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Christian content: Please help me answer this question Dd asked this morning.


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Guest momk2000

Does God love the devil?

Dd, 10yrs, wanted to know if God loves everybody, does He love the devil too?

I have never thought to question this myself and it's the first time I ever heard this question asked. She really stumped me!

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I would say yes, God does love the devil, but when the devil chose to rebel against God, he doomed himself to the wrath and judgment he justly deserved. That is why it's an act of GRACE that we humans are the chosen race.....chosen by God to receive his eternal life (everyone that believeth). It will really make you stop and thank God........we can become joint heirs with Christ.....something not even the angels (or demons) can do.

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I think the answers will vary depending on who's answering this question. According to Billy Graham, yes, God does hate the devil: http://www.billygraham.org/articlepage.asp?ArticleID=3852

 

But if you google the same question, others feel differently. The overall agreeing conclusion though is that God does hate sin & the devil encompasses every aspect of it. It's a good question and one that would be worth researching with your daughter, and simply let her draw her own conclusion in the end.

 

 

Susan

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I would say yes, God does love the devil, but when the devil chose to rebel against God, he doomed himself to the wrath and judgment he justly deserved. That is why it's an act of GRACE that we humans are the chosen race.....chosen by God to receive his eternal life (everyone that believeth). It will really make you stop and thank God........we can become joint heirs with Christ.....something not even the angels (or demons) can do.

:iagree: Hate the sin, love the sinner, but he had to face the consequences of his choice.

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I think the answers will vary depending on who's answering this question.

 

:iagree: You're absolutely right. The question was not does God hate sin. That would obviously be a big resounding YES. I think that God loves the devil....but hates what he has become. God can hate without it being sinful, as Billy Graham writes, because God's hate is a righteous hate.

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Guest momk2000

I feel so unequipped to answer this question, especially to the understanding of a 10yr old.

I basically just tried to explain to her how God loves everyone, but made us with a free will, and doesn't always love the things we do. She already knows all of this, I just didn't know what else to say. I didn't really answer her question though, and she still wanted to know, Yeah, but does God love the devil too? Arrgh! I may have her ask our pastor, I'm curous what he would have to say.

 

I appreciate all of your answers. Thanks!

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I may have her ask our pastor, I'm curous what he would have to say.

 

Definitely do that. I would actually ask my own pastor, as I'd like to know what HE'D say, but he's currently in India on a mission trip, so I'll have to wait until he gets back. :tongue_smilie:

Edited by jewel7123
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I feel so unequipped to answer this question, especially to the understanding of a 10yr old.

 

Honestly, I don't think you need to have an answer for her. Tell her it's a great question & that you aren't sure. Research the topic together & see where it leads you and what conclusions you draw together.

 

 

Susan

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I would say that God loves all of His created beings, and that Lucifer was the chief among angels, and at one time held a special place in His heart, and probably still does. However, God hates sin, and Lucifer has decided to sin against God, which a holy God cannot tolerate. So, as much as it saddens Him and breaks His heart, he must destroy Lucifer/Satan, just as it saddens and breaks His heart when any one of us dies without accepting His redeeming Gift of Christ.

 

Or, and probably more accurately, I'd have a screaming baby/toddler on my lap and say, "That's a question for when Daddy comes home." ;):D

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OK, I will start by saying I am Catholic and I don't know how much of my view on this is based on that. I believe that God loves everybody and everything. God loves the devil, God loved Hitler, etc. Hell is a place where people choose not to be with God. They decide that they don't love God and don't want to be in His presence. Anytime that someone chooses to repent and love God, God will accept them back with open arms (of course, we can only do this while we are alive).

 

The prodigal son is Jesus' example of this. The son left and wasted his inheritance and his life. He came back, got on his knees before his father and asked for forgiveness. His father forgave him and actually was so excited to have his son back, that he killed the fatted calf (I think it was a calf) and threw a party. The older son was jealous since he was faithful all the time, but the father was so excited to have his lost son back. That is how God feels about us. If we repent and love Him, He will be so excited to have us back.

 

So...sorry to ramble, but I believe that God loves everybody. I think if the Devil came to God tomorrow and said, "Sorry" and gave his love back to God, then God would welcome him back into Heaven.

 

 

BTW, I also think God is like a parent. We can love our kids, but dislike or even hate something that they do. God can love the Devil and hate what he does.

