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I know of a 4 year old who was left in a car for a few minutes while mom was dropping off something. The parking brake was broken. He got the car out of gear and totaled the car. All 3 children in the car were fine, but they could have been hurt, the car was totaled.

 

Enterprising small children could also play with more things even if the brake was on and cause the same type of reaction.

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I doubt that anyone would think twice if I was talking to someone 15 feet or more from my 5 year old at a park. If the child does not have the key and if the temperatures are temperate, what makes a child being in a car more of an issue to people?

 

I don't know, I'm puzzled too.

I'm thinking about when we go to the park with our friends. The kids play all over the park area and :gasp: sometimes they are out of our sight for a few moments. So if we walk to the parking lot and the kids get in the cars and my friend and I stand between the cars (each 15ft from our car) and talk, why is that now suddenly so dangerous?

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I think it depends on the kids and how they have been taught to behave and where they are at in the car...

 

A child who has been taught to behave or is known to not get into things and can be trusted could easily sit in a back seat while mom or dad is nearby...

 

A child who is known to be a handful, doesn't obey and cannot be trusted should probably not be left in the car...

 

Each of knows how our children are and if we trust them and what the situation is. The children that I raised from infancy, I would have had no problem having them sit in the car while I visited nearby or watched a sport of some kind. My stepsons, on the other hand, I would never allow it (even now) because they behave so differently and I know I would regret it, they cannot be trusted.

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Kids do dumb things sometimes :)

 

I guess it depends on how old your kids are. I would be concerned about choking - even well behaved kids put things in their mouths that don't belong!

 

My eldest ds (who's 6) I would leave alone in the car for short amounts of time if I just need to jump out for moment and the weather is nasty. He's happy to sit and read a book. I lock the car and wouldn't leave him alone for more than a couple minutes at most. Please don't call social services on me! My dd4 on the other hand, no way. She's the kiddo that puts silly things in her mouth!

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Some cars do not need to be on to be put in neutral. If you're on a hill, that could definitely be a problem. :) Otherwise, it's not really an issue to me, if I'm nearby or am only going to be a minute, I'll leave my kids in the car. I usually don't do it for very long because I have one who loves to start trouble as soon as my head is turned.:glare: I don't leave them alone in the parking lot either...but I will in our driveway.

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The other problem is that when you first see the kids in the car, you don't know if the parents have taken precautions or what how responsible the children are. I will leave mine in the car while I run into the dry cleaners, if I get one of the three spots right in front of the huge plate glass window(and see that there are no customers in line). I tell them to stay strapped (which my kids will do) I take the keys as I lock them in the car, and run in.

 

However, there was a case here in Oregon about 18 months ago. A mom was standing on the sidewalk talking to her friend while her kids were in the car. She was right next to the car (given on the passenger side) She had the doors unlocked and the engine running (and a lot of people do this) Someone jumped in her car and drove it off with the kids in. They were fine, but that is the reason I always take an extra look when I see kids in a car with mom chatting outside the car. You never know who is around.

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True story that happened in my my area.

 

Mum parked the car on the opposite side of the street to go to the ATM. She left her three children in the car (oldest was about 8) strapped into their carseats/seatbelts. She was in complete sight of them the whole time and literally just a few feet away. One of the kids undid their seatbelt, grabbed the cigarette lighter and dropped it onto the seat. The car went up in flames so quickly that even though their mum only had to run across the road to get to them - by the time she reached them there was no way to save them and she watched them all burn to death. They were parked by a brick wall and the scorch marks were two stories high up the wall - a horrible reminder everytime you drove past. If I was that mum I don't think I'd ever be right in the head again after witnessing that.

 

Also I know the chances are slim and I'm an excessive worrier but what if your kids are sitting in a car and another car rams into them.

 

There are just way to many incidences of kids undoing the handbrake -what if they did this and a sibling was playing behind the car.

 

It's just too dangerous to risk.

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Some cars do not need to be on to be put in neutral. If you're on a hill, that could definitely be a problem. :) Otherwise, it's not really an issue to me, if I'm nearby or am only going to be a minute, I'll leave my kids in the car. I usually don't do it for very long because I have one who loves to start trouble as soon as my head is turned.:glare: I don't leave them alone in the parking lot either...but I will in our driveway.

