New Vaccine Recommendation: Delay BFing at time of immunization

[joannqn]

Apparently, breastmilk reduces the effectiveness of vaccines so the doctors studying this issue suggest the possibility of delaying breastfeeding to allow the vaccines to work first. Really? Delay important life-giving nutrition and immunity-boosting support so you can pump chemicals and diseases into my baby's body more effectively?

 

Vaccine Truth article

 

The study

 

Direct quote of the interpretation, emphasis mine:

 

INTERPRETATION: The lower immunogenicity and efficacy of rotavirus vaccines in poor developing countries could be explained, in part, by higher titers of IgA and neutralizing activity in breast milk consumed by their infants at the time of immunization that could effectively reduce the potency of the vaccine. Strategies to overcome this negative effect, such as delaying breast-feeding at the time of immunization, should be evaluated.

[KristinaBreece]

:confused:

 

If anything, I would say this makes a compelling argument for delaying vaccinations while you're breastfeeding. Certainly not the other way around. :001_huh:

[ocelotmom]

I'm not in favor of anything that impacts breastfeeding, and rotavirus is one vax I feel absolutely no need to give my healthy, full term, breastfed, stay-at-home infant... but they're talking about not having the oral vaccination and breastmilk in the stomach at the same time. So, they mean delaying a single feeding a few hours, not delaying the entire breastfeeding relationship.

[Impish]

:confused:

 

If anything, I would say this makes a compelling argument for delaying vaccinations while you're breastfeeding. Certainly not the other way around. :001_huh:

:iagree:

And maybe I'm weird, but the idea of not feeding a baby when they're hungry, a delay of a few hours, makes me want to throw up. :(

[Parrothead]

You know I feel for the poor mothers and babies of these mothers who fall for this crap and volunteer for studies/strategies.

[ktgrok]

OMG. The reason that the breastfeeding hampers the vaccine is that there are already antibodies to rotavirus in the milk, competing with the vaccine. This just shows the vaccine isn't needed at that time. Stopping breastfeeding to create a need for the vaccine is the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

 

My ped (very mainstream) doesn't advise the roatavirus vaccine for babies that are breastfed, as they are already protected.

 

face:palm

[ChristusG]

What?? Umm wow, that's just crazy. I think I'd do just the opposite....delay the vax instead of breastfeeding.

[jelbe5]

This is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. :glare: In my opinion, delaying vaccines on newborns, whose brains and systems are still developing, is preferable.

[Desert Strawberry]

That sounds like a very misguided interpretation to me.

[FriedClams]

:confused:

 

If anything, I would say this makes a compelling argument for delaying vaccinations while you're breastfeeding. Certainly not the other way around. :001_huh:

 

It's amazing to me - replace nature with science. Makes me sick.

[Heatherwith4]

Crazy. Besides, anytime DD has had shots, the nurse lets us stay in the exam room for a few minutes afterwards so I can nurse her. ;)

[Perry]

1. That vaccine "truth" article is misleading. No one is recommending stopping breastfeeding for vaccines. The abstract does mention evaluating it as a possibility. That means studying it to see whether it would be effective without causing harm.

 

2. This is a study among people in developing countries. From medscape

 

Despite the proven effectiveness of oral rehydration solutions, rotavirus remains a major cause of childhood morbidity and mortality. Data indicate that rotavirus causes 440,000 deaths each year globally or ~5% of all childhood deaths;[10,11] 93% of these deaths occur in countries with the lowest gross national product per capita.[10] In the poorest countries, ~1 child in every 100 to 200 will die of rotavirus disease by 5 years of age.[10,12,13]

That's over 1000 kids per day.

 

Oops. Looks like breastfeeding isn't working out so well to prevent rotavirus.

 

 

I am not going to get into a debate over this. BTDT and it sucks my life away.

 

Just wanted to give a little perspective. :auto:

Edited April 6, 2011 by Perry

[mommymilkies]

You know I feel for the poor mothers and babies of these mothers who fall for this crap and volunteer for studies/strategies.

 

I agree. We don't vax at all, but if they told me this crap I wouldn't do it anyway. As far as breastfeeding not preventing rotavirus, I don't suppose it has anything to do with starvation, poor nutrition in general, and lack of clean water supplies, right? ;) in fact, that's one major reason a lot of people boycott Nestle because of the pushing of formula to countries where there is inadequate clean water supplies.

[RhondaJK]

I agree. We don't vax at all, but if they told me this crap I wouldn't do it anyway. As far as breastfeeding not preventing rotavirus, I don't suppose it has anything to do with starvation, poor nutrition in general, and lack of clean water supplies, right? ;) in fact, that's one major reason a lot of people boycott Nestle because of the pushing of formula to countries where there is inadequate clean water supplies.

