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Interesting article in Rolling Stone Magazine on profoundly gifted students


Nart
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There is an article in the Dec. 8th, 2011 issue in Rolling Stone Magazine (issue 1145) about a profoundly gifted thirteen year old attending a top engineering college. The article is entitled "Santiago's Brain - He knew the alphabet by two, fractions by four, and entered college at eleven. What happens to a kid who's too smart for school?"

There are so many articles that are anti- grade acceleration, so I thought it was fascinating to read a really pro-acceleration one. The article profiles Santiago and also delves into how the education system is failing profoundly gifted kids.

 

I didn't know Rolling Stone magazine has articles that are not about music. My husband left it on our nightstand for me to read thinking I might be interested in it since I am a school psychologist. Now he might be getting a subscription to the magazine for Christmas.

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I wish there was more press as to how the schools are failing the brightest academic students. It really is sad. It doesn't mean other students don't deserve a fabulous education, but the reality is that the majority of the brightest students have to wait until at least middle school to be able to take academically advanced classes. And even those are a joke half the time - our local school district is big into pushing algebra for most students, so a bunch of kids who still can't do basic math get put into the algebra classes. Then the teacher spends a lot of class time trying to bring the lower half of the class up to speed, which (once again) the brightest kids wait.

 

It is easy to see why gifted kids drop out of school.

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I wish there was more press as to how the schools are failing the brightest academic students. It really is sad. It doesn't mean other students don't deserve a fabulous education, but the reality is that the majority of the brightest students have to wait until at least middle school to be able to take academically advanced classes. And even those are a joke half the time - our local school district is big into pushing algebra for most students, so a bunch of kids who still can't do basic math get put into the algebra classes. Then the teacher spends a lot of class time trying to bring the lower half of the class up to speed, which (once again) the brightest kids wait.

 

It is easy to see why gifted kids drop out of school.

 

That is the point of the whole article. The student they profiled was at a gifted school outside of Denver for elementary school. From the article

 

"But the fifth grade curriculum turned out to be harshly retrograde for Santiago-he found almost all of it uninstructive - and the teacher made none of the adjustments that had previously proved indispensable. In algebra, the class spent a year on the first half of the book. That summer Santiago completed the second half in 16 hours. A unit on the history of the Earth taught him less than he had learned when he was four; a unit on Colorado history taught him less than when he was seven."

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That is the point of the whole article. The student they profiled was at a gifted school outside of Denver for elementary school.

 

Apparently I can't access this article without a subscription (or maybe next week when I go back to the grocery...). Does the article mention the school by name or district or other more specific description? Private or public? There are only a limited number of schools that it could be and I'd love to know.

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I have to try to get my hands on this. This has always been a problem for my older son. He's not as profoundly gifted as Santiago, but he has spent countless hours bored out of his mind even in advanced classes. What a waste of human potential for all the gifted kids sitting around, wasting their time while the class covers material they already know.

 

Sadly public schools have no incentive to maximize potential in their brightest students.

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I thought of this thread last night in the middle of the night (don't ask me why). What triggered it is that I was at a friend's home yesterday, and this friend's dd is in the same grade as my ds. Her dd was doing her math homework and I stole a look at the page. I was a little shocked - it was really basic (it seemed to me) math for a 3rd grader - stuff my son was doing two years ago in SM (ds is gifted). There were 10 problems, with items like 12/2 = ?. 3 x 5 = ? The one word problem was simplistic.

 

I came home and thought about ds and how utterly, completely miserable and depressed he was in first grade (before we pulled him). I thought of how much he enjoys challenges in math (even though he complains mightily about them) and how miserable he would be and how wasted his abilities would be if he were in school right now. And then I thought of all the gifted kids that have to sit through this cr*p, day after day, doing work that is YEARS behind them, all just to make it easier/better for someone else. If I was a single parent, or if I HAD to work to keep food on the table (as quite a number of parents have to do these days), we wouldn't have a choice - my son would be in public school, probably being harassed about his poor attitude and his lack of ability to "get along" in class.

 

It is very, very sad how we (speaking generally) have shunted out brightest kids out into the cold intellectually.

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Apparently I can't access this article without a subscription (or maybe next week when I go back to the grocery...). Does the article mention the school by name or district or other more specific description? Private or public? There are only a limited number of schools that it could be and I'd love to know.