:iagree: I was in a car w/my brother that started to go backwards out the driveway & across the street. Neighbor across the street jumped in & pulled the parking break. (My parents were standing in front of the car as it rolled towards the neighbor's car across the street. He said another car actually hit his car doing the same thing so he didn't want it happening again, lol!! I'm still paranoid about cars on slopes....)

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I doubt that anyone would think twice if I was talking to someone 15 feet or more from my 5 year old at a park. If the child does not have the key and if the temperatures are temperate, what makes a child being in a car more of an issue to people?

Are you serious ? You've never heard of a child dieing in a car - it gets hotter, the parent forgets they left the child in the car, the car get's stolen with the child in it - yes,that happens. They get the car out of gear and it goes down the hill and crashes. Come on. It's irresponsible to leave a child unattended in a car.

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When I was young,My dad got out of the family car and was about 10 metres away, my younger sister was in the car ( about 3) with the sliding door open. It was a van that has the motor under the front seats. The battery caught on fire and then the seat cover caught on fire. My dad didn't notice until my sister started screaming. Fortunately they were able to get her out and put out the fire.

 

I have witnessed twice a car full of children, the parent talking to someone, and one of the children playing with a cigarette lighter.

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My kids are left in the car in certain situations.

 

The 8, 7, and 3yo would hang out and watch videos or read books (with one of the sliding doors open) during baseball practice.

My 12yo stayed with my 3yo while I took the rest into the pharmacy the other day. 3yo was asleep.

They were all in the car when the stupid gas pump demanded I pay inside the other day.

Doors are always locked, cell phone in the car.

 

Quite frankly, I find it shocking that some people find it so "risky". You take those same kids and hurl them down the highway at 50-75mph (depending on your local speed limits) without batting an eye! Don't you know how many kids DIE that way?!?! :001_huh:

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My dad left my sister and me in the car when we were 3 and 5 respectively. That was in the dark ages when kids did not have to even wear seat belts, let alone carseats. Anyway, my dad left the car running and went into his office, where he could not see the car. My sister pulled on the gear shift and the car started backing up. By some supernatural intervention, I knew we were in a bad situation, and I hopped over the seat into the driver's seat and held onto the steering wheel while putting my feet on the brake. Don't ask me how I knew which was the brake. We had backed out into the parking lot, and were blocking the traffic, so people were beeping their horns like crazy. Finally, wondering what all the beeping was about, my dad came out and discovered what had happened. Needless to say, we were never left in the car alone again.

 

That said, I never left my kids in the car alone, until just last year when we went to the dry cleaners and they begged me to stay in the car because the dry cleaner was too stinky. I relented because I had parked right in front of the door and they had a huge plate glass window I could see through the whole time. I will leave them in the car with strict instructions not to touch anything or undo their seatbelts if I'm running into the dry cleaner or bank, which both have very close parking with big windows to see out. I lock them in and monitor the situation every few seconds. They ask me at other places to stay in the car, but I say no. If it's too hot or too cold, I say no at the bank and the dry cleaners as well. If they are not old enough to stay at home by themselves, they are not old enough to stay in the car by themselves.

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Are you serious ? You've never heard of a child dieing in a car - it gets hotter, the parent forgets they left the child in the car, the car get's stolen with the child in it - yes,that happens. They get the car out of gear and it goes down the hill and crashes. Come on. It's irresponsible to leave a child unattended in a car.

 

I don't know if you realize how rude the bolded parts sound?

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There are different kinds of leaving a child in a car. There is the kind in which the parent forgets he has the child. There is the kind in which the parent is irresponsible and leaves the child for hours. There is the kind in which a parent leaves children for a very short period of time to go pay in the convenience store or something.

 

The state laws to leaving a child in a car for a short period of time generally come about in reaction to kidnapping or car-jacking. Those are a total over-reaction, imo. In fact, I think the law covers it fine already without a separate car law by child abuse and neglect laws for parents who intentionally leave children in the car while they go to the bar or something.

