Is there any reason to test to see if my son is gifted?

[kristinannie]

It is pretty obvious that my son is gifted, especially in math. He is 5. Is there any reason to get a HSed child tested? If he was in school, I would fight for the test so he could get into gifted classes, but I can't really see any reason to get him tested if I am schooling him at home. Is that right? Thanks!

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

It is pretty obvious that my son is gifted, especially in math. He is 5. Is there any reason to get a HSed child tested? If he was in school, I would fight for the test so he could get into gifted classes, but I can't really see any reason to get him tested if I am schooling him at home. Is that right? Thanks!

 

 

I don't see why there would be. I would get something like Kitchen Table math book 1 and book 2 though so you can go really deep instead of just keep going through the grades. Also this book might benefit him. I am planning on getting these for my 5 1/2 year old ds as well. He just picks up his math without problem. He will blow through 4-5 pages and get them all correct in 10 minutes or so (sometimes a bit longer because his handwriting is not nearly at the level of his math skills)

[abbeyej]

I think, generally speaking, gifted testing is much less important for home schooled kids, and generally superfluous. There are a few exceptions...

 

-- Kids who have some quirks and may well be both gifted and have LDs. They can be challenging to teach, and sometimes testing can give you a bit more of a map of how their brains work and how to use the gifts to work around the challenges.

 

-- Getting in to special programs. Summer programs, enrichment opportunities, etc. Even admission to certain schools.

 

-- Giving parents "permission" to make radical changes or radical acceleration in a child's curriculum.

 

I haven't found official documentation necessary. (Though ITBS and CogAT scores -- which my kids start taking in 3rd grade -- could back up my claims about my kids if I needed some basic documentation. These aren't as involved as what you would get with a full work-up, but they're often enough for entry into various supplemental gifted programs -- though others will expect full one-on-one IQ tests.)

 

We've managed to find enrichment opportunities all along the way that work well for my kids without requiring particular testing. Some of the "gifted" classes we've come across (Saturday morning classes, summer events), honestly just didn't have that much to offer. Or they were obscenely expensive. We've found that by looking into programs that "self-select" (chess classes, writing courses, museum-based activities), you often end up with the same group of peers that you would find in the courses that require tests for entry. ... Now, if you *can't* find those other types of opportunities, gifted-specific events may be helpful -- but we've found more intellectual peers through interest-based activities than through gifted-specific activities anyway.

 

Sometimes parents do need permission to make radical accelerations. They just don't feel comfortable moving forward and letting a 9yo do a high school math course, etc. In that case, testing can make them feel better about the choice...

[Snowfall]

Nice to see the thread hasn't gone completely insane with people telling you how horrible you are to even consider it, then stating that it sounds to them like your kid is but bright, but not gifted. That's pretty much what happened to me when I asked on the accelerated board, and when I dared to comment back I was accused of only looking for one answer and expecting pats on the backs for it. Look, if you think that your child has some issues that might be helped by your possession of this knowledge, then yes, DO IT. If you don't, then don't waste your time or money. For the record, the testing was very beneficial to us, as we found that my daughter actually is gifted (so much for the armchair psychologists around here, who can diagnose based on a couple sentences in one post), but 2E. So now we know why she seems so wicked smart (because she is) but has trouble with so many things (because her processing speed and working memory are so low). If you are or start to experience issues with school work, then I think it's worth it. If we hadn't had any problems we probably wouldn't have, but it was so, so, so worth it for us.

[kristinannie]

I think, generally speaking, gifted testing is much less important for home schooled kids, and generally superfluous. There are a few exceptions...

 

-- Kids who have some quirks and may well be both gifted and have LDs. They can be challenging to teach, and sometimes testing can give you a bit more of a map of how their brains work and how to use the gifts to work around the challenges.

 

-- Getting in to special programs. Summer programs, enrichment opportunities, etc. Even admission to certain schools.

 

-- Giving parents "permission" to make radical changes or radical acceleration in a child's curriculum.

 

I haven't found official documentation necessary. (Though ITBS and CogAT scores -- which my kids start taking in 3rd grade -- could back up my claims about my kids if I needed some basic documentation. These aren't as involved as what you would get with a full work-up, but they're often enough for entry into various supplemental gifted programs -- though others will expect full one-on-one IQ tests.)

 

We've managed to find enrichment opportunities all along the way that work well for my kids without requiring particular testing. Some of the "gifted" classes we've come across (Saturday morning classes, summer events), honestly just didn't have that much to offer. Or they were obscenely expensive. We've found that by looking into programs that "self-select" (chess classes, writing courses, museum-based activities), you often end up with the same group of peers that you would find in the courses that require tests for entry. ... Now, if you *can't* find those other types of opportunities, gifted-specific events may be helpful -- but we've found more intellectual peers through interest-based activities than through gifted-specific activities anyway.

 

Sometimes parents do need permission to make radical accelerations. They just don't feel comfortable moving forward and letting a 9yo do a high school math course, etc. In that case, testing can make them feel better about the choice...

 

 

Thanks for posting this. It makes a lot of sense. I live in a small town and highly doubt that there is much in the way of gifted special programs although I will look into that. Our schools don't allow any involvement without full enrollment. I don't feel like I need a gifted test to be sure myself. I can see how I might need to give myself permission to accelerate later. Right now we are actually doing K math because he is learning to tell time, count money, write numbers, etc. These are actually things he needs to know. However, he gets the concepts way before the book is done teaching them. Plus, we are using a spiral method which drives him crazy. I am thinking about not making him do every.single.page of his math book and moving on to Singapore 1a sometime in the spring.

 

Thanks so much for the posts. I look forward to hearing what others think as well.

[wapiti]

Do pop over to the Accelerated board. A few threads you may find helpful:

 

Gifted testing?

 

Advantages vs. Disadvantages of testing

 

Is it worth testing?

[abbeyej]

In terms of the math... Don't be afraid to move quickly. Particularly in the early years, ds could easily go through several "grades" of math in a year. And once you get him past the basics (as in, he's operating on closer to a third grade math level -- which could be quite soon), you'll have more opportunity to bring in lots of fun and challenging supplements. At that point, you can just *play* with math more and let him go deeper and explore. (There's some of that to be done now, of course, but once he's covered a bit more, so many more possibilities open up.)

 

And then you can slow down -- not because he's doing less, but because there are more things to explore. He may still go quickly through levels, but often the speed slows down a bit as you get to go deeper.

 

Singapore is good. Use CWP and IP -- that's where the real challenge comes in. Play games. Read books like Penrose the Mathematical Cat and Sir Cumference and Number Devil. Build things.

 

Teach him to play chess and look for opportunities for him to play. Even in a small town, there may be a regular group that meets at the library or a community center or coffee shop. Sometimes these are groups for kids and sometimes they're mixed-age groups where you'll find some old men who will happily play with your son and coach him a bit. (The Fritz and Chesster software is a fun and age-appropriate way to get started, by the way.) Not only will he probably enjoy it, but it's a great place to look for "similar" kids.

 

(Later on, look for Math Olympiad teams, First Lego League teams, and things like that for other bright/gifted math-apt kids.)

[foxbridgeacademy]

You should definately switch to a mastery program. This has helped so much with my DS. He sees no sense in doing work he already understands. When we were using a sprial program he hated math, totally killed any possibility that he could have "fun" with math. We're now using Math Mammoth by the "subject" and he's doing great. As for the testing, unless you suspect a LD that you need help understanding I'd consider it a waste of money. You know your child is gifted that's good enough.

