How far to go in math?

[Amy in CO]

My dd has struggled in math. She is in 10th grade and we are just plugging away. She wasn't to the point of starting Pre-Algebra until 8th, had to repeat with a different program in 9th. Now we are into Algebra, and after a shaking start she is just starting to grasp the concepts. Next year we plan to do geometry which has me a little worried. If it takes her 2 years to be able to get through it, she won't get to Algebra 2.

 

So many graduation requirements are for 3 years of math Algebra 1 and higher. Colleges require this higher math. In Colorado we set our own graduation requirements as homeschoolers, so technically we don't need to go through Algebra 2. Would you hold your child back for a 5th year of high school to do Algebra 2 or would you just graduate them.

 

She is not headed to a top college, so that isn't an issue. But even the low and mid level colleges seem to have 3 maths as a requirement. Any BTDT advice?

[MamaAkins]

Could you cover math continuously (going right through the summers) to cover Algebra I in 10th, Geometry in summer + 11th, and then start Algebra II that summer and finish it her senior year?

[4wildberrys]

Here's my take on 'colleges want 3 years of math from Algebra 1 and higher'----some kids CAN 'T!!!! Sorry Colleges that want it----but on my dd's transcript she will have 4 years of math---4 full years. Of course those 4 full years include Pre-Alg, Alg 1, Geometry and then Consumer Math....because we tried and tried and spent close to $1000 trying this and that different Algebra programs to finally find one she could complete. I just think the 'one size fits all' mentality of some colleges is ridiculous! I guarantee there are many, many kids who check all the Algebra 1 and above boxes without even having an inkling of understanding about the topic----but complete it they did. In my school----my kids work to understanding, so therefore it took many years for my dd to be able to comprehend Algebra. ;)

 

Stepping down off my soap box now----but honestly, some kids just have a harder time with math and comprehending what would appear to be 'simple' Algebra, and I think it's ridiculous to expect all college applicants to be part of a homogenous herd. :glare:

[Teachin'Mine]

That's great that she's understanding algebra. Because of that, I'd be inclined to move right from algebra 1 to algebra 2, without more than a week's break. If she plans to take the SAT or ACT, I'd try to do some geometry - not the formal proofs - along with the algebra 2, and then finish up the geometry in her senior year. It's better to understand what she's doing than to worry about rushing ahead. That would satisfy the 3 math requirement. :)

[kiana]

If she doesn't complete the 3 years of math, she may have to start with a community college. This really isn't the end of the world. Many students start at a community college and transfer to rather good schools. Some universities will overlook deficiencies in otherwise good applicants. She'll almost certainly, though, have to take math (probably intermediate algebra) at university.

 

Also -- things may start making sense to her with more maturity. You may find that she's not as lost as she thinks she is. I would, however, review algebra (probably once a week?) regularly through the geometry course so that she needs less review, especially if you think geometry may take a long time.

 

Personal experience: My younger brother (homeschooled) clawed his way through school. Every time math came up, it was hysterical tears about how stupid he was, how he was never going to get it, etc. He started at the community college, and his transcript had 2 credits of general math, 2 credits of business math and accounting. He placed into algebra 1, where to his utmost surprise he earned a high A. He ended up going through calculus 1 at the community college (earning an A-) and transferring to a very good school, where he is doing just great in his junior year. Sometimes it really just takes some time and patience and persistent work. Some kids mature later.

[AngieW in Texas]

In your dd's case, I'd probably try to do Geometry and Algebra II concurrently and make sure to keep going through the summers. You can take the concurrent approach any way you like. You can do chapter 1 in geometry and then chapter 1 in Algebra II and then chapter 2 in geometry and chapter 2 in algebra II, ... You could do geometry and Algebra II on an A/B schedule (Geometry M/W/F one week and then Tu/Th the next week while doing Algebra II Tu/Th the first week and then M/W/F the next week). You could decide that geometry will always be M/W/F and Algebra II will always be Tu/Th (or the other way around).

