical son properly tested. The more testing I fought to get him, the more harm it did and the more the school system hid from and lied to me, after they saw the results. I had no health insurance and no money to hire a lawyer. the more I fought the worse things got. At times I felt like such a failure.

 

The times I just dealt with today, and let tomorrow worry about itself, were when we made the most progress.

 

I understand your pain. BTDT, and I think in a far worse situation. It's not all that bad :-) Seriously! It only looks so bad in the context you are looking at it.

 

Over 90% of what we worry about never happens. Set some REALISTIC goals based on where you are at NOW. Reach back to some of your Waldorf training and bring some rhythm and peace and healing and joy into your days. The ultimate success is mentally healthy children, not ones well on the way to typical white American upper middle class financial security myth.

 

Wow...Thanks Hunter :D

[BlueTaelon]

These questions are very interesting...My son seems to be a visual learner...He remembers many of his dreams in detail, not sure about the anxiety (doesn't seem like a problem but I am not very familar with anxiety), has problems with memory sometimes (unless it is something he saw - he can remember scenes and details in scenes that I would never remember and usually don't notice), and he does have white spots on his nails...He did not have ear infections as a child, none of my boys did though...

 

VSL's learn RADICALLY different then auditory learners but they often fail miserably when forced into the auditory learning box. There is a good description of them at http://www.gifteddevelopment.com/Visual_Spatial_Learner/vsl.htm once I understood HOW my dd learns and changed everything around she started doing wonderfully. As for those white spots, thats caused by a severe zinc deficiency which is common in kids with Pyroluria. VSL's are also on a radically different learning timeline as well. I've found this blog helpful is developing a more appropriate time frame for what my daughter should be doing instead of trying to force her to learn material she's just not ready for yet. http://www.throwingmarshmallows.com/rb-learning-journey/

[jibaker103]

I am in the same boat as you only my nephew will be 13 next month. I have to remind myself constantly to meet him where he is at and stop worrying about where he should be! I know it is hard to ignore the panic but you must do so. I know that threads like this one with all of the outpouring of support, encouragement, and suggestions really help when the doubt starts to creep in.

 

In reading this thread I am reminded again to do the following:

* Get him tested - completed last week. I meet with the doctor on Wednesday to discuss the results.

* Concentrate on the three R's - I am using AAS, Winston Grammar, and MUS.

* Focus on copy work, narration, dictation, and modeling - I am using WWS but I think I need to drop down to WWE 2 or 3 or design my own with SWB audio lectures.

* Drop all other writing as WWE will help slowly develop reading comprehension and paragraph making skills.

* Have him read books below his level and have him discuss them with me and summarize them.

* Read aloud or listen to audio books above level books to introduce a larger vocabulary and more complex and varied sentence structures without him having to discuss.

* Incorporate poetry memorization to help with reading fluency.

* I need to remember he can't write if he can't read, he can't write a paragraph or sentence if he can't spell, boys are slower in language development, and watch out for ADHD being misdiagnosed for CAPD.

 

Wow typing all of this out has helped me focus and be clear about what I am trying to accomplish but it also brings up a couple of questions. I hope this has helped you in some way!

[Hunter]

One thing I am realizing is that many curricula are the frosting on top of a culture and/or a religion. These curricula are created to produce children for that culture. This is obvious in the Mennonite curricula that emphasize conformity and neatness. The Waldorf curricula that are based on child development yes, but SO much more. We forget sometimes that most of the classical curricula are based on propagating a certain underlying culture.

 

I think this is maybe where you are getting hung up, and your husband is holding back and seeing things differently. Because classical is based on the culture currently holding power, it's harder to see it in context as just another curricula based on the ideals of one culture.

 

Really, really, really think back to some of what you saw of people trying to fit in and adapt in Waldorf circles. Just the little I've been dipping into Waldorf, I see the parallels to Mennonite, Bermudian, Italian, even Traditional Witchcraft, and yes Classical. All cultures that seem so different, but that I have learned are so much the same at the core. They are hard or impossible to break into, if they are not your own. The inability to adapt is labeled all sorts of negative things that you are told are a sign of your moral deficiency. In Waldorf think temperaments and developmental stages that are shamed if adults are demonstrating. Think of all the drawing skills and handcrafts and verses and so much more, that look so important and good, but that a newcomer will NEVER make much headway with. And overemphasis on trying to acquire ALL those new skills will prevent the newcomer from enjoying the MAIN idea that these individual activities are supposed to help achieve.