[Halcyon]

In terms of the math... Don't be afraid to move quickly. Particularly in the early years, ds could easily go through several "grades" of math in a year. And once you get him past the basics (as in, he's operating on closer to a third grade math level -- which could be quite soon), you'll have more opportunity to bring in lots of fun and challenging supplements. At that point, you can just *play* with math more and let him go deeper and explore. (There's some of that to be done now, of course, but once he's covered a bit more, so many more possibilities open up.)

 

And then you can slow down -- not because he's doing less, but because there are more things to explore. He may still go quickly through levels, but often the speed slows down a bit as you get to go deeper.

 

Singapore is good. Use CWP and IP -- that's where the real challenge comes in. Play games. Read books like Penrose the Mathematical Cat and Sir Cumference and Number Devil. Build things.

 

Teach him to play chess and look for opportunities for him to play. Even in a small town, there may be a regular group that meets at the library or a community center or coffee shop. Sometimes these are groups for kids and sometimes they're mixed-age groups where you'll find some old men who will happily play with your son and coach him a bit. (The Fritz and Chesster software is a fun and age-appropriate way to get started, by the way.) Not only will he probably enjoy it, but it's a great place to look for "similar" kids.

 

(Later on, look for Math Olympiad teams, First Lego League teams, and things like that for other bright/gifted math-apt kids.)

 

:iagree::iagree: Couldn't have said it better myself.

[Mommyof4ks]

We had my youngest son tested, because he needed a baseline for his future due to cancer treatment. The test did not tell me anything I did not know, and it has not changed how I teach him. I cannot see any reason why a child would need to be tested unless you are just curious to see how he stacks up against his peers.

[PeterPan]

Nice to see the thread hasn't gone completely insane with people telling you how horrible you are to even consider it, then stating that it sounds to them like your kid is but bright, but not gifted. That's pretty much what happened to me when I asked on the accelerated board, and when I dared to comment back I was accused of only looking for one answer and expecting pats on the backs for it. Look, if you think that your child has some issues that might be helped by your possession of this knowledge, then yes, DO IT. If you don't, then don't waste your time or money. For the record, the testing was very beneficial to us, as we found that my daughter actually is gifted (so much for the armchair psychologists around here, who can diagnose based on a couple sentences in one post), but 2E. So now we know why she seems so wicked smart (because she is) but has trouble with so many things (because her processing speed and working memory are so low). If you are or start to experience issues with school work, then I think it's worth it. If we hadn't had any problems we probably wouldn't have, but it was so, so, so worth it for us.

 

Snowfall, I just wanted to try to see if I could make you feel better about what happened on that thread. I hadn't seen it but just went over to find it. What you're running into is the usual mess that happens when you have a 2E kid and talk with 1E people. You have more dimensions. ;) And all the people who responded in a way that seemed to be missing what you were saying and left you feeling ramrodded or hurt responded that way because they don't have 2E kids. I read your post and, with what I now know, immediately knew could tell you needed testing. You were already saying all the code words and didn't even realize it. And as I read through the responses you got, I noticed the people telling you to get testing all had 2E kids. I know, cuz they hang out on the SN board. Head over there. We're nice, don't bite, and no one will think you're funny if your kid is assynchronous and genius and uber-frustrating at the same time. :)

 

Oh, so a few stories to make you feel better? We're getting ready to do testing, in fact we go for our first session of the testing tomorrow. EVEN FROM PEOPLE WITH 2E KIDS I got told I didn't need to bother, that I could probably sort it all out myself given everything I've read. (Maybe I could, but I feel a LOT BETTER finally getting some outside help!) I got told I wouldn't learn much. (Sound familiar?) Then I got told by some people (who don't have 2E kids, mind you) that my kid was clearly stupid and should be relegated to being a C student, just make her do the work no matter what. Ok, that's not an exact quote, but that was the TENOR. So I'm saying it's just the plight to get shafted by people and get contradictory opinions. It wasn't just you in that thread. I'm guessing every single mom who has pondered this has felt the SAME THINGS. It's SO much money ($1500 -3500, depending on the doc and services) that you really doubt yourself and wonder if you *need* to spend that money or could get away without. You wonder if you *could* just read a book and figure it out yourself. After all that's what homeschoolers do! We read books and learn stuff!

 

But I want to say to the op that, like Snowfall, I considered doing testing when my dd was 5/6. I actually did some calling, but at the time the places I called (local community college, etc.) just gave me dumb looks like I couldn't possibly need that, had no reason. So I ended up NOT doing the testing. My dd seemed exactly like your ds at that age btw, I mean to the T. And it turns out she DID have stuff going on, stuff thorough testing would have shown, even then. I'm not saying yours does. I'm just saying mine did and that they could have caught, had we done the testing back then.

 

So in hindsite, I wouldn't just do an IQ test even. I'd do a whole neuropsych or ed psych eval. (I'm planning on doing one with my ds when he hits 5.) There are psychs and neuropsychs who specialize in gifted kids. Google that with your state and find one. It would be WORTH the drive. At worst, you just learn more about how they think, how they process, etc. At best, you catch some things you weren't anticipating. Look at Snowfall's thread again and compare (just a tally) the number of people with 2E kids vs. the number of posters with 1E. It's much more common to end up with 2E kids than people think.

 

Ok, just because I was curious, I went back and added it up. In your thread linked here http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2014025#post2014025 8 of the 15 respondees were people with SN kids. That's pretty wild when you think about this. This is MUCH more common than people realize.

 

I think there are times when testing isn't necessary, absolutely. However I also think, when you get the right tester, you can learn a lot and might even uncover problems that are going to creep up later. If he's at all asynchronous, hard to teach, has challenging behavior, etc., etc. these are all indications that it would be a good idea to test. I think if your GUT says you'd like some more help, you should do it. Remember my gut said that 8 years ago, and I didn't listen. If your gut is asking for more information, you should get it.

[Canadianmumof5]

Nice to see the thread hasn't gone completely insane with people telling you how horrible you are to even consider it, then stating that it sounds to them like your kid is but bright, but not gifted. That's pretty much what happened to me when I asked on the accelerated board, and when I dared to comment back I was accused of only looking for one answer and expecting pats on the backs for it. Look, if you think that your child has some issues that might be helped by your possession of this knowledge, then yes, DO IT. If you don't, then don't waste your time or money. For the record, the testing was very beneficial to us, as we found that my daughter actually is gifted (so much for the armchair psychologists around here, who can diagnose based on a couple sentences in one post), but 2E. So now we know why she seems so wicked smart (because she is) but has trouble with so many things (because her processing speed and working memory are so low). If you are or start to experience issues with school work, then I think it's worth it. If we hadn't had any problems we probably wouldn't have, but it was so, so, so worth it for us.

 

I'm sorry that you didn't get more positive responses earlier. I am always advocating that parents get their child tested if they have any inkling that they may be gifted. There is just SO MUCH you can learn from these assessments and while it may not be critical to getting additional resources for them, boy does it ever help in the way you approach their education (homeschooled or not).

