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So I'm thinking about how I'm going to handle the next couple of years into high school. Maybe the prospect of being in the same place for more than two years has me twitchy (we're military and move a lot). Maybe it's just that I've realized how expensive putting three kids through college is going to be and want to give them all the basis for choice that I can.

 

I have two sons who have tracked together academically from the very beginning. One is in 7th grade, while his brother is in 6th. This year in math they are doing pre-algebra (Key to series and Saxon Algebra 1/2).

 

I would say that the 7th grader ® is a good student with a lot of creativity and smarts (with IQ and achievement test scores in early elementary that put him into gifted range) who tends toward distraction and inertia.

 

The 6th grader © is very smart. Fast, high level reader with a phenomenal memory. IQ and achievement scores that put him into profoundly gifted ranges. He has been doing the same math as his brother since they were in kindergarten and pre-k (actually 3.5 years old). He asked to learn to read at 4 and finished 100 EZ Lessons in six months. In many ways his academic ability is beyond his brother, but his emotional maturity is closer to age appropriate.

 

So,

 

I'm wondering what to do with the two of them as we approach academics that might go onto a high school transcript. I anticipate that R will start algebra next year, with C right along with him. If things go smoothly (here's our first assumption) then we might have a progression like 8-algebra 1, 9-algebra 2, 10-Advanced Mathematics, 11-Calculus. However, C would be in the same courses one grade earlier.

 

Questions:

1) This progression would have them doing three years of math in the high school years or would count 8th grade algebra on the transcript. What are the pros and cons of this.

 

2) As the math gets harder, it might take more than one year to complete a course (ex. adv. math or calc). What would the impact of this be.

 

3) I don't want to hold back the student who is honestly more comfortable with the math (C, the younger brother). But I'm worried about either counting his 7th grade work for high school levels or locking him into a situation where he has to take even high levels of math to have enough credits in high school (or to avoid his having a gap in senior year). Thoughts from thos who've been there and done this?

 

4) Or should I just not fret this early and plan to do dual enrollment if we get to that point (though we may only have online options as we've been spending a lot of years overseas, where the DOD schools and the local college campus extensions don't work particularly well with dual/partial enrollment students).

 

Please hit me with the good, bad and ugly that I'm not considering.

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if it were me....I would just go with point number 4, and just see how it goes over time. I would do online classes with them to keep them on track, unless I had better or local options. Also, I noticed your math schedule didn't have Geometry....might be something to include if you want to have your boys do SAT/ACT (since it is tested) and go to college in the states.

 

Transcript-wise, most colleges want at least 3 years of math, so just spread out their courses accordingly over a four year period on their transcripts.

(Read: I would count Algebra as "highschool" even if it was taken in 7th or 8th grade, and took longer than 1 year...if they completed it, it counts...catch my drift).

 

My two cents.

 

Lavender

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I have a 6th grader who is doing algebra 1. So i ahve given this some thought. I also have a 13 y/o who is finishing geometry this semester and at the same time halfway through algebra 2.

 

Questions:

1) This progression would have them doing three years of math in the high school years or would count 8th grade algebra on the transcript. What are the pros and cons of this.

 

 

Some school count 8thgrade algebra1- you might do the same. HOWEVER, I would strongly advise against no math in senior year. Students who do this are at a great disadvantage in college (I just talked to one of my students yesterday who regretted this mistake). So, you might just list what he actually does in his last four years. The college will realize that, when he has geometry and algebra 2, he must have taken alg 1 at some point before.

 

2) As the math gets harder, it might take more than one year to complete a course (ex. adv. math or calc). What would the impact of this be.

 

 

You can assign the credit in the year the course is completed. Or you can have them work on different maths in parallel.

 

 

3) I don't want to hold back the student who is honestly more comfortable with the math (C, the younger brother). But I'm worried about either counting his 7th grade work for high school levels or locking him into a situation where he has to take even high levels of math to have enough credits in high school (or to avoid his having a gap in senior year).

 

 

You can still have your son DO high school level work and just not count it on the transcript. He will still have to do something in his actual high school years. There are plenty of math topics aside from the typical sequence that he could study: statistics, number theory, topology - or make it special topics in geometry, fractals etc. He will not run out of math even if he decides not to do calculus.

 

4) Or should I just not fret this early and plan to do dual enrollment if we get to that point (though we may only have online options as we've been spending a lot of years overseas, where the DOD schools and the local college campus extensions don't work particularly well with dual/partial enrollment students).

 

 

I would not fret at this point and see what happens.

 

For a student strong in math I would recommend using a rigorous program such as AoPS which goes much deeper and has more challenging problems.

My 6thgrader does AoPS Intro to algebra and will take two years to complete the book. Since he started so early, we can afford to take all the time we want.

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Sebastian,

 

Personally, I wouldn't sweat the level of each dc right now. Just move them along with what they are academically comfortable. I've read various posts over the years about some colleges refusing 8th grade credit and others accepting it. When my oldest applied, I made his transcript up by subject, not by year, and he had 5 credits for high school that he earned in the 8th grade. No one even asked when the courses had been taken or even raised the issue. Now if I had sent in a "by year" transcript, maybe there would have been more questions. I know that the work he completed that year in those 5 courses was high school level, so I didn't care one bit when it was completed. I even asked one admissions VP specifically whether his 8th grade English could count towards high school so that the two CC liberal arts courses he took in 12th could be used as transfer credits. He said sure, and they did accept those two cc courses for transfer credit.

