Charlotte Mason ???

[TracyP]

I am very intrigued by CM methods but trying to understand something. I thought I read, somewhere in the many sites I visited, that CM was ahead of her times. The thread about BFSU and CM made me wonder why the CM programs seem behind the times, IYKWIM? Why are they using the same books she used. Wouldn't she be seeking the most recent, relevant information/books to teach with?

[kalphs]

I would recommend going to www.amblesideonline.org to read up on CM and her philosophy of education.

[stripe]

Why are they using the same books she used. Wouldn't she be seeking the most recent, relevant information/books to teach with?

I think some people think books have gone downhill in quality and that only these older books have an intelligent narrative style. From what I gather, they eschew hi-tech illustrations as they see these as dimming the mind's ability to imagine or whatever.

 

However, that does NOT explain all the Victorian illustrations. This is addressed directly in When Children Love to Learn. See p. 25 (on illustrations) and 29 in particular ("It would be a disservice to children to bring them up as Victorians with a misty idea that they'll live in a rose-covered cottage in a friendly, safe village, for instance" (29)).

 

I think there are some people who are attracted to Victorian times and extend that to everything they do.

 

Ambleside has old stuff because they are trying to use free materials, and mostly that means things in the public domain. Mater Amabilis uses more modern material, and I think they're worth looking at.

[Amy Jo]

From what I've read, CM did use up to date materials. But AO became frustrated by materials going out of print, as they spent considerable time reviewing them. So AO has focused on materials that are readily available, often this means public domain.

 

You might look at Simply Charlotte Mason, I think she has more up-to-date recommendations.

 

Remember, CM is a way to educate, not a booklist.

[Medieval Mom]

From what I've read, CM did use up to date materials. But AO became frustrated by materials going out of print, as they spent considerable time reviewing them. So AO has focused on materials that are readily available, often this means public domain.

 

You might look at Simply Charlotte Mason, I think she has more up-to-date recommendations.

 

Remember, CM is a way to educate, not a booklist.

 

:iagree:

[kalphs]

Remember, CM is a way to educate, not a booklist.

:iagree:

Once you undertand the philosophy/method of educating with CM then you can apply it to books you choose for your child/children instead of using a booklist.

A good book to read on CM is "For the Children's Sake" by Susan Schaeffer Macaulay.

I've written a review of the book at www.amazon.com if you would like to read it.

[TracyP]

Ambleside has old stuff because they are trying to use free materials, and mostly that means things in the public domain. Mater Amabilis uses more modern material, and I think they're worth looking at.

 

I hadn't thought about trying to use free materials. That makes sense. I have spent a lot of time at the Mater Amabilis site. :) CM methods have appealed to me but Ambleside does not for some reason. I think the old books have a lot to do with it.

 

From what I've read, CM did use up to date materials. But AO became frustrated by materials going out of print, as they spent considerable time reviewing them. So AO has focused on materials that are readily available, often this means public domain.

 

You might look at Simply Charlotte Mason, I think she has more up-to-date recommendations.

 

Remember, CM is a way to educate, not a booklist.

 

I am still learning to have curricula (and this would go for philosophies too) be tools I use and not be sooo stuck on doing things EXACTLY their way.

 

:iagree:

Once you undertand the philosophy/method of educating with CM then you can apply it to books you choose for your child/children instead of using a booklist.

A good book to read on CM is "For the Children's Sake" by Susan Schaeffer Macaulay.

I've written a review of the book at www.amazon.com if you would like to read it.

 

Thanks, I just put this on hold at the library.

 

So help me out here.:001_smile: What does give someone the "right" to call themselves CM? Is there 2-3 things (IYO) that are musts - short lessons, observation skills, etc. - or am I still missing the point?

[stripe]

What does give someone the "right" to call themselves CM? Is there 2-3 things (IYO) that are musts - short lessons, observation skills, etc. - or am I still missing the point?

I don't think there is a CM police so people say things are CM unit studies, for example, when she ranted a bit against unit studies in her books.

 

Personally, I think the website for Mater Amabilis makes an interesting point:

 

As we read and discussed Charlotte Mason style education we became aware that there is some confusion over what a Charlotte Mason education means. “CM†homeschooling is portrayed as everything from a relaxed, almost unschooling style, to a formal, structured method. We think this confusion can be resolved by dividing the different styles into two categories: CM structured and CM influenced education.