 

The death of a child is a horrible thing, but neglectful or abusive parents don't follow laws anyway, and kidnapping/carjacking is so rare. So far no state has outlawed swimming in the ocean because of risk of shark attack--also rare, nor outlawed eating hot dogs or grapes or popcorn or other foods kids choke on--not rare at all. I think so often states "close the barn door after the horse has left" with respect to a tragedy and prevent 0 more.

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There are different kinds of leaving a child in a car. There is the kind in which the parent forgets he has the child. There is the kind in which the parent is irresponsible and leaves the child for hours. There is the kind in which a parent leaves children for a very short period of time to go pay in the convenience store or something.

 

The state laws to leaving a child in a car for a short period of time generally come about in reaction to kidnapping or car-jacking. Those are a total over-reaction, imo. In fact, I think the law covers it fine already without a separate car law by child abuse and neglect laws for parents who intentionally leave children in the car while they go to the bar or something.

 

The death of a child is a horrible thing, but neglectful or abusive parents don't follow laws anyway, and kidnapping/carjacking is so rare. So far no state has outlawed swimming in the ocean because of risk of shark attack--also rare, nor outlawed eating hot dogs or grapes or popcorn or other foods kids choke on--not rare at all. I think so often states "close the barn door after the horse has left" with respect to a tragedy and prevent 0 more.

 

:iagree:

 

I am assuming that some people never take their eyes off of their child for anything.

 

I have left my dc in the van with it running, before. The doors get locked, the emergency brake is on, and the oldest in the van is 13. (I am assuming no one would have an issue at all with leaving them with my 17yo since he could drive in the van and take them all to the park if he wanted to!:tongue_smilie:) They don't get out of their seats.

 

Call me irresponsible if you want, but generally I won't take them in somewhere if it will take me longer to get them all in and out than it will to run the actual errand. When we lived near a super small town, I would leave them with the 10yo (who is now the 13yo.) I wouldn't leave them with my 10yo now because we live in a much more populated area.

 

I wouldn't leave a young child in a car to stand 15 feet away unless it wasn't running (and, of course, there was no danger of hyperthermia.)

 

Yesterday afternoon I left the 2yo in the van to finish sleeping in the driveway. However, the doors were open, we live at the end of the cul-de-sac, and the kids were out there playing.

 

When you are on the internet, you tend to "pick a side" but most people have shades of gray in their lives. This is why we get into such debates about things. The quote about "not leaving your dc somewhere you wouldn't leave a pile of money" is good until they are school-age. I send my dc to school everyday and feel that they are perfectly safe, but I don't believe a pile of money would get back off of that bus in the afternoon.;)

 

ETA:

 

FL law:

“No parent, legal guardian, or other person responsible for a child younger than 6 years of age shall leave such child unattended or unsupervised in a motor vehicle for a period in excess of 15 minutes; however, no such person shall leave a child unattended for any period of time if the motor vehicle is running or the health of the child is in danger.”

 

NC law is no one under 8 unsupervised. At one point in the past, they did try to pass a law saying the supervising person had to be 14 and some other particulars, but I can't see where it passed.

Edited by Renee in FL
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"However, there was a case here in Oregon about 18 months ago. A mom was standing on the sidewalk talking to her friend while her kids were in the car. She was right next to the car (given on the passenger side) She had the doors unlocked and the engine running (and a lot of people do this) Someone jumped in her car and drove it off with the kids in. They were fine, but that is the reason I always take an extra look when I see kids in a car with mom chatting outside the car. You never know who is around."

 

had to do the quote this way could not get it to work.

 

Here in Texas you do not leave a child under a certain age in the car alone. People get in a hurry, a lot of people just seem to forget that they have a kid with them and leave, them, especially little ones. How I do not know but way too many do. Also if there are not a lot of people around the area to see, a predator could break open the window open the door and take the child, yes that does happen. Plus when you go into any place you do not know how many people are in line and how long it will take. Even at home the kids in the drive way in the car, it can slip out of gear, they could fall asleep in the back without you seeing them and you get in the car and they lay there sleeping while you go in someplace.

People want a child bad enough they will figure a way to get in that car and take the child.

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I have recently started letting my 10.5 yo stay in the car in certain situations for brief periods of time (she's also been allowed to stay home by herself once for about 10 min). It's only in the last year that I felt she had the maturity to do so. In part, it had to do with her being able to get out of the car and safely come into the store to find me if she got too hot or had an issue.