 

There are people here who are going to totally misunderstand what I am saying here, but AutumnOak I'm writing this to YOU, not them, and I think YOU know what I am saying. Really think about what subjects you are struggling with and why the classical books are telling you that you must cover these topics NOW. In English the ultimate end goal is being able to argue effectively. Really think about that. There is far more than pure excellence wrapped up in that, and something that many other cultures would frown on as being the pinnacle of years of study.

 

What is the MAIN thing about classical that attracted you. Do you still think it's important after thinking about it? If so, are you letting the details keep you too busy to enjoy the MAIN thing that attracted you? Are you letting the equivalent of trying to afford beeswax crayons and spending 5 hours drawing a picture without outlines, distract you from the MAIN things you do want?

Edited February 27, 2012 by Hunter

[TheAutumnOak]

One thing I am realizing is that many curricula are the frosting on top of a culture and/or a religion. These curricula are created to produce children for that culture. This is obvious in the Mennonite curricula that emphasize conformity and neatness. The Waldorf curricula that are based on child development yes, but SO much more. We forget sometimes that most of the classical curricula are based on propagating a certain underlying culture.

 

I think this is maybe where you are getting hung up, and your husband is holding back and seeing things differently. Because classical is based on the culture currently holding power, it's harder to see it in context as just another curricula based on the ideals of one culture.

 

I understand just what you are saying here...

 

 

Really, really, really think back to some of what you saw of people trying to fit in and adapt in Waldorf circles. Just the little I've been dipping into Waldorf, I see the parallels to Mennonite, Bermudian, Italian, even Traditional Witchcraft, and yes Classical. All cultures that seem so different, but that I have learned are so much the same at the core. They are hard or impossible to break into, if they are not your own. The inability to adapt is labeled all sorts of negative things that you are told are a sign of your moral deficiency. In Waldorf think temperaments and developmental stages that are shamed if adults are demonstrating. Think of all the drawing skills and handcrafts and verses and so much more, that look so important and good, but that a newcomer will NEVER make much headway with. And overemphasis on trying to acquire ALL those new skills will prevent the newcomer from enjoying the MAIN idea that these individual activities are supposed to help achieve.

 

I remember clearly what it was like trying to break into Waldorf circles and watching others do the same...I remember clearly all the time I spent learning verses, learning how to make nature table dolls and all the rest of what goes along with Waldorf...I got pretty good at handcrafts and such, but at the expense of my oldest son's education...There was definitely an overemphasis on those skills...

 

 

There are people here who are going to totally misunderstand what I am saying here, but AutumnOak I'm writing this to YOU, not them, and I think YOU know what I am saying. Really think about what subjects you are struggling with and why the classical books are telling you that you must cover these topics NOW. In English the ultimate end goal is being able to argue effectively. Really think about that. There is far more than pure excellence wrapped up in that, and something that many other cultures would frown on as being the pinnacle of years of study.

 

Again, what you are saying makes total sense to me...I will have to give more thought to that...

 

What is the MAIN thing about classical that attracted you. Do you still think it's important after thinking about it? If so, are you letting the details keep you too busy to enjoy the MAIN thing that attracted you? Are you letting the equivalent of trying to afford beeswax crayons and spending 5 hours drawing a picture without outlines, distract you from the MAIN things you do want?

 

Honestly, the main thing that attracted me to classical education was reading WTM and seeing how much it focused on education...I wasn't very focused on education when my oldest was younger, as I spent most of our time doing crafts and such (my oldest knitted a wonderful recorder case when he was 8, but couldn't read yet)...I was convicted about how little time I spent actually educating him...WTM was such a laid out plan that it inspired me to want to give him more than what I was offering him...Now we have been playing catch up for the past year...And yes, I do think I am letting the details distract me from enjoying educating him...And I also remember spending lots of time modelling beeswax and trying to draw pictures without outlines :tongue_smilie:...Buying all that stuff to create "the right Waldorf atmosphere" and spending so much time on crafts did distract me from what I was trying to accomplish - giving my boys an education...

