lap dogs: born or made?

[lorrainejmc]

I'm always hearing dog people complain about those who have very small breeds treating them like babies and carrying them around, dressing them etc. The assumption is that the dog has been made this way and is against their doggie instinct.

 

I have been a small breed owner for 17 years. My latest addition is a 3.5 pound chihuahua. She was already 2 yrs old when we got her. She had a tough life on a puppy farm. She was kept outside with about 30 other dogs in a filthy barn. Her nails were curled under her feet and her ears were torn and infected. Certainly no pampered life. But here we are, 8 months along and she practically lives inside my sweater.

 

So, if we have created lap dogs, how come this dog has become one at an age when habits/behavior should have already been established?

[mooooom]

In the Middle Ages, women wanted their own dogs (as opposed to the mens' hunting dogs) - there is one breed that they kept in their, large, sleeves. I believe in parts of the Far East it was similar. We have a 9.5lb poodle who is a lovely mix of a hardy little fellow and a major snuggler. I think people should lighten up. You can't carry around a dog all day if the dog wants to get down.

[Carrie12345]

They're born, imo. My 95lb Shepherd mix thinks he's a lap dog. The baby does not much appreciated when his lap is the target. :tongue_smilie:

[snickelfritz]

Born. My 6 pound Maltese follows me....literally.... Everywhere I go. Kitchen, bathroom, outside, inside.... He is right by my feet and as soon as I sit, he jumps in my lap. I didn't train him that way, other than letting him in my lap. His personality has him much more attached to us than any dog I have ever owned before. He gets separation anxiety and will start pooping in the house and his crate if he is upset.

 

If we have to shave him in winter, due to mats, he even gets a sweater to go outside.

 

Our boxer is also allowed on the couch, but she is just a more independent dog. She will, gasp, go jump on the couch to nap by herself. That's something that my Maltese would NEVER do.

Edited December 20, 2011 by snickelfritz

[RoughCollie]

Many small dogs were bred for companionship to the upper class or royalty. I think it is part of their inherited temperament to be lap dogs if they have that opportunity.

 

As far as people complaining about small dogs, I think it is because they haven't had experience with them. All dogs are not alike. I've had two terriers, a hound, and a herding dog, and I've been well-acquainted with dogs from every group except the toy group. From my experience, the breed groups are a lot different from one another, which makes sense since they are categorized for a reason.

 

I have noticed that some people who are unfamiliar with the toy breeds think of them as not being "real dogs", and this formerly included me. I met a 2.5 pound, fully grown Yorkie who was owned by the breeder from whom we bought Aidan. I had to remind myself that even though she didn't look like a "real dog", she didn't know that. I treated her like a dog, and lo and behold, she was one - albeit in a tiny package.

 

When we got Aidan, he weighed 7.5 lbs. I was very surprised that I liked having a tiny dog, even though it didn't last long. For the first time, I understood a little bit why people like dogs from the toy group, and I think I would enjoy having one. He was never a lap dog, though. I tried to get him to be one, but it was like holding a barracuda. He likes a few cuddles here and there, but he vastly prefers active playtime and getting into everything.

 

His breed is a very affectionate one. I envisioned that as meaning he would sit next to me on the couch or in my lap while I read. Nope. It means he will bowl me over with kisses, and sit on my head before bouncing off to dance around before attacking me with kisses again.

 

Aidan does follow me everywhere, which is a trait of his that I like very much.

 

I figure that some dogs like to wear clothes. Aidan likes his coat and his sweater. He's a stubborn fellow, but not dumb -- he doesn't like to be cold and wet at the same time. Our collie, OTOH, took off the raincoat I bought him and refused to wear it. Because of his double coat and hair type, he did not need help in that respect.

 

Maybe small dogs are more amenable to being clothed simply because of their pleasant, agreeable temperaments. There certainly are a lot of well-dressed tiny dogs around. I was highly tempted to buy Aidan a wardrobe when we first got him. It would have been a waste of money since he grew so fast, but if I had a small dog, I would buy him clothes just for fun, along with something to carry it around in.

 

I think your chihuahua is very fortunate. Because of you, she is living the life she was meant to have.

Edited December 20, 2011 by RoughCollie

[SweetMissMagnolia]

never was a dog person till I got my min pin--love her to death and if I would hold her all day she would be in my lap all day LOL.....she follows me everywhere and is a mommy's:D dog for the most part....could be the personality also....