 

We, unfortunately, also had a child death here a few years ago. Mother left preschooler and infant in car while she went in to get the elementary school kid (may have been kindergartner, not sure). The preschooler played with a cigarette lighter he found (the car didn't have one, mother didn't realize someone had left one in the car), set the car on fire, was able to get out, but the baby died.

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Quite frankly, I find it shocking that some people find it so "risky". You take those same kids and hurl them down the highway at 50-75mph (depending on your local speed limits) without batting an eye! Don't you know how many kids DIE that way?!?! :001_huh:

 

I was called 'holier-than-thou' on this board for saying that I did not and would not break the speed limit. I heard nothing from people saying that they would not speed with children in their cars, even though the risk of injury is higher at higher speeds. These are much more real risks than those to a child in full view in a parked car.

 

Laura

Edited by Laura Corin
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I'm in Memphis, where we've had multiple children die in parked cars and busses when the parent/caregiver left them there to run errands or just plain forgot. Now, it's not a 5-15 minute thing, even here, but parked cars can quickly become ovens. And the public is made very aware of this every single year-but every single year it seems that there's at least one child who has, at minimum, a close call.

 

So here, a parent who leaves her sleeping child in a parked car while she goes up a drive way to look at a tag sale may well have a concerned citizen frantically trying to get the child OUT within 5 minutes-or worse, a concerned citizen who has already called 911.

 

In other climates, it's probably less of an issue, and therefore less likely that someone will overreact to what really isn't a big deal-but I don't even leave my daughter in the car to put the shopping cart back if I'm parked an aisle or two away. Not because it's not safe to do so, but because it's so likely that it will panic someone else.

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I was wondering the same thing. How often does a person break into a car in order to snatch a child or the car when someone is standing in clear view?

 

I mean, I have NEVER heard of anything like that happening in our area. My child has never been watched by anyone other than my parents, they don't go off our street alone, they've never walked to school or ridden a school bus, etc. I am confident that I am an extremely protective parent.

 

I've heard more snatchings occur related to walking to or from school or at bus stops than children locked in cars. Why doesn't the law require the parents to wait at the school bus with their child or walk their child to school?

 

Oh, and I am smart enough to know if it's too hot to leave my child in the car, and I have never forgotten my child anywhere. My purse, yes. My child, no.

 

People shouldn't treat everyone as incompetent. Just because someone forgot his child was in the back seat when he was on the way to work doesn't mean everyone will do that. I refuse to live my life afraid because other people make mistakes. My kids have been with me or my mom every day of their lives since the day they were born. I cannot imagine forgetting they are with me.

Edited by nestof3
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When I was young,My dad got out of the family car and was about 10 metres away, my younger sister was in the car ( about 3) with the sliding door open. It was a van that has the motor under the front seats. The battery caught on fire and then the seat cover caught on fire. My dad didn't notice until my sister started screaming. Fortunately they were able to get her out and put out the fire.

 

I have witnessed twice a car full of children, the parent talking to someone, and one of the children playing with a cigarette lighter.

 

Again, my kids have never played with a lighter (we don't even have one in the van since Honda finally realized that a cigarette lighter shouldn't be a standard feature in minivans). They never messed with things they weren't supposed to anyway.

 

And the van, it could have caught fire while the dad was driving, so I guess he shouldn't have been driving the car at all. It would have taken more time to stop the car, unbuckle his seatbelt and get everyone out.

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In our family's case, I'm pretty certain that statistically, my children are safer in a parked car with the keys removed, than while being driven on the Garden State Parkway.

 

All depends on the behavior of the children and the behavior of the drivers. ;)

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Are you serious ? You've never heard of a child dieing in a car - it gets hotter, the parent forgets they left the child in the car, the car get's stolen with the child in it - yes,that happens. They get the car out of gear and it goes down the hill and crashes. Come on. It's irresponsible to leave a child unattended in a car.

 

Your tone is uncalled for and rude. If you're standing 15 feet away, the child is NOT unattended.

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My Mother always told me, "never leave a child where you wouldn't leave a pile of money sitting on the seat."

 

{shrug}

 

That's what I always say: "If you wouldn't leave your purse sitting on the seat in plain sight while you are gone, why would you leave your child?"