 

 

• A Charlotte Mason structured education attempts to follow the methodology set out in CM’s own writings as closely as possible. Children follow a set, formal course of study, using a highly efficient method which allows children to cover a broad range of subjects in the course of a short school day.

• A Charlotte Mason influenced education gleans ideas such as living books, narration, short lessons and nature study from CM and applies them to a range of different styles of education –“ a particular curriculum, literature based education, relaxed homeschooling or even unschooling.

 

[TracyP]

 

Personally, I think the website for Mater Amabilis makes an interesting point:

 

As we read and discussed Charlotte Mason style education we became aware that there is some confusion over what a Charlotte Mason education means. “CM” homeschooling is portrayed as everything from a relaxed, almost unschooling style, to a formal, structured method. We think this confusion can be resolved by dividing the different styles into two categories: CM structured and CM influenced education.

 

 

• A Charlotte Mason structured education attempts to follow the methodology set out in CM’s own writings as closely as possible. Children follow a set, formal course of study, using a highly efficient method which allows children to cover a broad range of subjects in the course of a short school day.

• A Charlotte Mason influenced education gleans ideas such as living books, narration, short lessons and nature study from CM and applies them to a range of different styles of education –“ a particular curriculum, literature based education, relaxed homeschooling or even unschooling.

 

 

Yes, this is exactly my confusion! That explanation makes A LOT of sense to me.

[Guest Momlovesbooks]

I am very intrigued by CM methods but trying to understand something. I thought I read, somewhere in the many sites I visited, that CM was ahead of her times. The thread about BFSU and CM made me wonder why the CM programs seem behind the times, IYKWIM? Why are they using the same books she used. Wouldn't she be seeking the most recent, relevant information/books to teach with?

 

 

I read that too and was at first turned off of CM when AO Online was the only site I found. I like the ideas but AO felt dated and I also have no interest in teaching so much about a country we don't even live in.

SCM has some great choices and we tried Module 1 but it felt too light and easy for me. CM said do short lessons, but I feel it should still be a thorough education. I found LBC over the summer and we tried Grade 1 with my youngest, I also found HOD and tried a few of their guides. I didn't like how many crafts were in HOD, they seem a waste of time. We really love LBC. www.livingbookscurriculum.com If you look under resources they have several articles about CM. They spent time in Ambleside, England to learn more about CM. They feel CM would update all of her book choices if she were alive today because she was ahead of the times.

I have Grades 1,2,4,5 and 6 with LBC. Next year my oldest will do Grade 6, my middle son grade 2 and my youngest will start Foundations.

[Amy Jo]

I read that too and was at first turned off of CM when AO Online was the only site I found. I like the ideas but AO felt dated and I also have no interest in teaching so much about a country we don't even live in.

SCM has some great choices and we tried Module 1 but it felt too light and easy for me. CM said do short lessons, but I feel it should still be a thorough education. I found LBC over the summer and we tried Grade 1 with my youngest, I also found HOD and tried a few of their guides. I didn't like how many crafts were in HOD, they seem a waste of time. We really love LBC. www.livingbookscurriculum.com If you look under resources they have several articles about CM. They spent time in Ambleside, England to learn more about CM. They feel CM would update all of her book choices if she were alive today because she was ahead of the times.

I have Grades 1,2,4,5 and 6 with LBC. Next year my oldest will do Grade 6, my middle son grade 2 and my youngest will start Foundations.

 

I use Ambleside as a resource (we mix CM with LCC). For example, I like the old books, but I want all my kids in the same time period. AO considered this, but decided it was to complex a project for them.

 

I've heard the later SCM modules have a lot more meat to them. You might ask some of these questions on SCM's forum.

[mackenziefoust]

From what I've read, CM did use up to date materials. But AO became frustrated by materials going out of print, as they spent considerable time reviewing them. So AO has focused on materials that are readily available, often this means public domain.

 

You might look at Simply Charlotte Mason, I think she has more up-to-date recommendations.

 

Remember, CM is a way to educate, not a booklist.