 

Whichever way you do it, this will keep you moving forward. One will probably lag behind the other, but that's okay because neither one depends on the other.

 

Just make sure to keep working on it through the summers.

[J-rap]

I liked someone's idea of advancing to Algebra II directly after Algebra I. I forget what the percentage is, but I think a lot of the first part of Algebra II (maybe even 25% of it!) is just re-learning Algebra I. So if she goes directly into Algebra II, perhaps she could skip over several of the first chapters; plus, thinking algebraically will still be in her head.

[Murphy101]

I think how far to go isn't relevant past where to go NEXT.

 

I'm in the same boat with my oldest. He has struggled for many years with math. It just doesn't STICK for him.

 

I have set aside "how far to go" bc it really is a moot question right now.

 

Right NOW, we are going to work our way through algebra. I will worry about what to do next when we get there. If that means he needs to take some lower level math in college or work through the summer (which we alway do anyways as year rounders), then that is fine. Because it has to be fine doesn't it? If he isn't ready, then no amount of my pushing or stressing or supposed requirements are going to change that. (ETA: requirements are usually NOT set in stone. Even if your student wants a science field degree, the worst that would happen is they would take a bit more time and effort to get it bc the math component of the degree doesn't come as easy or fast for them. It does NOT mean they can't do it if they are willing to put forth the effort to make it happen.)

 

It is hard enough on him feeling stupid (he isn't) and seeing his younger sibling pass him in math. All he needs right NOW is a solid program, diligence in working through it, and cheerleading to help him do it.

 

So there is my very limited experience and conclusion so far with my first born.:grouphug:

Edited February 21, 2011 by Martha

[Sunshine State Sue]

I don't know that I have an answer for you. But, today, I was pondering the math offerings at the local high school. They offer Algebra 1A, Algebra 1B, Informal Geometry, Business Math, Liberal Arts Math 1 & 2. I am not really suggesting that you emulate our local public high school. But, it would be interesting to know what your local public high school offers in the math department. Obviously, not everyone is cut out for the typical sequence.

 

Of course, the best idea is to check what the potential colleges she's interested in expect.

[Hunter]

My oldest started CC without having finished Algebra1. He should have started remedial math there, but he's quite the slick dude and managed to graduate the CC without taking math, with some manuevering.

 

He graduated from the CC at 19, having put himself through school with grants and his own wages. Then he took off for Las Vegas. At 24 he is managing a retail store and financially secure enough to have managed to qualify for a mortgage and is building a house.

 

Some people do quite well in life without having complete higher maths :-0 It wasn't my plan for him, but he outweighed me by over 100 pounds and...at least he was working hard at SOMETHING...so...I just let it go and figured when the lack of math made him screech to a stop in reaching his goals, he'd stop and study it. He never had a problem though :-0

[LidiyaDawn]

My oldest started CC without having finished Algebra1. He should have started remedial math there, but he's quite the slick dude and managed to graduate the CC without taking math, with some manuevering.

 

He graduated from the CC at 19, having put himself through school with grants and his own wages. Then he took off for Las Vegas. At 24 he is managing a retail store and financially secure enough to have managed to qualify for a mortgage and is building a house.

 

Some people do quite well in life without having complete higher maths :-0 It wasn't my plan for him, but he outweighed me by over 100 pounds and...at least he was working hard at SOMETHING...so...I just let it go and figured when the lack of math made him screech to a stop in reaching his goals, he'd stop and study it. He never had a problem though :-0

 

Fabulous. :D

 

My husband never did any high school math classes - he barely showed up for school at all, never mind did any of the work. He dropped out somewhere in his 11th year. Did his GED exam in his late 20s, enrolled in the Accounting Technology course at a local college & graduated top of his class. He now works in the accounting department for a large company. Go figure. :laugh:

 