There is a reprint here, at NewsOrganizer. The formatting is annoying, at least in my browser, but all the words are there!;)

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  • 5 weeks later...

Thanks so much for posting!

 

The "whole child" thing scares me because we just toured the gifted charter we have available, and they praised this way of teaching. DS was in Montessori for a year, but we pulled him, because they were concentrating so much on bringing his weaknesses up to the level of his strengths that they were ignoring his strengths. He strung beads and played with tongs all day and he was miserable.

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Apparently I can't access this article without a subscription (or maybe next week when I go back to the grocery...). Does the article mention the school by name or district or other more specific description? Private or public? There are only a limited number of schools that it could be and I'd love to know.

 

It was the Mackintosh Academy.

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I don't necessarily think my DD is gifted, just that our local public school is behind. We originally started homeschooling to give DD a leg-up in public school, but it's proceeded to the point where I don't feel we would be able to enroll her into kindergarten this fall without feeling extremely guilty. My sister is a public school teacher, so I have a little inside knowledge of our school. They have cut all gifted programs and increased funding for Title programs (what remedial programs are called in our state). We could probably have DD enter first grade instead of kindergarten, but I really don't think that's best for her. So, we've set course for continued homeschooling.

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They have cut all gifted programs

 

So, so many school districts have done this. All the money is going to help the at-risk students (which, don't get me wrong, I'm glad that these students are getting help).

 

But I can't help thinking of all the talented students that will never have their needs met or ever have the possibility of rising to their potential. There aren't a lot of parents who really understand their local school and how to assess whether their own child's needs are being met, and a lot of parents either don't want to hs or aren't able to. For needy families or single-parent families, having a gifted child must be miserable. Ps doesn't/can't work and there are no other options. And gifted students have a surprisingly high drop-out rate - in my MS Ed classes, I was told that it is almost as high as that for at-risk students.

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So, so many school districts have done this. All the money is going to help the at-risk students (which, don't get me wrong, I'm glad that these students are getting help).

 

 

As another side note . . . in the two districts that border me, they do not do special ed testing anymore . . . none at all. You have to take your child somewhere and get a doctors order that they need special help, before they will give it.

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Just as a side note... if you are interested in another, similar article, check out: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2007/12/01/ST2007120102004.html

The Baldwin program is the one that my eldest entered last year.

 

Laughing.

 

The girl profiled in this article was my daughter's first roommate at MBC.

 

Is your daughter a PEG now?

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So, so many school districts have done this. All the money is going to help the at-risk students (which, don't get me wrong, I'm glad that these students are getting help).

 

But I can't help thinking of all the talented students that will never have their needs met or ever have the possibility of rising to their potential. There aren't a lot of parents who really understand their local school and how to assess whether their own child's needs are being met, and a lot of parents either don't want to hs or aren't able to. For needy families or single-parent families, having a gifted child must be miserable. Ps doesn't/can't work and there are no other options. And gifted students have a surprisingly high drop-out rate - in my MS Ed classes, I was told that it is almost as high as that for at-risk students.

 

 

I think the PS lingo behind this is RTI. It comes from No Child Left Behind. So although I agree it is awful, please don't view it as something the public schools are doing because they necessarily want to. It's something that is being forced on a lot of them by NCLB rules.

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Guest RunnerGirl

I agree with NART....My husband and I received a comp. issue of Rolling Stone magazine, and I was surprised to find this incredible article in the midst of the musical debuts. As a junior high teacher, I often see students who truly should be working on advanced material in our classrooms. I have never quite experienced the exceptionality of Santiago; however, it caused me to give a briefing of the article to my colleagues and principal so we could do our part with our gifted students in their own level of passionate learning. Kudos to Rolling Stone for a great article. I, too, just might be looking for a subscription!

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I have a very bright kid. But there is no way I will let him go to college early. the unnecessary attention and what the kid will miss out in college, I think it will screw them up for life.

 

That reminds me of what so many people say about homeschooling.

 

As far as unnecessary attention, articles like the one mentioned in the thread are a choice not a mandated part of the early college experience.

 

Kids are all one different. One kid's "early" is another kids "finally".

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That reminds me of what so many people say about homeschooling.

 

As far as unnecessary attention, articles like the one mentioned in the thread are a choice not a mandated part of the early college experience.

