LizzyBee Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 My dyslexic 9 yo will be doing Classical Conversations next year. I only signed her up for Foundations. I didn't sign up for Essentials because a) I really don't like IEW, and b) from what I've seen, I think Essentials will throw too much information at her too fast. If you've done CC with a student who has dyslexia or other language based learning disabilities, do you agree with that Essentials probably moves too fast? To give you a little background on where she is at, we are currently using Writing With Ease 2, so she's basically doing narration and dictation. She will occasionally write a letter to a friend or her grandma, and she writes short emails to family members. Her reading level is @ Boxcar Children books. We are in lesson 2 of Barton Reading and Spelling, so she's just gotten to multisyllable words and open syllables. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newlifemom Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 As a parent of a former Essentials student [typical] I would absolutely agree with your assessment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyBee Posted March 19, 2011 Author Share Posted March 19, 2011 As a parent of a former Essentials student [typical] I would absolutely agree with your assessment. Thanks! I feel good about the decision, but then I have those moments when I think maybe I'm depriving her of a great opportunity to be challenged beyond what I think she's capable of. I don't want to set her up for failure, though. I'm thinking about using Verticy's writing with her next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newlifemom Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 Thanks! I feel good about the decision, but then I have those moments when I think maybe I'm depriving her of a great opportunity to be challenged beyond what I think she's capable of. I don't want to set her up for failure, though. I'm thinking about using Verticy's writing with her next year. I know someone who did with a very slow reader and it was tough, I believe. I think you could if you were willing to sit next to her [you are supposed to anyway] and not allow any distractions, and then of there is the follow up at home that is well, essential. :) I don't know her age, but Essentials is a course that continues for 3 years with each year going deeper in the same material. You can always consider doing it next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyBee Posted March 19, 2011 Author Share Posted March 19, 2011 I know someone who did with a very slow reader and it was tough, I believe. I think you could if you were willing to sit next to her [you are supposed to anyway] and not allow any distractions, and then of there is the follow up at home that is well, essential. :) I don't know her age, but Essentials is a course that continues for 3 years with each year going deeper in the same material. You can always consider doing it next year. [you are supposed to anyway] Really? I asked about parent involvement. I was told (and the paperwork I signed said the same thing) that the parents are supposed to remain on-site or designate another parent to be in charge of your children. My friend who does CC said the moms just hang out and talk. I visited a foundations class, and only one other parent besides the tutor was there, but I got the impression she was an assistant. That said, I thought that if we did Essentials this year, I'd have to be in the class, scribe for her, and make sure I know what the homework is. My dd is 9 and in the fourth grade. I figure she'll start Challenge at least a year late if we stay with CC. I guess I'll see how things go this year, then decide whether to do Essentials next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizabethB Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 My friends with normal 9 year olds think it is too much! My daughter is ahead in language arts and I thought it would be too much for her so we just did foundations this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonshineLearner Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 There are actually whole classes of children who decide to wait a year for Challenge A. I think that 2 years of Essentials is more than enough to move on..... It's a ton of writing and grammar!! And, for Essentials, it's literally YOU being in the class as much or more than your child. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsmama Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 I am an Essentials tutor and I have a child w/special needs (though not of Essentials age). Essentials is a great course but very challenging. Many people don't put their typical kids in at 9, as a PP said. I think you have made the right decision. That said, you may want to sit in on an Essentials class early on in the year to determine how your daughter may fare in it in the future. In our CC program, most of the Foundations older kids are also in Essentials, but not all. It's a parent's choice as to what is right for their child! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyBee Posted March 19, 2011 Author Share Posted March 19, 2011 Thanks everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merry gardens Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 My dyslexic 9 yo will be doing Classical Conversations next year. I only signed her up for Foundations. I didn't sign up for Essentials because a) I really don't like IEW, and b) from what I've seen, I think Essentials will throw too much information at her too fast. If you've done CC with a student who has dyslexia or other language based learning disabilities, do you agree with that Essentials probably moves too fast? To give you a little background on where she is at, we are currently using Writing With Ease 2, so she's basically doing narration and dictation. She will occasionally write a letter to a friend or her grandma, and she writes short emails to family members. Her reading level is @ Boxcar Children books. We are in lesson 2 of Barton Reading and Spelling, so she's just gotten to multisyllable words and open syllables. Thanks! Hi Lizzy, I don't know anything about the question you asked. :tongue_smilie: Since we're starting to make better progress on the reading front, I plan to focus more on writing next. Someone on this board recommended the book "From Talking to Writing" by the Landmark School. I recently got it, along with the Sentence Frameworks and Paragraph Frameworks workbooks. They were developed specifically to teach writing to people with dyslexia and the International Dyslexia Association sells them in their online bookstore. (that's where I found the workbooks, thanks to you link to that website last week.) I'm so excited about them that I might not wait until next September to start. I was leaning towards using IEW until I found these books from the Landmark school. Once we're done with those, I'll probably look for another very structured writing program. :bigear: I had read somewhere around here that it was a good writing program for dyslexic children who have gotten through Barton level 4. I'll be reading what others have to say about using Classic Conversation with a dylexic child. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyBee Posted March 19, 2011 Author Share Posted March 19, 2011 Hi Lizzy, I don't know anything about the question you asked. :tongue_smilie: Since we're starting to make better progress on the reading front, I plan to focus more on writing next. Someone on this board recommended the book "From Talking to Writing" by the Landmark School. I recently got it, along with the Sentence Frameworks and Paragraph Frameworks workbooks. They were developed specifically to teach writing to people with dyslexia and the International Dyslexia Association sells them in their online bookstore. (that's where I found the workbooks, thanks to you link to that website last week.) I'm so excited about them that I might not wait until next September to start. I was leaning towards using IEW until I found these books from the Landmark school. Once we're done with those, I'll probably look for another very structured writing program. :bigear: I had read somewhere around here that it was a good writing program for dyslexic children who have gotten through Barton level 4. I'll be reading what others have to say about using Classic Conversation with a dylexic child. Oh, how funny. I put From Talking to Writing in my cart at amazon, but I haven't pushed the button yet. Do you think the workbooks are necessary? From the description on the Landmark school website, I got the impression that the workbooks are blank templates. If the templates are in the books, I can make photocopies instead of buying the workbooks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merry gardens Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 (edited) Oh, how funny. I put From Talking to Writing in my cart at amazon, but I haven't pushed the button yet. Do you think the workbooks are necessary? From the description on the Landmark school website, I got the impression that the workbooks are blank templates. If the templates are in the books, I can make photocopies instead of buying the workbooks. That's funny. You could create the worksheets from the information found in the book, but copying might be tricky. For one, unlike many other teacher's materials, this book doesn't give permission to copy. Plus, if someone did copy them, the pages in the book have a lot of dark areas and don't leave as much space for writing some phrases as the workbook pages do. If that wasn't enough to convince me to buy the workbooks, I often have printer problems on my computer--and with all that along with the cost of my printer's $$$ ink cartridges, I figured it was cheaper, easier and all around better to buy the workbooks. The workbooks aren't exactly neccessary, but having them will save me time, money and headaches. Edit: From Talking to Writing starts with some basic grammar concepts before it gets to the point where students write sentences and paragraphs. The earlier ideas in the book don't involve the workbooks. Edited March 19, 2011 by merry gardens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyBee Posted March 19, 2011 Author Share Posted March 19, 2011 That's funny. You could create the worksheets from the information found in the book, but copying might be tricky. For one, unlike many other teacher's materials, this book doesn't give permission to copy. Plus, if someone did copy them, the pages in the book have a lot of dark areas and don't leave as much space for writing some phrases as the workbook pages do. If that wasn't enough to convince me to buy the workbooks, I often have printer problems on my computer--and with all that along with the cost of my printer's $$$ ink cartridges, I figured it was cheaper, easier and all around better to buy the workbooks. The workbooks aren't exactly neccessary, but having them will save me time, money and headaches. Edit: From Talking to Writing starts with some basic grammar concepts before it gets to the point where students write sentences and paragraphs. The earlier ideas in the book don't involve the workbooks. It sounds like the workbooks are worthwhile. Is the book laid out in a way that's easy to teach, or does the teacher have to write her own lesson plans based on the method laid out in the book? If it requires a lot of teacher prep, it might never get done, in which case I'd be better off splurging on Verticy's writing. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merry gardens Posted March 20, 2011 Share Posted March 20, 2011 It sounds like the workbooks are worthwhile. Is the book laid out in a way that's easy to teach, or does the teacher have to write her own lesson plans based on the method laid out in the book? If it requires a lot of teacher prep, it might never get done, in which case I'd be better off splurging on Verticy's writing. Thanks! It requires teacher prep and some lesson plan writing. I haven't started it yet so I don't know if I'd say it takes "a lot", but it's not open-and-go. I'm excited about trying the ideas from the book because the authors clearly were very familiar with dyslexic students like my son. I'm thinking about starting sooner (sometime this spring) rather than later (next fall) while I'm still excited. I am also a little scared about the teacher prep that it might take, but all the writing programs I've looked at for my son scare me in some way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyBee Posted March 20, 2011 Author Share Posted March 20, 2011 It requires teacher prep and some lesson plan writing. I haven't started it yet so I don't know if I'd say it takes "a lot", but it's not open-and-go. I'm excited