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OK, I will start by saying I am Catholic and I don't know how much of my view on this is based on that. I believe that God loves everybody and everything. God loves the devil, God loved Hitler, etc. Hell is a place where people choose not to be with God. They decide that they don't love God and don't want to be in His presence. Anytime that someone chooses to repent and love God, God will accept them back with open arms (of course, we can only do this while we are alive).

 

The prodigal son is Jesus' example of this. The son left and wasted his inheritance and his life. He came back, got on his knees before his father and asked for forgiveness. His father forgave him and actually was so excited to have his son back, that he killed the fatted calf (I think it was a calf) and threw a party. The older son was jealous since he was faithful all the time, but the father was so excited to have his lost son back. That is how God feels about us. If we repent and love Him, He will be so excited to have us back.

 

So...sorry to ramble, but I believe that God loves everybody. I think if the Devil came to God tomorrow and said, "Sorry" and gave his love back to God, then God would welcome him back into Heaven.

 

 

BTW, I also think God is like a parent. We can love our kids, but dislike or even hate something that they do. God can love the Devil and hate what he does.

:iagree:

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I am not very religious but I do believe in God and the God I believe in loves everyone. He wishes that all people reach their full potential and don't hurt people along the way - but even if they make horrific mistakes, he still loves them and wants the very best for them.

 

But loving them and supporting them is another thing.

 

The God I believe in also believes in Justice. This gives him the authority to work against those who work against him.

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Honestly, I don't think you need to have an answer for her. Tell her it's a great question & that you aren't sure. Research the topic together & see where it leads you and what conclusions you draw together.

 

 

Susan

I think this is great advice. I would throw in that asking your pastor or her Sunday school teacher about it eventually (after you've looked into it) would be a good thing as well.

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OK, I will start by saying I am Catholic and I don't know how much of my view on this is based on that. I believe that God loves everybody and everything. God loves the devil, God loved Hitler, etc. Hell is a place where people choose not to be with God. They decide that they don't love God and don't want to be in His presence. Anytime that someone chooses to repent and love God, God will accept them back with open arms (of course, we can only do this while we are alive).

 

The prodigal son is Jesus' example of this. The son left and wasted his inheritance and his life. He came back, got on his knees before his father and asked for forgiveness. His father forgave him and actually was so excited to have his son back, that he killed the fatted calf (I think it was a calf) and threw a party. The older son was jealous since he was faithful all the time, but the father was so excited to have his lost son back. That is how God feels about us. If we repent and love Him, He will be so excited to have us back.

 

So...sorry to ramble, but I believe that God loves everybody. I think if the Devil came to God tomorrow and said, "Sorry" and gave his love back to God, then God would welcome him back into Heaven.

 

 

BTW, I also think God is like a parent. We can love our kids, but dislike or even hate something that they do. God can love the Devil and hate what he does.

 

:iagree: God doesn't hold grudges. He's above that.

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For a 10 year-old, I might explain it in the context of parental love - there's nothing my child could do to make me not love him, but if he disobeys my rules, he will be punished. Further, he could think the punishment unfair, or too much to bear and there may come a day when he decides he doesn't want to be in my presence.

 

It's hard because every time we try to "explain" God we end up painting him inside a box of human ideas. :)

 

For me, I agree that God does love all creation - God is Love. God is also "Holy, Holy, Holy," as well as Merciful and Just...those attributes are sometimes hard to balance with the concept of "hate." I think it's not so much he hates the sin as much as he is grieved by how hurtful ungodly behavior can be to us and those around us.

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hmm, great question. my initial response is to say "yes! of course he loves satan! god loves everyone!"...but i think i need to do some reading on the topic to really draw a conclusion. is satan a "sinner" or is satan better defined as evil? can we really separate him from his behavior as with human beings? the bible says he is the ruler of this world & he that loves the world does not have the love of god in him. so honestly, i would need to dig a little deeper to form an opinion. great food for thought though!

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I thought this article on the topic was interesting. From a Reformed perspective.

 

http://reformedanswers.org/answer.asp/file/99661.qna/category/th/page/questions/site/

 

 

"When God condemns people to hell, I think it is safe to say that his love is entirely withdrawn from them. He no longer harbors any love for them, and feels intense hatred for them, leading him to condemn and punish them."

 

 

I have a really hard time with this sentence in that article. I think that people choose to fall away from God and to go to Hell to avoid being in his presence. I truly believe that God grieves for everyone that chooses death over life or Hell over Heaven. One of the prayers of the rosary is "Oh my Jesus, forgive us our sins. Lead all souls to Heaven, especially those in most need of thy mercy." God is love. God is mercy. But we have free will and can choose to live without God. Just like parent whose son was a serial killer is glad that her son is in prison, she still loves him as the baby she carried and raised. God loves us even more than a parent can love a child. I know I am definitely not a Biblical scholar and everyone interprets the Bible differently, but I am just in serious disagreement with this concept! Sorry if that offends anyone. I am not trying to start something here!

