Critique my 4 year plan

[TheApprentice]

My older ds may actually be homeschooling highschool (nothing is certain yet). This is a plan based on his interests and his desire to major in civil engineering/architecture in college. It looks comprehensive to me, but there is no Grammar, Logic, or Chemistry. But it totals 26.5 credits. What do you think?

 

9th grade

geometry/algebra II simultaneously

American Lit./Comp

American History

US Government

Health

Introduction to Web Design

 

10th grade

Pre-Calculus

World Literature/Comp.

World History

Biology with Lab

Japanese

Architectural Drafting

 

11th grade

Calculus

AP English

World Geography

AP Physics

Japanese

Career Planning Course

Internship

 

12th grade

AP Calculus AB

Creative Writing

History of Arch.

Speech Communication

Introduction to Engineering

AP Psychology

Music Theory

Sculpture

Financial Class

[8filltheheart]

I would also be concerned about the low number of science credits (I only see 2, AP physics and biology) I would want to see a STEM major have a minimum of 4 (if they have earned 1 in middle school, I would not include toward the 4 for a STEM major)

 

I also wonder about the cal in 11th and cal AB in 12th. Is there a specific reason for this?

[regentrude]

Only two science credits? That would not be sufficient to satisfy admissions requirements at most universities (in fact, I don't know of any who are content with two sciences only).

 

Concurrent geometry and algebra 2: this can work, but you need to be aware that this means actually doubling the workload in math, i.e. your student will have to spend twice as much time on math as with only one course - otherwise you don't get through both.

 

I would find two years of foreign language not enough and would prefer four solid years of the same language - two years don't get you anywhere close to fluency.

 

Grammar is part of an English credit. I would not consider this a separate subject.

The lack of chemistry is a definite concern. If you son is interested in any STEM major, he should take chemistry in high school; the Chemistry intro courses at the university are tough.

Edited February 10, 2012 by regentrude

[TheApprentice]

Ooops. He'll be taking Algebra based physics in 9th grade. And the math is because that is the natural chain of classes I thought.:confused: And I thought the Engineering class in 12th grade is considered science. So he would have 4 sciences.

[Gwen in VA]

1) If I were you, I would not double up the math in 9th grade and then have him repeat calculus in 12th.

 

I would just do --

9th -- geometry

10th -- algebra 2

11th precalculus

12th -- calc AB

 

For many if not most students, calculus is not so hard that it takes two years!

 

2) I join the chorus saying he needs chemistry

 

3) He needs at least three years of a foreign language to be competitive at most schools, even engineering ones. If you can't find a way to do three years of Japanese, he should do another language.

 

4) Stay flexible. After each year, redo your high school plan. Your son may have no interest in music theory by 12th grade. He may enjoy studying literature so much by 12th grade that the idea of just doing creative writing and speech makes him miserable. And while he may be interested in architecture now, he may be less interested by late high school. Or he may want to ditch AP Psych and pursue drawing.

 

Be willing to adjust the plans to reflect his developing interests and skills.

 

5) If he is truly interested in architecture, he should have more art classes, especially drawing. Investigate local art studios and see if drawing classes are offered.

[Jane in NC]

Ooops. He'll be taking Algebra based physics in 9th grade. And the math is because that is the natural chain of classes I thought.:confused: And I thought the Engineering class in 12th grade is considered science. So he would have 4 sciences.

 

Intro to Engineering is not conventional for high school but that does not mean it cannot work. Is this a lab based science class? I'm curious about how you plan on orchestrating it.

[8filltheheart]

Ooops. He'll be taking Algebra based physics in 9th grade. And the math is because that is the natural chain of classes I thought.:confused: And I thought the Engineering class in 12th grade is considered science. So he would have 4 sciences.