 

I agree with a pp that it depends on the children.

 

But overall, I think that most people forget that a car is a huge piece of machinery, and so they have a false sense of security.

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Two years ago, my husband's friend left his 3 year old in the truck for literally 2 minutes when he went back inside to grab something. He came out to see the truck rolling backward. The truck went over a 6 foot embankment and the child was killed.

 

They still aren't sure what happened...if it was a mechanical failure on the vehicle or if she was fussing with something. I do think this situation was different because the vehicle was parked on a driveway with a slight incline that allowed the truck to roll out into the street and down a hill.

 

I have left my eldest in the car before with strict instructions not to touch anything. But it was in a flat driveway with no possibility of rolling. And I have let both my kids play in the car too because they wanted to and I didn't see the harm in it. (They then climbed on top and were using the windshield as a slide!)

 

If the vehicle is in a safe spot, I don't have issue as long as the children are in sight and it isn't too hot out.

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So, I went and did some googling of vehicle safety statistics and for the year 2005, 1335 children died in motor vehicle crashes. These were on the road accidents, not anything related to just putting a single car into gear and rolling. Crashes on roadways with a driver at the wheel.

 

That same year 48 children died of being left unattended in a motor vehicle. 48 was the summer statistic which is the most dangerous time - heat exhuastion/stroke/etc. It was a little less clear about other possible deaths from being left unattended, but the total for non-crashes i.e. no driver, was less than 100.

 

Obviously it is far more dangerous to put your child in a car and drive them down the road. Plain and simple, yet I don't think anyone is going to start calling parents irresponsible for using motor vehicles for transport.

 

Amongst teens, 60% of all deaths are related to teen drivers. The number of teens who die at the helm of a car each year is startling. So, are the same individuals so adamantly opposed to anyone leaving a child in a car for few minutes also going to take the same stance on not licensing new drivers until the age of 20?

 

Faith

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Just for a little perspective, my 5-year-old daughter is in another room in our house right now--much more than 15 feet away from me and out of my sight. We have a gas stove, knives, scissors, a baseball bat, a bathtub, steep stairs, lots of toys that could trip someone, coins and other small items that could choke someone, a chest freezer...

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Just for a little perspective, my 5-year-old daughter is in another room in our house right now--much more than 15 feet away from me and out of my sight. We have a gas stove, knives, scissors, a baseball bat, a bathtub, steep stairs, lots of toys that could trip someone, coins and other small items that could choke someone, a chest freezer...

 

Exactly. This is why I was asking - not because I am so dumb as to not to know that there are some dangers related to cars.

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This person I know leaves her almost-6-y-o in the car when the child doesn't feel like engaging in the extraordinary process of getting unbuckled, walking through the cold, snowy parking lot, being dragged at a frantic pace through the ridiculously large grocery store, and then repeating the parking lot/buckling thing. When given the choice, that child, who is extremely well-behaved and doesn't get into things that she shouldn't, would rather sit in the locked/emergency brake on/no cigarette lighter car and read. Ummm...big surprise! Her mother wishes she could just stay in the car, too! ;) Now please don't call CPS on "that" mother!

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I think cars are so dangerous because the media makes them so. Sensational horror stories are news worthy. I leave my kids in the running car when I forget something inside the house. More often, now that my kids are a bit older, one of them runs in, but still..... The media scares you. Horror stories of cousin's friend's auntie who.... scare you.

I would never run into the store with my boys in the car although my mom did all the time and my brother and I were fine. I guess I've gotten a little scared, too.

BTW, summer is about to hit Vegas and I dread the stories of kids left in 160 degree cars. Ugh. They are starting to charge parents now. A couple was just found guilty this week (that was a weird story though).

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I think cars are so dangerous because the media makes them so. Sensational horror stories are news worthy. I leave my kids in the running car when I forget something inside the house. More often, now that my kids are a bit older, one of them runs in, but still..... The media scares you. Horror stories of cousin's friend's auntie who.... scare you.

I would never run into the store with my boys in the car although my mom did all the time and my brother and I were fine. I guess I've gotten a little scared, too.

