I am failing...

[C_l_e_0..Q_c]

I feel like I'm failing at least.

My son learns super fast, always has. He's still somewhat interested in his studies (for a 14yo boy, I would say he's very interested compared to other 14yo that I know). Yet, when he has to write in an exam, he fails.

This is a child who's always had a hard time with output. And now, with high school exams, he just can't handle it.

Based on where we live, he *has* to master exam taking, because his college entrance will be strictly on exam results, be it SAT, IGCSE or anything else out there. He's got to be able to write exams!

 

where's that banging head against the wall icon??

[elegantlion]

:grouphug: I understand, I've spent part of the weekend pondering output and testing for my ds14.

[Teachin'Mine]

Cleo does he have test anxiety? Maybe you could give him a test which he should do well on as a confidence booster. The CAT exams are easy and all multiple choice. You can order them from Seton Home Study or from other sources.

 

I'm assuming that when you say he has trouble with output, you're not just referring to essay type exams, but multiple choice too. As for the SAT, you can get him a prep book to start working through. It's not so much about knowing the material as knowing how to take the test and give the answer they're looking for - preparation is key.

[justamouse]

:grouphug: It's a skill, he can learn it. I have horrible test takers, too. Only after a few years did it all even out for them.

[Sunshine State Sue]

:banghead:

 

Here ya go.

 

I often think of an old saying:

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

 

Home education is a collaboration between parent and student. As a parent, I can only do so much. As a student, he can only do so much.

 

:grouphug:

[C_l_e_0..Q_c]

He's generally fine with multiple choices, it's the written word that he has always had problems with, and the studying part. He understands almost everything right away but when comes time to study and really learn the material, he fails.

He just walked out of his biology exam near tears. He realizes that he's failing. But he's such a bright kid! Right now I don't know how to help him get over this hump

[Teachin'Mine]

He's generally fine with multiple choices, it's the written word that he has always had problems with, and the studying part. He understands almost everything right away but when comes time to study and really learn the material, he fails.

He just walked out of his biology exam near tears. He realizes that he's failing. But he's such a bright kid! Right now I don't know how to help him get over this hump

 

How are the questions asked on the biology exam? Are they open ended essay questions? If so, maybe you could make up a different exam which would better show all he's learned - maybe a mix of multiple choice, true/false, fill in the blank, etc.. Part of the test could be oral as well - let him describe processes or even use flow charts.

[SkateLeft]

While some kids pick up study skills and timed essay writing strategies intuitively, other kids need more direct instruction. It's a different skill set than just learning the course content. A child can learn course material easily, but being able to write an essay exam or study for a test require different skills. Has your son spent much time working with study skills?

[choirfarm]

My middle son has some of the same problems. In 9th grade it seems like there is a jump between being able to read and just get the overall facts that are good enough for middle school and the higher thinking questions and amount of minutia in high school.

 

Here is what you need to do. Have a Biology conference with him. He needs to bring his textbook, any and all worksheets and notes he has taken, copy of all tests and quizzes he has taken.

 

Now look over them together. What kind of questions is he missing? Are they the essay questions? Definitions? Questions that come from charts and/or graphs in the book(my son has trouble with these).

 

Now, how is he studying the material? Is he just reading it? Typically that is no longer enough anymore. My oldest son highlights the material as he reads it. My middle one takes notes: writing down definitons and important points. Some kids make out flashcards on index cards or do online ones. My middle son is taking Biology. He takes notes, does the study guide that is provided, goes over the chapter with dad, and finally makes a study sheet for the exam that he must show his dad before he takes the exam.

 

One thing I did in college was to make out a sample test. So look at the chapter that he is covering. Go through it with him. What definitions will they ask? What would be a good essay? Make out a test together. Have him take it the next day and the two of you go over it to see where his weak areas are.

 

Is this time intensive...YES!!! I haven't figured out a way around it. My oldest can do it all on his own and doesn't need my help, but he is now 11th grade. My 9th grader still needs my help...

[Lori D.]