 

Our DS was tested when he was 6 - his results sound very similar to your DD. He is crazy, off the charts smart in verbal, etc but the WM and PS totally brought his overall IQ down. Regardless, he was still ID'd gifted (and we were still in the school system at that point - so it DID matter so that we could get some resources), but I think it has been very beneficial to me to know that he has these issues so that we can try and figure out how to manage. Not just in school work but also in general day to day life. I KNOW I can't give him multi step instructions (clean your room, brush your teeth, get your PJs on and read 3 chapters of your history before lights out) or it goes in one ear and out the other. I break it down for him, and adjust my expectations accordingly. We actually made him a chart for his morning routine (before school starts) of what he has to do and I swear he still loves following it. He enjoys and works well when there is a process to follow - he is just starting to deviate from his usual schedule and asking to change things up a bit. So I think there is progress :)

 

It has been 4 years since we had him tested and I honestly would LOVE to test him again as I think there has been a marked improvement in those areas. I credit, in part, the FLL & WWE programs which really stretched him in terms of narration and memory work. Although it was a struggle last year, I think it was worth it.

 

I am no expert (as some others here claim to be), but I would definitely encourage ANY parent who suspects their child gifted, to go ahead and have testing done. It gives you a lot of information to help YOU to help your child. If you are just looking for confirmation of your gut instinct, that can also be tremendously helpful to your confidence as a parent, especially if it is your first child. And if you uncover other areas (like LDs) then isn't that a great benefit?? Why wouldn't you want to know how to best serve your child as their primary educator??

 

Sorry it got so long - I just wanted to say I can completely empathize with you.

[boscopup]

I have no plans to test my oldest. It wouldn't give me any helpful information. He's not having any problems. He's just cruising along at his own pace. I have no fear of "moving ahead" in the areas that I see he can do so, so I don't need a test to give me permission to do that. I have enough confidence in reading my child's academic ability to put him where he is, and adjust based on the topic - just as every homeschooler does, gifted or not. ;)

 

My middle son, I would like to get evaluated. He has a lot of behaviors (sensory issues, some OCD, etc.), along with a speech/language delay (already in speech therapy for that), and he usually seems normal or a bit below average, but then he'll do or say things that are really insightful and make me go :001_huh:. He's doing fine in his schooling, though certainly doesn't pick it up fast like my older son did. I didn't have to teach my oldest K math. He was figuring out multiplication in K. My middle son is still working on counting to 20. Yet he can tell me intricate details about various sharks and such. He knows more about the different types of sharks than I do. :tongue_smilie: Anyway, my middle son is clearly wired differently. I've had a couple people (who know him personally and have or have experience with such kids) mention being on the spectrum, though I don't think he really is. He sometimes acts kind of like he is, but then he "snaps out of it", so to speak... with a grin on his face... so I think it is just an act, and he's just enjoying his imaginative world.

 

I don't understand what snowfall's problem was in her thread that was linked above... It looked like everyone pretty much said that if you suspect a 2E situation, get tested with a full eval, not just an IQ test - IQ alone wouldn't be enough information, because IQ by itself doesn't explain behavior... Just having a label "gifted" doesn't tell you much. You need to ask yourself, "What would I do with this information?" That's what I've done with my kids. For the first one, who has no LD's and is doing great, having him tested wouldn't change anything that I'm doing, so it's not worth spending the money for him. For my second child, having a full evaluation (not just IQ) to see what is going on with him would help with how to approach behavior issues and possibly point out any LD's. So I do have reason to test him. I'm starting out by going through the school. If that doesn't pan out, I'll have to go the private route.

[ChrissySC]

While you suspect that your son is gifted, work on memory work and a general knowledge base. Do not try to push education beyond the limits of these two things. Without any knowledge, the child can neither reference, reason, or infer. Without the common bank of memory work, i.e. multipication tables, facts, vocabulary, et cetera, you will serve an injustice. There will be nothing to use or to grow upon.

 

So, I say cram things into his mind. :) I do this with my 4yo. I do mean everything. She is reading now, which I deliberately slow down so that she does not shortcut to a whole language approach entirely. LOL Read, read some more, and read yet some more. Start facts now. Worry about the why when the time comes for formal math to begin. You will find that your son will exceed all of your expectations if you build a great foundation. Try and recall of those things that you we needed as children to do our lessons over the years. Recall what you know or we refer to as common knowledge. Get these things in his head as soon as you can. This is when he can enjoy his advanced learning ability and later benefit to a greater extent. :D

 

My swiveling chair suggestions for what it's worth!

 

And no, do not test.

Edited November 10, 2011 by ChrissySC

[Sebastian (a lady)]

You should definately switch to a mastery program. This has helped so much with my DS. He sees no sense in doing work he already understands. When we were using a sprial program he hated math, totally killed any possibility that he could have "fun" with math. We're now using Math Mammoth by the "subject" and he's doing great. As for the testing, unless you suspect a LD that you need help understanding I'd consider it a waste of money. You know your child is gifted that's good enough.

 

For us, using a spiral program with my gifted son allowed him the room to mentally work through his perfectionist streak. He could look at a complicated problem (for his grade level) and just "see" the answer. But at the same time he'd break down in tears over the problems he did get wrong.

 

Find what is a good fit, whether that is mastery or spiral, hot off the press new thing or old standby. Be prepared to change when your kid does.

 

FWIW, on the OP, we did have our older kids tested. It was sort of forced upon us in order to get reimbursement for educational materials we were actually vice what was considered on grade level. This was through a program via dh's employeer, who paid for education when his job had us living overseas. I wasn't claiming they were gifted, but rather that they had high level reading ability and should be able to use books on their reading level not on their grade level. (This was for a 1st and 2nd grader who were reading on a 7th grade level. I was having books turned down because they were 3rd grade, not 1st grade.:banghead::cursing:)

 

On one hand I didn't really learn anything compelling with the testing. I already knew they were way above grade level in reading and doing well with math. We didn't have LD issues or 2E questions. It was a little intimidating to see just where #2 son did score. There was more than a little bit of gulping when the results came out. And in a way I wish I hadn't known, because I think once in a while I let #1 slide when I shouldn't because I know his scores weren't quite so statospheric.

 

On the other hand, it gave me confidence to accelerate them when it looked like it was profitable. For example, we skipped a grade in Saxon math (from 3 to 6/5). And I think it backed me up with the idea that they really could handle what I was giving them. It also made me up my game a bit and not rest on their just being good for their grade level. If you will, it shifted the goalposts on who I consider to be their academic peers.

 

ETA: I should add that we didn't have to pay for the testing. The education office paid for that in order to prove they didn't have to pay for our claimed books. Not only did the assessment go way beyond what I expected for our kids, requiring them to pay for almost everything we were using; but the assessment itself cost more than the curriculum they were denying. I don't know that I would have done such early testing (#2 son was not quite 6 if I remember correctly) if I'd had to pay out of pocket. ( It was really a raining down of God's blessings in so many ways, long story but the ed psych. who was sent to do testing was the daughter of a pilot dh's grandfather flew with in WWII and we'd actually met her dad a few years before in a completely different situation. What was intended as a gotcha was instead a really wonderful experience.)

Edited November 10, 2011 by Sebastian (a lady)

[....]

It is pretty obvious that my son is gifted, especially in math. He is 5. Is there any reason to get a HSed child tested? If he was in school, I would fight for the test so he could get into gifted classes, but I can't really see any reason to get him tested if I am schooling him at home. Is that right? Thanks!

 

I wanted to respond to a couple of things in this thread.