:iagree:

[RobinM]

For a while I thought teaching in a CM way simply meant reading living books, doing nature study, having short lessons etc... One thing I just figured out was that it's more than that... it's how you actually do it. For example, we read living books now, one chapter a day and then we're done with the book in a couple weeks time. CM recommends breaking books up over a longer period of time (maybe 12 weeks)... reading only one chapter a week instead of rushing through it. This helps children 'live' the book... they can't wait to hear the next chapter so they're more likely to remember small details.

 

When I learned this, a light bulb came on for me so now I have a whole new perspective when it comes to CM. I really like the book "When Children Love to Learn". You can find it for a reasonable price on Amazon.

 

Hope that helps.... I am still new to all of this. I've browsed the various CM websites but I'm still trying to get it all figured out too. :)

[MyFourSons]

For a while I thought teaching in a CM way simply meant reading living books, doing nature study, having short lessons etc... One thing I just figured out was that it's more than that... it's how you actually do it. For example, we read living books now, one chapter a day and then we're done with the book in a couple weeks time. CM recommends breaking books up over a longer period of time (maybe 12 weeks)... reading only one chapter a week instead of rushing through it. This helps children 'live' the book... they can't wait to hear the next chapter so they're more likely to remember small details.

 

I agree, short readings and stretching a book over a longer period of time is essential. It is something I have a hard time with. I tend to want instant gratification, and when I enjoy a book I want to read it as quickly as possible! As someone pointed out to me when I was asking about this on an AO board, we live in an age of instant entertainment, with movies, television, video games, a wide variety at our fingertips. So, it is more important now than ever to train our students to overcome this desire for instant gratification. I also think that reading the "CM" way really does improve comprehension, so students can get the most out of their reading no matter what it is they are reading. Of all the CM curricula I have examined, I think AO's schedule is better paced to allow for this type of reading more than others. Although I still like the booklists and schedules used by MA, SCM, and LBC, etc, their schedules seem to be a little faster (IMHO, I could be wrong). I use CM, mostly AO and MA, combined with WTM and LCC, and the "Multum non multa" motto of LCC also speaks to this, I believe.

 

AO does like to provide free and/or affordable book options whenever possible, but only if those options are also found to be the best option in terms of quality. They state on their site that they simply chose the books that they felt were the best written, and met CM's criteria for "living books" most closely, and more often than not that meant older books. AO's advisory panel found many modern books to be sorely lacking in this way. They do not always use out of print or public domain books, for example SOTW Vol. 4 by SWB is a suggested book used for history in one of the years. There are many other "modern" selections, especially in their free reading choices. It should also be noted that MA also uses older public domain books such as This Country of Ours and Our Island Story, and LBC also uses older books as well.

 

If you are looking for a CM booklist and/or curriculum that has includes more modern selections than AO, LBC is an option. I would also recommend MA, or Higher Up and Further In. Both of these are available free online. HUFI is structured more like AO, in that it has weekly schedules and the author used the AO booklist as a starting off point, and then tweaked it to add more modern book selections and a different history sequence. HUFI follows a 4 year history cycle that mirrors TWTM, and also has a 3 (or 4?) year US history cycle as well. She sets it up so it would be easier to have multiple students on the same period than AO. The author of HUFI also has a great "how to" site for CM methods in general called www.charlottemasonhelp.com. This site is less about philosophy and more a nuts an bolts guide, with practical ways to apply CM methodology in a homeschool setting.

 

Another important part of CM's philosophy and methodology that I don't think has been mentioned yet is habit training. While there are many ways to go about this, making a concious effort at habit training is another essential component of a true CM education. That said, it is an area where I am sorely lacking in our house! :001_smile:

Edited February 8, 2011 by MyFourSons
for spelling :)

[Lovedtodeath]

Remember, CM is a way to educate, not a booklist.

:iagree:

 

For a while I thought teaching in a CM way simply meant reading living books, doing nature study, having short lessons etc... One thing I just figured out was that it's more than that... it's how you actually do it. For example, we read living books now, one chapter a day and then we're done with the book in a couple weeks time. CM recommends breaking books up over a longer period of time (maybe 12 weeks)... reading only one chapter a week instead of rushing through it. This helps children 'live' the book... they can't wait to hear the next chapter so they're more likely to remember small details.

 

:iagree:

 

Heart of Dakota uses CM methods, but the books aren't all old, long, boring... and it is all done for you. yay

:)