First, YOU have not failed! You've identified a problem area, now it's time to address it! And, you know, HE has not failed, either! :) Failure is when you both decide to give up. You're no where near failure! :)

 

But yes, quite often, our dear, teenaged young men fail to grasp that baton we're trying to pass to them as fast or as well as we'd like, and so the baton hits the ground a LOT in some areas, before they figure out the technique. :)

 

Time, maturity, and growing responsibility (all his part), along with patience, diligent research to address specific issues, and discernment on whether to offer help or stand back (all your part) -- together, slowly, eventually, you'll see progress and get past this particular issue! :hurray: <-- (closest emoticon I could find for a cheerleader, LOL)

 

 

when he has to write in an exam, he fails.

 

 

- Do you mean the tests that go with your curriculum? (i.e., chapter or unit tests, quizzes, finals?)

- Or are you talking about national standardized tests?

- What *specific* portion(s) of testing does he fail -- fill in the bubble? multiple choice? matching? fill-in-the-blank/write the answer? essay writing?

- Is it an emotional issue -- test anxiety or performance fears?

- And finally, is there the possibility of a disability?

 

 

I ask all of these questions to help you pinpoint where, specifically, the problem is, to help you better address the specific need. :)

 

For example, if there is a potential disability , you can get it officially diagnosed, and then DS will be given special helps for test-taking to make it more fair (and less stressful) for him -- for example, NOT timed; use a computer rather than hand-written; etc.

 

 

If we're talking the tests that go with your curriculum, then what specifically is he failing at (my questions above) . To address that, together, do some research and find specific tips and advice for helping take those types of tests. Then, practice! Try taking the most recent tests again with you sitting beside him, and putting those tips into practice. Write some practice tests. Do chapter review questions as quizzes to practice/prep for tests. Etc.

 

 

If standardized national tests are the issue, then consider a test-taking course or book to learn test-taking tips and skills, and then schedule regular practice to get him practiced, and relaxed:

 

- sign up at the College Board website for the daily SAT practice question

- read past threads on which SAT prep book / DVD or online video tutorials / class or program would best fit with your DS and your family's budget

- do a a weekly essay together from a prompt, using past SAT prompts

 

 

And if it is test anxiety, then do some research on relaxation and visualization techniques. For the next 2 years, do tons of practice tests without timing, or do 3 practice questions a day until he can do these in his sleep without the least fear. More ideas here and here

 

 

Okay, there's your pep talk; now, you go girl! :D Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited January 23, 2012 by Lori D.
added links

[Lori D.]

Sounds like incorporating Study Skills into your regular schedule to learn and practice specific skills might help. Sounds like you might esp. want to start with resources that cover:

 

- reviewing textbooks and notes for test-taking

- test prep

- actual test-taking

- essay exam writing

 

Check out this website as a start! BEST of luck, warmly, Lori D.

[Laura Corin]

He's generally fine with multiple choices, it's the written word that he has always had problems with, and the studying part. He understands almost everything right away but when comes time to study and really learn the material, he fails.

He just walked out of his biology exam near tears. He realizes that he's failing. But he's such a bright kid! Right now I don't know how to help him get over this hump

 

This makes a big difference to Calvin - words flow more fluently and faster when he types. He has special permission because of his documented coordination difficulties.

 

Laura

[Nan in Mass]

Hugs and more hugs. I have been there. How much outlining and narration have you done with him recently? Mine were so good at it when they were little that I stopped doing it. Then I discovered they could no longer do it when they were older and the material was harder. High school level work is a big adjustment for the quick children who didn't have to work at anything in elementary school. During the period when study skills are usually learned (around 13yo), they can get away without them. Then, when they are 14 and suddenly need them, they don't have them and founder where their slower classmates do fine. At 14, he may not be willing to put in all the time necessary to really learn a chapter, especially if it takes him twice as long because he hasn't had much practice with the process. I have taught study skills many times only to have my children decide not to do enough of the process to really learn whatever it was. By now, they both know what they have to do, but they when they were 14 or 15, they chose not to do it, or only choose to do it for the subjects that interest them (and French grammar is not one of those - sigh). I was so very relieved to see my youngest, for his cc chem class, make flashcards, write things out on the whiteboard, and complain that his classmates didn't seem to be able to read the textbook. But this is why we decided to sign him up for intro chemistry instead of general chemistry - we weren't sure he was going to be able to manage the studying involved despite being brighter than most of his class. Or be willing to DO the studying. If your son wanted to know biology, would he know how to digest the textbook?