Thank you for your words...You have given me much to think about...

[PeterPan]

I wouldn't take being VSL (if he is) to mean there's nothing else going on. Jeffrey Freed (Right-Brained Children in a Left-Brained World) asserts that *all* kids with adhd are VSL. While the reverse isn't guaranteed, it's definitely something to consider, especially when you have symptoms of working memory, attention, processing speed, etc.

Edited February 27, 2012 by OhElizabeth

[Colleen in NS]

Honestly, the main thing that attracted me to classical education was reading WTM and seeing how much it focused on education...I wasn't very focused on education when my oldest was younger, as I spent most of our time doing crafts and such (my oldest knitted a wonderful recorder case when he was 8, but couldn't read yet)...I was convicted about how little time I spent actually educating him...WTM was such a laid out plan that it inspired me to want to give him more than what I was offering him...Now we have been playing catch up for the past year...And yes, I do think I am letting the details distract me from enjoying educating him...And I also remember spending lots of time modelling beeswax and trying to draw pictures without outlines :tongue_smilie:...Buying all that stuff to create "the right Waldorf atmosphere" and spending so much time on crafts did distract me from what I was trying to accomplish - giving my boys an education...

 

 

 

Can we help you with any specific concerns? Math? Reading comprehension? Writing?

 

Sometimes just making a plan for the next month or so for each "problem" area can be helpful - get us on a train and gain momentum and give our kids some confidence. Some of my days are filled with "Yes, I know you think this is difficult now, but let me walk you through this step-by-step, and you'll get it. And even if you don't fully get it today, tomorrow will be a little better." Guess what - my kids make progress - I have no clue how they compare to other 5th and 8th graders, but I don't care - I just know that each of them knows more grammar/math/writing skills than they did three months ago or a year ago. Making a short-term plan can give us hope, and space/time to get a breath in to make a longer-term plan.

 

I agree with every single thing Hunter wrote - she seems to have some hard-won wisdom.

 

I've read many of your posts, and I seriously think you are a good, detailed teacher.

[Hunter]

Honestly, the main thing that attracted me to classical education was reading WTM and seeing how much it focused on education...I wasn't very focused on education when my oldest was younger, as I spent most of our time doing crafts and such (my oldest knitted a wonderful recorder case when he was 8, but couldn't read yet)...I was convicted about how little time I spent actually educating him...WTM was such a laid out plan that it inspired me to want to give him more than what I was offering him...Now we have been playing catch up for the past year...And yes, I do think I am letting the details distract me from enjoying educating him...And I also remember spending lots of time modelling beeswax and trying to draw pictures without outlines :tongue_smilie:...Buying all that stuff to create "the right Waldorf atmosphere" and spending so much time on crafts did distract me from what I was trying to accomplish - giving my boys an education...

 

 

 

Don't be so quick to sell yourself short. You may have been accurately responding to cues, on what your child was capable of at the time. You looked at what was more typical in the USA right NOW and got scared and ricocheted into something that is almost the opposite in an attempt to right the imbalance.

 

Fear produces a desire to take action. Sometimes that is good. Sometimes, though we need to just sit with our fear and do absolutely nothing. How many times have we watched a war movie and the guy who jumps out of the foxhole dies? A couple years ago, I almost lost my life because I acted. For awhile I had been being shamed for sitting tight. I knew I was supposed to sit tight, despite the danger growing. The danger grew some more and the experts watching panicked. I begged them to stop panicking and start helping me plan from a place of logic, but they only claimed that I was morally deficient and pushed me to act. They were all wrong. Action was the wrong choice at the time, and I heavily paid the price, but at least I did survive, battered but more confident than ever that I need to trust myself.

 

Sometimes mommy sense cannot be articulated logically. Sometimes we were not morally deficient, but instead were automatically and properly adapting to our reality. You might have been doing the exact right thing.

 

You, like me, have arrived where we now are, against overwhelming odds. We didn't get here by not making wise choices. Just because we don't know WHY we did something, and just because similar action isn't being taken by the norm, doesn't make it wrong. It's okay to trust yourself when you know you have been right far more than you have been wrong. The few mistakes you have made do not justify taking the advice of others over your own gut. You have proven that statistically your best chance at success, is to do it your way.