 

My oldest (the one who went to ps for 2 years) went thru the gifted testing/interview with our school district. Nothing really came out of it. I think they just don't have the resources for it (where we lived) and there doesn't seem to be much out there for them. And, IMO, they are special needs kids. I tried to get help for her many, many times. My daughter had some really weird behaviors (like swaying, screaming fits the first hour after she got off the school bus, etc) and I really needed help. The best thing I did was get online and start researching it myself. Then, I had some huge "aha" moments.

 

I suspect that my 3rd child is gifted, but probably won't bother going thru testing. This kid is even more difficult to teach than the other daughter, so she is basically unschooling this year (1st grade). From my experience, these kids need an abundance of time to explore things on their level when they're little.

 

Also, my oldest kid who scored in the gifted range seems to have sensory issues and my third kid has some serious sensory issues. So, I'm thinking there's a connection.

 

 

Snowfall,

I've had several nervous breakdown threads. :tongue_smilie: About a year ago, I had a thread on the general board where I described me parking in a McDonald's parking lot and crying for 45 minutes. :D My 3rd kid (the one with SPD) was such a nut last year. Everytime we went somewhere, she just lost. her. mind. Things are getting better, tho. My kids seem to calm down a lot around 7.

 

It is impossible to describe what you're going thru in a few lines on a message board. :svengo:

[Runningmom80]

Nice to see the thread hasn't gone completely insane with people telling you how horrible you are to even consider it, then stating that it sounds to them like your kid is but bright, but not gifted. That's pretty much what happened to me when I asked on the accelerated board, and when I dared to comment back I was accused of only looking for one answer and expecting pats on the backs for it. Look, if you think that your child has some issues that might be helped by your possession of this knowledge, then yes, DO IT. If you don't, then don't waste your time or money. For the record, the testing was very beneficial to us, as we found that my daughter actually is gifted (so much for the armchair psychologists around here, who can diagnose based on a couple sentences in one post), but 2E. So now we know why she seems so wicked smart (because she is) but has trouble with so many things (because her processing speed and working memory are so low). If you are or start to experience issues with school work, then I think it's worth it. If we hadn't had any problems we probably wouldn't have, but it was so, so, so worth it for us.

 

 

 

Yes, I seem to recall a new poster being diagnosed with aspergers by a few hive psychs on that board in the not too distant past. :)

[Snowfall]

I don't understand what snowfall's problem was in her thread that was linked above... It looked like everyone pretty much said that if you suspect a 2E situation, get tested with a full eval, not just an IQ test - IQ alone wouldn't be enough information, because IQ by itself doesn't explain behavior...

 

What my "problem" was?!? Well, thank you for that useful summary of the thread. I wasn't suspecting a 2E situation. I thought there was a slight possibility of dyslexia, but the reason I was considering testing for anything at that point was because her therapist suggested that giftedness might be related to her issues. I was told by people in that hread that I only asked because I wanted them to agree and that they could tell based on my 2 or 3 sentence description that she was a bright, but average kid. I think most people would bristle at the first and find the second absurd.

 

At any rate, it is pretty well recognized that giftedness actually often *does* come along with behavioral quirks, even in the absence of LDs or other disorders so it's simply not true to act as if IQ is unrelated to behavior in every case, all the time.

 

But thanks for yet one more member of the hive misinterpreting my situation and failing to exhibit even a basic degree of kindness. I mean really...what my problem was?

[Guest]

Snowfall, I just wanted to try to see if I could make you feel better about what happened on that thread. I hadn't seen it but just went over to find it. What you're running into is the usual mess that happens when you have a 2E kid and talk with 1E people. You have more dimensions. ;) And all the people who responded in a way that seemed to be missing what you were saying and left you feeling ramrodded or hurt responded that way because they don't have 2E kids. I read your post and, with what I now know, immediately knew could tell you needed testing. You were already saying all the code words and didn't even realize it. And as I read through the responses you got, I noticed the people telling you to get testing all had 2E kids. I know, cuz they hang out on the SN board. Head over there. We're nice, don't bite, and no one will think you're funny if your kid is assynchronous and genius and uber-frustrating at the same time. :)

 

Oh, so a few stories to make you feel better? We're getting ready to do testing, in fact we go for our first session of the testing tomorrow. EVEN FROM PEOPLE WITH 2E KIDS I got told I didn't need to bother, that I could probably sort it all out myself given everything I've read. (Maybe I could, but I feel a LOT BETTER finally getting some outside help!) I got told I wouldn't learn much. (Sound familiar?) Then I got told by some people (who don't have 2E kids, mind you) that my kid was clearly stupid and should be relegated to being a C student, just make her do the work no matter what. Ok, that's not an exact quote, but that was the TENOR. So I'm saying it's just the plight to get shafted by people and get contradictory opinions. It wasn't just you in that thread. I'm guessing every single mom who has pondered this has felt the SAME THINGS. It's SO much money ($1500 -3500, depending on the doc and services) that you really doubt yourself and wonder if you *need* to spend that money or could get away without. You wonder if you *could* just read a book and figure it out yourself. After all that's what homeschoolers do! We read books and learn stuff!

 

But I want to say to the op that, like Snowfall, I considered doing testing when my dd was 5/6. I actually did some calling, but at the time the places I called (local community college, etc.) just gave me dumb looks like I couldn't possibly need that, had no reason. So I ended up NOT doing the testing. My dd seemed exactly like your ds at that age btw, I mean to the T. And it turns out she DID have stuff going on, stuff thorough testing would have shown, even then. I'm not saying yours does. I'm just saying mine did and that they could have caught, had we done the testing back then.

 

So in hindsite, I wouldn't just do an IQ test even. I'd do a whole neuropsych or ed psych eval. (I'm planning on doing one with my ds when he hits 5.) There are psychs and neuropsychs who specialize in gifted kids. Google that with your state and find one. It would be WORTH the drive. At worst, you just learn more about how they think, how they process, etc. At best, you catch some things you weren't anticipating. Look at Snowfall's thread again and compare (just a tally) the number of people with 2E kids vs. the number of posters with 1E. It's much more common to end up with 2E kids than people think.

 

Ok, just because I was curious, I went back and added it up. In your thread linked here http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2014025#post2014025 8 of the 15 respondees were people with SN kids. That's pretty wild when you think about this. This is MUCH more common than people realize.

 

I think there are times when testing isn't necessary, absolutely. However I also think, when you get the right tester, you can learn a lot and might even uncover problems that are going to creep up later. If he's at all asynchronous, hard to teach, has challenging behavior, etc., etc. these are all indications that it would be a good idea to test. I think if your GUT says you'd like some more help, you should do it. Remember my gut said that 8 years ago, and I didn't listen. If your gut is asking for more information, you should get it.

 

This why I am doing my own research :tongue_smilie:. I hesitate to post because you tend to get so many and various replies , you don't know what you should listen to, what to ignore, and what to get offended by :glare:. Anyway, OhElizabeth, you are always so helpful with your posts! I don't mean to highjack and I currently cannot afford to test anyway so... I was wondering if there are any 2e books you would recommend. I would really appreciate it :)!

Edited November 11, 2011 by Guest

[boscopup]

I wasn't suspecting a 2E situation. I thought there was a slight possibility of dyslexia

 

... which would be 2E, right? :confused:

 

I was told by people in that hread that I only asked because I wanted them to agree and that they could tell based on my 2 or 3 sentence description that she was a bright, but average kid. I think most people would bristle at the first and find the second absurd.