 

My younger guy has been working a "year ahead" in math since he was 4 yo. He's in 9th this year doing Algebra 2. He's doing well, but this is a long book and there are a lot of topics to cover. We might not finish this year, but then we'll pick up next year and after we finish a couple of chapters at the end, we'll move on to PreCalc. I'm finally comfortable with the idea that it's so much more important that he understands what he's learning than to say we finished an entire book or level in one school year. His transcript will also have some high school level stuff earned before high school, but that's what he accomplished and is capable of doing.

 

IMHO, you're definitely smart to consider that the higher maths could take more than a year each. Starting early if the dc are capable will give you some breathing room. If you think the younger one will finish the sequence too early, you could always throw in a year of Statistics as well. If you stick with Saxon, be aware that Advanced Math is usually a 3-semester book. That book has a lot of material in it. My oldest only finished 2/3 of it in one school year.

 

Looking at 6th & 7th graders, it's so hard to say what will be the best path for them for schooling/outside courses in 3 - 5 years. Kids that age change so much. I have a friend from another board who has lived over in Okinawa & mainland Japan who has had a positive experience with using the DOD schools for her very gifted son. He did fully enroll once he hit the 10th grade, but he was able to take a lot of APs through them and has been accepted to some very selective colleges.

 

As your two get older, you might consider the maturity of the younger one in placing him in a particular grade. If money for college is a big concern, you might look at having them go to college for the same 4-year period to maximize the aid they will be eligible for. You could have the younger one go early or have the older one take a gap year. Just some food for thought...

 

Best wishes,

Brenda

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Some school count 8thgrade algebra1- you might do the same. HOWEVER, I would strongly advise against no math in senior year. Students who do this are at a great disadvantage in college (I just talked to one of my students yesterday who regretted this mistake). So, you might just list what he actually does in his last four years. The college will realize that, when he has geometry and algebra 2, he must have taken alg 1 at some point before.

 

 

 

Not sure if you meant not taking math as a senior or not recording anything as a senior. I made the first mistake myself, taking an upper level foreign language instead of calc senior year. Big mistake that I regretted over and over.

 

Both of these kids do have a science/math bent so dropping math isn't going to be an option. Thanks for the reminder that there are lots of other math options. C would probably eat stats with a spoon (he's very interested in econ).

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Not sure if you meant not taking math as a senior or not recording anything as a senior. I made the first mistake myself, taking an upper level foreign language instead of calc senior year. Big mistake that I regretted over and over.

 

I meant not taking any.

If he takes math, then I see no reason not to list it on the transcript.

You can have MORE than four math credits - math is perfectly fine as an elective, too ;-)

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I'm in the same situation your are, except with a 6th & 8th grader. We do math year-round, so I don't have to worry about which class is taken when. When one finishes pre-algebra, they move right on into algebra. I realize this will have to change when they start taking outside courses, but for now it works really well.

 

I wouldn't worry about classes taken before high school not showing on the transcript. My youngest that is advancing rapidly will probably take more math courses overall than his older brother, so he will have plenty of math credits on his transcript. Early math classes would only be a problem if the child stopped taking math classes at some point because he felt like he had all the math he needed. I do expect him to slow down as he gets to tougher math courses, since he will be immature, but you never know.

 

I'm not a mathy person and my ability to tutor stops after Algebra II. We are planning on dual credit classes. I have several friend that took high school classes through high school calculus, then took dc college calculus - 3 semesters - and had great success.

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Here is a link to Kathy in Richmond's post about her children's math/science sequence. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1559496&highlight=mathcamp#post1559496

 

My 9th grader is following a similar pattern (his first math in high school is AoPS pre-cal and 2 sciences (chem and astronomy). In 8th, he took alg 2, AoPS ,alg 3, and AoPS Intro to COunting and Prob, and alg-based physics, as well as French 1.

 

She has written before about how she did include all of the course work on her children's transcript by simply including a <9th grade column. I am planning on a similar approach for ds's transcript.

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Not in math, though. :)

 

DS will be in 9th grade next year. DD will be in 8th. I combine them on some things, with the same expectations. If I'm giving DS deserved high school credit, should I give the same to DD?

 

Also, some courses she will be doing (like Memoria Press Second Form Latin) claim to be a high school level course. Should I give her that credit?

 

Friends who have kids in PS usually have a couple of 8th grade classes that count for high school credit. They typically do this so they can take AP level classes in high school and/or free up the schedule for electives.

 

I've heard that colleges only care about what you do in the 4 years of high school, so that's also on my mind.

 

My plan for now is to wait awhile, then contact colleges DD is interested in and find out what they want.

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My 14 yo and 12 yo are doing the same thing for science and math. The 12 yo is a bit more adept, even. They also use the same materials for all theirother subjects except Latin, though I expect a bit less from the 12 yo, knowing that it won't ever count for high school credit. She usually ends up doing all of her sister's extra assignments, though, anyway. :001_huh:

 

I'm choosing to just let her keep going and worry about it later. She is in 7th grade and doing Algebra I/II and Honors Biology. I don't know that I'll give her high school credit for them; it will depend on what the college she wants to attend says is okay. But there are many other homeschoolers who have dc ahead like that, including some I respect quite a bit, so I'm not too worried about it. Our big decision right now is whether to have her take the SAT II for Bio with older dd at the end of the year. :confused: I have no hesitation about letting her keep going, though. :001_smile: I know she may have to take some CC math at the end, repeat with a different high school health course to get her required 1/2 credit, etc. We'll worry about it when we get there.

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For the SAT, you have to request that a score from before 9th be saved by Jun of the year you take it. You might have to do the same for the SATII.

 

The same is true of the SAT II tests. If you are in 8th grade or lower, you have to request that they keep the score on file, otherwise it vanishes. There's really no risk at all taking the tests in 8th grade.

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