 

You are vulnerable to ricochet again right now. Subtle adjustments, often moving back a little into the direction we came from, is often the best way to balance. Trust yourself; you have earned it. Move slowly right now. Don't panic. There is a clock ticking, but...is it the clock YOU are supposed to be listening to?

Edited February 27, 2012 by Hunter

[Hunter]

Part 2:

Oh, and, the best formatted curricula, that look so perfectly laid out, are seldom the easiest to use when the rubber hits the road. You know the saying, "if it looks too good to be true, it usually is"? :-)

 

Homeschooling is messy, for most of us. If it wasn't so messy, we wouldn't need this forum!

[Stacy in NJ]

Thanks for this. :001_smile:

 

 

:iagree:

 

Top down planning often does more harm than good. The default goal that is pushed on all of us as "success" certainly needs to be questioned harshly, before top down planning from THAT, for EVERY child.

 

Nowadays ANYTHING that prevents a child from being plugged into the default top down planning is considered a disability that needs to be treated. And access to testing for these "disabilities" is not as available to all children, as it is to those with parents who successfully managed the default goals themselves. Maybe that is a good thing :-0

 

And some children CAN reach the default goal, but do it in skips and jumps and not in the orderly pace that the books are written in. Sometimes the orderly pace that is written to facilitate the top down planning doesn't match up to the realities of child development of even precocious children, never mind the average or atypical child.

 

From past posts, I know you have some challenges that other parents here have not faced. Do not compare the progress your family is making, with their progress. And some people here...are not entirely accurate about the exact details of what is going on...so don't compare yourself to what you THINK others are doing.

 

I was never able to get my atypical son properly tested. The more testing I fought to get him, the more harm it did and the more the school system hid from and lied to me, after they saw the results. I had no health insurance and no money to hire a lawyer. the more I fought the worse things got. At times I felt like such a failure.

 

The times I just dealt with today, and let tomorrow worry about itself, were when we made the most progress.

 

I understand your pain. BTDT, and I think in a far worse situation. It's not all that bad :-) Seriously! It only looks so bad in the context you are looking at it.

 

Over 90% of what we worry about never happens. Set some REALISTIC goals based on where you are at NOW. Reach back to some of your Waldorf training and bring some rhythm and peace and healing and joy into your days. The ultimate success is mentally healthy children, not ones well on the way to typical white American upper middle class financial security myth.

[TheAutumnOak]

Don't be so quick to sell yourself short. You may have been accurately responding to cues, on what your child was capable of at the time. You looked at what was more typical in the USA right NOW and got scared and ricocheted into something that is almost the opposite in an attempt to right the imbalance.

 

Fear produces a desire to take action. Sometimes that is good. Sometimes, though we need to just sit with our fear and do absolutely nothing. How many times have we watched a war movie and the guy who jumps out of the foxhole dies? A couple years ago, I almost lost my life because I acted. For awhile I had been being shamed for sitting tight. I knew I was supposed to sit tight, despite the danger growing. The danger grew some more and the experts watching panicked. I begged them to stop panicking and start helping me plan from a place of logic, but they only claimed that I was morally deficient and pushed me to act. They were all wrong. Action was the wrong choice at the time, and I heavily paid the price, but at least I did survive, battered but more confident than ever that I need to trust myself.

 

Sometimes mommy sense cannot be articulated logically. Sometimes we were not morally deficient, but instead were automatically and properly adapting to our reality. You might have been doing the exact right thing.

 

You, like me, have arrived where we now are, against overwhelming odds. We didn't get here by not making wise choices. Just because we don't know WHY we did something, and just because similar action isn't being taken by the norm, doesn't make it wrong. It's okay to trust yourself when you know you have been right far more than you have been wrong. The few mistakes you have made do not justify taking the advice of others over your own gut. You have proven that statistically your best chance at success, is to do it your way.

 

You are vulnerable to ricochet again right now. Subtle adjustments, often moving back a little into the direction we came from, is often the best way to balance. Trust yourself; you have earned it. Move slowly right now. Don't panic. There is a clock ticking, but...is it the clock YOU are supposed to be listening to?

 

All I can say is thank you so much, Hunter...Thank you so much...