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Does God love the devil?

Dd, 10yrs, wanted to know if God loves everybody, does He love the devil too?

I have never thought to question this myself and it's the first time I ever heard this question asked. She really stumped me!

 

I prefer to answer directly from Scripture. Satan is the adversary of God and will be crushed.

 

1 John 3:8

Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil.

 

Rom 16:20

The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet.

 

1 Peter 5:8

Be sober-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.

 

Matt. 13:36-42

Then he left the crowds and went into the house. And his disciples came to him, saying, "Explain to us the parable of the weeds of the field." He answered, "The one who sows the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the world, and the good seed is the sons of the kingdom. The weeds are the sons of the evil one, and the enemy who sowed them is the devil. The harvest is the close of the age, and the reapers are angels. Just as the weeds are gathered and burned with fire, so will it be at the close of the age. The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will gather out of his kingdom all causes of sin and all law-breakers, and throw them into the fiery furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

 

Acts 13:9-11

But Saul, who was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked intently at him and said, "You son of the devil, you enemy of all righteousness, full of all deceit and villainy, will you not stop making crooked the straight paths of the Lord?

 

Ps. 68:1

God shall arise, his enemies shall be scattered; and those who hate him shall flee before him!

 

Rev. 12:10

And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, "Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.

 

Matt. 12:25-26

Knowing their thoughts, he said to them, "Every kingdom divided against itself is laid waste, and no city or house divided against itself will stand. And if Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then will his kingdom stand?

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"When God condemns people to hell, I think it is safe to say that his love is entirely withdrawn from them. He no longer harbors any love for them, and feels intense hatred for them, leading him to condemn and punish them."

 

 

I have a really hard time with this sentence in that article. I think that people choose to fall away from God and to go to Hell to avoid being in his presence. I truly believe that God grieves for everyone that chooses death over life or Hell over Heaven. One of the prayers of the rosary is "Oh my Jesus, forgive us our sins. Lead all souls to Heaven, especially those in most need of thy mercy." God is love. God is mercy. But we have free will and can choose to live without God. Just like parent whose son was a serial killer is glad that her son is in prison, she still loves him as the baby she carried and raised. God loves us even more than a parent can love a child. I know I am definitely not a Biblical scholar and everyone interprets the Bible differently, but I am just in serious disagreement with this concept! Sorry if that offends anyone. I am not trying to start something here!

 

I'm with you! One of my old pastors, who was a Biblical scholar, came to the conclusion that if Satan himself repented and asked forgiveness, God would welcome him back.

 

Is he right? I don't know nor do I presume to know. I can only say what I believe. :)

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Just another resounding reason why I cannot abide the reformed theology.

 

So I guess I'm one of those "non chosen".

 

S'all good. I'm just fine with that. Matter of fact, it makes me happy.

 

I was attempting to answer the OP's question from a Scripture-only perspective. I don't understand how "reformed theology" comes into this. I quoted directly from Scripture and did not share anything from any one theological perspective or another. I am reformed, that is true, but Scripture is speaking for itself here. :confused:

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I was attempting to answer the OP's question from a Scripture-only perspective. I don't understand how "reformed theology" comes into this. I quoted directly from Scripture and did not share anything from any one theological perspective or another. I am reformed, that is true, but Scripture is speaking for itself here. :confused:

 

that's YOUR interpretation of scripture. There are very different interpretations. I don't believe in Sola Scriptura and that one interpretation has all the answers and the others don't.

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that's YOUR interpretation of scripture. There are very different interpretations. I don't believe in Sola Scriptura and that one interpretation has all the answers and the others don't.

 

But even when you read scripture as a whole, it certainly isn't all warm & fuzzy. God does many things & allows many things that I don't consider "loving everyone". I'm not disagreeing with you - so please don't take my post that way, as I myself am not sure where I fall with my opinion here. This is a question I will need to ponder and mull over myself. It's great that a 10 year old is thinking so broadly.

 

Susan

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Well...... I might be a heretic, but I would say, yes, God DOES love the devil.

 

God hates evil. But Lucifer himself was one of His creations. And I think that God's love and grace is relentless, and eternity is a long time, and that maybe, possibly (?) God might be able to redeem him. I don't know if that's likely, but God's grace is far more powerful than the devil.