 

I have never seen an Intro to Eng class that would be the equivalent of a high school science credit. Typically they involve discussions around the various fields of engineering. Our 20 yos has just decided that he wants to major in engineering, so we asked him to take intro to eng this semester. So far they have done the "different field" discussions, but they are also doing excel spreadsheets. But, no, definitely not "science." (ditto the class dh took 25+yrs ago and oldest ds his freshman yr)

 

When I look through the plans, there are multiple courses that I would not encourage my kids to take and many that I would encourage them to.

 

For example, AP psy is really not a choice I would select for a possible engineering student. Same w/creative writing and music theory. I would pick hard core science and research type writing instead.

 

B/c of the way life is in comparing w/other applicants, I would want to see 4/4/4/4/3 or 2+2 (4 English/lit, 4-science, 4-math, 4-history, 3 of the same foreign lang or 2 yrs each of 2 different.)

 

FWIW, the AP cal courses have no pre-reqs other than pre-cal. Our ds is taking BC this yr after pre-cal last yr (the difference b/t AB and BC is pace. AB is the equivalent of 1 semester of college cal and BC is the equivalent of 2)

 

HTH

Edited February 10, 2012 by 8FillTheHeart

[regentrude]

And I thought the Engineering class in 12th grade is considered science. So he would have 4 sciences.

 

No, engineering is not a science. I'd do it as elective in addition to traditional sciences.

 

I re-read your initial post and I had missed the part that he is interested in an engineering major.

In that case I would push for four years of actual science. I would most definitely include chemistry, because engineering majors have to take chem at the university; these are hard and time consuming classes and prior chem will help.

If you need to make room for this, I'd cut out some of the stuff like psychology, creative writing and multiple art electives.

Btw, I would not consider "Career Planning" an actual high school credit.

Edited February 10, 2012 by regentrude

[Trilliums]

The local public school offers several engineering courses and the students are eligible for college credit in certain circumstances. The high school considers these classes science electives; they do not count toward the basic science requirement to graduate. I am not sure how Universities/colleges would view them though.

 

These engineering classes are hands on problem solving classes. They generally do a computer based module to learn a concept and then implement the concepts learned in a project. They have built solar cars, sumo wrestling bots, marbles sorters, etc. They have been very engaging for DS. On a side note though, DS has been interested in Materials Science Engineering and Physics for a couple of years as possible careers. Even though he thoroughly enjoys his Engineering class, he is now leaning more towards physics. He did a job shadow of an engineer and it was very useful.

[Trilliums]

Do you think your son might end up taking classes at a local community college? This is what DS is considering for 11th grade. I am thinking this would allow him to accumulate high school credits faster.

 

We are especially considering this for foreign language. He is studying Mandarin with a tutor and will take some summer classes in it, but I am not sure he can really accumulate 4 solid high school credits this route.

[regentrude]

Do you think your son might end up taking classes at a local community college? This is what DS is considering for 11th grade. I am thinking this would allow him to accumulate high school credits faster.

 

Could you explain why you think this would be faster? In know, a four hour college class can count as a high school credit. We are currently there with DD who is taking one class at the university: the amount of work required for this class at home means that she will complete fewer of her other credits because it takes up more than twice as much time.

When she is taking calc based physics at uni next semester, we are looking at 10-12+ hours of work per week throughout one semester for one high school credit... compared to an hour per day for a full year.

So, I'm not sure I understand how it would speed things up.

[TheApprentice]

8FillTheHeart, what do you mean by "hard core science and research type writing instead." I'm not sure where to look for those resources. I'll have to do some tweaking. It's hard to include some courses that the child is interested AND stay competitive with college admissions. He really wanted to take Japanese, but I could only find 2 credits worth, so he may have to do a Language he has no interest in just to get in the 4 credits. I will definitely see how we can fit more drawing classes in.

 

The Intro. to Engineering class is offered at our CC, and I was just going to dual enroll him for that, along with the sculpture class.

 

Thanks for the input.