 

If you haven't done much textbook science before, you may have the added problem that your son is inexperienced answering textbook questions. What looks obvious to those of us who grew up in school just plain is not to anyone who didn't. To answer a question, the student needs to know what assumptions are being made, whether he is supposed to spit back the phrasing in the book, or add in his own knowledge from elsewhere, or give his opinion or give the opinion the teacher is teaching, or infer something. This is difficult to determine if you haven't had lots of experience. Often, the questions are poorly worded, making the problem even worse.

 

Science is tricky because it is complex enough that it is easy to read the textbook and get distracted by one aspect and ignore the others. It is also easy to read the textbook and feel that you have understood it only to discover on the exam that you didn't make the necessary links between all the material. There isn't really time to do that on the exam. You have to have done it beforehand as part of the problem set or while studying.

 

I can think of several things you can do, but your son may not be willing to do them. You can sit down together with the textbook, read a paragraph, and then have your son narrate it back to you. Do the same with any processes. Can he explain how something works, in words? Can he define the terms in his own words? If he can't, have him read the paragraph again. If he still can't do it, explain it to him. Then have him read it again and try again to tell you what it said. Then cover your ears when he yells at you that he just did that and it is stupid and he gets it. Then try again. If you can manage to do this together, it will help immensely because you are right there to say things like "not quite" and "what else" and to give examples.

 

You can make sure your son knows how to memorize something and keep it memorized with some sort of review schedule. I'm sure he can effortlessly memorize no end of things - if he wants to remember them. It is much harder to learn to make oneself memorize something unpalatable and then keep working on it at intervals to keep it memorized.

 

The other thing you can do is get the book "What Smart Students Know" by Robinson. I like this book because of the examples. The author gives an example passage about geology, then an example set of notes, then examples of other things one can do with the notes in the process of studying them. In all likelihood, if your son does even some of that, he will do just fine on 9th grade biology. The bad part about using this book is that it seems pretty overwhelming. That part about all the different sorts of questions just boils down to really wanting to understand and really trying to understand the material, rather than just wanting to pass the test without really learning.

 

More hugs.

Nan

Edited January 23, 2012 by Nan in Mass

[Nan in Mass]

Both mine like using a white board and markers to study. They think better when colour is involved, and when they are standing, and when the writing is larger and easy to erase.

Nan

[8filltheheart]

Cleo,

 

You are not failing. Both you and your ds are learning areas that need addressing. It isn't time to throw your hands up in defeat, but to roll up your shirt sleeves and dig in.

 

Does your ds outline his chapters? Learning to decipher what are the important details and which are superfluous is a skill that must be learned. Outlining the chapters is a great to learn that skill (and will give you a concrete view what his thought processes are in deciding what to include and exclude in his outline. (My dd had a lot of trouble with this and outlining helped her tremendously.)

 

There is a huge difference between a 14 yr old and a 17/18 yo. (Think about how much your children changed between 2 and 5.....Really there is a dramatic shift.)

 

It will be ok. Hang in there.

[C_l_e_0..Q_c]

Couple of quick answers to give you more details.

 

We are using the tests that come with Kolbe Academy. They're not written by me, and I get a scoring sheet to help mark the exam. The tests are partly multiple choices and partly short questions or essay questions. My son can handle the multiple choices just fine.

In the short questions, he will only answer the first part. Usually there are up to 4 questions inside one question, like "what are the differences between this and that, list the advantages of one over the other, illustrate with a drawing and name the following parts in your drawing.".

He will list one difference and call it done. :banghead:

 

On the essay question, he will answer with one short sentence, if I'm lucky. Sometimes I get a yes or a no, for an essay question! We're working with IEW and Essay Voyage from MCT. He knows what an essay is, even though he finds them very difficult to write...