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I will tell what I would have told my dd in that situation. My response would have been similar to a few others. "God IS love. God loves. Therefore, yes God loves the devil." There is no person, angel, or any created being that God does not love."

 

I would qualify it by saying, "Does mommy like all the things you do? Are there times when something you "choose" to do makes me angry? Even if I am angry, do I still LOVE you?" The answer is of course...Yes!

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Do you all remember the story floating around about the drawbridge keeper who was forced to make the decision between sacrificing his son or allowing many people crossing the bridge to die? It's an allegory to illustrate God sending his son as a sacrifice.

 

I was thinking about the story, though, in context of satan. Satan is God's adversary and is bent on destroying mankind. God will crush him, but perhaps not out of hatred for him, but out of love for mankind.

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I prefer to answer directly from Scripture. Satan is the adversary of God and will be crushed.

 

1 John 3:8

Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil.

 

Rom 16:20

The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet.

 

1 Peter 5:8

Be sober-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.

 

Matt. 13:36-42

Then he left the crowds and went into the house. And his disciples came to him, saying, "Explain to us the parable of the weeds of the field." He answered, "The one who sows the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the world, and the good seed is the sons of the kingdom. The weeds are the sons of the evil one, and the enemy who sowed them is the devil. The harvest is the close of the age, and the reapers are angels. Just as the weeds are gathered and burned with fire, so will it be at the close of the age. The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will gather out of his kingdom all causes of sin and all law-breakers, and throw them into the fiery furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

 

Acts 13:9-11

But Saul, who was also called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked intently at him and said, "You son of the devil, you enemy of all righteousness, full of all deceit and villainy, will you not stop making crooked the straight paths of the Lord?

 

Ps. 68:1

God shall arise, his enemies shall be scattered; and those who hate him shall flee before him!

 

Rev. 12:10

And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, "Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.

 

Matt. 12:25-26

Knowing their thoughts, he said to them, "Every kingdom divided against itself is laid waste, and no city or house divided against itself will stand. And if Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then will his kingdom stand?

 

Those all seem to reference the fact that Satan has sinned horribly, and that HE hates God, and that he is & will be punished for his horrible actions & eventually stopped, but I never saw anything about God hating Satan himself. It really is easy to interpret scripture different ways, huh? :)

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Do you all remember the story floating around about the drawbridge keeper who was forced to make the decision between sacrificing his son or allowing many people crossing the bridge to die? It's an allegory to illustrate God sending his son as a sacrifice.

 

I was thinking about the story, though, in context of satan. Satan is God's adversary and is bent on destroying mankind. God will crush him, but perhaps not out of hatred for him, but out of love for mankind.

:iagree:

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I will tell what I would have told my dd in that situation. My response would have been similar to a few others. "God IS love. God loves. Therefore, yes God loves the devil." There is no person, angel, or any created being that God does not love."

 

I would qualify it by saying, "Does mommy like all the things you do? Are there times when something you "choose" to do makes me angry? Even if I am angry, do I still LOVE you?" The answer is of course...Yes!

 

:iagree:

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I'm bowing out of this one......I pretty much stay off the general board because of threads that get heated and it looks like that is where this is headed. :leaving:

 

Really? I'm not reading that tone at all. Certainly I don't want to be the one stoking fire. Forgive me if I've come across that way. :)

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that's YOUR interpretation of scripture. There are very different interpretations. I don't believe in Sola Scriptura and that one interpretation has all the answers and the others don't.

 

But I didn't interpret it. I quoted it. That is exactly why I did just that. It isn't me, or what I think that matters, but what God thinks that does.

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Those all seem to reference the fact that Satan has sinned horribly, and that HE hates God, and that he is & will be punished for his horrible actions & eventually stopped, but I never saw anything about God hating Satan himself. It really is easy to interpret scripture different ways, huh? :)

 

I did not use the term "hate" at all and I am not interpreting Scripture. I am quoting it.

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But I didn't interpret it. I quoted it. That is exactly why I did just that. It isn't me, or what I think that matters, but what God thinks that does.

 

Everyone interprets scripture. It's your worldview-everything you see through your eyes gets interpreted. There is no "it just is" because those people viewing all come at with with different life experiences, and different values because of those. Scripture doesn't exist on some out of time paradigm all on its own. It's a thing that means something different to every single person that interacts with it. That is the beauty of it. That is the glory of it.

 

You read that sitting from your view and what you've been taught, and I read it entirely differently. Almost from the opposite side. You way isn't entirely right, and I'm willing to bet mine isn't either. But to say you don't interpret it- I don't buy that.