[8filltheheart]

8FillTheHeart, what do you mean by "hard core science and research type writing instead." I'm not sure where to look for those resources. I'll have to do some tweaking. It's hard to include some courses that the child is interested AND stay competitive with college admissions. He really wanted to take Japanese, but I could only find 2 credits worth, so he may have to do a Language he has no interest in just to get in the 4 credits. I will definitely see how we can fit more drawing classes in.

 

The Intro. to Engineering class is offered at our CC, and I was just going to dual enroll him for that, along with the sculpture class.

 

Thanks for the input.

 

I simply mean physics, chem, bio and then 1 or more at the advanced level. I would not skip any of them. (my 10th grader does not want to take bio at all, but he is going to have to. We are delaying it until 12th grade and then most likely he will simply take it dual enrolled. He is far more interested in other sciences to let bio take up an entire yr. ;))

 

Research writing would be simply that. Non-fiction essay/research/technical composition. Allowing students to develop those skills in high school makes the transition into them easier at the college level.

 

Of all of the things being discussed, the foreign lang would be the one that I would worry about the least. I would look into the admission requirements at various schools and see what they require. Depending on where you are, 2 yrs might be sufficient. Here the state graduation requirements for a college bound diploma require 3. I make sure that my student surpass the state minimums.

[Trilliums]

My thought was for a foreign language course 4 high school credits could be obtained over a period of 2 years instead of over 4 years. If the college workload is indeed twice as much and the student has to take fewer classes, then I can see this as problematic. I am basing my statement off conversations with local homeschoolers who have attended the CC but DS has no personal experience as if yet. From what other parents/students say, the CC classes are easier than classes at the Univ. Llocal homeschoolers describe the CC Chem class as only moderately harder than the high school honors Chem. They also mentioned a lot of emphasis on developing organizational skills. At this point I asked how the CC classes compared to the ps AP classes and the students who took AP classes at the high school described them as primarily focused on learning how to score well on the AP exam.

 

The year long engineering classes offered by the

public school are offered as semester long courses at the CC. I do not know the difference in structure, but I am guessing the class focuses on conceptual and forgoes a lot of the hands on components.

[elegantlion]

An option to consider for Japanese would be Irasshai. There are free videos , sponsored by the GPB. http://www.gpb.org/irasshai

 

Workbooks and Textbooks are available at Amazon. The two volumes are equivalent to 3 years of high school study.

[Jonibee]

Elegantlion,

 

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but my son is also using Irasshai Japanese. Did you see somewhere in print that this 2-year program would be equal to 3 years of high school? I was trying to find a 3rd or even 4th year addition to this when he finishes. He wants to be fluent!

BTW, Love, love this program!!

[lmrich]

Please check with the schools that he is considering and schools you are considering and ask what they want. In GA Latin 3 counts as an arts credit, in nearby SC it would not. My kids could not get into the easiest SC school because they don't meet their requirements. Don't be afraid to contact an admissions office and ask.

[TexasRachel]

:iagree: with pp. My into to engineering class was only one hour and it was definitely not a science class. Chemistry is a must. I had 4 classes that were required or would've had I stuck with engineering. And I'd go with more foreign language because then maybe he could test out or at least it would be an easy class because he will need an easy one.

[elegantlion]

Elegantlion,

 

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but my son is also using Irasshai Japanese. Did you see somewhere in print that this 2-year program would be equal to 3 years of high school? I was trying to find a 3rd or even 4th year addition to this when he finishes. He wants to be fluent!

BTW, Love, love this program!!

 

Yes. In the textbook it states "recommended for use as a three year high school foreign language course". It breaks down into:

 

Year 1: Vol 1, lessons 1-49

Year 2: Vol 1, lessons 50-73, Vol 2, Lessons 1-20

Year 3: Vol 2, Lessons 21-63

[Jasda]

:iagree: I believe more science classes need to be added. To be sure of exactly which ones, check with the colleges he's looking at attending to see which ones they require to be on his transcript.