I'm still confused. The first two responses were telling you to go ahead and get tested if you suspected a 2E situation.

 

At any rate, it is pretty well recognized that giftedness actually often *does* come along with behavioral quirks, even in the absence of LDs or other disorders so it's simply not true to act as if IQ is unrelated to behavior in every case, all the time.

But what do you do with the information? That's the question posed. A full eval will give you information. A simple IQ number may not. Kids with a particular IQ don't all act in a certain way. Gifted kids aren't all quirky. Non-gifted kids can be quirky. So the question was would the information help you? And regenetrude's point in her initial post was that her two kids HAD been tested for IQ, had equivalent IQs, and they behaved differently, had different personalities, and had different academic needs, so the IQ number didn't really help her deal with their individual needs. You seemed to get upset at that post, and I didn't understand why.

 

But thanks for yet one more member of the hive misinterpreting my situation and failing to exhibit even a basic degree of kindness. I mean really...what my problem was?

I'm sorry, I just don't understand the problem with the responses you got. You bristled at people suggesting that IQ testing alone might not be helpful. You asked for opinions, they gave them, and then you got upset. By "what your problem was", I guess I meant, I don't understand what about that thread upset you (and I'm sorry with my original wording... that was poor choice of words). You got upset pretty early on, when I saw nothing to get upset about. No one said your kid wasn't gifted. In fact, most seemed to be acknowledging that she might be gifted, but that an IQ test alone might not give you any useful information. Would you rather they lie and let you spend a lot of money on a test that, alone, wouldn't help? I just don't understand. :confused:

 

Again, I have one child for whom a test seems useless. It wouldn't give me any information I don't already know. For another child, a full eval would be helpful (not just an IQ test), as it might give me some answers to some behavior questions. I just had to ask myself, for each child, what would I do with the information from the test? If it would change something in what I'm doing, then it's a good idea. If it wouldn't change anything, then it's a waste of money. That's all I got from the myriad of posts from people in your thread, and it's why I don't understand what upset you about it.

 

And I will apologize again for the poor choice of words... "what your problem was" just doesn't sound like what I intended, and for that I am sorry. I am heavily distracted whenever I post, and I hope that other moms here would understand that. :grouphug:

[....]

But thanks for yet one more member of the hive misinterpreting my situation and failing to exhibit even a basic degree of kindness. I mean really...what my problem was?

 

I really don't think Boscopup was trying to offend you. I think meanings get lost when people are typing out a response as opposed to speaking with someone IRL.

 

Edited to say: when I get to go online, there are usually kids screaming, phones ringing, dogs barking, UPS guy ringing the doorbell. I probably sound crazy in my posts. :tongue_smilie:

Edited November 11, 2011 by starrbuck12

[boscopup]

I really don't think Boscopup was trying to offend you. I think meanings get lost when people are typing out a response as opposed to speaking with someone IRL.

 

Edited to say: when I get to go online, there are usually kids screaming, phones ringing, dogs barking, UPS guy ringing the doorbell. I probably sound crazy in my posts. :tongue_smilie:

 

Thank you for understanding. :D I know I sound crazy in most of my posts. I'm only about half as crazy IRL. :lol:

[Guest]

This why I am doing my own research :tongue_smilie:. I hesitate to post because you tend to get so many and various replies , you don't know what you should listen to, what to ignore, and what to get offended by :glare:. Anyway, OhElizabeth, you are always so helpful with your posts! I don't mean to highjack and I currently cannot afford to test anyway so... I was wondering if there are any 2e books you would recommend. I would really appreciate it :)!

 

Never mind OhElizabeth! I'll PM you a little later, if that's ok.

[PeterPan]

This why I am doing my own research :tongue_smilie:. I hesitate to post because you tend to get so many and various replies , you don't know what you should listen to, what to ignore, and what to get offended by :glare:. Anyway, OhElizabeth, you are always so helpful with your posts! I don't mean to highjack and I currently cannot afford to test anyway so... I was wondering if there are any 2e books you would recommend. I would really appreciate it :)!

 

Ooo, books on 2E. I assume you've already read the basics like stuff by the Eides (Dyslexic Advantage, Mislabeled Child) and Freed (Right-Brained...). Right now I'm reading Fletcher's book on Learning Disabilities, and it has really fascinated me. No pom-poms in this book, hehe, just lots of sleep-inducing summaries of studies on how they parse this and that, 4 causes of comprehension problems, how they distinguish them, etc. But things are making a lot more sense to me as I read this book. I'm also hoping the $1500 np eval we're doing will yield us some lightning bolts or something. :)

[wapiti]

I was wondering if there are any 2e books you would recommend.

 

Webb's Misdiagnosis and Dual Diagnoses of Gifted Children

the Eides' new book, The Dyslexia Advantage, currently being discussed at length on the SN board

Silverman's Upside Down Brilliance (get from your library)

Freed's Right Brained Child in a Left Brain World

 

re: my 2E-ish kiddos, if I could have only one of the above books, I'd choose Upside Down Brilliance, no question.

 

:lurk5: please add to this list

 

eta, guess I'm late as usual. OhE, do you think the Fletcher book is worth buying (for someone like myself with a large number of kids :))? My library doesn't have it.

[PeterPan]

... which would be 2E, right? :confused:

 

I'm still confused. The first two responses were telling you to go ahead and get tested if you suspected a 2E situation.

 

But what do you do with the information? That's the question posed. A full eval will give you information. A simple IQ number may not. Kids with a particular IQ don't all act in a certain way. Gifted kids aren't all quirky. Non-gifted kids can be quirky. So the question was would the information help you? And regenetrude's point in her initial post was that her two kids HAD been tested for IQ, had equivalent IQs, and they behaved differently, had different personalities, and had different academic needs, so the IQ number didn't really help her deal with their individual needs. You seemed to get upset at that post, and I didn't understand why.

 

I'm sorry, I just don't understand the problem with the responses you got. You bristled at people suggesting that IQ testing alone might not be helpful. You asked for opinions, they gave them, and then you got upset. By "what your problem was", I guess I meant, I don't understand what about that thread upset you (and I'm sorry with my original wording... that was poor choice of words). You got upset pretty early on, when I saw nothing to get upset about. No one said your kid wasn't gifted. In fact, most seemed to be acknowledging that she might be gifted, but that an IQ test alone might not give you any useful information. Would you rather they lie and let you spend a lot of money on a test that, alone, wouldn't help? I just don't understand. :confused:

 

Again, I have one child for whom a test seems useless. It wouldn't give me any information I don't already know. For another child, a full eval would be helpful (not just an IQ test), as it might give me some answers to some behavior questions. I just had to ask myself, for each child, what would I do with the information from the test? If it would change something in what I'm doing, then it's a good idea. If it wouldn't change anything, then it's a waste of money. That's all I got from the myriad of posts from people in your thread, and it's why I don't understand what upset you about it.

 

And I will apologize again for the poor choice of words... "what your problem was" just doesn't sound like what I intended, and for that I am sorry. I am heavily distracted whenever I post, and I hope that other moms here would understand that. :grouphug:

 

Ok, thing one, I totally get why Snowfall was offended in her thread. It only takes a few hurtful responses to overshadow all the good ones. So I grant a lot there, having had it happen myself.