[astrid]

Awww...your poor sweet pup! I'm so glad he's got a warm lap (sweater) in which to snuggle now!

 

My thoughts on small "lap" dogs are as follows:

 

1. The coddling, dressing, etc. does not foster a healthy relationship, in a language the dog "understands." Big or small, dogs are wired a certain way to understand their own specific brand of body language. You may not speak Inuit, but I bet you could tell if you met an angry one on a highway in Alaska! Dogs are not human babies, and by always carrying them around, picking them up, constantly reassuring them when they quiver, owners are not allowing them to develop the self-confidence and ability to assess situations and react appropriately. These are skills dogs need. For instance: Dog quivers and freaks out when he sees a man, another dog, whatever freaks him out. By picking him up, cooing and petting, you're actually reinforcing that fear. He learns that the fearful behavior is actually what you WANT. It's reinforced. Then this behavior often turns into resource guarding, with YOU and YOUR LAP as the resource. Your toddler falls down and scrapes his knee. He naturally goes to you and seeks comfort, so you pull him up on your lap. "UH, NO WAY!" says tiny lap dog. "This is MY LAP! You hear me?! MINE!" and since lap dog sees himself as a)owning the lap and b) higher in pack than toddler because he's always higher in space (on the couch, in your arms, etc.) then he feels he has ever right to rip into toddler's face. Not cool.

 

Also, when they're thought of as human babies, they're often fed food that's completely inappropriate and unhealthy for them. Allowed to eat at the table, fed by hand, etc. This sets up lots of food guarding issues as well, but are often overlooked because the dog can easily be picked up and the situation dealt with.

 

2. As a big dog owner, it just burns me up when I see little dogs going completely ballistic: snarling, growling, barking, pulling, exhibiting "I WANT TO KILL YOU!!!" behavior as people, cars or other dogs go by. 99 times out of 100, they are not reprimanded for this, or if they are, it's a half-hearted "Oh, Fifi, stop it!" and then picked up. If MY dogs acted like that, they'd be a menace to society. So we work really hard on socialization and training what is appropriate behavior and what is not.

 

So that's my rant. I have nothing against small dogs, as long as they're properly trained, socialized and regarded as dogs first, babies second. But that's just the trainer in me speaking. YMMV. Dont' throw tomatoes; my Corgi will eat them! :D

 

astrid

[lorrainejmc]

This dog is such a darling. She is nothing like the horrid, spoiled creatures as described by Astrid. :lol: She sits on my lap a lot but is never aggressive to anyone, even when they come really close, accepts strangers by sniffing then sits in their lap.:D I think she is just so cold all the time, poor thing. She is the 6th small dog I've had (and I currently have 5:001_huh:) and only the first one had some challenging behavior, but he came to us as a no longer wanted pet. He was a yorkie/chi.

 

We also fostered a yorkie last summer for 24 hrs. That's all I could take. He was only a year old and was more than I was prepared to handle; he leaped on my 15 yr old papillon and challenged every other dog. He also peed all over the house. My parents took him.

[lorrainejmc]

Awww...your poor sweet pup! I'm so glad he's got a warm lap (sweater) in which to snuggle now!

 

My thoughts on small "lap" dogs are as follows:

 

1. The coddling, dressing, etc. does not foster a healthy relationship, in a language the dog "understands." Big or small, dogs are wired a certain way to understand their own specific brand of body language. You may not speak Inuit, but I bet you could tell if you met an angry one on a highway in Alaska! Dogs are not human babies, and by always carrying them around, picking them up, constantly reassuring them when they quiver, owners are not allowing them to develop the self-confidence and ability to assess situations and react appropriately. These are skills dogs need. For instance: Dog quivers and freaks out when he sees a man, another dog, whatever freaks him out. By picking him up, cooing and petting, you're actually reinforcing that fear. He learns that the fearful behavior is actually what you WANT. It's reinforced. Then this behavior often turns into resource guarding, with YOU and YOUR LAP as the resource. Your toddler falls down and scrapes his knee. He naturally goes to you and seeks comfort, so you pull him up on your lap. "UH, NO WAY!" says tiny lap dog. "This is MY LAP! You hear me?! MINE!" and since lap dog sees himself as a)owning the lap and b) higher in pack than toddler because he's always higher in space (on the couch, in your arms, etc.) then he feels he has ever right to rip into toddler's face. Not cool.

