Problem with teachers

[jspringer4]

What do you do when your child's public school teachers insist there is NO WAY your child could possibly be gifted simply because she does not stay on task during the school day? Her reading level is two grades ahead of her actual grade. Two summers ago (the summer after Kindergarten) she spent several weeks writing books. Complete books with a cover and several pages of text and illustrations. Her language arts teacher is the most adamant that giftedness is not even a possibility.

 

Unfortunately, my daughter has pretty much shut down at this point. I've already decided to pull her out next year, but we still have 3 more months to go with these teachers. I would pull her now, but I want the state to pay for her to be tested just so I know where and how much she needs to accelerate if we homeschool next year.

 

Anyone have any ideas of how I can help make the rest of this school year tolerable for her despite everything else?

[Dmmetler]

It is a rare district that will test on a parent's say-so alone when the teacher sees no problems. The parent has to be given a response within X days under special ed law (and GT may or may not qualify for special ed-it depends on the state), but that response can be "we don't see a need to test at this time" or "We will monitor for X weeks and make a decision then"-which, given that it's February, would probably stretch past the end of the school year. Or you'll hear "The kids will take the OLSAT in April, and this will determine GT placement"-which would give you some information, but nothing else.

 

As far as what to do now, honestly, I'd say pull her, use screening tests by book publishers or something like the DORA/DOMA to figure out her current achievement levels, pick good curriculum, and really dive into school for next year. She's already above grade level, so unschooling/deschooling and just letting her have a few months to come out of her shell for the rest of 2nd grade will almost certainly hurt her less than staying in a classroom that is forcing her underground.

Edited February 4, 2011 by Dmmetler2

[Staceyshoe]

I agree with getting testing. Ds was in ps K last year. Even though he was too young for any of the gifted services our school district provides, they did testing on him. The teacher was not very cooperative, but the gifted coordinator and school psychologist did a lot of advocating for him. Before the assessment, they were not very helpful either. After seeing test scores, they completely changed their attitude about it.

[jspringer4]

She actually is scheduled for testing (thanks to her wonderful Guidance Counselor), but unfortunately it is a multi-step drawn-out process. I'm guessing it will be 2-3 weeks before the initial assessment (due to scheduling backlogs) and probably more than a month before the whole process is complete. Gotta love bureaucracy! The counselor is aware that some sort of giftedness assessment needs to be done, despite what her teachers say, but I won't know what kind of test it will be until that initial meeting is completed. They'll also look for any possible LD's, etc. It seems like it will be very comprehensive and I would really like her to participate. Plus, it would be nice to have that "proof".

 

On the other hand, she is miserable (and really has been to some degree since starting Kindergarten). After meeting with her teachers, I think I have a pretty good idea why this year has been so much worse than the last two, where her teachers were very supportive and motivated to make the system work for her. I had a conference with them the other day and it was very clear to me that they had no business teaching elementary school. I really just was hoping there was some way I could help my daughter cope with this difficult situation until I am able to make it go away. The Guidance Counselor has put a behavior modification plan in place where she will earn stickers if she stays on task every day and she said the teachers were very excited to do that. I guess I just want her to be happy again even though she still has to go into this toxic environment every day. Maybe I'm just dreaming, I don't know.

[Storm Bay]

One word of caution: if your dd is gifted but refuses to cooperate in the testing it can still hinder her getting her needs met. My eldest took one test that she decided was utterly stupid and refused to cooperate with about half of it. The next text she took, which was open and not done with strict questions that could only be asked one way, she blew the test administrator away because she was having fun and so cooperated.

 

As for reading, that alone isn't enough to gauge giftedness, nor is boredom in a class that's too easy, as I'm sure you already know. (plus, not all gifted dc read early, particularly if they are gifted but also dyslexic, but for other reasons, too, such as eye development, tracking issues, interestk, etc.)

[HeidiD]

What do you do when your child's public school teachers insist there is NO WAY your child could possibly be gifted simply because she does not stay on task during the school day? Her reading level is two grades ahead of her actual grade. Two summers ago (the summer after Kindergarten) she spent several weeks writing books. Complete books with a cover and several pages of text and illustrations. Her language arts teacher is the most adamant that giftedness is not even a possibility.

 

Unfortunately, my daughter has pretty much shut down at this point. I've already decided to pull her out next year, but we still have 3 more months to go with these teachers. I would pull her now, but I want the state to pay for her to be tested just so I know where and how much she needs to accelerate if we homeschool next year.

 

Anyone have any ideas of how I can help make the rest of this school year tolerable for her despite everything else?

 

We've had some of our kids tested (through the school system, and also privately) and honestly, I didn't learn anything from the testing that wasn't also observable by teaching them and working with them at home. And the test results are only a measure of current performance at a given time, and may be useless a month from now. Case in point: One of my kids had a relatively low score on a visual-spatial section of the WISC. After I read the results, it dawned on me that he hadn't done much in the way of visual-spatial practice (didn't like legos, or drawing, or other things of that sort). But after a week playing with "Mighty Mind" and some visual spatial workbooks, he was whipping through each puzzle rapidly. So the test result was actually kind of misleading if one were to regard it as a measure of potential ability, since the score was due to a lack of exposure (and also proves the assertion made by some posters here that people can practice for IQ tests! :))

 

Another of my kids would have appeared to be dyslexic if he were tested a couple of years ago (reversed numbers and printed in mirror image). He still puts his shoes on the wrong feet. But he suddenly taught himself to read from watching Leap Frog and skipped ahead six years in math and reading during a single year. Had he been tested at 6 yo, the results would have been discouraging and misleading.