[TGHEALTHYMOM]

Thanks for all of the input: especially ones with some actual answers! I too have trouble with my son testing. I have ordered some practice tests and they don't contain much writing. And I do remember having some anxiety over some testing myself. Sometimes it was purely a lack of studying, others it was just a huge (5-6 hour test : in college) and most of the time it ended up well if I studied. I had a Chemistry tutor (free ) on campus.

This has made me realize I need to give more practice tests over the next few years with writing. :001_smile:

 

I also think that any student who is struggling needs to have at least one person to go over the problem and see what is at the root: anxiety, lack of study, lack of testing ( to practice), lack of writing skills.

[Teachin'Mine]

Have you ever asked him to give his essay answers orally? That will at least help to pinpoint if it's just the actual writing of the essay, or if it's also forming the ideas into a coherent essay. Is this your first year with Kolbe? I know that when we started with Seton, the first year was a learning experience for how to answer things completely. Dd still finds that occasionally she'll leave off part of what was asked, but in 8th grade it was much more often. IOW if he has the knowledge, and he's new to this type of testing, it may just be a matter of time and practice. You are not failing! He is not failing! He's learning. :grouphug:

[Nan in Mass]

I had mine reread the question, write a number next to it indicating how many things he has to answer, and then and lightly cross off the part of the questions that he has answered when he has answered it. My 21yo still writes the number of parts next to the questions on his college tests. In order to get more than a yes or a no answer, you can give him a list of question words: who what when where why how. He has to make sure that he answers those. He also has to avoid pronouns. He has to restate the question in his answer. (Why is the sky blue? The sky is blue because ...) And he has to give examples. While he is learning to do this, it might be helpful to give him some starter phrases like "This means blank" that he can use after he has given an example or explained how something works. Mine are always extremely frustrated with questions that require them to state the obvious.

 

Believe me, you aren't alone in struggling with this.

 

Nan

[Teachin'Mine]

I had mine reread the question, write a number next to it indicating how many things he has to answer, and then and lightly cross off the part of the questions that he has answered when he has answered it. My 21yo still writes the number of parts next to the questions on his college tests. In order to get more than a yes or a no answer, you can give him a list of question words: who what when where why how. He has to make sure that he answers those. He also has to avoid pronouns. He has to restate the question in his answer. (Why is the sky blue? The sky is blue because ...) And he has to give examples. While he is learning to do this, it might be helpful to give him some starter phrases like "This means blank" that he can use after he has given an example or explained how something works. Mine are always extremely frustrated with questions that require them to state the obvious.

 

Believe me, you aren't alone in struggling with this.

 

Nan

 

That is brilliant!!! :)

[C_l_e_0..Q_c]

Thanks, everyone

I think I have a plan for next time he does that exam (tomorrow is co-op day, and Wednesday is ski day).

 

I will have him do the essay questions, one at a time, orally, then taking notes from what he tells me (him taking notes) and finishing with him writing it down. He HATES writing, be it at the computer or not.

 

And I will have him write in pencil the number of subquestions to be answered, and scratch them out. That's just brilliant.

 

I was a great test taker, so I don't think of all these tricks. I SO depend on you all.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Have you ever answered the questions on a test to show him what you think a standard answer would be? I'm working up a sample essay for my kids for lit, just to show them what I think it should look like.

 

Are the questions pretty predictable? DH had one class in college that started with the prof writing a list of 15-25 names, terms or events on the board. He would go on to discuss them at some point in the lecture. The midterm and finals included a large number of these terms. Students had to define and explain them in a short paragraph. I think there were about 250-350 to know by the end of the course.

 

But the point is that they knew ahead of time what the important terms and ideas were, so they could have them pre-defined and put into context. The test was a matter of recall and writing, not for synthesis (at least for this portion of the test).

 

So has he been working with this course long enough that he could predict what sort of questions would be on the test? Maybe he could work through some possible answers to likely questions as part of his review.