[Hunter]

"What to Do When All Seems Lost"

 

http://www.waldorfinspiredlearning.com/content/what-do-when-all-seems-lost

[In the Rain]

No advice, but :grouphug:. I know how hard it is to watch one of our kids struggle, and wonder if we are doing enough, or doing the right thing to help.

[ktgrok]

Don't be so quick to sell yourself short. You may have been accurately responding to cues, on what your child was capable of at the time. You looked at what was more typical in the USA right NOW and got scared and ricocheted into something that is almost the opposite in an attempt to right the imbalance.

 

Fear produces a desire to take action. Sometimes that is good. Sometimes, though we need to just sit with our fear and do absolutely nothing. How many times have we watched a war movie and the guy who jumps out of the foxhole dies? A couple years ago, I almost lost my life because I acted. For awhile I had been being shamed for sitting tight. I knew I was supposed to sit tight, despite the danger growing. The danger grew some more and the experts watching panicked. I begged them to stop panicking and start helping me plan from a place of logic, but they only claimed that I was morally deficient and pushed me to act. They were all wrong. Action was the wrong choice at the time, and I heavily paid the price, but at least I did survive, battered but more confident than ever that I need to trust myself.

 

Sometimes mommy sense cannot be articulated logically. Sometimes we were not morally deficient, but instead were automatically and properly adapting to our reality. You might have been doing the exact right thing.

 

You, like me, have arrived where we now are, against overwhelming odds. We didn't get here by not making wise choices. Just because we don't know WHY we did something, and just because similar action isn't being taken by the norm, doesn't make it wrong. It's okay to trust yourself when you know you have been right far more than you have been wrong. The few mistakes you have made do not justify taking the advice of others over your own gut. You have proven that statistically your best chance at success, is to do it your way.

 

You are vulnerable to ricochet again right now. Subtle adjustments, often moving back a little into the direction we came from, is often the best way to balance. Trust yourself; you have earned it. Move slowly right now. Don't panic. There is a clock ticking, but...is it the clock YOU are supposed to be listening to?

 

This is SO true. I know for years I was judged for how I parented my son. Obviously what I was doing must be causing his social problems, behavior, etc. When he was 11 he was diagnosed with Asperger's and it was made clear to me that my parenting had been what allowed him to progress as far as he had. It has NOT caused his problems. For so many years I acted as an interpreter for him, repeating what people said to him in a way he would understand (more concretely) and then when he gave one word answers I would expand on it for him. My mother was sure that caused his social issues. Later, I learned that the biggest frustration in Aspergers can be an inability to communicate and often they need an interpreter which is just what I'd been doing. I didn't cause things, I met him where he was.

[Hunter]

This is SO true. I know for years I was judged for how I parented my son. Obviously what I was doing must be causing his social problems, behavior, etc. When he was 11 he was diagnosed with Asperger's and it was made clear to me that my parenting had been what allowed him to progress as far as he had. It has NOT caused his problems. For so many years I acted as an interpreter for him, repeating what people said to him in a way he would understand (more concretely) and then when he gave one word answers I would expand on it for him. My mother was sure that caused his social issues. Later, I learned that the biggest frustration in Aspergers can be an inability to communicate and often they need an interpreter which is just what I'd been doing. I didn't cause things, I met him where he was.

 

This is so common. Moms see an issue, and without giving it a lot of thought--because there isn't time to think about everything--react appropriately to that EVENT.

 

I'm going to borrow a recovery phrase. Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome is a "normal reaction to an abnormal event". It isn't normal to do what everyone else is doing, if your EVENTS are different. Normal healthy people adapt to their environments and the events taking place in THEIR environment. It can look "wrong" to people who don't notice--or are choosing not to recognize--the events in someone else's life.

 

Moms are given an impossible job and then shamed for almost pulling off a miracle. Society says you should be able to create miracles. Ladies we cannot make wine out of water.

 

Look at the little people you were given, your own strengths, and the tools you have been given to do the job. Build what you can and know that is enough.

 

And remember that pain is NOT evidence that you are doing your best. Pain is self-neglect. All forms of neglect are wrong. Pain is evidence you are doing too much. Doing your best STOPS at pain, NOT starts with pain.

[Colleen in NS]

Hunter,

 

You are giving *me* a lot of insight and encouragement with your posts here. Thanks for continuing to post your thoughts on these forums.