 

Thing two, I found Boscup's analysis interesting. I obviously read too quickly, as I had missed that nuance in that thread. I'm sure she only meant to be helpful.

 

Thing three, I SURE HOPE the np we're using gives me back more information than what I already know, considering what I'm paying. But hey, I guess we all get to make $1500 mistakes. :)

 

And the moral of the story? The SN board is the nicest place to be. Come over. No one bites you or calls 2E kids stupid there. :)

[PeterPan]

Wapiti, how kind of you to add to my reading list! That dual diagnoses book looks good! :)

 

And no, I wouldn't buy Fletcher. Maybe another library can get it for you? It's just awfully pricey. Ok, it's priceless if you have insomnia. But seriously, it's not worth that $30+ price tag.

[Guest]

Thank you both :)! I'll be looking into these. The Upside Down Brilliance is one I have been looking into.

 

Webb's Misdiagnosis and Dual Diagnoses of Gifted Children

the Eides' new book, The Dyslexia Advantage, currently being discussed at length on the SN board

Silverman's Upside Down Brilliance (get from your library)

Freed's Right Brained Child in a Left Brain World

 

re: my 2E-ish kiddos, if I could have only one of the above books, I'd choose Upside Down Brilliance, no question.

 

:lurk5: please add to this list

 

eta, guess I'm late as usual. OhE, do you think the Fletcher book is worth buying (for someone like myself with a large number of kids :))? My library doesn't have it.

 

This just came out recently. I stumbled on it because Temple Grandin's name has been added as a contributor. Not sure if you have seen it.

 

ETA: Ooops... forgot the link:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Bright-Not-Broken-Gifted-Autism/dp/0470623322/ref=sr_1_17?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1320977267&sr=1-17

 

Ooo, books on 2E. I assume you've already read the basics like stuff by the Eides (Dyslexic Advantage, Mislabeled Child) and Freed (Right-Brained...). Right now I'm reading Fletcher's book on Learning Disabilities, and it has really fascinated me. No pom-poms in this book, hehe, just lots of sleep-inducing summaries of studies on how they parse this and that, 4 causes of comprehension problems, how they distinguish them, etc. But things are making a lot more sense to me as I read this book. I'm also hoping the $1500 np eval we're doing will yield us some lightning bolts or something. :)

 

I first started researching ADD/ ADHD (Hallowell and others) but have switched over to Asperger's now and Sensory Integration. I just finished Grandin's Emergence (trying to find out a little more about her and also watched the movie made about her) and now I am reading her book "The Way I See It", which I have found really helpful. I am also starting Thinking In Pictures, for both me and Adrian. Through her books I have seen a bit of myself too. I have also purchased a couple of books on Sensory Integration, and I am taking it from there. I only started considering all this the past few months. Prior to that, quirky was all I was thinking, which is not unusual for either side of the family :tongue_smilie:. The sensory issues are from my side of the family. Anyway, I have so... much to learn!

 

ETA: Thanks again to both of you for the book recommendations.

Edited November 11, 2011 by Guest

[boscopup]

Thing three, I SURE HOPE the np we're using gives me back more information than what I already know, considering what I'm paying. But hey, I guess we all get to make $1500 mistakes. :)

 

I certainly hope you get good information! :D I'm sure you will. I could see snowfall getting good information in her case too (and I assume she did do some testing? It sounded like she had). The OP of this thread doesn't seem to be having any issues... her oldest sounds a lot like my oldest. I wouldn't spend $1500 on testing for my oldest at this point. If I noticed something being off, I'd absolutely do it though.

[Iucounu]

It is pretty obvious that my son is gifted, especially in math. He is 5. Is there any reason to get a HSed child tested? If he was in school, I would fight for the test so he could get into gifted classes, but I can't really see any reason to get him tested if I am schooling him at home. Is that right? Thanks!

Yep, that's right, since you haven't stated any reasons to get him tested. If there aren't any, there just aren't. :) Reasons for testing in general include getting access to services (not an issue for you), to pinpoint learning disabilities, etc.

 

You don't need IQ testing to figure out how to properly homeschool a child. Achievement testing is bound to be pretty worthless too for your purposes; achievement tests like the Woodcock Johnson only tell you the rareness of your child's scores compared to children of the same age (and/or grade, not important for a homeschooler), not what grade level they're at in certain subjects. You of course already know a good deal of info as to how fast your child can learn, what level your child's roughly at in each subject, etc.

[wapiti]

Wapiti, how kind of you to add to my reading list! That dual diagnoses book looks good! :)

 

LOL. I still haven't finished The Dyslexia Advantage, and it's already time to renew it. Get Webb from the library first to have a look - it's not a book I personally refer back to very often. Maybe I'll pull it out... it amazes me that I can get a lot more out of a book simply by waiting until my perspective has changed slightly :D

[PeterPan]

4evercanucks--You're reading to decide who to take your dc to for an evaluation? Or you're reading to figure out if you need an evaluation? Or you're reading to understand your evaluation results? I'm just asking, because I definitely think you want an evaluation with the things you're saying. I've sort of swung hard on this in the last little bit into the "get an evaluation" camp, and it's because I put up with things for so long that I didn't need to or didn't need to go through without answers. But even when I was officially told by someone to get an eval, it took me over a year to find the right person and work up the gump. So I understand waiting in that sense too. :)

[PeterPan]

You don't need IQ testing to figure out how to properly homeschool a child. Achievement testing is bound to be pretty worthless too for your purposes; achievement tests like the Woodcock Johnson only tell you the rareness of your child's scores compared to children of the same age (and/or grade, not important for a homeschooler), not what grade level they're at in certain subjects. You of course already know a good deal of info as to how fast your child can learn, what level your child's roughly at in each subject, etc.

 

Yeah, the WJIII is an oddity, where it might not show up everything. It's reading comprehension exercises don't mirror school activities, so you can end up with really high scores there and still have problems. But as a quick way of knocking out our state's requirements it was good, and it was fun to do a test with no ceiling.

[Guest]

4evercanucks--You're reading to decide who to take your dc to for an evaluation? Or you're reading to figure out if you need an evaluation? Or you're reading to understand your evaluation results? I'm just asking, because I definitely think you want an evaluation with the things you're saying. I've sort of swung hard on this in the last little bit into the "get an evaluation" camp, and it's because I put up with things for so long that I didn't need to or didn't need to go through without answers. But even when I was officially told by someone to get an eval, it took me over a year to find the right person and work up the gump. So I understand waiting in that sense too. :)

 

For me, all this is still new, and based on personal observation. No one has told us we need any kind of evaluation for either boy, but then again having lived in Greece and the Middle East, I feel certain things could have been missed, that only a mother's gut instinct might notice. Anyway, for now I am reading to know what someone that may be doing an evaluation is talking about. I need to know before we decide how to approach this. I just can't handle being handed a diagnosis of some sort and not know what the results mean or what the person is talking about. Also, I know both my boys. I am constantly observing them (since birth), so I want to know if what is said to me makes sense for my kids or not. I am also trying to determine if I need an evaluation in the first place. If there's something there (I mean beyond the sensory issues which are obvious to me anyway) they are both definitely high functioning. My main focus is on Adrian for the time being. In other words, I am trying to find out as much as I can, in order to decide how we need to approach this as a family before and after a possible diagnosis.

Edited November 11, 2011 by Guest

[Snowfall]

... which would be 2E, right? :confused:

 

I'm still confused. The first two responses were telling you to go ahead and get tested if you suspected a 2E situation.