 

Kids are all one different. One kid's "early" is another kids "finally".

 

It also can depend on how much your child stands out. DH and I met in the CMU APEA program. I don't think most of DH's instructors ever realized he was an APEA student, because he was not physically substantially different from his classmates. But when I started, I was still pre-pubescent, and looked/sounded like a "kid genius"-so it was OBVIOUS I was APEA.

 

I do have to say that I'd prefer my DD to want to do online options or something local rather than leaving home early for college, simply because I don't want to lose her so early. At 7, while I can look at the level she's working at in many subjects, and recognize that it's highly likely that she WILL be ready for college coursework about the time most kids are ready to start high school, I can't imagine her being ready for college just because she IS so young now. But, at the same time, I really wonder how much my life would have been different if my parents hadn't completely refused to consider the PEG program at Mary Baldwin when it was strongly suggested for me, because middle school and high school were so horrible and my life was so much better once I was allowed to enter the APEA program and be with other gifted and just plain academically oriented kids my age. And that required going to college.

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But, at the same time, I really wonder how much my life would have been different if my parents hadn't completely refused to consider the PEG program at Mary Baldwin when it was strongly suggested for me, because middle school and high school were so horrible and my life was so much better once I was allowed to enter the APEA program and be with other gifted and just plain academically oriented kids my age. And that required going to college.

 

And that is exactly why we were willing to "lose" our daughter so early, because neither of us had the opportunity to go to a program like PEG. We were both beyond miserable in middle and high school, both burned out in different but equally spectacular ways, both brought an enormous amount of baggage into our adult lives as a result.

 

We didn't want that for our kids. And so we put our own want to hold on aside and let our daughter try doing it her way.

 

I would make the same decision again for our son if there were an appropriate program for him.

 

For what it's worth, by the way, my daughter felt the online thing was not enough. She was doing AP courses online here at home and was still bored and lonely. She really craved actual, in-person interaction with academic peers and instructors. Online was just not the same. And we tried every local campus looking for somewhere she could take at least a couple of classes. Every one of them turned us down because of her age. At some point, PEG became the only viable option.

 

It wasn't perfect, and she has mixed feelings about her experiences there. Primarily, she wishes strongly that she could have / would have transferred to more challenging school after her first year or two. But, at the time, she was attached to her friends and her life at MBC. I suspect it will be a few years before she can get enough perspective to really sort out her feelings.

Edited by Jenny in Florida
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Guest tokinouta

Wow, I've enjoyed reading this thread! I am new to this forum and it is great to see so many in the same spot as I am with my son. He quickly went from kindergarten to a gifted 1st grade program in our public school which I thought at the time was a lucky thing to have, I was thrilled, I had never had this option with my other kids. They gave a wonderful meeting on how fast paced it was, extraordinary, etc..... Well, half way through the year my son was bored out of his wits, straight A's and trying to move beyond his set level, which was about fourth grade math at the time. The teacher explained to me although this was a gifted program the children couldn't move beyond third grade math, they were only suppose to teach up to two years ahead. I almost passed out from laughter because of the big deal they made about the freedom to move ahead, etc, in the beginning. It was disappointing to me and my son to say the least.

 

At the end of his first grade year when he was now doing mostly fifth grade math or equivalent math and reading well beyond third grade level we took him out. He was doing just as much math on his free time at home while being bored and complaining about going to school. He got in trouble for trying to teach the others division because they weren't "there" yet. I guess the problem was, because it was a gifted class, they all wanted to learn it. lol

He caused a commotion and you know what happens in a uncontrolled gifted class. :lol::lol::D

 

We ran into a person who taught the gifted programs at Connections Academy. This is an online school you might already know about. She told us to give it a try with my son because not only do they have test based placement but they allow grade advancement. Long story short, he tested in and was placed in fourth grade gifted language, science and social studies as well as moved up to grade level six math. He is very happy with this as are we. I wanted to have some documentation as I had a hard time with my older ones without it.

 

If the traditional public schools are not going to make these advancements then it's nice that the newer eschools and charter schools might fill the need. I have home schooled before with my other two when I ran into this because I had no other options. It was hard as they got older to come up with curriculum. Then comes Khan Academy and others online. How wonderful! It's nice to see others with these problems and taking them into their own hands instead of letting the system run the show. :iagree:

The articles are great as well.

