How do you allow your teen to talk to you?

[Jean in Newcastle]

Okay, another scenario with a question: I am sweeping up a pile of spilled debris. Child is assigned the part of picking up pieces too large for the dustpan. She is standing there ready to help. I go to get the dustpan and child does nothing to help me and instead starts looking for the phone and asking where it is. So I snap at her. "You are not getting the phone you are helping me." Because I snapped at her does that give her the right to cross her arms, stomp out of the room, say that I yelled at her (I didn't I just used a snappish tone of voice) and refuse to do as she was told? Then complain to other family members about me and they join in? Is this the acceptable course of events?

 

Maybe I can establish a hand signal or something.

 

I'm probably not the best one to answer this because I'm still working all of this out, but I think it's ok for all of us to show some negative emotions like irritation. If I snap at someone and they start to get mad back, I'll stop and say, "Let's stop. I'm feeling frustrated right now that you are not helping. I am sorry that I didn't tell you that but snapped at you instead. Now, please help me clean up this mess." I would stop them from doing what you described because two wrongs don't make a right and because I don't think that having someone irritated at you excuses you from direct obedience.

 

I have allowed my kids to say something along the same lines, "I'm frustrated, Mom, because you didn't let me finish the other job before assigning me this one." (I tend to do this at times. . . )

[Lovedtodeath]

Thank you Jean.

I'm still working all of this out,

 

It is so hard isn't it? When you have no model to follow? And I asked my nephew what his mom would do... but we don't know if her actions are the right ones either, kwim? Because we don't know what normal is anymore, or if normal is right.

 

And typing that out I thought well duh, we do have a perfect example to follow... no Christ wouldn't snap at anyone... but then I am not always perfect and his followers wouldn't ignore and ridicule him either so I don't really think that really helps a whole lot.

 

I always post my thoughts as they come to me... and that often gets me in trouble on here. Sigh.

[elegantlion]

I get that, and thank you for your suggestion but you did not really answer my question.

 

Two separate questions, for everyone, and this are sincere because this really seems to be what everyone is saying:

 

Is it really wrong to snap every time? I should never snap at the child no matter what their actions?

 

If I do not pull this off perfectly and I snap I do then it is okay for my child and others in the household to ignore and ridicule me?

 

I tend to snap sometimes. Part of the issue in a scenario like that is expectations, we've had almost the same thing, child standing with dustpan in hand totally clueless. In my mind there is nothing to think about, you help by putting the dustpan on the floor and helping me. However, I believer there is a disconnect in the teen brain for some. They need explicit instructions, that yes, I need you to help me RIGHT NOW.

 

Because I assumed they knew what I meant and they had no clue, they took my snapping as yelling.

 

Some days it feels like I'm doing more training than when they were a toddler. Both dh and I have a short tempers, which mellowing in a benefit to having children when you are older. I grew up with a dad with a short fuse, he'd just get mad and yell and quit. I don't want that to be how ds remembers my parenting.

 

In a scenario like that I would let us all chill out, then ask about expectations. Did you understand that I needed you now? If not, I stress that we BOTH need to work on our communication skills.

 

There have been plenty of times I stopped and told ds, we've covered this enough, you know what to do, if you need help ask, but I'm not doing it for you.

 

I used to train employees in the last few jobs I had. I do take that mentality with ds a lot, it when I'm overwhelmed that my emotions take over.

[Lovedtodeath]

I tend to snap sometimes. Part of the issue in a scenario like that is expectations, we've had almost the same thing, child standing with dustpan in hand totally clueless. In my mind there is nothing to think about, you help by putting the dustpan on the floor and helping me. However, I believer there is a disconnect in the teen brain for some. They need explicit instructions, that yes, I need you to help me RIGHT NOW.

 

Because I assumed they knew what I meant and they had no clue, they took my snapping as yelling.