 

It might be worth pulling her out now if she's finding school so intolerable that she's shut down, rather than hassling with the school district over testing. Something to consider, anyway. :)

[jspringer4]

The guidance counselor didn't feel she should be pushed to do more challenging things when she wasn't doing the grade appropriate stuff she was already being given. She wanted the teachers to do a behavior modification plan first and see how that went getting her back on task. Honestly, when I talked with my daughter about it, she seemed really excited about the idea of earning the stickers. Whether or not she'll actually do it is another question. Right now, when she's given free time to read/write she spends it drawing, which I think might be how she's discovered she can escape for a bit.

 

I actually just got back from an open house at a private school near us and oh, how I wish we had sold some of our organs or something to be able to afford to send her there from the jump. The teachers were warm and engaging. The third grade LA teacher is actually doing a 6th grade novel with her class because (imagine this!) the kids have the ability to do it. I'm not sure at this point if sending her to a formal school environment is even an option, though, because she is so anti-school. I'm wondering if maybe I should homeschool for a year and then re-evaluate.

 

I know every parent says this, but this kid really should have come with an instruction manual!

[cmb6]

We did public school for K, and the teacher didn't see the qualities we saw. We pulled DS out to homeschool, and tested this fall, and I have been very happy to have the results. They confirm exactly my suspicions (advanced in math and slow processing), which was helpful after battling the school, and it is reassuring to have numbers in case we need to go into the system again.

 

That said, the achievement results we've gotten from our charter this year are interesting, but not very helpful as far as selecting curriculum, because DS is accelerating so fast (I think, to catch up to his real level, to where he should be if he had been given what he needed all along). I am finding in some domains that I need to just plan a week or so at a time, and I am glad that Singapore is so cheap. I would definitely not use any achievement testing to make any large purchases until you've been at this a little while and gotten a feel for what works and what you need. It *is* nice to have a starting point, and to know if there are gaps that need filling. You might need to strap in and prepare for an exciting ride :)

 

Heather

[OrganicAnn]

Testing may help you understanding better. Our DD was tested for a variety of things. She has fine motor difficult and it is easy to tell she is bright. But they wanted to see if she had some LD. Well testing showed she was gifted and had ADD. So difficulty staying on task makes sense. We weren't expect this at all. We thought she might be gifted. I think when she hit 1st grade and was expected to do more work, the ADD was finally completely manifested.

 

So you never know what you'll find. Often when there are 2 things going on with a kid, the one thing (gifted) might mask another issue.

 

Good luck.

[EKS]

A couple things.

 

Reading two grade levels ahead is not necessarily a sign of giftedness. Also, individual achievement testing with the WJ-III isn't going to help you with where to place her. It can take a bit of mucking about to figure out where a kid is placement wise. Achievement testing will tell you a bit, but not as much as you might think.

[Storm Bay]

Bottom line I think too many people think giftedness is the same as highly motivated. Many gifted people aren't particularly motivated. When my son is bored/not challenged he shuts down as well. I think that would only make him appear to have behavioral issues and be a lousy student. Teachers don't have time to deal. They want everyone on the same page and to just do what they tell them. Not that I totally blame them. It is difficult to treat 30 people as individuals.

 

Good for you for advocating for her. That is going to make all the difference in her life.

 

Yes, this is absolutely correct.

 

A couple things.

 

Reading two grade levels ahead is not necessarily a sign of giftedness. Also, individual achievement testing with the WJ-III isn't going to help you with where to place her. It can take a bit of mucking about to figure out where a kid is placement wise. Achievement testing will tell you a bit, but not as much as you might think.

:iagree:

[HoneyFernDotOrg]

Love this page for some quick and dirty info on giftedness. Scroll down for myths about the gifted: http://www.ri.net/gifted_talented/character.html

 

I also love the stats at the top.

 

Pull your child out. Testing won't tell you anything you don't already know, and many tests for "giftedness" are really testing how well your child takes a test. When your child comes out of school, there will be a period when both of you need to de-institutionalize. I can tell you that the longer she stays in an unresponsive, unsupportive school, the closer she comes to dropping out. Public schools these days are not focused on gifted students at all, and 25% of dropouts would qulify as gifted.

[Storm Bay]

Love this page for some quick and dirty info on giftedness. Scroll down for myths about the gifted: http://www.ri.net/gifted_talented/character.html

 

I also love the stats at the top.

 

Pull your child out. Testing won't tell you anything you don't already know, and many tests for "giftedness" are really testing how well your child takes a test. When your child comes out of school, there will be a period when both of you need to de-institutionalize. I can tell you that the longer she stays in an unresponsive, unsupportive school, the closer she comes to dropping out. Public schools these days are not focused on gifted students at all, and 25% of dropouts would qulify as gifted.

 

 

What a great link and so accurate. What I learned from this page is this:

Experts in the field of gifted education are beginning to address the higher incidences of ADHD and Spelling/Handwriting disabilities in the gifted population verses those in the much larger normal population.

 

All 3 of my dc and I have had trouble with handwriting, and 2 of my dc with spelling. I hadn't realized that gifted dc have higher instances of this.

 

The emotional stuff is all very true for my dc and I. My gifted sister, though, isn't sensitive emotionally, but of course, not all gifted dc are. I'm definitely bookmarking this page since I haven't seen this particular one before and it's very succinct.