 

Also, when they're thought of as human babies, they're often fed food that's completely inappropriate and unhealthy for them. Allowed to eat at the table, fed by hand, etc. This sets up lots of food guarding issues as well, but are often overlooked because the dog can easily be picked up and the situation dealt with.

 

2. As a big dog owner, it just burns me up when I see little dogs going completely ballistic: snarling, growling, barking, pulling, exhibiting "I WANT TO KILL YOU!!!" behavior as people, cars or other dogs go by. 99 times out of 100, they are not reprimanded for this, or if they are, it's a half-hearted "Oh, Fifi, stop it!" and then picked up. If MY dogs acted like that, they'd be a menace to society. So we work really hard on socialization and training what is appropriate behavior and what is not.

 

So that's my rant. I have nothing against small dogs, as long as they're properly trained, socialized and regarded as dogs first, babies second. But that's just the trainer in me speaking. YMMV. Dont' throw tomatoes; my Corgi will eat them! :D

 

astrid

 

I totally agree. It drives me nuts to see small dogs getting away with aggression like it's cute.

[hillfarm]

We have a pug. A breed that doesn't hunt, doesn't guard, doesn't protect, doesn't pull, doesn't chase, doesn't retrieve, doesn't track... They have been bred for centuries to be lap dogs.

 

Ours revels in her breed description and especially this time of year, is always in search of a lap/nap combo. She seems to be working hard daily to improve her breed specific abilities. I estimate that she spends approximately 75% of her non-asleep-with-dd-in-bed time in someone's lap or on the seat next to them.

 

Seriously though, I know some pugs do bark at strangers a bit and may show a few non-breed traits (ours actually likes to run agility, of all things) but for the most part, they seem to be lap sitters of the first order.

[sparrow]

I think they are born. We have a Shih-Tzu Maltese mix that is an absolute sweetheart, but not in a spoiled way. He just loves being with people :001_smile:.

 

 

Awww...your poor sweet pup! I'm so glad he's got a warm lap (sweater) in which to snuggle now!

 

My thoughts on small "lap" dogs are as follows:

 

1. The coddling, dressing, etc. does not foster a healthy relationship, in a language the dog "understands." Big or small, dogs are wired a certain way to understand their own specific brand of body language. You may not speak Inuit, but I bet you could tell if you met an angry one on a highway in Alaska! Dogs are not human babies, and by always carrying them around, picking them up, constantly reassuring them when they quiver, owners are not allowing them to develop the self-confidence and ability to assess situations and react appropriately. These are skills dogs need. For instance: Dog quivers and freaks out when he sees a man, another dog, whatever freaks him out. By picking him up, cooing and petting, you're actually reinforcing that fear. He learns that the fearful behavior is actually what you WANT. It's reinforced. Then this behavior often turns into resource guarding, with YOU and YOUR LAP as the resource. Your toddler falls down and scrapes his knee. He naturally goes to you and seeks comfort, so you pull him up on your lap. "UH, NO WAY!" says tiny lap dog. "This is MY LAP! You hear me?! MINE!" and since lap dog sees himself as a)owning the lap and b) higher in pack than toddler because he's always higher in space (on the couch, in your arms, etc.) then he feels he has ever right to rip into toddler's face. Not cool.

 

Also, when they're thought of as human babies, they're often fed food that's completely inappropriate and unhealthy for them. Allowed to eat at the table, fed by hand, etc. This sets up lots of food guarding issues as well, but are often overlooked because the dog can easily be picked up and the situation dealt with.

 

2. As a big dog owner, it just burns me up when I see little dogs going completely ballistic: snarling, growling, barking, pulling, exhibiting "I WANT TO KILL YOU!!!" behavior as people, cars or other dogs go by. 99 times out of 100, they are not reprimanded for this, or if they are, it's a half-hearted "Oh, Fifi, stop it!" and then picked up. If MY dogs acted like that, they'd be a menace to society. So we work really hard on socialization and training what is appropriate behavior and what is not.

 

So that's my rant. I have nothing against small dogs, as long as they're properly trained, socialized and regarded as dogs first, babies second. But that's just the trainer in me speaking. YMMV. Dont' throw tomatoes; my Corgi will eat them! :D

 

astrid

 

As a medium and small dog owner, this drives me bonkers, too.