[TheAutumnOak]

Hunter,

 

You are giving *me* a lot of insight and encouragement with your posts here. Thanks for continuing to post your thoughts on these forums.

 

:iagree: With all of it...

[ElizabethB]

:grouphug:

 

You have time with your youngest two...as long as they are getting a good start on phonics and math, they are good.

 

It takes a while to fully remediate an older student, and then you have catch up to do with spelling and vocabulary from the reading they missed. I would focus my efforts on fully remediating the reading and math...when these basics are sound, they can read or study any other subject on their own if they have the basic math and reading skills to tackle any other subject they need to learn.

 

I find with my older students that continually working with nonsense words and syllables is helpful. Also, I like to build up their vocabulary with having them read through a series of graded readers, starting a bit below their comfort reading level. For someone who needs more help with phonics, I like the 1879 McGuffey Readers. For someone whose phonics is sound but needs a lot of vocabulary work, I like the Parker Readers.

 

You can also work through Don Potter's 1908 Webster's Speller for reading and vocabulary as well as phonics and a bit of spelling work. (Don also has a hard copy for purchase now through Cafe Press but is keeping the pdf free.)

 

I also like Rewards Reading (intermediate or secondary, not their topical programs) and Marcia Henry's Words for building up reading skills while working on other things. Rewards also works on reading comprehension and vocabulary. Words also works on spelling and vocabulary and Latin/Greek word roots.

 

For comprehension, Don Potter has a good resource, it was designed for ESL students but is also helpful for non-ESL students who need explicit comprehension help.

 

For nonsense words, you can play my game and I also like We All Can Read, 3rd grade through adult.

 

My New Elizabethian test is a good diagnostic test based on nonsense words, it can pinpoint lingering areas of trouble and is correlated to my phonics lessons.

 

I would focus on getting basic skills up to par while doing some audio books and perhaps SOTW on CD. Then, add back in a bit of your other stuff lightly, one thing at a time.

 

Once you're remediated reading and comprehension, then you can work on writing. Work on good sentences, then good paragraphs, then a good essay.

 

You can do it! It takes a while, but it is worth building up the skills and doing it right, once you have that solid foundation, they can soar and learn anything on their own.

Edited March 1, 2012 by ElizabethB

[Hunter]

I'm glad that I'm able to help a little bit here :-) You ladies stay on my mind throughout the day and sometimes ideas come to me.

 

Have you read the Bluedorn's article Ten Things to Do Before Ten recently? The Bluedorn's advocate a slower start than TWTM.

 

I've been reading a few books on child development recently and am seeing where certain important things were skipped in my own childhood, and in each of my boys, and the exact side effects listed, are evident in our adult lives. I am trying to go back and remediate some of these things. If it is preschool level skips, then that is what needs to sometimes be remediated :-0

 

I think I saw somewhere that a drug recovery center is showing success with using lot of adapted Waldorf preschool and kindergarten ideas with recovering addicts.

 

I think we sometimes forget how important the basics are, in our rush to get moving towards the top down planning. Some of the basics happen naturally in some families, and those families may not even be aware of the essential skills being covered. For those of us with eventful and disadvantaged backgrounds, I think we need to pay special attention to what the preschool and primary basics are, because we may THINK we have covered things better than we actually have. "More is caught than taught" is such an important concept. Some of us didn't have much to catch and then don't now to model that for our children.

 

In a 1st generation homeschool family, or the 1st generation not to live in full poverty, or the 1st generation to live in the USA, or the 1st generation almost anything, is not going to be able to compete with a family playing on their own home ground, playing by their rules. The whole college selection process is a competition. Unless we change the rules of the competition, and don't really even play the established game, we will not win. Ignoring the holes in the basics, and the lack of resources, and just jumping in the deep end and trying to "just do it" isn't going to work.

 

Think about the Revolutionary War. The colonists couldn't win against the English playing by their rules, so they made up their own, that were adapted to their less civilized backgrounds, and they won against great odds. The patriots looked at what they had for resources and used them. Some say they "cheated". My Bermudian history books had all sorts of negative things to say :-)

 

I'm kind of rambling, but just wanted to post that link, and to let you ladies know I'm still thinking about you.

Edited March 1, 2012 by Hunter