I was able to calmly talk to her after the fact and this was it exactly. She somehow thought that she had helped and I somehow thought that she hadn't. It makes no sense, but this misunderstanding was what started the problem.

[KristinaBreece]

That must be one of the most useful lines ever spoken. :D

 

 

 

When my mother encountered such people she would stop talking and raise her eyebrows. That would stop most people. And when "I'm bigger than you" stopped working, it became "because I'm the Mum!" And as we were clever enough to realise, that meant "I'm richer than you, so you'd better play nice or I won't share!" Oh, what fun times I have to look forward to.

 

Rosie

:lol:

 

I love the way you phrase things. I can hear myself saying something like this to one of my DC in the distant future.

[Rosie_0801]

Two separate questions, for everyone, and this are sincere because this really seems to be what everyone is saying:

 

Is it really wrong to snap every time? I should never snap at the child no matter what their actions?

 

If I do not pull this off perfectly and I snap I do then it is okay for my child and others in the household to ignore and ridicule me?

 

Does mother have to be perfection in a skirt to be entitled to pleasant social interactions with her family? Uh, no.

 

Perhaps your second reminder can be more in question format?

"I just asked you to X, is there a reason you haven't?"

 

If you need to, that can be followed up by "Now I understand, but I still need you to finish it," or "Now I understand, ok, I'll do this, you go and take care of that. Come back and tell me when it is finished." If this is done without yelling, anyone throwing a tanty at your unreasonableness is being unreasonable.

 

Rosie

[Lovedtodeath]

Does mother have to be perfection in a skirt to be entitled to pleasant social interactions with her family? Uh, no.

 

Perhaps your second reminder can be more in question format?

"I just asked you to X, is there a reason you haven't?"

 

If you need to, that can be followed up by "Now I understand, but I still need you to finish it," or "Now I understand, ok, I'll do this, you go and take care of that. Come back and tell me when it is finished." If this is done without yelling, anyone throwing a tanty at your unreasonableness is being unreasonable.

 

Rosie

In question format. I think that helps. Thanks.

[Peela]

Cranky is not the same as disrespectful. My DD likes to point out all of my faults and shift any blame of hers onto my own failings and complain that I am not good enough... or if she is to do a chore, then what is Mom doing? Mom you should be doing it too, or more than me, etc.

 

See the food thread. A kid should not think that they have the right to tell Mom that she is doing a bad job. Cranky is different. Kwim?

 

Hi-jack: I haven't been perfect in example or expectations from the day of her birth. I had severe PPD and was terrible during that time. That is where she got a lot of this attitude. For her sanity she had to ignore what I said. But I have been better for 2 years now and she is keeping the same attitude. It just isn't helpful to say that it has never been allowed or I have always modeled a good attitude, etc. now, is it? It is too late.

 

Here is an example of DDs attitude: I go through emotional blackmail with her all day long. I will tell her to empty the dishwasher. "Why?" It is one of your chores. "But today we were going to..." JUST DO IT! "See that is the kind of attitude that makes me yell at you and lock myself in my room." The thing is when I had PPD this would be acceptable part of the time. But now I am much much better and this type of behavior from her is worse. She uses it as an excuse to get out of everything.

 

OK, here is where i am at with this stuff. I have been doing some training in non violent communication- went to another workshop yesterday. I have changed in how I communicate with my kids.

Instead of always "telling" , including the type of telling where we sound like we are asking but we are really telling, I am asking nicely.

If I get a bad response- I stop and communicate and find out what is going on, and also share what is going on for me- but respectfully.

I have also told the kids this is what I am doing. Yes, sometimes they take advantage of it- but overall, the communication is healthier and the anger levels are much lower.

 

I have come to the conclusion that telling kids what to do all the time IS also a way of disrespecting them. Especially teens- and I have only got teens to work with.

I know *I* dont like my husband to *tell* me what to do. Or anyone else. But if he *asks* me nicely in a way that I feel I actually have a choice here, it is completely different- I am respected as an autonomous being.