 

We just spent the weekend with my in-laws that have an absolute TERROR of a toy poodle. She was a puppy mill breeder that was rescued, so I was willing to give her the benefit of doubt, but oh. my. goodness. that dog is awful. She barked at all of us, including my in-laws (her owners!) incessantly. Our kids were told to "walk quietly" across the living room after the little snot aggressively charged my daughter and grabbed the hem of her jeans :glare:. We had told our kids to "ignore and avoid" after hearing that our niece had been bitten twice at Thanksgiving (nothing serious, but still- bites!), but she still came after them. My in-laws just pooh-poohed all of it and encouraged the kids to play tug with her :001_huh:. Apparently, they think it's cute that she's trying, and succeeding, in her little dominance games.

 

It's a shame. She's a super cute dog, but I also think she's the first dog that I literally cannot stand. My husband is terrified that since his parents are up in years, something will happen to them, and we'll end up with her :tongue_smilie:.

[mooooom]

it's pure fear. He was attacked three times as a puppy while on leash and he no longer feels safe when he sees something coming until he realizes it is not a threat to him. I feel so badly about it, and we do work with him, but it is not always possible to completely undo what has been done.

[EmilyinND]

I think it could be a little of both. I have a non-cuddler & a cuddler. Our Springer was born a big baby & is a lap dog (although, we haven't discouraged it.)

[Rose in BC]

My 85 pound Bernese mountain dog is our giant lap dog!

[Wabi Sabi]

We just spent the weekend with my in-laws that have an absolute TERROR of a toy poodle. She was a puppy mill breeder that was rescued, so I was willing to give her the benefit of doubt, but oh. my. goodness. that dog is awful. She barked at all of us, including my in-laws (her owners!) incessantly. Our kids were told to "walk quietly" across the living room after the little snot aggressively charged my daughter and grabbed the hem of her jeans :glare:. We had told our kids to "ignore and avoid" after hearing that our niece had been bitten twice at Thanksgiving (nothing serious, but still- bites!), but she still came after them. My in-laws just pooh-poohed all of it and encouraged the kids to play tug with her :001_huh:. Apparently, they think it's cute that she's trying, and succeeding, in her little dominance games.

 

It's a shame. She's a super cute dog, but I also think she's the first dog that I literally cannot stand. My husband is terrified that since his parents are up in years, something will happen to them, and we'll end up with her :tongue_smilie:.

 

What is it with MILs and their toy poodles? Like you, MIL's nervous, yippy, non-house trained poodle is the first dog I absolutely cannot stand. I'm a dog person myself so that's saying a lot.

[Ellie]

Awww...your poor sweet pup! I'm so glad he's got a warm lap (sweater) in which to snuggle now!

 

My thoughts on small "lap" dogs are as follows:

 

1. The coddling, dressing, etc. does not foster a healthy relationship, in a language the dog "understands." Big or small, dogs are wired a certain way to understand their own specific brand of body language. You may not speak Inuit, but I bet you could tell if you met an angry one on a highway in Alaska! Dogs are not human babies, and by always carrying them around, picking them up, constantly reassuring them when they quiver, owners are not allowing them to develop the self-confidence and ability to assess situations and react appropriately. These are skills dogs need. For instance: Dog quivers and freaks out when he sees a man, another dog, whatever freaks him out. By picking him up, cooing and petting, you're actually reinforcing that fear. He learns that the fearful behavior is actually what you WANT. It's reinforced. Then this behavior often turns into resource guarding, with YOU and YOUR LAP as the resource. Your toddler falls down and scrapes his knee. He naturally goes to you and seeks comfort, so you pull him up on your lap. "UH, NO WAY!" says tiny lap dog. "This is MY LAP! You hear me?! MINE!" and since lap dog sees himself as a)owning the lap and b) higher in pack than toddler because he's always higher in space (on the couch, in your arms, etc.) then he feels he has ever right to rip into toddler's face. Not cool.

 

Also, when they're thought of as human babies, they're often fed food that's completely inappropriate and unhealthy for them. Allowed to eat at the table, fed by hand, etc. This sets up lots of food guarding issues as well, but are often overlooked because the dog can easily be picked up and the situation dealt with.

 

2. As a big dog owner, it just burns me up when I see little dogs going completely ballistic: snarling, growling, barking, pulling, exhibiting "I WANT TO KILL YOU!!!" behavior as people, cars or other dogs go by. 99 times out of 100, they are not reprimanded for this, or if they are, it's a half-hearted "Oh, Fifi, stop it!" and then picked up. If MY dogs acted like that, they'd be a menace to society. So we work really hard on socialization and training what is appropriate behavior and what is not.