 

I went to a inservice last week on promoting BF in the hospital with our new moms, it was a good inservice but I left with a lump in my throat over one of the statement. One of the contrindications for BF in the US is mom being HIV positive, but not in "developing" countries. The rationale was the babies are not going to receive treatment for HIV anyway, they will have a better quality of life being BF as long as mom is able to feed them. I understand the rationale and agree they will have a better quality of life, but I guess I just never realized that there would be no attempt at treatment or prevention of infection to these infants. I am not pro vaccine by any means, but I think delaying one feeding to increase immunity to rotavirus in these countries could possibly save lives and is worth the investigators research time.

[flobee76]

You know I feel for the poor mothers and babies of these mothers who fall for this crap and volunteer for studies/strategies.

 

:iagree:

[mommymilkies]

I went to a inservice last week on promoting BF in the hospital with our new moms, it was a good inservice but I left with a lump in my throat over one of the statement. One of the contrindications for BF in the US is mom being HIV positive, but not in "developing" countries. The rationale was the babies are not going to receive treatment for HIV anyway, they will have a better quality of life being BF as long as mom is able to feed them. I understand the rationale and agree they will have a better quality of life, but I guess I just never realized that there would be no attempt at treatment or prevention of infection to these infants. I am not pro vaccine by any means, but I think delaying one feeding to increase immunity to rotavirus in these countries could possibly save lives and is worth the investigators research time.

 

I would rather put the money into obtaining clean water and adequate nutrition, as well as breastfeeding support for families in developing nations. Pushing vaccines should not be top priority-these children are dying with them. They need these human rights of food and water. Vitamin A supplementation, in fact, was shown by WHO to be far more effective in dealing with measles. It's sad to me that we can spend millions a day on wars and yet even 1/10 of that can save thousands of lives of children around the world. But that's another discussion. ;)

[jplain]

That's over 1000 kids per day.

 

Oops. Looks like breastfeeding isn't working out so well to prevent rotavirus.

And how many of those 1000 per day are breastfed?

[Perry]

I would rather put the money into obtaining clean water and adequate nutrition, as well as breastfeeding support for families in developing nations. Pushing vaccines should not be top priority-these children are dying with them. They need these human rights of food and water. Vitamin A supplementation, in fact, was shown by WHO to be far more effective in dealing with measles. It's sad to me that we can spend millions a day on wars and yet even 1/10 of that can save thousands of lives of children around the world. But that's another discussion. ;)

I disagree with the bolded statement. Can you provide a source?

 

 

In the long run, of course the goal is to improve nutrition and the standard of living, and have clean water accessible to all. But we are many, many years away from that happening, and it's not because no one's thought of it. We can do something right now that will save over 1000 lives a day, and we should be doing it.

[ocelotmom]

I went to a inservice last week on promoting BF in the hospital with our new moms, it was a good inservice but I left with a lump in my throat over one of the statement. One of the contrindications for BF in the US is mom being HIV positive, but not in "developing" countries. The rationale was the babies are not going to receive treatment for HIV anyway, they will have a better quality of life being BF as long as mom is able to feed them. I understand the rationale and agree they will have a better quality of life, but I guess I just never realized that there would be no attempt at treatment or prevention of infection to these infants. I am not pro vaccine by any means, but I think delaying one feeding to increase immunity to rotavirus in these countries could possibly save lives and is worth the investigators research time.

 

The rationale I've heard is that, when there is insufficient access to formula and/or clean water, the risk of death from malnutrition or infection is higher than the risk of transmission of HIV via breastfeeding. Which isn't quite the same as what you were told. I wonder which is true? (Or, perhaps, both.)

[Perry]

And how many of those 1000 per day are breastfed?

I don't have a number. Do you? Does it matter?

 

People are suggesting "letting nature take its course". That's exactly what is happening, and over 1000 kids a day are dying from a vaccine preventable disease. I find that abhorrent.

[ktgrok]

I went to a inservice last week on promoting BF in the hospital with our new moms, it was a good inservice but I left with a lump in my throat over one of the statement. One of the contrindications for BF in the US is mom being HIV positive, but not in "developing" countries. The rationale was the babies are not going to receive treatment for HIV anyway, they will have a better quality of life being BF as long as mom is able to feed them. I understand the rationale and agree they will have a better quality of life, but I guess I just never realized that there would be no attempt at treatment or prevention of infection to these infants. I am not pro vaccine by any means, but I think delaying one feeding to increase immunity to rotavirus in these countries could possibly save lives and is worth the investigators research time.

 

I believe that has just changed. I am almost certain that I recently read that moms that are on retrovirals are encouraged to breastfeed.

[ktgrok]

I don't have a number. Do you? Does it matter?

 

People are suggesting "letting nature take its course". That's exactly what is happening, and over 1000 kids a day are dying from a vaccine preventable disease. I find that abhorrent.

 

ugh, no, in areas where rotavirus is rampant then of course a vaccine is a good idea. I just don't think limiting breastfeeding, which is the message moms may take home, is a good idea either, given the conditions we are talking about. And injectable version, or another form, may solve both problems.