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I think the PS lingo behind this is RTI. It comes from No Child Left Behind. So although I agree it is awful, please don't view it as something the public schools are doing because they necessarily want to. It's something that is being forced on a lot of them by NCLB rules.

 

Yes, I'm familiar with the lingo. I have an M.S. Ed and am a certified elementary teacher. I think most teachers are fully hamstrung by the NCLB rules & the resulting administrative directives/pressure. However, that doesn't change the end result for the gifted students.

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Guest tokinouta

I agree, I think most gifted students are looked at like a man with so much money he's not sure what to do with it. Most won't bother fighting for investment advice. They are going to concentrate on the people without money.

While I see this point, I also think gifted parents don't come with all the free time it takes to fill this gap. It would be nice if we did but most of us just don't. It's hard to just let it slide, as is. Your child bored, making a fuss, getting into trouble. It needs to be addressed.

The largest contradiction ever! We need to turn out brighter students! lol When you have one you realize nobody tries to turn them out. lol ;)

If it's my job to turn out one of the brightest then it would be nice to keep my school taxes for resources to do so.

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It's amazing how little is out there. The programs that claim to be targeted at the gifted are not always adequate. My kids are nowhere near the abilities of some on this board..they're just ordinary gifted. But when they've attended enrichment courses, they have at times been bored. We did a talent search hoping to qualify for summer camp at a local university. Qualify? DS doubled the highest required score for any of the camps. Often the courses and camps offered look really cool...if he were only 2 years older. And then by the time he's old enough, we've already covered so much of whatever the topic is, I know he'd be bored (and it would be a waste of the very high cost of admission).

 

I guess the drawback of homeschooling is that we actually have time to pursue his interests :) but I'd sure like a few more opportunities for him outside the home.

 

Brownie

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I agree with NART....My husband and I received a comp. issue of Rolling Stone magazine, and I was surprised to find this incredible article in the midst of the musical debuts. As a junior high teacher, I often see students who truly should be working on advanced material in our classrooms. I have never quite experienced the exceptionality of Santiago; however, it caused me to give a briefing of the article to my colleagues and principal so we could do our part with our gifted students in their own level of passionate learning. Kudos to Rolling Stone for a great article. I, too, just might be looking for a subscription!

 

Interesting you teach jr. high because my husband teaches jr. high too! He has three periods of gifted students and one regular class and a double period intervention class. There are 42 students in one of his gifted English classes, so trying to individualize learning is tremendously difficult, particularly since NCLB. He used to be able to do literature units on novels but now he is supposed to use a scripted program even with the gifted students! Everyone is supposed to being doing the same unit at the same time.

 

I ended up giving him an envelope with the subscription card in it for Christmas and he told me that he would prefer to wait until after the semester is over to start the subscription because he has so much grading since semester grades are due soon.

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I'm beginning to feel sorry for PG kids. I can't seem to find many of places where my kids can fit in and be challenged, so I can't imagine.

 

I've been looking at cyber schools. The sample courses I looked at last night were completely underwhelming, but ds can't handle the workload of a kid 3yrs ahead of him, nor do I want him to. I'm not looking for straight acceleration.

 

I contacted our local talent search to see if they would let ds take camps for higher grade levels based on his test results. They said maybe with teacher permission, but he should be fine bc all the kids are advanced. They let in kids in the 95%ile and my kid was in the 99.9%ile. This again almost guarantees my kid is the smartest in the room if I place him at grade level. I've tried it...he's bored. The only way we've had success is to put him in a class with a 3 grade level span where he's in the youngest grade. It doesn't provide a lot of options.

 

I just want to provide opportunities for him to fit in besides our home! Non-academic activities are really the only option.

 

Brownie

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I just want to provide opportunities for him to fit in besides our home! Non-academic activities are really the only option.

 

Brownie

 

I don't know how old your son is, but we found by the time mine were eight or nine that even non-academic activities were problematic.

 

I mean, imagine it: how much fun would you have, as an adult, hanging out with and doing activities appropriate for, say, 12 year olds? Would that be something you'd want to do frequently? Would you be likely to make a lot of friends?

 

Well, that's the way many exceptionally gifted kids experience even extracurriculars.

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