Our dd14 isn't going to be doing "calculus" or such ~ she's working through MUS Epsilon right now. If you run into that program being discussed on these boards, it's usually in the K-8 section (she's "officially" in 9th - we don't like grade levels much here) - but that's fine. She's working where she is and she's doing her best. We'll most likely be using a consumer math type program in 10th onwards. She works well with numbers "in real life" - cooking, budgeting, etc - and she's moving forward. She's very talented artistically and wonderful with kids - most likely she will will be following a path in life that revolves around something in those areas. :)

Edited February 21, 2011 by LidiyaDawn

[Storm Bay]

What does your dd want to major in? I'd contact the colleges you're interested in, talk to people in the appropriate departments and find out exactly what they require. I heard all about foreign language requirements (selective colleges need 3-4 credits), but when I contacted the math departments in several top math universities (not Ivies), there was no foreign language requirement at all, although English was required throughout high school. Two of them required a minimum of 90 pecent average in math courses in high school (but she'll need higher averages than that to be accepted), and certain GPAs, but no foreign language, whereas for arts she'd need them. There are also colleges that give remedial (aka high school) math courses, and this may be what they require if she doesn't get through enough math courses from Alg 1 and up.

 

fwiw, if you haven't read my threads about dd, this came up when she switched to ps. The ps doesn't offer the foreign language she was taking at home, and in order to get other things done she had to forgo taking a foreign language there this year.

Edited February 21, 2011 by Karin

[LuvingLife]

Although I am highly considering a music major, I still have to have at least four years of math, (algebra 1 and up) so I am not off the hook. But I do love math and may minor in somehting close to it. The thing is I have to have math explained to me very well, especially algebra and geometry which I ma doing together this year. Lials is excellent for me, your dd might be different though. Have you tried Teaching Textbooks? Although it won't give you a strong foundation in math, it does explain things very well and moves at a slower pace.

 

The colleges I plan to send my transcript to requires that I have at least 3-4 years of higher math no matter what. But these are the competitive colleges, your dd may not want this. There are plenty of colleges out there that don't require that kind of math until you get into college. Jut be confident and keep moving forward with math. Just because she isn't a rocket scientist doesn't mean she isn't smart. God created us all differently, and she may have a special gift that hasn't been discovered yet. Try to find it, and build on that. This is what I am doing now and things are going well.:)

[Amy in CO]

Thank you so much for all your replies. It has been a busy couple of days and I didn't have the opportunity to check back.

 

I like the idea of working on both Algebra 2 and Geometry together.

 

For those that have tried to do this, have your children gotten confused by going back and forth between the two subjects?

[regentrude]

I like the idea of working on both Algebra 2 and Geometry together.

 

For those that have tried to do this, have your children gotten confused by going back and forth between the two subjects?

 

No. Geometry and algebra 2 are so completely different- I can't imagine how the student could get confused.

[Lori D.]

How about graduating your DD at the end of summer at the end of her senior year (rather than at the beginning), and take the Alg. 2 or College Algebra at the local Community College for dual credit as a summer school class? Or... do MUS Geometry (which is *quite* a gentle geometry course) in first semester of senior year, and the Alg. 2 or College Algebra as dual credit class at community college in the second semester of college?

 

Or, just delay entry to a 4-year college, and instead take 2-3 classes per semester at the local community college for the first 1-2 years after high school graduation and get a number of "gen. ed." classes (needed for any college) -- math included -- out of the way more cheaply, with an actual Prof. rather than a T.A. and with a much smaller class size, and while still living at home, and with family support and CC free tutoring services available to your DD.

 

Unless there are maturity issues or other reasons for taking a 5th year for high school, I don't think I would do so just because the student struggles with math and is a little slower to accomplish math credits than other students and would be short only 1 math credit... but that's just my opinion, without knowing the student and situation. :)

 

BEST of luck, whatever you decide! :) Warmest regards, Lori D.