 

But that really wasn't playing into why I was considering it at that point. I understand that it doesn't make sense to you that the dyslexia thing wasn't playing into it, but it really was not part of my concern at that place and time. I was not suspecting behavioral issues were related to what we eventually discovered, and it was behavioral issues I was concerned about. (Turns out she's on the spectrum, in case that matters to anyone.) Dyslexia (she doesn't have it) did not seem at all related to the issues for which I was considering IQ testing. I was considering it based on things said by her therapist, who turned out to be a cruddy therapist, given that she never noticed there was anything else going on, but you live and you learn.

 

But what do you do with the information? That's the question posed. A full eval will give you information. A simple IQ number may not. Kids with a particular IQ don't all act in a certain way. Gifted kids aren't all quirky. Non-gifted kids can be quirky. So the question was would the information help you? And regenetrude's point in her initial post was that her two kids HAD been tested for IQ, had equivalent IQs, and they behaved differently, had different personalities, and had different academic needs, so the IQ number didn't really help her deal with their individual needs. You seemed to get upset at that post, and I didn't understand why.

 

I'm sorry, I just don't understand the problem with the responses you got. You bristled at people suggesting that IQ testing alone might not be helpful. You asked for opinions, they gave them, and then you got upset. By "what your problem was", I guess I meant, I don't understand what about that thread upset you (and I'm sorry with my original wording... that was poor choice of words). You got upset pretty early on, when I saw nothing to get upset about. No one said your kid wasn't gifted. In fact, most seemed to be acknowledging that she might be gifted, but that an IQ test alone might not give you any useful information. Would you rather they lie and let you spend a lot of money on a test that, alone, wouldn't help? I just don't understand. :confused:

.....

 

And I will apologize again for the poor choice of words... "what your problem was" just doesn't sound like what I intended, and for that I am sorry. I am heavily distracted whenever I post, and I hope that other moms here would understand that. :grouphug:

I understand that you don't understand, but again, the tone from a very few (maybe even only one or two - I don't remember) people in that thread was not nice. Is it really nice to suggest that a person is asking but doesn't actually want opinions? If I disagree with someone's response, it doesn't mean my mind is already made up or I don't care about what they say. It means I'm thinking through what is being said, and I don't have to agree with it in order to have been seeking information. It wasn't the fact that people gave opinions. It was that, after I disagreed with their analysis, a few people acted like I clearly didn't want to hear what they said (and now it's happening again) then, of course, was the ridiculous determination of my dd's status by someone who'd never met my kid. She said dd sounded "bright" (that's pretty much not gifted, given the rest of the post), but completely normal (in all caps), while she lectured about how rare giftedness actually is, how overdiagnosed it is, how many parents want labels for everything, and how very, very few people are actually gifted. It was granted that there was a slim possibility that this was the case, then the backhanded remark that I wouldn't be wondering about it if it were. lol Other than coming right out and saying I was obviously looking to get my totally normal kid called gifted, just so I could have a label to brandish about, I'm not sure how much clearer she could have been about that opinion, lol. Those were the things that bothered me. I can understand why they might not seem obvious to you at this point, but they were hurtful at the time. And wrong. This is the first time on this board I've even mentioned my dd's giftedness, and I actually don't go around telling anyone else about it, either. [i did just go back and re-read the thread, and I can see why it would be difficult to understand my upset, from someone else's POV. Most posters were very, very helpful and kind. It really just takes a couple...less thoughtful...posts for a person to walk away with a bad taste about a thread, lol.]

 

Anyway, I really am sorry for turning this thread into anything about or to do with me or my experience and hope we can all move on now. I'm glad the OP is getting helpful advice. I hope she is able to do what she needs to do, without guilt, whatever that turns out to be.

Edited November 11, 2011 by Snowfall

[Guest]

Wapiti, when I was posting earlier I mentioned a book but forgot to add the link so I am not sure if you noticed it after the fact when I added it in. I am quoting myself below :tongue_smilie::

 

This just came out recently. I stumbled on it because Temple Grandin's name has been added as a contributor. Not sure if you have seen it.

 

ETA: Ooops... forgot the link:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Bright-Not-Bro...977267&sr=1-17

Have you heard of this book? It came out in September. The question goes for you too OhElizabeth. I have it on my list but have not decided whether to get it or not, yet.

[boscopup]

then, of course, was the ridiculous determination of my dd's status by someone who'd never met my kid. She said dd sounded "bright" (that's pretty much not gifted, given the rest of the post), but completely normal (in all caps), while she lectured about how rare giftedness actually is, how overdiagnosed it is, how many parents want labels for everything, and how very, very few people are actually gifted.

 

Ok, I can see how that one would have been taken that way.

 

I think she made some good points, but I disagree with her definition of giftedness (PG-only, it seems), and that has been hashed out recently in that forum already. :D I think some posters, you just have to know their style to read their intention sometimes, so they might come across as saying one thing if you don't know them well, but if you have seen them post in a million threads, you can read something different. It's the problem of text-only communication. And then in this case, we have a variation of definitions amongst the group talking, and that muddies the waters.

 

I'm glad you found some answers with your DD, and again, I apologize for the tone of my first post. :grouphug:

[PeterPan]

Canucks-I think I have BbnB on my library request list. Books just take a while to come in. It definitely sounded good! :)

[Embassy]

If he is chugging along and happy as a clam and you feel like you are meeting all his needs then I don't think testing is necessary. If there are issues you are running into then I would look into testing to get more information.

 

I would test my kids right now if I had the funds. I was extremely frustrated my first year homeschooling because I had expected my son to logically progress through the chosen curriculum. He zoomed ahead in some areas that were supposed to come behind other skills.:confused: I wanted to get testing done to figure what in the world was going on. But places wanted big $$$ that I didn't have. I happened to move near to my former university where I had trained in giving tests. I contacted my old department and they let me bring my son to a room there and test him. I tested him for 3 hours using a couple of tests. I was his parent and teacher, but that piece of paper gave me information that helped transform how I taught him. I don't think the number (IQ) is so important and I don't think I would change anything based on that number, but the weakness and strengths that testing revealed can give you a different perspective on your child.

[wapiti]

Wapiti, when I was posting earlier I mentioned a book but forgot to add the link so I am not sure if you noticed it after the fact when I added it in. I am quoting myself below :tongue_smilie::

 

Have you heard of this book? It came out in September. The question goes for you too OhElizabeth. I have it on my list but have not decided whether to get it or not, yet.

 

Thank you!! I may have seen the title someplace but I can't remember where... ah, here http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=316573

 

If you do get it, please let us know what you think :). I may see if our library has it.

[Guest]

Canucks-I think I have BbnB on my library request list. Books just take a while to come in. It definitely sounded good! :)

 

Thank you!! I may have seen the title someplace but I can't remember where... ah, here http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=316573

 

If you do get it, please let us know what you think :). I may see if our library has it.

 

Thank you for the input! I think I need to spend some time on the SN board :tongue_smilie:. I never even saw that thread. Thank you wapiti :)! Judging by Crimson Wife's review, it sounds like I could benefit by reading it, at this stage of the game especially.

 

ETA: I will post if I read it :). My library doesn't have it and it would take a while for them to bring it, if they do.