 

So that's my rant. I have nothing against small dogs, as long as they're properly trained, socialized and regarded as dogs first, babies second. But that's just the trainer in me speaking. YMMV. Dont' throw tomatoes; my Corgi will eat them! :D

 

astrid

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

The dog breed most often on "The Dog Whisperer:" chihuauas. Not pit bulls, not rottweilers, not any other big fierce dog you'd imagine. Who knew?

[itsheresomewhere]

My 85 pound Bernese mountain dog is our giant lap dog!

 

Our Bernese thinks she is a tiny lap dog, too.

[astrid]

We just spent the weekend with my in-laws that have an absolute TERROR of a toy poodle. She was a puppy mill breeder that was rescued, so I was willing to give her the benefit of doubt, but oh. my. goodness. that dog is awful. She barked at all of us, including my in-laws (her owners!) incessantly. Our kids were told to "walk quietly" across the living room after the little snot aggressively charged my daughter and grabbed the hem of her jeans :glare:. We had told our kids to "ignore and avoid" after hearing that our niece had been bitten twice at Thanksgiving (nothing serious, but still- bites!), but she still came after them. My in-laws just pooh-poohed all of it and encouraged the kids to play tug with her :001_huh:. Apparently, they think it's cute that she's trying, and succeeding, in her little dominance games.

 

It's a shame. She's a super cute dog, but I also think she's the first dog that I literally cannot stand. My husband is terrified that since his parents are up in years, something will happen to them, and we'll end up with her :tongue_smilie:.

 

WHAT a nightmare!!! Oh, I think she needs to come to Astrid's Boot Camp for a week. Her life would change DRASTICALLY! ;)

 

As far as I"m concerned, "Cujo" was totally miscast as a St. Bernard. Should have been a teeny, tiny little Chihuahua poodle mix. :D

 

astrid

[Nakia]

Well, let me say my sweet and precious little Diesel (a Yorkie) will NEVER be such a naughty boy. ;)

[astrid]

No, Nakia...I am CERTAIN he will not be! :D

 

Enjoy him!

 

astrid

[DarlaS]

My 85 pound Bernese mountain dog is our giant lap dog!

 

:lol:

 

 

I have a German Shepherd snoring next to me on the sofa right now. It's actually a little hard to type with his ginormous head wedged under my arm.

 

He's not even MY dog! :tongue_smilie:

 

(But he's so nice and warm. :001_wub:)

[Homemama2]

My 85 pound Bernese mountain dog is our giant lap dog!

 

:iagree: Our Bernese mountain dog is over 100 lbs and he 'sneaks' onto our laps as often as possible. He's so funny...he's comes up next to us on the couch, looks the other way (cuz he's sneaky like that!) then plops his butt on our lap. He's so tall he doesn't have to jump.

[AK_Mom4]

I have two giant monster puppies here who would have liked to have been lapdogs. Since that is SO NOT ALLOWED here, they are my under-the-recliner or under-the-desk dogs. It would be a very odd day indeed if they were inside and not lying down within 6 feet of someone.

[Annie Laurie]

Maybe small dogs are more amenable to being clothed simply because of their pleasant, agreeable temperaments. There certainly are a lot of well-dressed tiny dogs around. I was highly tempted to buy Aidan a wardrobe when we first got him. It would have been a waste of money since he grew so fast, but if I had a small dog, I would buy him clothes just for fun, along with something to carry it around in.

 

 

My dd would love to dress our chihuahua and has tried to put sweaters on him when it's cold, but he just takes them right off. So I guess some small breed dogs don't like clothes. But see, they can let you know when they don't want to wear them, so I don't think any dog is being tortured if they have clothes on, they do know how to get them off. (Like you mentioned with your collie too).

[Annie Laurie]

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

The dog breed most often on "The Dog Whisperer:" chihuauas. Not pit bulls, not rottweilers, not any other big fierce dog you'd imagine. Who knew?

 

I believe it! I have a chi mix, we got him from a rescue when he was 2, and I stupidly had not done my research on chihuahuas. They are not a great match with kids from what I've read since. But my dog, maybe because I think he's a mix, is very good to my kids and always has been. He's 13 now. He does have issues though with going ballistic around other dogs, which I do not like about him. I attributed that to his being 2 when we got him and not properly socialized to other dogs as a puppy. But maybe all chihuahuas have this inferiority complex?