BTW, summer is about to hit Vegas and I dread the stories of kids left in 160 degree cars. Ugh. They are starting to charge parents now. A couple was just found guilty this week (that was a weird story though).

 

Uh, weird or evil?

 

http://www.lvrj.com/news/21762444.html

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Another reason I don't leave my kids in the car unless I can see it is because my aunt came out to her car one day, and found some crazy lady in it who was cutting up the fabric with scissors. Who's to say she wouldn't have started stabbing kids if they were in there? Weird and crazy stuff does happen. The chances are slim, but they do exist.

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That's what I always say: "If you wouldn't leave your purse sitting on the seat in plain sight while you are gone, why would you leave your child?"

 

I don't think those sorts of comparisons are very realistic though - statistically speaking, a purse is MUCH more likely to be stolen than a kid. People looking for a quick buck can be tempted into snatching an unattended, unprotected (locked, etc) purse...there aren't too many people looking for a quick.. addition to their family. :p

 

(I know, someone is gonna bring up abducted kids - again though, most of that is parental abductions.)

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I don't think it's any more dangerous than living and breathing. It isn't any more dangerous than leaving them unattended in a different room of the house. There are hazards EVERYWHERE! Life is risky. I minimize the risks the best I can but I'm not going to live my life in fear.

 

Having said that my #1 greatest fear about leaving my kids in the car is having some busybody get up in arms about it. I take the precautions I feel are necessary for their maximum safety. But after reading through some of the responses here I guess the best thing to do is to be familiar with the laws in your state and break them at your own risk. :D

....or, ummm, obey them.

 

Here's the law for my state (fairly new) from a newspaper article:

 

The law makes it illegal to leave any child, 5 or younger, unattended in a vehicle, unless they are supervised by someone 13 or older.

It designates the offense as a one-year, $1,000 misdemeanor if the unattended child is physically harmed; a 10-year, $5,000 felony if the child is seriously physically harmed, including brain damage, bone fractures, dislocations, sprains, internal injuries, poisoning, burns or severe cuts; and a 15-year, $10,000 penalty if the act results in death.

If the child is not injured, as was the case with Colon's child, the punishment is up to 93 days in jail and $500 fine.

 

Well my oldest is 13 and nearly always with me if I'm in a situation to leave my littles and pop in the store real quick. So I guess I dodged a bullet with that one.

 

ETA: With regards to the other thread with the 5yo, I wouldn't consider a mom standing 15 feet away to be unattended.

Edited by silliness7
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I don't think those sorts of comparisons are very realistic though - statistically speaking, a purse is MUCH more likely to be stolen than a kid. People looking for a quick buck can be tempted into snatching an unattended, unprotected (locked, etc) purse...there aren't too many people looking for a quick.. addition to their family. :p

 

(I know, someone is gonna bring up abducted kids - again though, most of that is parental abductions.)

 

Unfortunately, they don't take a child to add him or her to a family. I would worry a lot less then. And yes, children are abducted by strangers. It's not as common as parental abductions, but it happens enough to make me take reasonable precautions. As I said, though, my reason for taking them with me is more about their quality of life than safety worries. I just wonder when I see someone leave a baby or young child in the car and go into a store. To me, it's a measure of value. I am careful with my purse. Am I as careful with my child, when the stakes are SO much higher.

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The quote about "not leaving your dc somewhere you wouldn't leave a pile of money" is good until they are school-age. I send my dc to school everyday and feel that they are perfectly safe, but I don't believe a pile of money would get back off of that bus in the afternoon.;)

 

:lol::lol: True that. :)

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Actually, I would leave my purse on the front seat in plain view if I am 15 feet away.

 

That's what I always say: "If you wouldn't leave your purse sitting on the seat in plain sight while you are gone, why would you leave your child?"

 

I agree with a pp that it depends on the children.

 

But overall, I think that most people forget that a car is a huge piece of machinery, and so they have a false sense of security.

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Brakes, shifts, gears, gas pedal, knobs, playing with windows, locking themselves in, anything in the console that could be dangerous, old food? and heat, etc., etc., etc.!

 

Certainly nothing more dangerous than is in my house, and I took showers with my 5 year old unattended every day. I never had mischievous children. You cannot even roll the windows down with the keys out of the ignition.

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