[jplain]

I don't have a number. Do you? Does it matter?

 

People are suggesting "letting nature take its course". That's exactly what is happening, and over 1000 kids a day are dying from a vaccine preventable disease. I find that abhorrent.

You suggested that the rotavirus death rate means that breastfeeding "isn't working," and yet you don't even know how many of these babies are being breastfed? That's some pretty poor logic.

 

Yes, it matters. And yes, it is abhorrent.

 

Are you aware of how rotavirus is transmitted?

 

If pushing formula on moms who do not have access to clean water is the reason these children contract rotavirus in the first place, it matters.

 

If these babies' lack of access to breastmilk containing maternal rotavirus antibodies makes them more likely to die when they do contract rotavirus, it matters.

[JESSICAinMD]

:confused:

 

If anything, I would say this makes a compelling argument for delaying vaccinations while you're breastfeeding. Certainly not the other way around. :001_huh:

:iagree:

[Perry]

You suggested that the rotavirus death rate means that breastfeeding "isn't working," and yet you don't even know how many of these babies are being breastfed? That's some pretty poor logic.

Studies are conflicting. Some studies show HIGHER rates of rotavirus in breastfed kids. Some show no difference. Many deaths occur in kids over 2 years old, who are neither breastfeeding nor on formula. The reason it doesn't matter is that kids are dying, both breastfed and non-breastfed.

Yes, it matters. And yes, it is abhorrent.

 

Are you aware of how rotavirus is transmitted?Yes.

 

If pushing formula on moms who do not have access to clean water is the reason these children contract rotavirus in the first place, it matters. I agree. I hate Nestle. I have boycotted them for many, many years.

 

If these babies' lack of access to breastmilk containing maternal rotavirus antibodies makes them more likely to die when they do contract rotavirus, it matters.

 

One example

 

Observations questioning a protective role for breast-feeding in severe rotavirus diarrhea.

 

Glass RI, Stoll BJ, Wyatt RG, Hoshino Y, Banu H, Kapikian AZ.

Abstract

 

To investigate whether breast-feeding protects children against rotavirus diarrhea (RVD), we compared rates of breast-feeding by age and enteric pathogens among 2,276 children with diarrhea 0-4 years of age who attended a diarrhea hospital in Bangladesh. Infants 0-5 months were less likely to be breast-fed than children 6-11 months of age suggesting that some protection against diarrhea with all agents was associated with early breast-feeding. In every age group studied, breast-feeding was more common among children with RVD than among children with non-RVD whereas it was less common among children with cholera and shigellosis. Twenty percent of breast milks consumed by infants less than 1 year of age had high levels of neutralizing activity (greater than or equal to 320) to the Wa strain of rotavirus but this activity did not appear to be protective since the 30 infants with RVD consumed milk which had titers that did not differ significantly from those consumed by 44 infants with diarrhea of other cause. Despite the prolonged breast-feeding which is common in Bangladesh, the mean age of hospitalization with RVD is approximately the same as in countries where the duration of breast-feeding is quite short. None of these 3 independent observations support a protective role for breast-feeding against rotavirus diarrhea after the first months of life.

 

 

and this is my last post on the subject. I have things to do today.:) Edited April 6, 2011 by Perry

[Dawn in OH]

This is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. :glare: In my opinion, delaying vaccines on newborns, whose brains and systems are still developing, is preferable.

 

:iagree:

[TracyP]

My ped (very mainstream) doesn't advise the roatavirus vaccine for babies that are breastfed, as they are already protected.

 

:iagree: Mine too except he didn't bring up breastfeeding. He said the vaccine has already been pulled once and will be again soon. This may not be true in developing countries but I was VERY surprised to hear this and try to share it with others. (we are a pro vaccine family and he is a pro vaccine doc)

[ocelotmom]

:iagree: Mine too except he didn't bring up breastfeeding. He said the vaccine has already been pulled once and will be again soon. This may not be true in developing countries but I was VERY surprised to hear this and try to share it with others. (we are a pro vaccine family and he is a pro vaccine doc)

 

Yes, it's definitely true that it has been pulled before.

 

I'm not anti-vax. I think many of them are beneficial. But I do question the constantly increasing number of vaccinations and the motives behind it, as well as the pretty much one-size-fits-all vaccination schedule.

[Slartibartfast]

I am all for questioning vaccinations but I do think that people in third world countries are in entirely different situations than we are.

 

Breastfeeding or not living in those places would impact my vaccine choices.

 

I take issue with people patronizing people in those places for the decisions they have made, we can't possibly place ourselves in their shoes. We are privileged to live in developed nations

 

The whole vaccine or not debate is a first world issue. I can't imagine the choices they face everyday that would never even occur to me.

 

What we should focus on is people undermining breastfeeding in third world nations, not whether or not they should vaccinate their kids from illnesses they see kids die from in huge numbers.