Teenagers are on the threshold of adulthood and I think deserve more than to be *told* to do things all the time- even if they are disrespectful.

Mine are responding pretty well to being asked. Yes, they often dont do their chores still- mainly because they are very busy nowadays, especially in the mornings- but a gentle reminder and a checking if they are going to do them- is usually enough if they forget. Thats better than the escalating frustration I used to act on and express, and which would cause a certain response in the teen. I am not setting up a pattern of resistance, or an opportunity for rebellion. I am just asking.

The thing is- they respond much better to being asked. They feel respected. Even if they are chores they are meant to be doing day after day, that we have an agreement on. And I feel better- I sometimes do get upset- but I also share my feelings with them- how frustrating it is to have to remind them etc- and that way, I am being real with them too, not just selling out and being nice.

I havent gone the whole way with the non violent communication methods because I am just working with this one and building trust with them. Empathising with them. No one likes to be bossed around and everyone wants to be heard and seen deeply. A kid who feels really understood and respected is much more likely to see the reasonablness in unpacking the dishwasher.

 

 

Because we might have had a misunderstanding the night before when people were tired, does not mean I need to carry that over into the next morning. Each day is a new day for me. I see my dc is a very loving person. I don't have any concerns about his general character or heart.

 

Yes, I think that is very important- to start fresh and not to hold their bad handling of their own emotions against them in an ongoing way. I know my son has told me what he hates the most is when he first gets up in the morning to be told to do something. He would really like some time to just connect, and do his thing, before being told/asked to do things. And he especially doesnt want to go to school with a parent angry with him.

 

 

There is a hierarchy in my home; my kids are aware of it. That said, we have, as a family, a quirky, informal, contemporary and snarky way of relating. My boys (with my dd, it's not an issue) have an intuitive understanding of "the line" and only rarely cross it.

 

My teens talk to me in mature language that I minimally censor. However, I am able to cultivate that because my kids typically respect me as a close, loving, playful authority.

 

Yes, I think that is the same here too.

 

Except in our case, dh has a tendency to toilet humour so the toilet humour level sometimes goes over the top. :glare:

 

But ds13 can escalate very quickly into burning anger (he's almost punched a hole through a wall before) and his language when angry can become abusive at it's worst. I've had trouble with my own anger in the past - more of a scathingly sarcastic kind of thing - and I've had to learn how to become the calm ice woman when dealing with him. He's my child I've had to work with from day one with modeling self talk and now how to express legitimate feelings in a respectful and non-abusive way. He's also my most openly loving and snuggly child even now at 13.

 

My angriest is my most loving and affectionate one too.

They make us grow, don't they? Thats why I think it is more a personality thing than necessarily a "there is one way to do it" thing. You learn what works for your kid.

 

See, I think this is part of my problem. I was raised that any emotions got you in trouble and sometimes the trouble was a slap in the face. Crying was punishable as well. And I know the crying was sincere quiet crying... not screaming type crying to get my way... So I tend to go the other way and allow too much and now I have an out of control child who doesn't reign in her emotions at all.

 

Oh and even though I typically acted with much, much more respect I certainly didn't feel it... at all. KWIM?

 

It sounds like you have some serious emotional wounding there, which makes it hard to find the balance?

 

 

I

 

Two separate questions, for everyone, and this are sincere because this really seems to be what everyone is saying:

 

Is it really wrong to snap every time? I should never snap at the child no matter what their actions?

 

If I do not pull this off perfectly and I snap I do then it is okay for my child and others in the household to ignore and ridicule me?

 

No- and if they are not respecting you that is because you are not respecting yourself.

But if you snap- which is perfectly human- what about apologising?

If snapping is common, then are you feeling out of control and disrespected regularly?

But when I have seen what you have written- it sounds very much like you are ordering your daughter around- and while that is "normal" parenting in our society, I really wonder if that is a source of her disrespect and rebelliousness towards you? Its a pattern and it builds resentment in some teenagers.