 

And, I read it as Satan hating God, not God hating Satan. And that's the interpretation-meaning there is this subject, and you came and posted these verses and so TO YOU, that is the answer to the question. That is your interpretation-you see what I mean? You didn't expound on them in the post, I get that, but those are the verses you reached for that support your interpretation.

Edited by justamouse
i killed a kitteh
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Of course you can answer if how you want. We all belong to different faiths here on the board. So what one person may believe another may not.

 

What we all can agree on is that is that God is love. We can try and relate it to human experience and say its just like when mom and dad get mad at you for doing something wrong. Of course we don't like what you did but we don't ever hate you. We will always love you no matter what you do because you are our child.

 

I'm sure that God can be sad, I'm sure he can be disappointed, but I don't think He can hate. Satan can hate , but not God.

 

No matter which way you look at it : God IS love

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Well, think about this...

 

Is hate a sin?

 

If it is a sin, then how could God hate? If He hates, then God sins.

 

Yet, the definition of sin is "going outside God's will".

 

So if God sins, then He is going outside His own will.

 

Yet, this is an impossibility, since His will is defined by Him alone.

 

It just doesn't make any sense at all.

 

Yes, but scripture says clearly that God hates many things time & time again. I know that isn't a lovely thought, but it is definitely in scripture. I found this article & it sums up my thought on it closer than anything else.

 

 

http://carm.org/does-god-hate-anyone

 

Susan

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Everyone interprets scripture. It's your worldview-everything you see through your eyes gets interpreted. There is no "it just is" because those people viewing all come at with with different life experiences, and different values because of those. Scripture doesn't exist on some out of time paradigm all on its own. It's a thing that means something different to every single person that interacts with it. That is the beauty of it. That is the glory of it.

 

You read that sitting from your view and what you've been taught, and I read it entirely differently. Almost from the opposite side. You way isn't entirely right, and I'm willing to bet mine isn't either. But to say you don't interpret it- I don't buy that.

 

And, I read it as Satan hating God, not God hating Satan. And that's the interpretation-meaning there is this subject, and you came and posted these verses and so TO YOU, that is the answer to the question. That is your interpretation-you see what I mean? You didn't expound on them in the post, I get that, but those are the verses you reached for that support your interpretation.

 

I see what you are saying but your definition of "interpretation" isn't my own. I mean explaining the meaning of something in my own words - telling others what God thinks. I did not do that. I used God's words and let His words express His meaning on their own. That is what I meant when I said that I was not doing the interpreting. Of course I believe what Scripture says so when it says these things:

 

"The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil."

"The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet."

"Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour."

"You son of the devil, you enemy of all righteousness, full of all deceit and villainy..."

 

 

I think it proves that Satan is the enemy of God and will be crushed. I don't know how any other view can be drawn from them.

 

You are the second person to suggest that I stated in some way that "God hates Satan." I did not say that. I don't know if He does or does not. I am not prepared to go beyond what Scripture clearly states. It clearly states these things:

 

Proverbs 6:16-19

There are six things that the LORD hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

 

What God says is what He says. It doesn't really matter what I think.

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Guest momk2000
I haven't read any other responses, so I apologize if I'm repeating...

 

Satan is God's creation. Satan (Lucifer) was an angel before he was cast out of heaven, and all the angels are God's creation. God loves all his creations. Therefore, God loves Satan, too.

 

However, God grieves Satan's rebellion against Him. But grieving and hating are two different things, and not at all the same.

 

You can't say that God hates any part of His creation, because God is incapable of hate. Hate is a sin, and God can not sin. But God can, and does, grieve sinful behavior.

 

This was exactly my feeling when dd asked the question, but since I never thought about it myself, I really hesitated to give a staightforward answer. I just always though of the devil as the evil in the world, and never thought about it beyond that. Dd really got me thinking today, she certainly does keep me on my toes! :D

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Guest momk2000

Wow! Looks like I really started something here. This is just one of those questions that is open to many interpretations and I respect everyones thoughts on the topic. Thank you so much for your responses.

I think I am going to have dd ask our pastor, I'm really curious now how he would answer this question. ;)

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Yes, but scripture says clearly that God hates many things time & time again. I know that isn't a lovely thought, but it is definitely in scripture. I found this article & it sums up my thought on it closer than anything else.

 

 

http://carm.org/does-god-hate-anyone

 

Susan

 

Ah, Mr. Slick certainly knows how to wield a verse or three.

 

I'm sure Satan does, as well.

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