[Trilliums]

If you haven't done much textbook science before, you may have the added problem that your son is inexperienced answering textbook questions. What looks obvious to those of us who grew up in school just plain is not to anyone who didn't. To answer a question, the student needs to know what assumptions are being made, whether he is supposed to spit back the phrasing in the book, or add in his own knowledge from elsewhere, or give his opinion or give the opinion the teacher is teaching, or infer something. This is difficult to determine if you haven't had lots of experience. Often, the questions are poorly worded, making the problem even worse.

 

 

More hugs.

Nan

 

 

This was true for my kids and a big surprise to me. I read a question in a textbook and quickly focus in on the bare bones information to answer the question. My kids, however, want to hash over all the 'what ifs', especially for social studies and science.

[Amy in TX]

I have no advice to add to all that's been given, but I just wanted to chime in: you are NOT failing! You are doing an EXCELLENT job. No parent could be more on top of things than you appear to be. I don't know why we do this, but I also have that trumpet in my head that periodically blares, "You have FAILED at homeschooling!" Sigh. Try not to listen to it.

 

 

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

[Colleen in NS]

I feel like I'm failing at least.

 

 

No, you are way too smart to be failing at teaching.

 

Does your ds outline his chapters? Learning to decipher what are the important details and which are superfluous is a skill that must be learned. Outlining the chapters is a great to learn that skill (and will give you a concrete view what his thought processes are in deciding what to include and exclude in his outline.

 

:iagree:, great content-area study skill.

 

He HATES writing, be it at the computer or not.

 

 

I know you didn't ask for suggestions about this, but I'll ask anyway...have you considered having him go through SWB's new course called Writing With Skill? Though, it's written in English - not sure if he could do that? I just ask because WWS is so much MORE than just concrete lessons on skills talked about in WTM logic stage, or even on her writing audio lectures. It really gets kids thinking about the details (and asking questions about) about their reading. And then teaching them how to "output" from their reading. It covers a variety of skills - a review of narration, then teaching one and two level outlining, how to write a chronological narrative, a descriptions of various kinds, narratives of scientific descriptions, etc.. It's fantastic. I esp. like the lessons on scientific writing. SWB is hoping to publish one level per year, so I hope the second level is out by next fall. My son is working through it, and she mentioned in a thread that her then-14 year old (in the fall) was working through it. She also gave someone on that thread a possible plan for WWS through high school, and then doing a scaled down (from WTM, anyway) rhetoric study.

 

You are not failing at all!!:)

[Laura Corin]

And he has to give examples.

 

I taught Calvin to answer exam questions for the GCSEs. I went through old examiners' reports to see exactly what they wanted. The keys were: state your answer; expand on your answer; give an example (or quotation) to support your answer; conclude your answer.

 

This was the format for short answers. Essays were essentially an expanded version of the same thing (with each paragraph containing those elements).

 

Laura

[Nan in Mass]

I taught Calvin to answer exam questions for the GCSEs. I went through old examiners' reports to see exactly what they wanted. The keys were: state your answer; expand on your answer; give an example (or quotation) to support your answer; conclude your answer.

 

This was the format for short answers. Essays were essentially an expanded version of the same thing (with each paragraph containing those elements).

 

Laura

 

How helpful! I wish I'd had this when I was trying to teach mine to answer essay questions! This is very important. At first, mine just sort of floated around the point, exploring an extreme what-if case or side issue and then deciding they had written enough and demonstrated that they understood the material and moving on to the next question without ever addressing the most typical or basic situation. They had trouble believing that that is really what was being asked for, and trouble doing it once I finally convinced them that they weren't supposed to demonstrate new thinking unless the question specifically asked for them to speculate or extrapolate or project or for their opinion. And then when the question did ask them to make some sort of guess as to what would happen, they tended to declare that they could guess but that that wasn't very scientific and refuse to do it. Sigh. I had to work hard to convince them to make educated guesses. My father used to tell me to "play stupid" on exams to keep me from going down the what-if rabbit trails, and to think about what the exam writer probably meant rather than assume the exam writer was covering every possiblility and writing multiple choice answers that were absolutely true or false.

 

Nan

Edited January 24, 2012 by Nan in Mass