 

To me, asking nicely doesn't mean I am not respecting myself- I am - but I am also modelling respect to my teens and giving them an opportunity to respond with similar respect. They nearly always do.

 

And by the way, my dh is not on board with my approach and that is causing issues here but I can't go back to my old way of parenting of bossing them around. I just can't. So we have 2 parenting models happening here and the teens are seeing both and responding accordingly. Dh knows what i am doing though and it is influencing him. However I am also respecting *him* more to parent the way *he* wants instead of arguing with him about it. The kids are fine with it- we have always had different approaches.

[LibraryLover]

I'd say, "Babe! I need your help! Hold this dustpan!!" If they were about to get on the phone, I'd say it louder, " I need you! Please help me before you get on the phone!"

 

I don't think this is snapping, I think it's stating the obvious...but in reality, some people don't notice the obvious. They do not mean to be obtuse. For those of us who notice *everything*, this trait is hard to understand. We do need to help them become more aware. They really do need reminding, but it's not personal. They don't see what we do.

 

If they got on the phone without helping me? And I was sure they heard me? Well... off the phone. That's a battle I would choose.

Edited March 27, 2011 by LibraryLover

[Lovedtodeath]

Wow, these responses are very helpful. My first reaction is to think that not ordering the kids around and not snipping at them abdicates my roll as an authority figure, their mother/aunt/caregiver.

[Rosie_0801]

Wow, these responses are very helpful. My first reaction is to think that not ordering the kids around and not snipping at them abdicates my roll as an authority figure, their mother/aunt/caregiver.

 

Nah, not necessarily. That's why in my post I suggested, if they convince you they have something more important to do that what you had asked, you have them report back when they are done. All you need to say is "Oh, good, thanks :) " but it is keeping you in the know and both of you know it. Or you might have to say "Show me. Just fix up that bit there, then you can go play."

 

When you settle what the new rules are going to be, it's going to take a while before everyone gets used to it, so don't give up.

 

Rosie

[Peela]

Wow, these responses are very helpful. My first reaction is to think that not ordering the kids around and not snipping at them abdicates my roll as an authority figure, their mother/aunt/caregiver.

 

I am finding that parenting teens involves many roles, and I can step into different ones as needed. I don't need to hang on to the authority figure role, with power behind it, when I am asking if they would please unpack the dishwasher. They live here, we live together, I cook most meals- its just a reasonable request of another human being. I reserve my "authority role" for when there is already disrespect happening and I need to power up a bit to deal with the situation- and even then, more communication and more listening is usually a better option.

I would rather they helped because they want to, than because I told them to. My goal is young adults who pitch in, who behave well, because they want to, not because they are afraid of me or the consequences of not doing so. I am not especially into "obedience", especially by the teen years- I think the cost of that is too high. I want cooperation.

[Sweetpeach]

I am finding that parenting teens involves many roles, and I can step into different ones as needed. I don't need to hang on to the authority figure role, with power behind it, when I am asking if they would please unpack the dishwasher. They live here, we live together, I cook most meals- its just a reasonable request of another human being. I reserve my "authority role" for when there is already disrespect happening and I need to power up a bit to deal with the situation- and even then, more communication and more listening is usually a better option.

I would rather they helped because they want to, than because I told them to. My goal is young adults who pitch in, who behave well, because they want to, not because they are afraid of me or the consequences of not doing so. I am not especially into "obedience", especially by the teen years- I think the cost of that is too high. I want cooperation.

 

Thank you, Peela, for all the ways you lovingly express your parenting style on this board. Your ideas have tremendously influenced the dynamic in our home. I really agree with your statement above that the cost of obedience is too high. A meaningful life unfolds when young people want to do the right things while still living in the context of family of origin. I can't force that. It has to unfold. You just say it so much nicer than I do!

Tricia