[kristinannie]

Yep, that's right, since you haven't stated any reasons to get him tested. If there aren't any, there just aren't. :) Reasons for testing in general include getting access to services (not an issue for you), to pinpoint learning disabilities, etc.

 

You don't need IQ testing to figure out how to properly homeschool a child. Achievement testing is bound to be pretty worthless too for your purposes; achievement tests like the Woodcock Johnson only tell you the rareness of your child's scores compared to children of the same age (and/or grade, not important for a homeschooler), not what grade level they're at in certain subjects. You of course already know a good deal of info as to how fast your child can learn, what level your child's roughly at in each subject, etc.

 

 

This makes a lot of sense to me. Thanks!

[Guest]

Snowfall, I just wanted to come back here and say that I had the chance to read your thread in full and I can see where you were coming from and why you reacted the way you did :(. A lot of assumptions/ accusations where made in there about you and your family and some were not even listening to what you were saying. I was glad to see that you dealt with it well and also had some positive support. It takes a parent that deals with certain challenges to know what another is talking about :grouphug:.

 

Hope all works out well for you and your family!

[Guest]

Webb's Misdiagnosis and Dual Diagnoses of Gifted Children

the Eides' new book, The Dyslexia Advantage, currently being discussed at length on the SN board

Silverman's Upside Down Brilliance (get from your library)

Freed's Right Brained Child in a Left Brain World

 

Wapiti, I really wanted to get my hands on Upside Down Brilliance but can't find it anywhere :(. I really wanted to buy it but that does not appear to be an option. I live in Canada and my library does not carry it. Thankfully I found copies through Interlibrary loan so I will try to get it that way. I will most likely just buy Bright not Broken on Kindle.

[catz]

It is pretty obvious that my son is gifted, especially in math. He is 5. Is there any reason to get a HSed child tested? If he was in school, I would fight for the test so he could get into gifted classes, but I can't really see any reason to get him tested if I am schooling him at home. Is that right? Thanks!

 

No. I've never done full testing on either of my kids and they're both gifted. In fact we started homeschooling my oldest when he hit the ceiling of the GT screener at public school and it became obvious it wasn't going to work for him. They require testing in our state so over the past 5 years my son has been achievement tested in several (relatively inexpensive) ways and it's helped paint a picture. Talent search testing is great starting at 2nd or 3rd grade age wise. For us, full testing locally would probably run at least $1500-3000 and that's a TON of enrichment and books we could have bought. ANY test is a snap shot in time and you really need to look at what you know about your child and how they test and perform academically over a long period of time to get a clear picture. I'm still learning new things about my oldest.

 

If I had a child that I suspected was 2E, I would probably spend the money for a full assessment. Between personal research and the scores we have gotten for not so much money, I feel like I have a fairly clear picture for my oldest. My youngest has only been tested once so far, but that has been a good baseline for her and she is tracking much like her brother.

 

I agree with what abbeyej said!

[wapiti]

Wapiti, I really wanted to get my hands on Upside Down Brilliance but can't find it anywhere :(. I really wanted to buy it but that does not appear to be an option. I live in Canada and my library does not carry it. Thankfully I found copies through Interlibrary loan so I will try to get it that way. I will most likely just buy Bright not Broken on Kindle.

 

Upside Down Brilliance is worth the trouble to get through interlibrary loan if you can (LOL, I have no idea how to do that myself). I bought my copy from the author's testing clinic four years ago when we first tested dd. I don't understand why they don't print another run, unless she's working on a revised version or a sequel. I've probably read it at least five times, each time with a different person in my family in mind, and each time I see something I didn't notice before. Hmm.. I think it's time to read it again, LOL (but Dyslexia Advantage is due back at the library today and I can't renew it, so if I find reading time today it will have to be that one :tongue_smilie:).

[Guest]

Upside Down Brilliance is worth the trouble to get through interlibrary loan if you can (LOL, I have no idea how to do that myself). I bought my copy from the author's testing clinic four years ago when we first tested dd. I don't understand why they don't print another run, unless she's working on a revised version or a sequel. I've probably read it at least five times, each time with a different person in my family in mind, and each time I see something I didn't notice before. Hmm.. I think it's time to read it again, LOL (but Dyslexia Advantage is due back at the library today and I can't renew it, so if I find reading time today it will have to be that one :tongue_smilie:).

 

I wonder why they don't at least sell it as an ebook :confused:! I'll be keeping an eye out for a sequel. I need to contact our library for interlibrary. I usually only get books that are available in our library system in our area but I really want to read this one so I'll do the IL this time since I can't find it to buy it anyway (meaning at a decent price ;)). Dyslexia does not seem to be an issue in our case but I will be looking at Misdiagnosis from your list. That seems like another one that would suit my purpose right now, with what I am researching.

 

Thanks again for the recommendations :)!

[Guest]

I just stumbled on a book called Visual-Spacial Learners by Alexandra Golon. Have you seen that one? It has good reviews but only 6 reviews on Amazon. It seems interesting!

[wapiti]

I just stumbled on a book called Visual-Spacial Learners by Alexandra Golon. Have you seen that one? It has good reviews but only 6 reviews on Amazon. It seems interesting!

 

Golon works with, or is somehow associated with, Silverman. Her book isn't in the same category as Silverman's - it's more self-help from a mom's point of view, rather than the psychologist's explanation/description of this huge combination of traits/tendencies. If Golon's book is available at your library, it's worth taking a look. I have one of Golon's book somewhere in my house. However, IMO, it doesn't hold a candle to Silverman's.

 

By the way, there are numerous free articles on the website that you may find helpful (some of which are included in the appendix of Upside Down Brilliance or otherwise included in the book, in one way or another,). Golon has her own list of articles there too. Also, it looks like they've expanded the list of resources (I hadn't clicked on that for a long time). The resources page states:

 

Silverman, Linda K. (2002). Upside-Down Brilliance: The Visual-Spatial Learner. Denver, CO: DeLeon Publishing. [Available through Australian Gifted Support.]

though I can't figure out how to buy the book at that website or what price they would charge (presumably shipping from Australia).

 

Definitely poke all around the visual-spatial website.

[Guest]

Golon works with, or is somehow associated with, Silverman. Her book isn't in the same category as Silverman's - it's more self-help from a mom's point of view, rather than the psychologist's explanation/description of this huge combination of traits/tendencies. If Golon's book is available at your library, it's worth taking a look. I have one of Golon's book somewhere in my house. However, IMO, it doesn't hold a candle to Silverman's.

 

By the way, there are numerous free articles on the website that you may find helpful (some of which are included in the appendix of Upside Down Brilliance or otherwise included in the book, in one way or another,). Golon has her own list of articles there too. Also, it looks like they've expanded the list of resources (I hadn't clicked on that for a long time). The resources page states:

 

 

though I can't figure out how to buy the book at that website or what price they would charge (presumably shipping from Australia).

 

Definitely poke all around the visual-spatial website.

 

Thank you for this! My library does not carry any VSL books so I was considering buying it. When a book is useful, I like buying it to refer back to, just like you said about Upside-Down Brilliance. I guess I will take this one off my list :tongue_smilie:. I have spent quite a bit on books lately and have a lot sitting waiting to be read so I will be busy for a while anyway.

 

Funny you should mention the articles. I was reading some late last night and the input was very helpful. I need to spend more time on those.

 

I will check out the Australian website and see where it gets me. I assume shipping will be high from there to Canada :lol:, so I will probably pass but it's worth a look.