about trying the ideas from the book because the authors clearly were very familiar with dyslexic students like my son. I'm thinking about starting sooner (sometime this spring) rather than later (next fall) while I'm still excited. I am also a little scared about the teacher prep that it might take, but all the writing programs I've looked at for my son scare me in some way. Thanks for the info; it is very helpful. I too have heard good things about the way the book breaks down writing into incremental steps. But my dh is the primary teacher for now. He has ADHD, and anything that's not laid out very clearly makes his head spin. I work full time and do dd's reading tutoring, so I'm concerned that I would never get around to reading the book thoroughly and writing lesson plans that dh can follow. I have several levels of Classical Writing sitting on my shelves and I originally thought we'd follow WWE2 with CW Aesop. CW worked great for my mildly dyslexic dd, but I've realized it probably moves too fast for dd9. And I don't think my dh will have the patience to figure out how to teach Homer! So at this point, I think our options are WWE3 or Verticy. I'm leaning toward Verticy after reading so many good reviews of it here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julesnpebbles@suddenlink. Posted March 21, 2011 Share Posted March 21, 2011 Haven't read all the responses but I'm a Foundations/Essentials director and I have a daughter who was in Essentials when she was 9 and it was way too difficult for her. She has a slew of LDs and it just flew over her head. However, Foundations has been wonderful for her! She's learning so much because it's predictable, catchy memory work. It doesn't make her think dialectically so it works for her. This year, we have a student who is 13 years old and has Asperger's. She has done SO well in Essentials! Her mom just can't believe how much she has improved in her writing and grammar. I am so proud of her. She works so hard to get a paper done so she can read it in front of the class. Whoa!! So, you never know. It might be JUST the thing your child needs later on. Btw, they are changing the EEL guide so that it's much more parent and student-friendly. Looking forward to seeing it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyBee Posted March 21, 2011 Author Share Posted March 21, 2011 Haven't read all the responses but I'm a Foundations/Essentials director and I have a daughter who was in Essentials when she was 9 and it was way too difficult for her. She has a slew of LDs and it just flew over her head. However, Foundations has been wonderful for her! She's learning so much because it's predictable, catchy memory work. It doesn't make her think dialectically so it works for her. This year, we have a student who is 13 years old and has Asperger's. She has done SO well in Essentials! Her mom just can't believe how much she has improved in her writing and grammar. I am so proud of her. She works so hard to get a paper done so she can read it in front of the class. Whoa!! So, you never know. It might be JUST the thing your child needs later on. Btw, they are changing the EEL guide so that it's much more parent and student-friendly. Looking forward to seeing it! Thank you for chiming in! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paisley Hedgehog Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 nm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyBee Posted March 25, 2011 Author Share Posted March 25, 2011 I just found out there is a CC group in our area (well ... only 30 minutes away :tongue_smilie:). I have been trying to figure out the website, but I can't understand what CC uses for curriculum in Foundations other than VP cards. Does it vary by group? Also, is there an online sample of the guide? I am looking at this for my 10yo dyslexic guy. For those who've done it, how much writing is required in class? We've been in co-ops before and this was ds's downfall. He simply couldn't copy from the board, couldn't write down assignments, and got lost and frustrated when trying to take notes or fill in worksheets during class time. :001_unsure: Check with that group to see if you can visit a class. I don't know if they're all the same, but ours ends April 1, so you might have to act pretty quickly. When I visited, there was no writing during Foundations. They went to Science class where they had a bridge project, then memory work class where they reviewed that week's mapwork, history, science, math, etc; and then fine arts where they learned about Beethoven and listened to part of one of his symphonies. For the memory work, they have one fact to memorize every week in a variety of subjects. The parents can build on those topics at home to the extent they wish. The last half-hour, each child did a presentation on a topic of their choice that they studied that week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paisley Hedgehog Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 nm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copswife Posted April 9, 2011 Share Posted April 9, 2011 I'm an Essentials tutor in Florida. (last year I was a mom in an Essentials class) In both classes, the moms sat next to their student and were engaged and involved. My moms keep score for games, help their child if they are stuck on something, and sometimes PLAY games with us. (kids and moms love this) Whether a mom is in Foundations or Essentials, they are supposed to be involved and in the classroom. (our community has a rotation for nursery, which is the exception to the rule) The tutors are modeling for the moms, as well as instructing the students. Also, if you have any questions about Essentials, sit in on a class. This year I had a 9 year old boy, who didn't write at all. He was delayed in reading and writing. It is AMAZING where he is now compared to the beginning of the year. Since many of the charts are memorized and he didn't like to write, I would have him recite them orally. It's okay to be flexible like that. At first his mom had to type/write his papers... as he dictated them. Now, he can type and do it himself. But, each child is different and each circumstance (dyslexia) I remember coming across an article on Essentials and Dyslexia. I will see if I can find it. Blessings, Tracie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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